Churches increasingly feel need to offer sanctuary to undocumented migrants

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

So compassion can't be helping people in their home country, it means you have to have no border and let everyone in and care for them here?

That's pretty silly.

Its helping people who are in need of it at the moment. Of course helping in their own home country would be ideal, but what if bombs are being dropped on their home country, what if they have no freedom of religion in their home country, what if they get raped in their home country.

What you are implying is ideal and only happens in a perfect world, we can dream. But compassion is very important.

So everyone from certain countries HAS to be allowed into the US?
If you don't like where you came from, change it.

Where did I say don't help them in the moment? Help them every step of the way as they get deported and keep helping them once they get back home.

Help =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.
Compassion =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.

Yes, we should welcome people from all over the country into the US. It is diversity that makes us America. Of course take the proper registering procedures, but YES, welcome EVERYONE! Treat everyone with kindness and compassion.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

It's my actual degree too! A Master's level! It was my "job" for 30 years --- and it remains my "calling!"

So - now ---- you having shared that makes it even more bizarre that you would deny the women and children and men who are the victims of NATO bombing from having refuge....the people who want to work, to provide for their families, the people who are fleeing famine NO MATTER WHERE THEY ARE FROM --- or anyone who doesn't speak English and isn't a "Christian."

Why are we talking NATO bombings?

Migrants =/= Refugee

You seemly sadly mistaken about what is going on. Any actual refugee from these areas can apply for refugee status. The problem is the real refugees are overwhelmed by economic MIGRANTS (not refugees) taking up all the resources that could be used for actual refugees.

Now back in America, where the problem has nothing to do with NATO bombings ... Per the source ...

A woman from Mexico who entered the United States illegally feared a meeting with immigration officials would end in her deportation.

Explain to me what NATO bombing has to do with an illegal immigrant from Mexico. This should be interesting.

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

So compassion can't be helping people in their home country, it means you have to have no border and let everyone in and care for them here?

That's pretty silly.

Its helping people who are in need of it at the moment. Of course helping in their own home country would be ideal, but what if bombs are being dropped on their home country, what if they have no freedom of religion in their home country, what if they get raped in their home country.

What you are implying is ideal and only happens in a perfect world, we can dream. But compassion is very important.

So everyone from certain countries HAS to be allowed into the US?
If you don't like where you came from, change it.

Where did I say don't help them in the moment? Help them every step of the way as they get deported and keep helping them once they get back home.

Help =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.
Compassion =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.

Yes, we should welcome people from all over the country into the US. It is diversity that makes us America. Of course take the proper registering procedures, but YES, welcome EVERYONE! Treat everyone with kindness and compassion.

So if 100 million people with no money and no skills wants to come here we should let them all in? 200 million? How many do we let in? Are they paying the fees for legal immigration, or are the tax payers covering the THOUSANDS it costs per person to do checks on each person and register them?

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
The thread is about churches offering sanctuary and common decency to refugees.

Actually it's not, it's about economic migrants, not refugees.

Title ..

Churches increasingly feel need to offer sanctuary to undocumented migrants

Not refugees, try again please.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Actually it's not, it's about economic migrants, not refugees.

Title ..

Churches increasingly feel need to offer sanctuary to undocumented migrants

Not refugees, try again please.

They are also now refugees - because they're seeking refuge

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Churches increasingly feel need to offer sanctuary to undocumented migrants

They are also now refugees - because they're seeking refuge

Hahahahaha, hilarious. Refugee has an actual definition. You don't become a refugee by saying you are one. Can't believe you posted that, seriously, you can't make this stuff up. Fact is always weirder than fiction.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Dude. The people coming here from Mexico (which number has fallen significantly over the last 12 years) need assistance. Have you ever been there? Do you speak Spanish?

Tell me all about the families you know who came here to earn some money to send home to their elderly abuelitos y primos --- who have left behind their moms and dads, who have brought their kids here for an education, for a safe place to raise them.......

It's hilarious in a really sad way that you would bring up Mexico. You know that refugees from SOUTH of Mexico are here in large numbers too, right? You know that, right?

Guatemalans, Salvadorans, Hondurans.....also Mexicans.....they come here to work. Many are fleeing cartels, insufferable poverty, oppression, neglect, and lives of hardship and meager sustenance. Mexico is struggling, and has been for a long time.


LOL!! It's so ironic that you would bring up Mexicans. Yeah -- I know LOTS of Mexicans. I helped them beyond what you can even imagine.

DO YOU SPEAK SPANISH? Have you EVER been south of our border? Do you have children?

Do you know ANY Spanish-speaking people on a personal level, as a friend, a neighbor, a therapist, a case manager, a parent educator? How about as a supervisor, a transporter and health-care liaison? An advocate, an interpreter? ANY of those?

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
The thread is about churches offering sanctuary and common decency to refugees.

Actually it's not, it's about economic migrants, not refugees.

Title ..

Churches increasingly feel need to offer sanctuary to undocumented migrants

Not refugees, try again please.

Educate yourself, please. See my earlier reply. LEARN something today. I promise it won't hurt you.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Hahahahahaha....

Do you ever stay at hotels? What about dining out? Who cuts your yard? You like those flowers and landscaping in front of your building? Along the streets? What about tamales, you like those?

If you have children, who provides their care while you are work?

Where do you live?
DO YOU SPEAK SPANISH?

So stupid!
when they have 50,00 in a church for 5,000 and more out side!
in all churches.
they will see they have made a Very Big mistake.
and they will steal every thing.
and if they dont feed them they will riot.
poo ever ware. like a cat.
No Joke!

Except said churches are not actually offering what you would consider "sanctuary". Has anyone here actually called these churches to see what they are really doing to help?
Weeeell I know someone who did call these churches.
Here is the video.

So claiming to help refugees and actually helping refugees are actually the same according to these progressive left leaning churches. This is why I believe they get an oppression hall pass from the OP and the left. Even though they are "bible clingers" they perform the proper virtue signaling to fit their narrative. Friends today back to enemies tomorrow am I right ctrl-lefties?

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Dude. The people coming here from Mexico (which number has fallen significantly over the last 12 years) need assistance. Have you ever been there? Do you speak Spanish?

Feel free to assist them in Mexico. I am not stopping you. What do they have to do with refugees from NATO bombing, like you talked about.

Tell me all about the families you know who came here to earn some money to send home to their elderly abuelitos y primos --- who have left behind their moms and dads, who have brought their kids here for an education, for a safe place to raise them.......

So if 500 million people want to bring their families here illegally we should allow it? What do they have to do with refugees from NATO bombing, like you talked about.

It's hilarious in a really sad way that you would bring up Mexico. You know that refugees from SOUTH of Mexico are here in large numbers too, right? You know that, right?

And NATO bombed them? You said we did this so we have a responsibility. When did we bomb these countries?

Guatemalans, Salvadorans, Hondurans.....also Mexicans.....they come here to work. Many are fleeing cartels, insufferable poverty, oppression, neglect, and lives of hardship and meager sustenance. Mexico is struggling, and has been for a long time.

What do they have to do with refugees from NATO bombing, like you talked about.

LOL!! It's so ironic that you would bring up Mexicans. Yeah -- I know LOTS of Mexicans. I helped them beyond what you can even imagine.

DO YOU SPEAK SPANISH? Have you EVER been south of our border? Do you have children?

Do you know ANY Spanish-speaking people on a personal level, as a friend, a neighbor, a therapist, a case manager, a parent educator? How about as a supervisor, a transporter and health-care liaison? An advocate, an interpreter? ANY of those?

Awesome, keep helping them. What does that have to do with them being refugees and not economic migrants? What do they have to do with refugees from NATO bombing, like you talked about?

Where did I ever tell you or these churches to stop helping people? Or is the only way to help to have no borders. What happens if hundreds of millions want to come, we take them all?

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Hahahahahaha....

Do you ever stay at hotels? What about dining out? Who cuts your yard? You like those flowers and landscaping in front of your building? Along the streets? What about tamales, you like those?

If you have children, who provides their care while you are work?

Where do you live?
DO YOU SPEAK SPANISH?

Are you saying LEGAL Mexicans can't make tamales?
are you saying LEGAL Mexicans can't do any of these jobs .. only illegals?
No illegals provide any service for me. None. Good try though.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

So compassion can't be helping people in their home country, it means you have to have no border and let everyone in and care for them here?

That's pretty silly.

Its helping people who are in need of it at the moment. Of course helping in their own home country would be ideal, but what if bombs are being dropped on their home country, what if they have no freedom of religion in their home country, what if they get raped in their home country.

What you are implying is ideal and only happens in a perfect world, we can dream. But compassion is very important.

So everyone from certain countries HAS to be allowed into the US?
If you don't like where you came from, change it.

Where did I say don't help them in the moment? Help them every step of the way as they get deported and keep helping them once they get back home.

Help =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.
Compassion =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.

Yes, we should welcome people from all over the country into the US. It is diversity that makes us America. Of course take the proper registering procedures, but YES, welcome EVERYONE! Treat everyone with kindness and compassion.

So if 100 million people with no money and no skills wants to come here we should let them all in? 200 million? How many do we let in? Are they paying the fees for legal immigration, or are the tax payers covering the THOUSANDS it costs per person to do checks on each person and register them?

To answer your question, as I already said, proper registrations should be done for tax reasons.

And if it is so aweful to you and becomes a 3rd world country in your eyes and all of these people are so beneath you and like cats? Then you can just move yourself

See, everyone gets a choice.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

They are being persecuted - and forced to leave their home

You - going by the letter of the law - only see them as lawbreakers

Some of us - these churches included - see them as people first

I'm not sure why this confuses you. Maybe you need some kind of artificial barrier between your need for law and order and your ability to actually see that this is a crisis

First of all - these people have been permitted (if not actually encouraged) to come here and live for decades. This is not up for argument - its a fact. They are a silent workforce, they pay taxes - they pay to live here and are a part of the community and economy

They're also undocumented

If we agree that illegal immigration is a problem, there are better ways of handling it than rounding people up like animals, forcing them to leave their jobs, homes - family (for Christ's sake) and ship them off, dump them like garbage in a country many of them never really knew

I understand that they are here illegally - mostly everyone understands that. The people in these churches don't care about that. They see human beings that are seeking refuge

That's life I guess - some people get how God works - some people support their master no matter what

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

So compassion can't be helping people in their home country, it means you have to have no border and let everyone in and care for them here?

That's pretty silly.

Its helping people who are in need of it at the moment. Of course helping in their own home country would be ideal, but what if bombs are being dropped on their home country, what if they have no freedom of religion in their home country, what if they get raped in their home country.

What you are implying is ideal and only happens in a perfect world, we can dream. But compassion is very important.

So everyone from certain countries HAS to be allowed into the US?
If you don't like where you came from, change it.

Where did I say don't help them in the moment? Help them every step of the way as they get deported and keep helping them once they get back home.

Help =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.
Compassion =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.

Yes, we should welcome people from all over the country into the US. It is diversity that makes us America. Of course take the proper registering procedures, but YES, welcome EVERYONE! Treat everyone with kindness and compassion.

So if 100 million people with no money and no skills wants to come here we should let them all in? 200 million? How many do we let in? Are they paying the fees for legal immigration, or are the tax payers covering the THOUSANDS it costs per person to do checks on each person and register them?

To answer your question, as I already said, proper registrations should be done for tax reasons.

And if it is so aweful to you and becomes a 3rd world country in your eyes and all of these people are so beneath you and like cats? Then you can just move yourself

See, everyone gets a choice.

So you refuse to answer my questions because the tough questions you have no answer to.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: veracity

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

So compassion can't be helping people in their home country, it means you have to have no border and let everyone in and care for them here?

That's pretty silly.

Its helping people who are in need of it at the moment. Of course helping in their own home country would be ideal, but what if bombs are being dropped on their home country, what if they have no freedom of religion in their home country, what if they get raped in their home country.

What you are implying is ideal and only happens in a perfect world, we can dream. But compassion is very important.

So everyone from certain countries HAS to be allowed into the US?
If you don't like where you came from, change it.

Where did I say don't help them in the moment? Help them every step of the way as they get deported and keep helping them once they get back home.

Help =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.
Compassion =/= Opening my door and letting people live in my house. It's a false argument.

Yes, we should welcome people from all over the country into the US. It is diversity that makes us America. Of course take the proper registering procedures, but YES, welcome EVERYONE! Treat everyone with kindness and compassion.

So if 100 million people with no money and no skills wants to come here we should let them all in? 200 million? How many do we let in? Are they paying the fees for legal immigration, or are the tax payers covering the THOUSANDS it costs per person to do checks on each person and register them?

To answer your question, as I already said, proper registrations should be done for tax reasons.

And if it is so aweful to you and becomes a 3rd world country in your eyes and all of these people are so beneath you and like cats? Then you can just move yourself

See, everyone gets a choice.

So you refuse to answer my questions because the tough questions you have no answer to.

which question, I have answered every question, if not in that post, then another. I dont like repeating myself, its one of my pet peeves.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

I think the problem is (as one person in this thread states), they do not see them as people, they see them as filth...cats.

Tis sad

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

They are being persecuted - and forced to leave their home

You - going by the letter of the law - only see them as lawbreakers

Some of us - these churches included - see them as people first

Awesome logical fallacy and lie. An ad-hom too.

You can play games spit lies and try to tug on heart strings, it's what all great advertising is about, obfuscating the issue and trying to elicit an emotional response to prevent logical thinking. That crap doesn't work on me. You can be logical and compassionate, at least I can.

a reply to: veracity

I think the problem is (as one person in this thread states), they do not see them as people, they see them as filth...cats.

Tis sad

You're right - and it would be bad if it was only a few people. But - it's a whole electoral college worth

Nothing for it but to fight the good fight veracity

Human rights - nothing less is acceptable