Trump Threatens Coverage Of Millions If Democrats Won’t Negotiate On ACA Repeal

originally posted by: AndyFromMichigan
The Dems will not face the fact that Obamacare is destroying healthcare in this country. If they won't play ball, then the only thing Trump can do is to force their hand somehow.

The ACA was not destroying healthcare. It never actually addressed the real issues underlying the costs of healthcare while trying to maintain the lucrative business side of healthcare and shifting the burden on cost.

a reply to: neo96

I'm well aware of the existence of Medicare/Medicaid. I was responding to that user's statement that the government should not be providing free healthcare.

originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: neo96

I'm well aware of the existence of Medicare/Medicaid. I was responding to that user's statement that the government should not be providing free healthcare.

It shouldn't be providing free corporate products for the masses.

originally posted by: rickymouse

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: rickymouse
We do need to replace Obamacare, it is too expensive, but they need to work together to do that. I actually thought Obamacare might work but it was a mess from the beginning and it got worse.

The Dems wanted to work on it, fixing it.

The Reps refused.

Yeah, but they really did not want to start fixing it till after Trump got elected. If they would have got rid of the problems as they were showing up, yes, Obama care would have been better.

As much as the Reps and Rep vocalists on ATS try to deny it - - - they flat out declared they would not allow Obama his presidency.

They put up a deliberate/intentional "block wall" from day one.

I am pro a healthy nation. I am anti the animalistic behavior of "survival of the fittest". A progressive, civilized nation should be beyond that mindset.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

The AHCA was blatantly worse for the working class than the ACA. Every analysis of the plan said that millions (specifically millions of working class individuals) would lose their coverage. Then of they didn't get coverage within a couple months they would be required to also pay for the time they weren't covered. Leading to an endless loop of being unable to afford health insurance.

And let's not even get started on the reliance on HSAs. Something that only works if you have spare money to begin with.

At least the ACA had some supporters in the medical field. The AHCA was shouted down by everyone except the insurance companies and Big Pharma.

Clearly if Trump kills healthcare for the poor its Obama's fault, somehow.

originally posted by: Wayfarer
Clearly if Trump kills healthcare for the poor its Obama's fault, somehow.

Of course

a reply to: neo96

And therein lies the problem. Healthcare should not be in the hands of corporations whose sole goal is not to help the sick but to maximize profits.

So much of our healthcare system is dictated by the insurance companies. Yet they don't actually provide a service. Their entire scam is to take your money and then find a way to not give you your money because those are now their profits. And those are the ones deciding on prices for medication/medical procedures/etc.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

I'm really shocked by the number of people on this thread who are saying that they don't have any personal responsibility toward their fellowman. We all have a responsibility to help one another. This Randian "selfishness is a virtue" crap has got to go. For almost 200 years this country was motivated by "I am my brother's keeper" and the notion that everyone needs everyone. But now too many people are becoming selfish. They aren't willing to spend a few bucks to help others and that's just terribly immoral, cruel, and selfish.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

And therein lies the problem. Healthcare should not be in the hands of corporations whose sole goal is not to help the sick but to maximize profits.

Been ignoring the latest news about the VA ?

I don't want my healthcare in the hands of the state.

originally posted by: Wayfarer
Clearly if Trump kills healthcare for the poor its Obama's fault, somehow.

If President Trump let's Obamacare die a natural death, that is 100% Obama's fault.

If Bill Clinton's wife had won instead of Trump, she'd be pleading with the Republican Congress right now to fix the very plan not one of them voted for.

How is ANY of this the fault of the Republicans?

The massive historic failure of Obamacare is 100% the fault of Obama himself and the tiny partisan leftist majority that passed it (right before getting kicked out of office).

A combo Public-Private system for the country would be perfect. It doesn't have to be one or the other. They can co-exist.

originally posted by: dovdov
a reply to: Xcalibur254

I'm really shocked by the number of people on this thread who are saying that they don't have any personal responsibility toward their fellowman. We all have a responsibility to help one another. This Randian "selfishness is a virtue" crap has got to go. For almost 200 years this country was motivated by "I am my brother's keeper" and the notion that everyone needs everyone. But now too many people are becoming selfish. They aren't willing to spend a few bucks to help others and that's just terribly immoral, cruel, and selfish.

I'm not responsible for you and I don't expect you to be responsible for me. If someone needs help and I choose to help them, that's fine -- that's my choice.

Obamacare is a disaster that has cost this nation trillions of dollars and materially degraded millions of lives. Do you want to double-down on failure, or worse yet shoot for a "single-payer" system that would bankrupt this country?

Do you know how much that would cost and why it wouldn't work in the United States? We pay about 17% of our GDP in taxes. Your average socialized medicine country (Canada, etc...) pays MORE THAN 200% of that in taxes.

Further compounding that problem here is that more than 50% of income earners don't pay ANY taxes -- that is not the case in any of the socialized medicine nations.

That means that the top 10% of taxpayers (who pay 90% of the taxes) would have to absorb the cost of that massive plan. Many of these folks would simply retire or quit and move elsewhere. From time to time, because of what I do for a living (land development), I pay taxes in that category. I can tell you unequivocally that even though I'm nowhere near retirement age, if I was taxed 200% more than I pay now, I would retire, and there are millions more of me out there.

Socialized medicine will never work in this constitutional republic because the system is set up to prevent that kind of massive government intrusion. That's why the comparatively tame Barrycare is collapsing.

The bottom line is, healthcare is not a right. I shouldn't have to pay for the healthcare of others. If somehow the Left ever got back into total control of government like they had in 2009 - 2010 (except for the SCOTUS of course) and tried to pass single-payer, you'd see a mass exodus of wealth like you can't imagine. The entire economy would collapse.

a reply to: Xcalibur254
I'm going to have to add, hospitals closed in part BECAUSE of decreased funding and an increase in ER visits consisting of drug seekers, people too lazy to make a doctor's appointment for routine care and generalized non-emergencies.

They also call them ED's now, I was surprised too, right?
newnurseinthehood.blogspot.com...
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www.agraphia.net...

Affordable care shouldn't be an impossibility, but misuse of the healthcare system drives costs for the rest of us thru the roof. Equally I don't want lower income people to be stranded without, but GEEZE! This behavior is common to the point of absurdity. The war cry " Poor people will die" is tone deaf to what's really going on.

Abuse by Insurance Companies AND abuse of the system.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

Assuming this is true, there's one good thing about all of this. It's proving that the conservatives' "love of America" and "love for Americans" is BS. The fact that they're in this very thread cheering the fact that Trump may threaten to cut healthcare from millions of Americans is sickening, repulsive, and outright unpatriotic.

What's the point in securing a border if they gleefully watch as the Americans inside of those borders lose their healthcare over political gamesmanship? This could include your neighbor's healthcare, a family member's healthcare, or even their own kids' healthcare. But they'd literally rather spend millions of dollars bombing people on the other side of the world than make sure their fellow Americans can continue getting their cancer treatments, prenatal care, multiple sclerosis treatments, etc.

It seems like Representative Grayson was right about the Republican healthcare plan after all.

Even better, let's see them walk the walk. They should prove they believe in this crap by cutting the healthcare in their own districts first. Show us how it's done by being an example of the crap they claim to believe in.

trump couldn't get his own party to get on board with that crappy plan they proposed by threatening them.. what makes him think the dems will jump on board?
and, has anyone thought about how just up and deciding to cancel the reimbursements to the insurance companies would affect the insurance companies, and medical providers? first, since they are REIMBURSEMENTS, they can't just one day decide not to pay them, they would have to give the insurance companies notice that they will end at a certain date so they could drop their subsidized customers beforehand... just like the company you work for, who is going along reimbursing you for the gas you feed into the company truck can't just one day decide not to do this any longer and turn around and refuse to reimburse you for the $50 you just threw into their gas tank..

but, even then, the market, as sick as it is, has acclimated itself to the ACA... it has gotten dependent on the money the gov't was feeding into it. just like it's become dependent on the money that is fed to it through chips, medicaid, and medicare...

While he may have taken action after his line in the sand was crossed in Syria...

What 'line in the sand'??? A line in the sand is stated BEFORE something is done when it's violated. Trump clearly and repeatedly said that the U.S. should NOT get involved in Syria. It was the Syrian's business. There was no margin in it for the U.S. When 'beautiful babies' were gassed in 2013 and Obama wanted to strike in retaliation Trump said no way. And pointed out that Obama would need to get Congressional approval for any strike. So Trump had NO 'line in the sand' and acted contrary to his own admonishment to Obama by NOT going to Congress first.

I'm sorry, he's an arrogant blowhard and an ass. He's going to screw this country into the ground.

I'm an open-minded person when presented with facts, and I promise I won't bite, but please tell me HOW we pay for mandatory healthcare in this country when right now the bottom 60% of earners don't pay any tax and the top 20% pay about 90%?

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: rickymouse

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: rickymouse
We do need to replace Obamacare, it is too expensive, but they need to work together to do that. I actually thought Obamacare might work but it was a mess from the beginning and it got worse.

The Dems wanted to work on it, fixing it.

The Reps refused.

Yeah, but they really did not want to start fixing it till after Trump got elected. If they would have got rid of the problems as they were showing up, yes, Obama care would have been better.

As much as the Reps and Rep vocalists on ATS try to deny it - - - they flat out declared they would not allow Obama his presidency.

They put up a deliberate/intentional "block wall" from day one.

I am pro a healthy nation. I am anti the animalistic behavior of "survival of the fittest". A progressive, civilized nation should be beyond that mindset.

The Republicans tried to block everything Obama did. The Democrats are trying to block everything Trump is trying to do.

There was some good in what Obama did, there is some good in what Trump is trying to do.

Two wrongs do not make a right, it seems that the polarization between the parties is not doing what is in the best interest of Americans. We do need a good health system, even before Obamacare this countries medical system was getting out of hand.

We do need to bring more real jobs back to America to stabalize the economy, a service and consumer based economy cannot survive in a country this big. We need to make sure immigrants are not a threat to the citizens that are here and we also need to make sure that Terrorists and people wanting to destroy our society cannot even visit here. They are not our citizens, they do not have a right to come here and disrupt our society. It seems that people want the tourist dollars of people from other countries so bad that they tend to ignore that someone visiting here can disrupt society. The US is way more lax than many other countries on this issue.

More people from this country travel to other countries and spend their money than come from those countries to spend their money here. Why don't people who live here spend their money here, we have some real nice stuff in North America. Canada is our closest neighbor, I do not have a problem with spending money there, I don't even have a problem with buying some stuff from Mexico.....other than the drugs they sell to Americans through there.

But we need to start getting decent paying jobs here again, I grew up in way better times. People worked in factories making cars, washing machines, furniture, and all sorts of appliances and it was a good time, people had money in the bank, health insurance was paid by the companies, they had pension plans that were secure. Now we have a fake economy. Think about this, if the stock market didn't collapse and everyone got to take out the value of their stock, where would that money come from. There is really no money there, it is a scam. Ten thousand shares can trade and raise the price of a share up five bucks, essentially increasing the value twenty five percent. But the fifty million outstanding shares all go up five bucks. So there was an increase of money of value of two hundred fifty million dollars, that is creating money out of thin air, to see reality, if everyone tries selling their shares, the stock goes down to nothing, the billion dollars value, a value that never existed, disappears. The company just keeps trucking on producing things, the profits can stay the same, but when people try to push it, the company has to sell out and it is respoonsible for a penny on the dollar of the last stock sale. Not the original billion, it is on the value of the ten million of the last day of stock sales.

Building a secure and real economy will provide oportunity of people to have employer paid healthcare again. But when people do not support our economy, then it will not work. Buy local, buy American made, support your community and your country. Sure, We can still buy some things from China, with real money we earn from our own real businesses.

originally posted by: rickymouse

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: rickymouse

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: rickymouse
We do need to replace Obamacare, it is too expensive, but they need to work together to do that. I actually thought Obamacare might work but it was a mess from the beginning and it got worse.

The Dems wanted to work on it, fixing it.

The Reps refused.

Yeah, but they really did not want to start fixing it till after Trump got elected. If they would have got rid of the problems as they were showing up, yes, Obama care would have been better.

As much as the Reps and Rep vocalists on ATS try to deny it - - - they flat out declared they would not allow Obama his presidency.

They put up a deliberate/intentional "block wall" from day one.

I am pro a healthy nation. I am anti the animalistic behavior of "survival of the fittest". A progressive, civilized nation should be beyond that mindset.

The Republicans tried to block everything Obama did. The Democrats are trying to block everything Trump is trying to do.

There was some good in what Obama did, there is some good in what Trump is trying to do.

I was a Republican. A Goldwater Republican.

I remember when my fellow Republicans made fun of, laughed at the weak Democrats because they wouldn't fight back when the Republicans powered over them. That was a long time ago.

I remember the Dems trying to be true to who they were. They did not want to "Fight Fire with Fire". But, eventually they had no choice. They had to take a stand and fight back. They HAD to play the Republican's game. They were FORCED to.

I remember the Republican's being horrified that the Dems fought back. The attitude was "how dare they".

Not much has changed. So, NO - - I'm not buying the Dems are now trying to stop Trump just because he's Republican. Trump is not presidential material. He's acting like a Corporate Raider. "Hard Line Money - - cut the fat".

I am no longer a Republican, but will never be a Dem. I am unaffiliated - - looking at each issue independently.

IMO - - the Dems sincerely do want the health care issues solved and always have.