The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor

Here's a link to the map.

www.marteydodoo.com...

Thanks, Hawaii looks like it's in a compromising position if a tsunami, earthquake or hurricane happens.

[edit on 6-9-2005 by Indigo_Child]

The problem with this map is that it does not break down the counties by Red and Blue.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird

Originally posted by Roth Joint

The blame is entirely on this administration that did NOTHING until they were pressured to respond. We won't forget that.

Another fact is that it's this administration that is hypocritically playing their "blame game."

You have got to be kidding me.

Wow Roth. Just stop it now. Please. Stick to stuff you have a clue about, because you have no clue as to what you're talking about.

The Mayor of NO was on the radio today apologizing for his mistakes!
You're telling me, you know more than him??????
You're an absolute fool if you think the blame rests entirely on the administration. State and local officals are ALWAYS are the first responders to events like this. ALWAYS. And before storms like this, State and local officals are solely responsible for getting the people to safty.

Please Roth, don't even go there. There is plenty of blame to go around on every level and I am in NO WAY defending the Govs. response time, but it'd be past ignorant into the realm of stupidity to blame this entirely on the Admin.

What it's about is our present Administration playing the BIGGEST "blame game" here. We do have a "leader" don't we? Is he afraid to take his responsibility as our "leader" so suddenly? Why didn’t our well informed President “leader” in 2005 leave Crawford, Texas, a bit sooner so that he could coordinate efforts Monday, rather than wait until Wednesday?

Where was our well informed President “leader” in 2005 on Day 1 of the New Orleans tragedy? This was a catastrophic situation that needed a wartime response from Day 1. Where was our "leader?"

Well informed? Yes! A Category 5 hurricane hitting New Orleans was ranked as one of the top three disasters on a 2001 Federal Emergency Management Agency emergency plan! It is tragically sad that in 2005, with all the resources we have in America, our well informed President “leader” could not mobilize our troops fast enough to curtail the death toll in New Orleans. Even in Day 5, the relief was limited.

Why don't we ask the House of Representatives why funding needed to repair the levees protecting New Orleans has been consistently cut since 2003? Why was millions of dollars of funding for levee maintenance and development diverted for the last three years? Where was the National Guard?

Unfortunately, the questions all have one answer: the war in Iraq.
Yes, I know where our 'taken by surprise' President “leader” was on Day 1 of 9/11/2001.
Unfortunately I now also know where our 'prepared and well informed' President "leader" was on Day 1 of 8/29/2005.

We will not forget this…

[edit on 6-9-2005 by Roth Joint]

I am sick and tired of watching my great nation be destroyed by BUSH & Co. ... and I voted for him, TWICE!

I think that the time has come to IMPEACH Bush, under voilation of Posse Comitatus.

Anyone could do a better job of protecting this country.

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
Was New Orelans a blue or red state?

Louisiana was a red state. However, JT said to pay attention to the red and blue COUNTIES. NO is in an overwhelmingly blue county.

Anyone who wants to understand american politics has to look at the county maps, not the state ones.

John Titor
"Do you think the Electoral College should be continued?"

Q: Are some areas of the United States safer than others?
"Take a close look at the county-by-county voting map from the last
elections." [2000]

"From the age of 8 to 12 [2006-2010], we lived away from the cities and spent most of our time in a farm community with other families avoiding conflict with the federal police and National Guard. By that time, it was pretty clear that we were not going back to what we had and the division between the "cities" and the "country" was well defined."

www.snopes.com...
On the eve of the Civil War (which began in April 1861), the United States was very sharply divided along regional lines. Going into the 1860 campaign, the two major parties both essentially split in two, each creating a northern and a southern wing. In the subsequent presidential election the northern Whig/Republican party (represented by Abraham Lincoln of Illinois) didn't even appear on the ballot in most southern states, and while the Southern Democratic party (represented by John C. Breckinridge of Kentucky) did make the ballot throughout most of the north, they rarely drew more than a relative handful of votes in those states. All four candidates captured at least one state's electoral votes, a rarity in U.S. election history.

The electorate in 2004 was not nearly so sharply divided along regional lines, however — an electoral map just makes it appear that way because of the "winner take all" nature of the U.S. electoral system.

Both the popular and electoral vote totals in 2004 were quite close (President Bush won the popular vote by a 51%-48% margin, and a single strongly-contested state such as Ohio could have tipped the electoral vote balance in the other direction), and although the states won by each candidate were largely clumped into regional clusters, both candidates generally ran very strongly even in the states they did not win. An election map with finer gradation (i.e., displaying results on a county-by-county basis rather than a state-by-state one, and providing color shading to reflect the closeness of the vote in each area) produces a better picture of how strongly both candidates in the 2004 election ran even in states which they lost:

According to exit polls and analysis of county-by-county election returns, the sharpest geographic distinction between the two candidates did not primarily correspond to region but to size of community: Senator John Kerry had a substantial 60%-39% edge in large cities (representing roughly 13% of the total U.S. population), while the reverse was true in rural areas (representing roughly 16% of the total U.S. population), where President Bush garnered a 59%-40% majority. What we saw in the 2004 election was more of an urban vs. rural division, regardless of state.

[edit on 6-9-2005 by Roth Joint]

I still think that any Civil War is going to be faith based....those who believe, vs. those that don't... Many of our laws are based on faith [drug laws, law against marriage for gays].. Remember all the laws in the past keeping the black man down[racial laws] where from the white christian values point of view. Personally I think laws should be based on how humans are not on a religous value belief system. An those people who are not self righteous follow US to salvation, are sick of them trying to control our lives. More and more you have to be christain or christain like to be a good American...this is crap

I posted a post about who was to blame, but I don't see it here

The Mayor of NO deserves a medel for not abandoning his city or people.

The Governor needs to be fired

FEMA acted like it was the first hurricane it has ever responded too. Bush put His man in charge, and well as most of the desisions made by Bush, it/he Sucks...as did their response.


well see if this gets posted

peace

I can't believe this thread is alive and strong 55+ pages later...

How about we stop bitching about minor discrepencies between prophets and predictions and start discussing that something is truly terribily wrong here in America. It makes little difference in the end if Titor was the real deal but the message even if its a hoax provides a valuable warning to the people. He obviously was on to "Something" because his name and message is still persistent today.

Here is a link for the county by county election information for 2004:

www-personal.umich.edu...

And probably the most relevant picture:

Didn't I tell you to stop Roth, you keep digging yourself into a deeper hole.
You quoted me, but you didn't even take the time to read what I said. Pathetic.

Originally posted by Roth Joint
What it's about is our present Administration playing the BIGGEST "blame game" here. We do have a "leader" don't we? Is he afraid to take his responsibility as our "leader" so suddenly? Why didn’t our well informed President “leader” in 2005 leave Crawford, Texas, a bit sooner so that he could coordinate efforts Monday, rather than wait until Wednesday?

Why? Because that's not his job.

Here's what happens after a major disaster:

A Major Disaster Declaration usually follows these steps:

* Local Government Responds, supplemented by neighboring communities and volunteer agencies. If overwhelmed, turn to the state for assistance;

* The State Responds with state resources, such as the National Guard and state agencies;

* Damage Assessment by local, state, federal, and volunteer organizations determines losses and recovery needs;

* A Major Disaster Declaration is requested by the governor, based on the damage assessment, and an agreement to commit state funds and resources to the long-term recovery;

* FEMA Evaluates the request and recommends action to the White House based on the disaster, the local community and the state's ability to recover;

* The President approves the request or FEMA informs the governor it has been denied. This decision process could take a few hours or several weeks depending on the nature of the disaster.

More
www.fema.gov...

Where was our well informed President “leader” in 2005 on Day 1 of the New Orleans tragedy? This was a catastrophic situation that needed a wartime response from Day 1. Where was our "leader?"

Where every other person was. Trying to stay safe. And it did not need a wartime response from day 1. Don't tell me you have that much short term memory loss?

The levees broke and flooded the city Tuesday. Bush was back the next day when everyone realized that it's getting worse and that the situation was going to bigger than it appeared 24 hours ago.

Well informed? Yes! A Category 5 hurricane hitting New Orleans was ranked as one of the top three disasters on a 2001 Federal Emergency Management Agency emergency plan! It is tragically sad that in 2005, with all the resources we have in America, our well informed President “leader” could not mobilize our troops fast enough to curtail the death toll in New Orleans. Even in Day 5, the relief was limited.

In major disasters, it's usually 72 hours before FEMA responds, in the mean time State and local officials are supposed to be on the job.
The gov had 6000 troops ready and waiting, yet.....she waited.....why?
The mayor had thousands of buses at his disposal to transport people to safty, yet they went unused....why?

Why don't we ask the House of Representatives why funding needed to repair the levees protecting New Orleans has been consistently cut since 2003? Why was millions of dollars of funding for levee maintenance and development diverted for the last three years? Where was the National Guard?

Do a little research. Funding has been cut or simply not given since....who knows.....maybe Reagan....probably before him.

Unfortunately, the questions all have one answer: the war in Iraq.

Ok, you're going to have to explain this one...

LD

I still think that any Civil War is going to be faith based....those who believe, vs. those that don't...

Nope, that's impossible. There are too many different beliefs for that to happen. Also, believe it or not, people still come to America for that reason. Practicing whatever faith they want.
You make it sound simple, like "those who believe vs. those that don't" but you fail to recognize the vast amount of people who simply don't know what to believe.

Rebel:

How about we stop bitching about minor discrepencies between prophets and predictions and start discussing that something is truly terribily wrong here in America. It makes little difference in the end if Titor was the real deal but the message even if its a hoax provides a valuable warning to the people.

It's no use RS. I've said that before, but of course it's ignored.....

My quote (edited a bit)

Actually, it's not even a matter of Titor being "wrong". Titor is and has always been a fictional character in a fictional story. Stop taking what he said as fact. It's not. Period. (insert - why am I so sure? Well the Titor story having way to many similarities to Alas B. to be coincidental for one. And, I'm still looking to see if the threads were archived somewhere, but it seems our friend Titor came back to one of the boards.....as an alien. So saith the Mods who checked his ISP address. Plus the fact that he's been wrong so far - despite people trying to twist current events into Titor events - and his leaving out of certain world changing events, etc....)
It's a fictional story showing how complacent the author percieves America has become and what could happen if we continue on the path of complacency and allow the gov to get away with everything, it's not a prediction of what will happen. So yeah, take it to heart....so we can make sure it doesn't happen, but please please stop thinking this is fact (it's not healthy) and all that he said will happen because chances are extremely high that the majority of what he "predicted" doesn't happen.

Yes Titor seems to be gaining ground against the non believers lately. I suspect John will become an icon before not to much longer. I found his story amazingly difficult to believe even through it's simplicity. Had to have taken so much an IBM 5200 was the reason for someone coming back i time.

But anyway.. perhap's I should re-look Titor's trip with a bit less sceptisism.

Dallas

ThatsJustWeird

Titor is and has always been a fictional character in a fictional story. Stop taking what he said as fact. It's not. Period.

ThatsJustWeird since you seem so sure Titor is a hoax, please give some facts then go collect your $100.00 at anomalies.net
Tell us when you win the money.

Good Luck, so far no one has proven Titor a hoax

$100.00 JT Hoax Contest " I Put Up"
communities.anomalies.net...

the faith vs. no faith is just 1 possible senario. What segment of This society will back the fed government if and when they crack down on the people?? How long will the Fed government allow this discussion before they Stop it. I discus this in Real life with friends and family and anyone who will listen to me preach. Last week I spoke to 10 people about it, 4 said they were surprized civil war hasn't allready happened, 4 said they could see it happening, 2 didn't think it could happen[the 2 are conservitive repubicans], but I don't talk to many conservitive republicans. I feel the segment of our society that will back the Fed government are the same ones that support the Iraq war even though its based on BS, or the ones that think there was a 9/11 link to the war in Iraq.


Me and some friends are preparing, better to have a gun and not need it, than to need one and not have it.

Besides I have lived through blizzards that shut society down for a week or more.....

peace

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Didn't I tell you to stop Roth, you keep digging yourself into a deeper hole.
You quoted me, but you didn't even take the time to read what I said. Pathetic.

You are the one desperately trying to deny, twist and bend the hard facts presented to you. So I will happily continue slamming them in your face until you wake up and smell that strong coffee.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird

Originally posted by Roth Joint
]Why don't we ask the House of Representatives why funding needed to repair the levees protecting New Orleans has been consistently cut since 2003? Why was millions of dollars of funding for levee maintenance and development diverted for the last three years? Where was the National Guard?

Do a little research. Funding has been cut or simply not given since....who knows.....maybe Reagan....probably before him.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird

Originally posted by Roth Joint
Unfortunately, the questions all have one answer: the war in Iraq.

Ok, you're going to have to explain this one...

Why don’t you do a little research yourself. Stop projecting yourself as the ignorant fool. And please stop denying facts and talking BS at the same time as well. This entire present war mongering Administration is to blame for the New Orleans deaths because of their recent cuts in funding for levee maintenance and development. Cuts that were decided upon to feed their war in Iraq.

www.newhousenews.com...
Until recently, efforts to squeeze coastal protection money out of Washington have met with resistance. The Louisiana congressional delegation urged Congress earlier this year to dedicate a stream of federal money to Louisiana's coast, only to be opposed by the White House. Ultimately a deal was struck to steer $540 million to the state over four years. The total coast of repair work is estimated to be $14 billion.
In its budget, the Bush administration had also proposed a significant reduction in funding for southeast Louisiana's chief hurricane protection project. Bush proposed $10.4 million, a sixth of what local officials say they need.

www.findarticles.com...
In fiscal year 2006, the New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers is bracing for a record $71.2 million reduction in federal funding.

It would be the largest single-year funding loss ever for the New Orleans district, Corps officials said.

I've been here over 30 years and I've never seen this level of reduction, said Al Naomi, project manager for the New Orleans district. I think part of the problem is it's not so much the reduction, it's the drastic reduction in one fiscal year. It's the immediacy of the reduction that I think is the hardest thing to adapt to.

There is an economic ripple effect, too. The cuts mean major hurricane and flood protection projects will not be awarded to local engineering firms. Also, a study to determine ways to protect the region from a Category 5 hurricane has been shelved for now.

www.philly.com...
For the first time in 37 years, federal budget cuts have all but stopped major work on the New Orleans area's east bank hurricane levees, a complex network of concrete walls, metal gates and giant earthen berms that won't be finished for at least another decade.

www.tpmcafe.com...
The Bush administration's proposed fiscal 2005 budget includes only $3.9 million for the east bank hurricane project. Congress likely will increase that amount, although last year it bumped up the administration's $3 million proposal only to $5.5 million.

"I needed $11 million this year, and I got $5.5 million," Naomi said. "I need $22.5 million next year to do everything that needs doing, and the first $4.5 million of that will go to pay four contractors who couldn't get paid this year."

The challenge now, said emergency management chiefs Walter Maestri in Jefferson Parish and Terry Tullier in New Orleans, is for southeast Louisiana somehow to persuade those who control federal spending that protection from major storms and flooding are matters of homeland security.

"It appears that the money has been moved in the president's budget to handle homeland security and the war in Iraq, and I suppose that's the price we pay," Maestri said. "Nobody locally is happy that the levees can't be finished, and we are doing everything we can to make the case that this is a security issue for us."

Levee-raising is only part of the flood-related work that has stopped since the federal government began reducing Corps of Engineers appropriations in 2001, as more money was diverted to homeland security, the fight against terrorism and the war in Iraq.

www.editorandpublisher.com...
The Corps never tried to hide the fact that the spending pressures of the war in Iraq, as well as homeland security -- coming at the same time as federal tax cuts -- was the reason for the strain. At least nine articles in the Times-Picayune from 2004 and 2005 specifically cite the cost of Iraq as a reason for the lack of hurricane- and flood-control dollars.

www.politicalaffairs.net...
In Louisiana, specifically, local officials fought for, begged for, and demanded federal funding to implement hurricane defense plans that could have avoided the widespread flooding of New Orleans.

But the Bush administration has continuously slashed funding for those projects. Robert Hartwig, chief economist for the Insurance Information Institute, was quoted early last week in Newhouse News Service as saying, "It’s going to be very evident that there were an enormous number of vulnerabilities that weren’t addressed."
In general, funding for construction has been on a downward trend for the past several years, said Marcia Demma, chief of the New Orleans Corps' programs management branch.

In 2001, the New Orleans district spent $147 million on construction projects. When fiscal year 2005 wraps up Sept. 30, the Corps expects to have spent $82 million, a 44.2 percent reduction from 2001 expenditures.

The Bush administration’s shift in concern to the "war on terrorism" and its war on Iraq have forced states to shoulder more of the responsibility to provide support for natural disasters and emergencies. Unfortunately, state budget shortfalls, fueled by cuts in direct grants to states on many levels, have meant fewer dollars for emergency management programs. In fiscal year 2004, the average budget for a state emergency management agency was $40.8 million, a 23 percent reduction from fiscal year 2003.

In an effort that showed the President’s personal lack of concern for natural disaster preparedness, Bush called for cutting the federal percentage of large-scale natural disaster preparedness expenditures from 75 percent of such costs, with states and municipalities funding the other 25 percent, to a 50 percent federal responsibility.

For Louisiana directly, Bush rejected pleas from the state’s congressional delegation urged Congress earlier this year to dedicate a stream of federal money to Louisiana’s coast. Ultimately a deal was struck to steer $540 million to the state over four years, far short of the needed estimated of $14 billion. In its budget, the Bush administration also proposed only $10.4 million in funding, a sixth of what local officials say they needed for southeast Louisiana’s chief hurricane protection project.

And this one would have been very funny if it wasn’t so tragically serious:
www.wonkette.com...
We're naming it Lake George, 'cause it's his frickin fault. Have you seen all that data about the levee projects' funding being cut over the past three years by the Prez, and the funding transferred to Iraq? The levee, as designed, might not have held back the surge from a direct Class 5 hit, but it certainly would not have crumbled on Monday night from saturation and scour erosion following a glancing blow from a Class 3. The failure was in a spot that had just been rebuilt, not yet compacted, not planted, and not armed (hardened with rock/concrete). The project should have been done two years ago, but the federal gov't diverted 80% of the funding to Iraq. Other areas had settled by a few feet from their design specs, and the money to repair them was diverted to Iraq.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird

Originally posted by Roth Joint
What it's about is our present Administration playing the BIGGEST "blame game" here. We do have a "leader" don't we? Is he afraid to take his responsibility as our "leader" so suddenly? Why didn’t our well informed President “leader” in 2005 leave Crawford, Texas, a bit sooner so that he could coordinate efforts Monday, rather than wait until Wednesday?

Why? Because that's not his job.
Here's what happens after a major disaster:

You still don’t seem to get the picture do you?

Apart from his desire to cut funding for levee maintenance and development... I ask again:

WHERE WAS OUR PRESIDENT “LEADER” ON DAY 1?

Where was our well prepared and well informed President “leader” in 2005 on Day 1 of the New Orleans tragedy?
This was a catastrophic situation that needed a wartime response from Day 1 !

So where was our great "leader?" then...

[edit on 7-9-2005 by Roth Joint]

Originally posted by XPhiles
ThatsJustWeird

Titor is and has always been a fictional character in a fictional story. Stop taking what he said as fact. It's not. Period.

ThatsJustWeird since you seem so sure Titor is a hoax, please give some facts then go collect your $100.00 at anomalies.net
Tell us when you win the money.

Good Luck, so far no one has proven Titor a hoax

$100.00 JT Hoax Contest " I Put Up"
communities.anomalies.net...

How about this, if you can prove Titor is real, I'll give you $200.00
It's not about proving he's a hoax, it's about proving he's real.

I have made 2 posts to this thread that didn't show up

Ok if JT civil was is citizens vs. fed government, witch part of our society would side with the fed government, most likely those that are siding with it now, like those that support the BS war in Iraq, and those that feel that 9/11 had something to do with Iraq, those that feel gays should not have rights, those that side with pat robertson, and his warped view of the world......ok just a thought


peace

Originally posted by LDragonFire
I have made 2 posts to this thread that didn't show up

Ok if JT civil was is citizens vs. fed government, witch part of our society would side with the fed government, most likely those that are siding with it now, like those that support the BS war in Iraq, and those that feel that 9/11 had something to do with Iraq, those that feel gays should not have rights, those that side with pat robertson, and his warped view of the world......ok just a thought


peace

I know what you mean, i made a post yesterday on this topic and it disapeared too!

I think you are right! There is a reason why the Europeans kicked the Puritans out of Europe!

We made a big mistake in letting the Christian right Take control over this country through the Republican Party. The Republican Party has almost Total Control of our government. The Checks and Balances are were put there for a reason and with the Chief Justice dying now the Republicans have control over every section of our Federal Government.

It will take years to restore the balance of power.

The Christian Right should never be allowed to be in power. They are fanatical and Power Hungry, looking to fulfill the Book of Revelations.

We need to give the Libertarian Party a Boost and take back our country through democratic means.

If you want Answers to why the Government is Purposely letting people die in New Orleans, then Read this intelligence report from Russian source!

www.whatdoesitmean.com...

I posted this in its own thread, but ATS Mod Gool moved it to the trash bin. Ats is involved in the cover-up and censorship!

Originally posted by Where2Hide2006
If you want Answers to why the Government is Purposely letting people die in New Orleans, then Read this intelligence report from Russian source!

www.whatdoesitmean.com...

I posted this in its own thread, but ATS Mod Gool moved it to the trash bin. Ats is involved in the cover-up and censorship!

If it's real... a major natural disaster will happen soon... maybe a Tsunami? HAARP powaaa

I'm going to try and stop reading this thread for a while. It absolutely saddens me that there are so many stupid and gullible people in the US. I'm almost to the point of tears. People believing every little thing that comes across their computer screens. I truely fear for America. I fear not what could come from Civil War, we can overcome that. But I fear the gullibility so many Americans have. Being so willing to believe everything is extremely dangerous. And extremely hard to break.
Roth: Wow. This is a place to deny ignorance not spread propaganda.
Info from people who know what they're talking about
(just a side note and way off topic: building the levees higher raises the water level and still wouldn't protect if from a large cat 5 storm. You'd just have worst flooding. I'm not sure what they'll do in this case, especially with alot of the city below sea level. Have two sets of levees maybe?)
Wiki
www.msnbc.msn.com...
Bottom line: hindsight is always 20/20

Where was our well prepared and well informed President “leader” in 2005 on Day 1 of the New Orleans tragedy?
This was a catastrophic situation that needed a wartime response from Day 1

wtf
Did you not read what I wrote earlier? Are you filled with that much blind hatred?

Dragon and Where2hide:
Where are you getting these dreams about the Christian right taking over from? lol
There is a 100% more likely hood that the Christian right will become slaves than them taking over the country or world or whatever. In every major issue they deal with, the lose.

btw, if you can find 2 people in this world who agree with Pat Robertson on everything he says....then.....well......I wouldn't believe you


Where2Hide....there's a good reason why that crap is in the trashbin. Please tell me you believe that. I want to confirm something.



Anyway Back on track....Titor....