Minority youths to get softer sentences in the UK.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Discrimination does not cause crime. It is one factor out of many that have an influence on people's life opportunities and choices.

The guidelines just say to take such things into account. This isn't even new, it is just confirming what judges already do.

It isn't true that discrimination influences one to commit crime or not, no matter how long judges have made that sort of judgement.

Our legal system is not a legal matter anymore, it is a business and immigrants have no money so it is a waste of time trying to get blood from a stone..!

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: ScepticScot

Discrimination does not cause crime. It is one factor out of many that have an influence on people's life opportunities and choices.

The guidelines just say to take such things into account. This isn't even new, it is just confirming what judges already do.

It isn't true that discrimination influences one to commit crime or not, no matter how long judges have made that sort of judgement.

100s of years of legal tradition, study and thought by some of the brightest most educated people in the country.

Versus

Bloke on the internet.

You are of course entitled to your opinion. It's just that, as I said earlier, I am thankful that our legal system is slightly more nuanced than your binary world view.

a reply to: Redback

Yet we still issue fines to our homeless for simply existing and being in the wrong place(generally asleep), at the wrong time.

The mind boggles at the sheer lack of logic displayed!

a reply to: ScepticScot

100s of years of legal tradition, study and thought by some of the brightest most educated people in the country.

Versus

Bloke on the internet.

You are of course entitled to your opinion. It's just that, as I said earlier, I am thankful that our legal system is slightly more nuanced than your binary world view.

Appeals to tradition and authority. Thousands of years of principles of reason and you cannot muster a better one. I'm a little worried that such an unreasonable technique is in the hands of those who believe themselves morally superior.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope


Yes we have all far too much of these experts haven't we .

No one has made a claim of moral superiority.

Much like your view on crime , that appears to be something you have just made up.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Yes we have all far too much of these experts haven't we .

No one has made a claim of moral superiority.

Much like your view on crime , that appears to be something you have just made up.

It's a matter of simple logic. To say that discrimination is a factor in crime is the same as saying it is a factor in not committing crime. Not everyone who was discriminated against, youth or otherwise, has committed crimes. Your lack of evidence, along with your appeals to authority and tradition, leave me no other option to believe you have arrived at your conclusions not due to reason and evidence, but the sense that one position is morally superior, or as you say, "nuanced".

a reply to: andy06shake

They are just trying to scare the homeless, like i said, you cant get blood from a stone but they do not want homeless people either..!

20 years ago i sat in family courts month after month, tried numerous lawyers and it was always the same crap, my ex could say whatever she wanted about me, she even told the courts that i threatened her life but she never even turned up for them court dates to explain her accusations and yes there was many accusations BUT when i tried to get her into court for slander or defamation i was laughed at by my lawyers and was told that no court would jail or fine a single mother...!

Month after month i realized that it was the same faces time after time trying to get access to their children with the exact same story as mine, exact same story and it was at that point i realized that our legal system was just a money factory, they didn't want US single men walking away because we paid their wages and that still goes on to this day...!

The homeless cannot pay fines and they know that, it is just a deterrent and our legal system is a money factory, our "judges" and i use that word loosely need their massive wages....!

It is all a farce

a reply to: Redback

Buddy the mind boggles as to how "They" manage to fine anyone with no fixed abode!

But the fact remains that when the inevitable happens and these poor souls get busted again for existing and having unpaid fines, that £100 becomes £1000.

And when there get apprehended once more some bastard judges are inclined to give the poor souls a modicum of gaol time.

Sometimes that's even preferable given the 3 meals, however bad they may be, a day. Access to TV, electricity, and medical health care for a few weeks.

Farce does not even begin to cover it.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: ScepticScot

Yes we have all far too much of these experts haven't we .

No one has made a claim of moral superiority.

Much like your view on crime , that appears to be something you have just made up.

It's a matter of simple logic. To say that discrimination is a factor in crime is the same as saying it is a factor in not committing crime. Not everyone who was discriminated against, youth or otherwise, has committed crimes. Your lack of evidence, along with your appeals to authority and tradition, leave me no other option to believe you have arrived at your conclusions not due to reason and evidence, but the sense that one position is morally superior, or as you say, "nuanced".

Not everyone who smokes develops lung cancer therefore smoking is not a factor in developing long cancer. Wow using your logic I have just overturned years of scientific evidence.

Your position is the one contrary to the accepted view of the experts in the field. Pointing this out is not an argument from authority. The extraordinary claim here is yours.

If you want to go with logical fallacies your entire position is an argument by assertion.

i has a question :

when the " minority yoof " crime rate falls - will the sentencing guidelines be reset ?

a reply to: Grambler

Are you honestly suggesting white youths deserve to have harsher sentences than others?/

No, and neither are the actual facts. It's suggesting all mitigating circumstances should be taken into account. The OP is trying to make it sound like what you are suggesting.

edit on 8-3-2017 by uncommitted because: (no reason given)

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: Redback
Sometimes that's even preferable given the 3 meals, however bad they may be, a day. Access to TV, electricity, and medical health care for a few weeks.

I don't know the answer to this but i assume someone is making money from them jailing homeless people..!
If i was homeless, this sounds like a good B&B to me..