Toronto Van Attack Suspect Likely Motivated by "Involuntary Celibacy"

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
Atsbhct

4chan is a dangerous collective of incels and Keklords just waiting for an excuse to kill or maim those they despise, particularly women, gays, trans individuals and Muslims. They're all absolutely insane and must be actively monitored to prevent tragedies like this from occurring.

At least that's my opinion.

*shrug*

Kind of goes down the path of thought police and removing people's rights... You can't stop crazy until it happens.

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
Grambler

Because, heretofore, left leaning groups haven't committed murder with a vehicle. If you don't believe these incel Keklords are dangerous then you're either A) one of them yourself or B) talking out of your ass.

Oh so its only murder with a vehicle that matters?

So when the shoot up republicans like scalise playing ball, thats no big deal?

When a bernie supporter kills people by slashing their throat, no big deal?

Please, you arbitrary stance is laughable, and a thinly veiled attempt to pretend their is only extremist violence on one side.

Grambler

Perhaps, but that's opinion on the matter.

However, I will admit that I have a very strong bias against 4chan.

Furthermore, I think it's quite funny that you seem to solely equate incels with the right. At least you know where you stand.

Ha!

Xtrozero

No, but you can sure as hell look at it and say, "yeah, that guy is a danger to society"

Otherwise, what's the point of intelligence operations at all?

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
Grambler

Perhaps, but that's opinion on the matter.

However, I will admit that I have a very strong bias against 4chan.

Furthermore, I think it's quite funny that you seem to solely equate incels with the right. At least you know where you stand.

Ha!

I equate 4chan and keklords with the right, I would say thats fair

I am glad you are unabashedly partisan and seek to only monitor those you deem to be in the other side of you politically.

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
Xtrozero

No, but you can sure as hell look at it and say, "yeah, that guy is a danger to society"

Otherwise, what's the point of intelligence operations at all?

It is hard to say that until a person acts out... Before he acted out he was just a sexually frustrated guy, and then one day he snaps and gets a van...

Grambler

I'm not on the left either. I never mentioned partisan politics at all, that's on you.

I just happen to opine that Incels and Keklords are far more dangerous (in a physical capacity not a political capacity) then say Antifa or any myriad of gay rights activists.

Again that's my opinion and you are welcome to disagree till you're blue (or green, as the case may be) in the face.

Xtrozero

You're right. When you're right, you're right.

*shrug*

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Aazadan

Wonder how many of them actually had fathers in their lives?

Young black men have gangs ... young white men go incel.

From the ones I've known, and the reading I've done on the community, most of them actually.

The majority of people who make up this group, are upset because they're in the demographics that should be successful romantically and financially but they aren't. They have good family lives, often very supportive families (this is a class of people who often do live in their parents basement), grew up middle class or better, either went to college or had the opportunity to goto college. And yet, things didn't work out for them.

originally posted by: ketsuko
Long and short of it is that at some point their upbringing failed them and that's why they are what they are now.

According to incel belief, that is not true. They believe girls can and do have sex whenever they want, with whoever they want.

As I said before, it's quite common among the incel community for straight people to have gay hookups because that community tends to be promiscous and they can find people to have sex with them on dating websites.

Aazadan

That describes the incels I've argued with to a tee. They're almost always rich (or close enough), pampered mama's boys that have been handed everything they own to them on a silver platter, no work ethic to speak of and social skills that make Hodor seem like a well versed conversationalist.

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: CagliostroTheGreat

i disagree.

How would this be any different than saying we need to monitor all far left outlets that advocate violence against right wing people?

You raise a good point and I would respond that the main difference is in the degree of radicalization within the community. Bernie Sanders supporters? They're left, but they're not the type of radicals who think the best way to get Bernie elected would be to murder people in Hillary districts, and I don't think any leaders of the Bernie crowd were suggesting that, or that they even had such a potential. The incel crowd is a powder keg, but there is serious potential there if the right charismatic leader comes along with the right message.

The message is that "you should have X, Y took it, go take it back". I didn't believe it at the time, but in hindsight, I think this group would have taken up arms for Trump, had Trump asked for it if he lost the election. Bannons message, being delivered by someone charismatic carries a lot of resonance with this crowd.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: CagliostroTheGreat

i disagree.

How would this be any different than saying we need to monitor all far left outlets that advocate violence against right wing people?

You raise a good point and I would respond that the main difference is in the degree of radicalization within the community. Bernie Sanders supporters? They're left, but they're not the type of radicals who think the best way to get Bernie elected would be to murder people in Hillary districts, and I don't think any leaders of the Bernie crowd were suggesting that, or that they even had such a potential. The incel crowd is a powder keg, but there is serious potential there if the right charismatic leader comes along with the right message.

The message is that "you should have X, Y took it, go take it back". I didn't believe it at the time, but in hindsight, I think this group would have taken up arms for Trump, had Trump asked for it if he lost the election. Bannons message, being delivered by someone charismatic carries a lot of resonance with this crowd.

We see tyhe same thing on the left, with groups like antifa.

Have you seen the MSM support incel violence, or make excuses for it?

I saw them do that for antifa. I saw professors galore say violence is justified against trump supporters.

The point is there are extremists on all sides.

Aazadan

You mean like this?



I'm all for defending the Constitution but the level of sycophancy involved is frightening.

I had more like this but unfortunately I seem to have misplaced them...

Grambler

I have seen the right say two completely different things regarding Antifa, either they are violent extremists that present an immediate and fundamental threat to our country or they are a group of softie beta soy boys that can barely lift a whacking stick, so... Which is it?

a reply to: Grambler

I haven't seen excuses made for Antifa. I also haven't seen them be violent as a whole. At the most they've shown up to protest with weapons, but if the 2nd amendment folks are to be taken at their word, that's not violence, that's just reminding people you're there.

originally posted by: CagliostroTheGreat
Grambler

I have seen the right say two completely different things regarding Antifa, either they are violent extremists that present an immediate and fundamental threat to our country or they are a group of softie beta soy boys that can barely lift a whacking stick, so... Which is it?

I dont care what "the right" says.

I have seen them engage in violence, and have seen prominent people downplay or defend that violence.

You are the one who wants to monitor entire websites and groups of people based on the fact that one nut may have been connected to them (which you have shown no proof he was on 4chan that I have seen)

Grambler

Oh, so know you don't want to talk partisanship, okay, weird, but okay.

With regard to Alek Minassian having ties to 4chan, I don't have any. I never said this idiot was on 4chan (even though I thoroughly believe he is), just that the majority of its users are, without reprieve, incels and Keklords.

By the way, if you honestly believe that 4chan isn't already being monitored along with ATS you're not nearly as clever as you think... The FBI already knows 4chan is a powderkeg for far-right radicalization.

originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: Grambler

I haven't seen excuses made for Antifa. I also haven't seen them be violent as a whole. At the most they've shown up to protest with weapons, but if the 2nd amendment folks are to be taken at their word, that's not violence, that's just reminding people you're there.

But you have seen incel be violent as a whole?

And yes, the media and many left wiong activists did make excuses or downplay antifa.

Cnn had to scrub their article about Antifa bring peace through violence.

Many examples of Milo deserving what he got at berkely when inncoent boys and girls were beaten by antifa.

Many professors saying by any means neccessary saying violence is ok.

The guardian posting videos saying antifa and groups like them are right, and it is ok to punch a nazi.

And on and on.

There was even almost univeral denouncing of anyone who said that antifa type groups at charlottesville were wrong as well.

I've been married for 11 years and we have 2 kids.

I know EXACTLY how this guy feels.