Brexit, Today is the Vote!

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: ScepticScot

You can't just keep moving the goalposts to suit. There's your answer.

Actually doesn't answer anything.

What goal posts have moved?

originally posted by: Freeborn

What would be different about this referendum than the first referendum?

As i said earlier, the only point of another referendum would be to actually ask people what they want from Brexit. And then deliver on it.

Not ask if we should leave or not, that has already been decided.

As a simple example (we have discussed this many times mate) i only know 1 person who wants to ditch the Customs Union wheras you know lots that do - this is mirrored all over the country and allows the politicians to weasel out of decisions. So we ask people what they want, get the results, majority wins and hey presto they have a manifesto to deliver on, regardless of party affiliations.

The other (added) bonus from this is that any politician railing against the results would be highlighted to the nation as the self serving incompetent feck wits that they really are.

a reply to: ScepticScot

The majority of people voted to leave the EU, hence the reason the 2 year notice period was given to the EU.

That's why it's taken 2 years from the issuance of Article 50.. it was well known at the time of the People's Vote to leave the EU. The decision is made.

You've not given any valid reason or made any sense as to why a 2nd Referendum is needed.

a reply to: ScepticScot

The "Keep voting until you get the result you want and then stop voting" goal posts - them's the ones.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: ScepticScot

The "Keep voting until you get the result you want and then stop voting" goal posts - them's the ones.

Is that really a thing? Does this mean i may actually get to be Milk Monitor a mere 40 odd years later?

So looks like there will not be a second referendum, and May has categorically said she will not be revoking article 50. Looks like the May has decided to go down with the ship.

originally posted by: Flavian

originally posted by: Freeborn

What would be different about this referendum than the first referendum?

As i said earlier, the only point of another referendum would be to actually ask people what they want from Brexit. And then deliver on it.

I think that would be fine.
Separating the top 5 issues would not be a bad thing - as long as those issues were properly defined and proposed solutions to those issues carried no consequences that undermined the sovereignty of the UK (as the terrible May deal did). In other words the core of Brexit needs to be maintained - not one single shred of power given to Brussels over the UK.

originally posted by: maddy21
So looks like there will not be a second referendum, and May has categorically said she will not be revoking article 50. Looks like the May has decided to go down with the ship.

Nope.

There is currently no motion in parliament for a second referendum.

It's possible though that we might have a general election.

Its also looking more likely that Article 50 will be extended.

a reply to: Flavian

If it makes you happy - go on then. And don't forget the Lincoln biscuits.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: ScepticScot

The "Keep voting until you get the result you want and then stop voting" goal posts - them's the ones.

Apparently we should just keep changing the law based on the musings of people just turning 18... whatever they want.
Given the mind of an 18 year old, that might actually be fun for a couple of years, but it would turn into a complete disaster.

a reply to: UKTruth

The majority of the people reside in London through.

Put it this way, just about nobody in Scotland wants Brexit to transpire, especially not a hard Brexit.

I imagine it's a similar story just about everywhere else in the UK bar London and middle England.

But that's where the majority of our population reside.

originally posted by: oldcarpy
a reply to: Flavian

If it makes you happy - go on then. And don't forget the Lincoln biscuits.

I'm not still bitter about it.

Honestly.

Now please excuse me whilst i sort my twitching eye out and push this lump back in my neck that seems to have appeared.......

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: UKTruth

The majority of the people reside in London through.

Put it this way, just about nobody in Scotland wants Brexit to transpire, especially not a hard Brexit.

I imagine it a similar story just about everywhere else in the UK bar London and middle England.

But that's where the majority of our population reside.

Most of London want to remain actually because of the impact its going to have on the finance sector when they lose passporting rights to the EU in a hard Brexit.

a reply to: UKTruth

I am starting to think it is the only way to get any sort of proper consensus to set out our position as a nation. Quite simply, each camp has too many subdivisions of opinion - there can't be any consensus with the current method. Which in turn means we can't have a coherent position.

Leave is happening - that is set in stone. So let's actually discuss what we want from Leave.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Already answered,

Err, no you haven't.

Was the first referendum undemocratic?
Was it illegal?
Was it misleading?

Straight forward questions that require simple Yes/No answers.

New voters don't invalidate elections, but we do keep having elections....

Not without the result of the first election being implemented and the party with most seats forms a government.
Under certain circumstances the government can call a snap election or a parliamentary vote of no confidence can result in an early election.

Otherwise governments have a fixed 5 year term after which a General Election is called.

Nothing about new voters or voters changing their minds.

The key point is that the result of ALL ballots are enacted before any new election.....why should this referendum be any different?
Please explain.


If the majority of people want to stay in the EU do you think we should still leave?

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

My understanding is that the city of London, where all the finance sector institutions are located, is a nation in its own right anyway, with its own separate rules and regulation at play.

I can see your point where the passport situation is concerned all the same.

End of the day i think we all just wish to know what the hell is bloody going on and what is going to happen because this crap is simply tedious in the extreme.

Second referendum and be done with it.

The EU referendum was the biggest IQ test done on the UK public without our prior knowledge or permission.

The results are in, 52% (17,410,742) of the UK voting public is as thick as elephant #.

a reply to: Freeborn

"If the majority of people want to stay in the EU do you think we should still leave?"

Well if they feel that way and we do then it's hardly a democracy.

Then again we live under a Monarchy at the end of the day, not a democracy, no matter which way "They" care to spell it.

a reply to: andy06shake

The majority of the people reside in London through.

Yes.

Put it this way, just about nobody in Scotland wants Brexit to transpire, especially not a hard Brexit.

Yes, I understand that.
It's the same as Northern Ireland and it is a genuine concern for any reasonably minded person.

The way things are at present I can't offer any easy solutions.

I imagine it's a similar story just about everywhere else in the UK bar London and middle England.

Not true.
London voted 60/40 in favour of remaining in the EU.

London, Scotland and Northern Ireland were the only regions of the UK to vote for remaining in the UK.
Everywhere else voted to leave.

www.bbc.co.uk...

a reply to: Freeborn

London, Scotland and Northern Ireland were the only regions of the UK to vote for remaining in the UK.
Everywhere else voted to leave.

Ohhh you missed out a few....

Bristol: LEAVE 38.3% REMAIN: 61.7%
Leeds: LEAVE: 49.7% REMAIN: 50.3%
Liverpool: LEAVE: 41.8% REMAIN: 58.2%
London: LEAVE: 40.1% REMAIN: 59.9%
Manchester: LEAVE: 39.6% REMAIN: 60.4%
Cardiff: LEAVE: 40% REMAIN: 60%

Also Newcastle....

Link


So yeah lets not pretend this was just a Scottish, Irish and London thing because its wasn't.