Parents may face charges, hogtie 'predator' who wanted sex with 13-year-old daughter

Are you a pedo? Whats wrong with you!? Few issues are as black and white as an adult trying to meet a child with the intent to insert their penis into the childs orifices. You should be reported.

9a reply to: Aazadan

originally posted by: lakenheath24
Are you a pedo? Whats wrong with you!? Few issues are as black and white as an adult trying to meet a child with the intent to insert their penis into the childs orifices. You should be reported.

9a reply to: Aazadan

Seems like paedo talk to me.
I don't know anyone who thinks paedo hunters catching men who solicit children for sex is harrassment.

originally posted by: lakenheath24
Are you a pedo? Whats wrong with you!? Few issues are as black and white as an adult trying to meet a child with the intent to insert their penis into the childs orifices. You should be reported.

9a reply to: Aazadan

So you're letting the seriousness of the charge justify how someone should be treated after an accusation rather than letting the courts go through due process, produce a verdict, and sentence if guilty?

That's an utterly ridiculous way to run a society.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
Seems like paedo talk to me.
I don't know anyone who thinks paedo hunters catching men who solicit children for sex is harrassment.

But you think it would be ok for other crimes? What if I'm a store owner and set something out that appears to be easy to steal, but use a hidden camera just so I can capture people stealing it and apprehend them? That happens in society too, especially in some of those societies where they chop ones hand off for stealing. Some people just like to see others punished.

Do you think that's a healthy mindset for society? I don't. You're just justifying it because this particular crime greatly offends you.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
Seems like paedo talk to me.
I don't know anyone who thinks paedo hunters catching men who solicit children for sex is harrassment.

But you think it would be ok for other crimes? What if I'm a store owner and set something out that appears to be easy to steal, but use a hidden camera just so I can capture people stealing it and apprehend them? That happens in society too, especially in some of those societies where they chop ones hand off for stealing. Some people just like to see others punished.

Do you think that's a healthy mindset for society? I don't. You're just justifying it because this particular crime greatly offends you.

If your a store owner and you set something out and someone comes along and steals it ... I'm guessing you have a pretty sold case if you apprehend the theft and if you've also set up a camera that captures the theft in action.

Store owners do that all the time. They set out their items where people can interact with them prior to the purchase; this also makes it easy to steal said items and is a common problem for store owners. As a result the owners set up cameras and attempt to apprehend the theft and hold them until the police show up... that's how shop lifting works and is deterid.

originally posted by: DanDanDat
Also I realize you didn't say the part about the 75 year old man. That was my point at which the finer details become relevant... when the events in the article are completely wrong then the those points become relevant.

When I said "I didn't say that" I meant that I didn't say that the whole story could be bogus. I didn't even say that some of it could be bogus, I'm assuming the woman told her truth and the police did the same.

A) "the man was there to meet at 13 year old girl" or B) "the man was there to meet someone other than a 13 year old girl" ... if he was there to meet a 13 year old girl than "the door being open" or "how he knew where her room was" or even "what the mom asked of the police" are all irrelevant to the fact that the man was there to meet a 13 year old girl.

Is it illegal for an adult to meet a minor? If it's not then how he was invited is relevant. Did the mother (pretending to be the girl) said she accepted to have sex with him and the man's answer was going to meet her? That shows intent on the man's part to have sex with the girl. But if the mother only asked him to meet her (supposedly the girl) then how can the man be accused of any illegal action?

Some of your points might be good to explain why the parents where arrested; and they will no doubt be important to the whether or not the parents are convicted of assault. Its clear the parents made a few mistakes in this exchange. But the unanswered questions they don't come close to posibly explaining away the mans actions.

The only actions from the man we know really happened was that he went to the girl's home and to the girl's room. Just that.

originally posted by: Aazadan
What if I'm a store owner and set something out that appears to be easy to steal, but use a hidden camera just so I can capture people stealing it and apprehend them?

Happens every day, the UK is pretty CCTV'd up to the hilt. Civilians detain thieves and all manner of people all the time, but if you are comparing store thieves to paedo's then you really do need to think again in terms of the damage to victims.

originally posted by: Aazadan
Baiting people into committing a crime is not due process, the person who tempts is even more guilty than the tempted.

I think you are missing a point here: the paedo hunters do nothing special, they wait for the paedo to bait himself.

If the actions of the paedo hunters are the same as those of girls (that's the whole idea), do you think girls bait the paedos?

'We will work with so-called paedophile hunters', vows police chief.

Officers will work with so-called paedophile hunters because any other move would ‘lose in the court of public opinion’, a police boss has said.

Too many paedo's and not enough police so the obvious answer is citizens plugging the gap.

a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

Read that quote again, "lose in the court of public opinon", not justice... opinion. Pedo's are very unpopular, double standards are often applied to them.

a reply to: Aazadan

Oh I totally understood court of public opinion, make no mistake about that.
The public expect the police to work with paedo hunters now, and they are going down that road because it is legal for them to do so.
Why do you seem to be defending paedos?
Are you against citizens and police working together to catch paedos?

a reply to: Aazadan

I think I understand your point of view, everybody has the same rights, including people suspect of crimes, but those paedo hunters are doing it the same way police does, so if the actions of the police are OK so are those of the paedo hunters.

originally posted by: ArMaP
a reply to: Aazadan

I think I understand your point of view, everybody has the same rights, including people suspect of crimes, but those paedo hunters are doing it the same way police does, so if the actions of the police are OK so are those of the paedo hunters.

I don't agree with police tactics in these cases either, but I see that as a different argument as part of an ethical debate against sting operations as a whole. In any case, I think it would make sense that if I have problems with sting operations in a general sense, it would be very obvious why I have problems with non law enforcement carrying them out.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
Why do you seem to be defending paedos?
Are you against citizens and police working together to catch paedos?

I'm against sting operations.
I'm against non law enforcement playing cop.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
Why do you seem to be defending paedos?
Are you against citizens and police working together to catch paedos?

I'm against sting operations.
I'm against non law enforcement playing cop.

Why? It's legal, and it works at catching paedos. I don't see the problem when within the law.

A bit ridiculous going to all that trouble when the typical response is to shoot, shovel, shut-up. Nobody knows anything, no story, no thing, just vanished.

originally posted by: ArMaP

originally posted by: DanDanDat
Also I realize you didn't say the part about the 75 year old man. That was my point at which the finer details become relevant... when the events in the article are completely wrong then the those points become relevant.

When I said "I didn't say that" I meant that I didn't say that the whole story could be bogus. I didn't even say that some of it could be bogus, I'm assuming the woman told her truth and the police did the same.

A) "the man was there to meet at 13 year old girl" or B) "the man was there to meet someone other than a 13 year old girl" ... if he was there to meet a 13 year old girl than "the door being open" or "how he knew where her room was" or even "what the mom asked of the police" are all irrelevant to the fact that the man was there to meet a 13 year old girl.

Is it illegal for an adult to meet a minor? If it's not then how he was invited is relevant. Did the mother (pretending to be the girl) said she accepted to have sex with him and the man's answer was going to meet her? That shows intent on the man's part to have sex with the girl. But if the mother only asked him to meet her (supposedly the girl) then how can the man be accused of any illegal action?

Some of your points might be good to explain why the parents where arrested; and they will no doubt be important to the whether or not the parents are convicted of assault. Its clear the parents made a few mistakes in this exchange. But the unanswered questions they don't come close to posibly explaining away the mans actions.

The only actions from the man we know really happened was that he went to the girl's home and to the girl's room. Just that.

There are NO legitimate reasons for a man to go to 13 year old room with out the explicit consent of the 13 year olds parents. ... except maybe if he's a firefighter reporting to a fire.

So if we assume it really happened that the man went to the girls room ... then we also need to assume he intended to molest her.

originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: CornishCeltGuy

Read that quote again, "lose in the court of public opinon", not justice... opinion. Pedo's are very unpopular, double standards are often applied to them.

... for good reason?

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
Why? It's legal, and it works at catching paedos. I don't see the problem when within the law.

With regards to (any) sting operations, which is the bigger issue. It's something that's very questionable ethically. I see them all as entrapment.

a reply to: Aazadan

I understand your position..generally, however I have not much of an issue entrapping people who would molest our children..it's not the kind of thing a normal/good person gets trapped in.