White slavery

a reply to: sapien82

that may have been the case in the beginning , however through European exceptionalism and with the creation of darwins origin of the species there were those who decided to use this information to change the face of slavery
they were no longer savage humans , they were sub humans and used fallacy to promote their hateful ideologies , and was justification for increased enslavement and mistreatment of large populations of Africans and others over the globe

No argument we agree on the times as per the time line.

I guess slavery (at the best of times) has a kind of paternalism about it.

Being property also means you have some kind of value.

Controversial to say, but the general living conditions of slaves in the US was more often superior to that of the urban slums and proletariat of some European cities.

The chimney sweep or coal mining factory urchin in London lived under daily torture, but what was worse for them was the uncertainty ...

Capitalist labor could be exploited like slaves for a pittance, and when their bosses didn't like them anymore, they could be thrown out into the streets to freeze and starve to death.

What you speak of is true. Not only did the Jew practice this but most of the world. It was a way to pay off debt.

originally posted by: carsforkids
a reply to: halfoldman

Early on in Israel if people became poor in the community they
could sell themselves in to servitude to those who were well off.

It was a different form of slavery practiced to help the community
thrive. The poor weren't neglected nor did they become a burden.

And when the opportunity to prosper presented itself again. If there
was no debt the poor were allowed to return their own lives.

So as we know slaves in the south often loved their owners. Some
even left with broken hearts as they were very close families.

Slavery wasn't always an evil.

originally posted by: carsforkids
a reply to: halfoldman

. . .

So as we know slaves in the south often loved their owners. Some
even left with broken hearts as they were very close families.

Slavery wasn't always an evil.

Interesting you have stated such. On my mother's side of the family, my great aunt keep the stories of her family alive. They left Missouri after the civil war and settled in the Colorado territory. Many on that side of the family owned slaves since James Town.

When slaves were emancipated and freed, the family and their "help", as my aunt corrected us in her stories, cried due to the separation and uncertain future they now faced. Some of that part of my family did very well with slave labor, others like in my aunt's story, were just getting by with some extra "help". I never heard about their slaves being rebellious or needing a good whipping. Of course, early on in James Town and just after, they did some horrible stuff like poison a whole tribe during a peace treaty. I can be pretty certain that they never spared the rod on their "help" in those earlier years.

Looking at the Wikipedia page for slavery in the US, which ended (according to my knowledge) in 1865.

But yet:

"Ute Woman", was a Ute captured by the Arapaho and later sold to a Cheyenne. She was kept by the Cheyenne to be used as a prostitute to serve American soldiers at Cantonment in the Indian Territory. She lived in slavery until about 1880. She died of a hemorrhage resulting from "excessive sexual intercourse"

en.wikipedia.org...

That must probably be the single most upsetting thing I've read all night.
Blame the patriarchy?
In that case, yeah.
Many males from different cultures were all complicit.
Shame on our gender.

a reply to: halfoldman

Again, an interesting tidbit in regards to my mother's family. The Ute were the tribe my great uncle Jimmy had to deal with at his ranch on the Santa Fe Trail in southern Colorado. He was the first of the slave owning family that moved west after the Civil War.

That info could lead you to who I'm talking about if you looked into it.

a reply to: carsforkids

Aye , slavery is only ever about profit ,

it wasnt the crushing weight of the worlds moral compass that forced our hand to end slavery
it was an appeal to the pockets of the wealthy

Adam smiths "the wealth of nations" I think was pivotal in bringing to light the idea that a slave would work longer and harder if they were working as free men for themselves
which would lead to increased profits for the plantations

so the argument to end slavery wasnt won from compassion to our fellow man
it was won on the basis of more profit!

and these are the same principles we find ourselves all working under now

a reply to: MichiganSwampBuck

I've been watching a lot of documentaries on different Native American tribes. Quite astounding how the US made varying deals with different nations, Chief Washakie of the Shoshone for example organized the scenic Wind River reservation and was given a military funeral. Although it was a hard life, I wouldn't necessarily want it.

The Utes however, that is a heartbreaking story, although I believe there were two groups.
But, when people say: "As poor as a newt", some linguists claim it came from "As poor as a Ute". They were really dispossessed into sand and whatever rags you can make shelter from.
And they had all the legends of the giants and the red-hairs.

I would have expected better of the Mormons than to treat your neighbor like that. But that was long ago, they've also moved on apparently, and some are doing great.

Here the doccie I saw (it won't embed for some reason): www.youtube.com...

a reply to: halfoldman

Looking at the Wikipedia page for slavery in the US, which ended (according to my knowledge) in 1865

American Prison " Chain Gangs " where operating until the 1950's

Slavery by another name.

The problem with the current uproar about slavery is that some people want to believe that slavery was a thing Europeans invented and targeted people in Africa.

Putting aside the utter stupidity of this stance, because slavery has existed for millennia and across all societies and cultures, and across all continents. It is conveniently ignored that for the Atlantic Slave Trade to have existed, it had to rely on a pre-existing slave culture across Africa which fed African slave states and the Arab world. The Europeans were just a new customer. The Europeans (and later Americans et al) bought blacks from blacks.

In the uproar of revisionism, white slavery which fed the Arab and Barbary slave trade seems to be (er) whitewashed from the history books. It’s completely impossible (in some people’s empty minds) for white people to be victims.

a reply to: paraphi

they certainly didnt invent slavery

however they did bastardise science and use it to further their own bigoted agenda towards "sub humans"
and that is beyond cruel , slavery is disgusting but justifying it by demonising people with fallacy, this type of behaviour leads to world wars and genocides , its all just about profit , if they cant keep us as slaves then they will keep us as happy workers , until they needs us for war we are the worlds biggest resource
and we are exploited

I got 2 white slaves

One for the cleaning

One for the cooking

a reply to: paraphi

Well Islamic slavery is on-going in some countries, even if "unofficially."
Slave markets in Libya, and not very long ago ISIS were openly and proudly trading often blonde and blue-eyed Yazidis.

but yes lets all get worked up and angry over slavery that happened 300 years ago or further

but lets not address the global human trafficking that is happening right under our noses

human trafficking statistics

"This Report increases our understanding of modern slave markets, yet it also exposes our ignorance", said Mr. Costa. "We have a big picture, but it is impressionistic and lacks depth. We fear the problem is getting worse, but we can not prove it for lack of data, and many governments are obstructing", he admitted. The head of UNODC therefore called on governments and social scientists to improve information-gathering and -sharing on human trafficking. "If we do not overcome this knowledge crisis we will be fighting the problem blindfolded", he warned.

What I want to know is why are the UN calling it trafficking , call it what it is "the slave trade "

originally posted by: sapien82
What I want to know is why are the UN calling it trafficking , call it what it is "the slave trade "

Optics.

a reply to: halfoldman

Ohh, the price goes up if you have blonde hair and blue eyes?

I'm both revolted and flattered.

a reply to: sapien82

Well said! This idea that people were happy to become slaves to rid themselves of debt was most likely due to minipulation.

It makes sense to convince the population that slavery is an honorable way to pay debt. That way the higher caste can reap the rewards of slavery while not recieving the bad moral mojo that can lead to revolution .

Greed !!

originally posted by: eletheia


SOoooo......does that mean that the black population can no longer use

slavery to promote 'white guilt'?

You know it's not just about "Slavery" which was common in almost all African, Asian and adjoining middle east societies but racializing the institution, where as before it was an unfortunate condition, that had nothing to do with what you could not control about yourself, your physical make up, add to that the form it took in the west..that of chattel , which was particularly dehumanizing , leaving very little room for upward mobility, now because of the racialization of that peculiar institution , attitude of worth came into being , and followed us post slavery, thus modern racism and its fallout is connected to it.

Another thing, it was not Black folks who denied white folks were never slaves, lay that on those white folks who wrote books that made it seemed White folks were just too damned superior to ever being slaves, especially to none Whites, that attitude is still a thing among many today , with taunts of some white Ppl that their ancestors owned "BLACK SLAVES"

Goes to show, don't ever let your teachers tell you you'll amount to nothing.

Excuse me sir, but have you actually checked the global slavery market to make that assumption?