Can you prove evolution wrong? -- Part 2

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: Phantom423

I am not clear on this either. Sykes comments are themselves interesting "In 2015, Sykes reported that he had undertaken DNA tests on saliva samples of six of Zana's living relatives and a tooth of her deceased son Khwit and concluded that Zana was 100% African but not of any known group, refuting the theory that she was a runaway Ottoman slave. Rather, he believes her ancestors left Africa approximately 100,000 years ago and lived in the remote Caucasus for many generations." (1)

Surprising yes. Nenderthal? No. Indeed Sub Saharan means there was no Denisovian or Neanderthal involved.

(1) Was 19th Century apewoman a yeti? 6ft 6in Russian serf who could outrun a horse was 'not human', according to DNA tests, retrieved 06 April 2015.

I have to research it tomorrow. If she had a female child, the mitochondrial gene could be sequenced and compared to other humans. The story, coming out of Russia at that time period, is sure to be unreliable. Have to see where the remains are and who/how they were analyzed. She probably was a slave under the Ottomans in Azerbaijan. I'll look into it more tomorrow.

originally posted by: wildespace

originally posted by: testingtesting
a reply to: wildespace

Wow what is that in your Avatar?.

It's Kinesin, a protein that transports molecules around your cells, by "walking" along the microtubules. en.wikipedia.org...

www.youtube.com...

Great!

a reply to: All Seeing Eye

Yes she may have. HOWEVER still human. Homo sapien human. It still has nothing to do with evolution and how it is taught.

You are creating a straw man.

a reply to: Phantom423

Actually I think they HAVE looked at the mitochondrial DNA, and its not from one of the known Clades ("Clans"). The inference was they had migrated north many thousands of years previously. The DNA was all human however. This is based from descendants. Her remains are "lost". Which is convenient.

originally posted by: AngryCymraeg

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: AngryCymraeg

Do you think you came from a monkey? Do you think your monkey ancestor was special and able to evolve into a human while the other moneys were too dumb and stayed behind to stay monkeys? Maybe somewhere down the line a human donked a monkey and a child was able to be born, but they didn't evolve into monkeys.

...... Ever read a book on this subject? Please do, it will explain a few things. For instance we share a common ancestor with the great apes. There's a difference.

Yeah I know what the books say man. I just don't buy into the whole farce that I was evolved from a monkey. But here's the thing, Neanderthals interbred with modern humans as far back as 100,000 years ago according to other studies and as recently as last week, researchers uncovered the jawbone of a modern human that is estimated to be between 177,000 and 194,000 years old in a cave in Israel. They say that homo sapiens could be as old as 500,000 years. So possibly 500,000 years and yet the only thing that's evolved is technology and we're not evolving into anything else. I'll let you put two and two together but I firmly believe that the only way a human came from a monkey is if they mated.

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: LSU0408

Oh and how is this more believable? You seem to not know the first thing about biology, let alone evolution.

Because it's stupid to think we came from monkeys just because our DNA is similar.

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: odzeandennz
can evolutionists tell me where or how consciousness evolved, or why only one species seemed to have developed this. why aren't there more like us, why don't we have a natural predator, why don't we have a mating season for reproduction like every species known to man.

A more believable instance would be a male monkey sleeping with a female human and the human bearing the child that had more human traits than monkey since supposedly the DNA in a human and monkey is close. Evolution is ignorant though, and unproven.

LOL Evolution is ignorant and unproven? I'm laughing that you said it was ignorant. There has been so much research into evolution. Scientific research...that is the exact opposite of ignorant.

There is so much research, data, evidence on evolution. But as I always ask, what is the alternative theory? How are we here?

Do you honestly think that you once belonged to a group of monkeys and swung through trees with them? Very very ignorant. Evolution isn't a fact, it's a theory, I assume you understand the difference. Hundreds of thousands of years and we haven't evolved. I guess it decided on its own to stop, right? You keep your science, I'll keep my common sense.

originally posted by: wildespace
a reply to: LSU0408
Why do all creationists say that, if evolution were true, all apes and monkeys should have evolved into humans?

That's not how evolution works.

Amphibians evolved out of fish, but there are still fish around. Reptiles evolved out of amphibians, but there are still amphibians around. Mammals evolved out of reptiles, but there are still reptiles around.

Evolution doesnt just take the original organism and evolves it towards some end-result.

Right, and a Pekingese and Poodle evolved into a Pek-a-poo but Pekingese and Poodles are still around. I get it. But dude, we're not amphibians or reptiles and we only compare to mammals because we're warm-blooded, have hair and our women give live birth and produce milk. I guess it's not odd to you that we're superior to other mammals though. We just happened to evolve from a dumb ape (that has to be trained to do what we do) and just so happened to be the only intelligent species capable of advancing on our intelligence, eh?

originally posted by: All Seeing Eye

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: AngryCymraeg

Do you think you came from a monkey? Do you think your monkey ancestor was special and able to evolve into a human while the other moneys were too dumb and stayed behind to stay monkeys? Maybe somewhere down the line a human donked a monkey and a child was able to be born, but they didn't evolve into monkeys.

It looks like that might be a bit of logic "they" wish not to debate.

I point out that most certainly "Bestiality" did occur. Its just that some folks are rather "Ashamed" of what they did, and refuse to show their faces, in the light of day. Did I just say that? (Monkey Humpers. LOL LOL)

Not just any monkey as Neanderthal was more human than any other primate. The story of Zana, if true, and I have no reason to consider the story to be a fabrication, displays the process of natural creation, not evolution. But again, the first 3 billion years of this planets history is wide open to natural Evolution.

So, could it be true that Zana was actually a Neanderthal who wondered away from her tribe of highly illusive, intelligent leftovers? A awful lot of sightings of "Bigfoot" globally. Nothing is settled!

You have to give the Bigfoot credit in that they are intelligent enough, to stay away from us . lol lol lol

Agreed. It's not like there was an abundance of choices back then and nobody knew bestiality was bad or immoral so when desperate times called for desperate measures, I'm sure many humans partook in the action. Bigfoot is interesting because scientists love to discount its existence yet you can find sightings of Bigfoot that go back a long long time. Same theory can be applied there. Interbreeding between a female human and male monkey would lead to the mother taking care of the child and the child breeding later with another human, whereas if a male human interbred with a female monkey, that female monkey would take care of the child which would breed with monkeys. Who's to say the genes didn't keep it walking upright and keep its human traits?

Evolution is just one of many theories. It's always funny to see the die hard science folks accept one theory but aggressively reject any other theory. Maybe it's the monkey genes coming out

a reply to: Noinden

Evolution is a theory, a system of ideas. You can believe it if you wish, but you can't get pissed off just because someone else doesn't buy into that same system of ideas.

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: Noinden

Evolution is a theory, a system of ideas. You can believe it if you wish, but you can't get pissed off just because someone else doesn't buy into that same system of ideas.

But not once has it been disproven in this thread or any other thread on this forum. Over 500 pages of waffling and no closer to discrediting evolution than when this website was started.

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: LSU0408

Oh and how is this more believable? You seem to not know the first thing about biology, let alone evolution.

Because it's stupid to think we came from monkeys just because our DNA is similar.

We didn't come from monkeys, we came from primate ancestors that modern monkeys also came from.

This isn't based solely on DNA similarities, it's based on paleontology and many other fields of science.

Evolution is a theory, a system of ideas.

A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment. Such fact-supported theories are not "guesses" but reliable accounts of the real world. The theory of biological evolution is more than "just a theory". It is as factual an explanation of the universe as the atomic theory of matter or the germ theory of disease. Our understanding of gravity is still a work in progress. But the phenomenon of gravity, like evolution, is an accepted fact.

Evolution as fact and theory

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: odzeandennz
can evolutionists tell me where or how consciousness evolved, or why only one species seemed to have developed this. why aren't there more like us, why don't we have a natural predator, why don't we have a mating season for reproduction like every species known to man.

A more believable instance would be a male monkey sleeping with a female human and the human bearing the child that had more human traits than monkey since supposedly the DNA in a human and monkey is close. Evolution is ignorant though, and unproven.

LOL Evolution is ignorant and unproven? I'm laughing that you said it was ignorant. There has been so much research into evolution. Scientific research...that is the exact opposite of ignorant.

There is so much research, data, evidence on evolution. But as I always ask, what is the alternative theory? How are we here?

Do you honestly think that you once belonged to a group of monkeys and swung through trees with them?

Statements like this do nothing other than verify that you don’t even have the most basic understanding of biology let alone a working understanding of what the lineage of our genus, Homo, is comprised of. Nowhere does the Modern Evolutionary Synthesis state or even surreptitiously hint that we were once monkeys or evolved from monkeys. If you had been personally insulted at sharing ancestry with the extant great apes, you still demonstrate a massive defeee if cognitive dissonance and willful ignorance.

Very very ignorant.

Oh sweet irony...

Evolution isn't a fact, it's a theory, I assume you understand the difference.

By this logic then gravity is not a fact because it’s a Scientific Theory. To be clear, evolution (which, since you quite clearly don’t grasp the most basic aspects of because you find the notion of being special more appealing than understanding facts, is at the most fundamental level a measurement of changes in allele frequency over time) is an observable, testable and repeatable fact. The theory as put forth in the Modern Evolutionary Synthesis serves to demonstrate the mechanisms that lead to the observed changes in allele frequency. Perhaps before condescending towards other posters from your inelegant soapbox, it would behiovw you to actually understand the topic that you are attacking because you haven’t got the foggiest clue about evolution as a biological process.

Hundreds of thousands of years and we haven't evolved. I guess it decided on its own to stop, right?

We haven’t changed at all in hundreds of thousands of years? Damn! You had better get your data published because you’re going to be on the short list for a Nobel.

In the last 10 Ka alone we have developed the mutation for lactase persistence, eye colors other than brown, lighter skin in people living at higher latitudes, sickle cell which protects some people from Malaria... thats off the top of my head and are just the last 10 Ka or so. To list every phenotype and genotype adaptation of the last 300 thousand years would take up far more space than ATS allots for and far more time for me to type out for you to just dismiss it with a wave of your hand as if the information were never presented to you

You keep your science, I'll keep my common sense.

How about you add in a library card and then use it to borrow some books. I don’t expect some light reading to ha he your view in this topic but you could at least learn enough to avoid utilizing straw men and non sequitors as the centerpiece for the willful ignorance that is the entire backbone of your thought process.

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: odzeandennz
can evolutionists tell me where or how consciousness evolved, or why only one species seemed to have developed this. why aren't there more like us, why don't we have a natural predator, why don't we have a mating season for reproduction like every species known to man.

A more believable instance would be a male monkey sleeping with a female human and the human bearing the child that had more human traits than monkey since supposedly the DNA in a human and monkey is close. Evolution is ignorant though, and unproven.

LOL Evolution is ignorant and unproven? I'm laughing that you said it was ignorant. There has been so much research into evolution. Scientific research...that is the exact opposite of ignorant.

There is so much research, data, evidence on evolution. But as I always ask, what is the alternative theory? How are we here?

Do you honestly think that you once belonged to a group of monkeys and swung through trees with them? Very very ignorant. Evolution isn't a fact, it's a theory, I assume you understand the difference. Hundreds of thousands of years and we haven't evolved. I guess it decided on its own to stop, right? You keep your science, I'll keep my common sense.

Anyone who thinks evolution means humans are directly descended from monkeys, doesn't understand the theory of evolution. Humans and certain species of monkey/ape share a common ancestor, specifically those in the Pan family, classified under "hominidae".

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: All Seeing Eye

[snipped]

Thank you for the kind words.

There are other stories coming from Russia about interactions with "Ape" men so Zana is not a isolated case.

There can be little doubt as to the fractured nature of mankind's genesis on this planet. Where did we come from, by who, and why. Our history as recovered is a puzzle with rather large pieces missing, and in some cases willfully destroyed (The Library of Alexandria). And presently a education system that by design is highly compartmentalized. How many "Truths" lie waiting to be discovered under a mountain of bureaucratic, political red tape? Or, the left arm making a discovery the right arm knows nothing about? Are we that incompetent to record accurately who and what we are?

As you point out the idea of IQ may actually be at the heart of our problems. And as my own mother warned me, "Your too smart for your own good".

Today we see a covert agenda playing out in real life. Even Science warns us that Fluoride is dumbing down the population. Some may say its because of greedy businessmen trying to take advantage of us. Certainly true, but might they be the only ones??

Looking into the Bible we are told to bow down to "Lord God" and worship him. Submit or your going to get your butt smitted. Then in the original Sumerian test we are given a different history. We were created, to be slaves. And in knowing or learning this, we become knowledgeable as to what is truly, Good, and Evil.

At the end of John F. Kennedys "Secret Society" speech he concludes "For man to be what he was born to be "Free and Independent". That begs the question, free of what, and independent, of who? And again, from a unlikely source, George Bush, "They hate our freedom". WHO?

Well, if we were created to be slaves then it stands to reason who the "who" is, regardless of the passage of time. President Kennedy inferred there is a plot to enslave the people of the United States, but if you look globally it is a global issue.

There are important things we must understand about "Slavery". George Carlin put the subject in the public eye with his "Owners" video.



There are two mindsets concerning slavery, the benevolent, and malevolent "Owner". The Good King, the bad King, the good corporate owner, and the evil corporate owner. The good god, and evil god! Etc etc, etc.

Perhaps it's a good explanation of why sub-Saharan Africans have the lowest average IQs on Earth. I don't know, but there's a lot to tie in and think about.

To the slave owner, as George pointed out, you just want them to be smart enough to do the task, but dumb enough to do the labor, without question.

In times past slavery was pretty obvious, slaves in chains. The benevolent slave owner might allow certain freedoms for his slaves, as long as they were productive. JFK saw the roots of slavery that had taken place in this country and took action to fight it, as witnessed in his presidential order "Executive Order 11110" . He didn't realize the true scope of his task.



As a side not, President Johnson wasted no time in reversing President Kennedy's order, as it was done before President Kennedy's body, was even cold.

A Lot To Tie In.

What does the theory of Evolution actually do? It ends all thought, speculation, and knowledge, of our true situation , and genesis, in this life, on this planet. And what does IQ have to do with it? You want smart monkeys, to be nothing more, than dumb humans, if you, are the "owners".

But that simply isn't enough to keep the IQs at a manageable level, you need enforcers, overlords, or slave guards in place. "They" are the lackeys who keep the owners informed of the situation, and enforce intellectual (Sub) standards. The "Over Lords" are actually a separate species of modern man, given special genetic gifts that allow them to rise above the average "Smart Monkey". "You can fool some of the people sometime, but not all of the people, all of the time", hence, my mothers warning to me.

Evolution is just a Psychological mind game to keep you from learning the truth, and the same is true of "Subduction"!!!

I have now seen the mindset of the "Owners, Creators", and it makes me sick.

ADDED: This video just came my way, and I include it because of its "Evolution" content, besides, we are both saying the same thing from different angels.

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: odzeandennz
can evolutionists tell me where or how consciousness evolved, or why only one species seemed to have developed this. why aren't there more like us, why don't we have a natural predator, why don't we have a mating season for reproduction like every species known to man.

A more believable instance would be a male monkey sleeping with a female human and the human bearing the child that had more human traits than monkey since supposedly the DNA in a human and monkey is close. Evolution is ignorant though, and unproven.

LOL Evolution is ignorant and unproven? I'm laughing that you said it was ignorant. There has been so much research into evolution. Scientific research...that is the exact opposite of ignorant.

There is so much research, data, evidence on evolution. But as I always ask, what is the alternative theory? How are we here?

Do you honestly think that you once belonged to a group of monkeys and swung through trees with them? Very very ignorant. Evolution isn't a fact, it's a theory, I assume you understand the difference. Hundreds of thousands of years and we haven't evolved. I guess it decided on its own to stop, right? You keep your science, I'll keep my common sense.

But it is common sense. If you were to study evolution and read about it you'd see. The basics are that over time small mutations happen to help us cope with our environment better. These small mutations keep adding up over time....over millions of years. That's both micro and macro evolution right there. Of course not every organiam mutates and of those that do not all mutate the same. Look at the human race..some cultures are lighter skinned, darker skinned, taller, and shorter etc. Look the fish in the ocean...they aren't all the same.

If you don't believe in evolution, then how did we come to be here on earth? Did humans just suddenly appear? What's your theory on that?

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: All Seeing Eye

Nice find... Think about this going on a couple hundred thousand years ago in a tribal Africa and interbreeding with a monkey and the child then breeding with a human and so on. After a few generations, it's just gonna look like a human/monkey mix but with more human traits than monkeys. Perhaps it's a good explanation of why sub-Saharan Africans have the lowest average IQs on Earth. I don't know, but there's a lot to tie in and think about.

The above has to be the most staggeringly ignorant and racist statement I have seen for some time on this site. No. Take your racism and your ignorance somewhere else.

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: All Seeing Eye

SNIP

When the race card gets pulled out you can rest assured which of the two races is doing it. To be fair, some of the brightest also come from that region. Regardless of color, that other Superior, highly intelligent, arrogant race, looks at all of us smart monkeys with disrespect. It really isn't about the color of the skin, but the color of something else...

originally posted by: LSU0408
a reply to: Noinden

Evolution is a theory, a system of ideas. You can believe it if you wish, but you can't get pissed off just because someone else doesn't buy into that same system of ideas.

You obviously can't read. Evolution is fact based on the scientific definition of fact. Prove that wrong.