Orlando is worst attack on US since 9/11, but POTUS uses incident to pivot against guns

Anyone remember back, right after 9/11, was it one of the Clinton's or was it Al Gore trying to plug in the need for gun control because of the attacks or some BS, and I'm sitting there thinking "WTF do guns have to do with homicidal religious turds with box cutters flying planes full of people into the buildings? Last time I checked, no guns were fired, yet 3,000 people were still murdered with something you find on the desk in many American businesses and households"

Ok, so this time a gun was used to kill people. However, people seem to forget that the turd monkey who wielded this weapon was also a religious extremist who honestly did not give two sh*ts about law or morality, since he was absolutely hellbent on murdering a bunch of innocent people he never met because grown men offended him and his religious beliefs. This is a guy who by all accounts, has pledged himself to ISIS, a group that thinks drowning people in acid, setting them on fire, and crucifying people is a perfectly acceptable religious expression. Somehow, I don't think a total gun ban would have stopped him from mass murder.

originally posted by: Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
Anyone remember back, right after 9/11, was it one of the Clinton's or was it Al Gore trying to plug in the need for gun control because of the attacks or some BS, and I'm sitting there thinking "WTF do guns have to do with homicidal religious turds with box cutters flying planes full of people into the buildings? Last time I checked, no guns were fired, yet 3,000 people were still murdered with something you find on the desk in many American businesses and households"

Ok, so this time a gun was used to kill people. However, people seem to forget that the turd monkey who wielded this weapon was also a religious extremist who honestly did not give two sh*ts about law or morality, since he was absolutely hellbent on murdering a bunch of innocent people he never met because grown men offended him and his religious beliefs. This is a guy who by all accounts, has pledged himself to ISIS, a group that thinks drowning people in acid, setting them on fire, and crucifying people is a perfectly acceptable religious expression. Somehow, I don't think a total gun ban would have stopped him from mass murder.

d
and let's not forget about these bastard throwing people off the tops of buildings, and raping christen women. I am sure that Allah and Mohammad are very happy how their religion is being applied today NOT.

EDIT: Never mind, video does not allow embedding

originally posted by: imod02

I seem to remember in the news that gun shops were running out of shotguns as the aussis were buying them all

You seem confused as to our gun laws here in Australia. We are still allowed to own guns, provided that we pass checks and tests, and there are certain types of guns that are illegal to own such as assault-style weapons. We can still own many types of guns, shotguns included.

You should stop listening to the LIES of some people who would have you believe we don't have guns at all here. These people ignore FACTS and tell these outright LIES in order to bolster their own failing arguments.

Remember, if we react negatively to the moslem community over this horrific crime, we're as bad as the shooter. At least that's what Hillary believes. Its our fault as much as the shooter, according to Hillary.
I knew she'd throw the gay community under the bus and Obama would be too much of a coward to say a word.

originally posted by: Kryties

originally posted by: imod02

I seem to remember in the news that gun shops were running out of shotguns as the aussis were buying them all

You seem confused as to our gun laws here in Australia. We are still allowed to own guns, provided that we pass checks and tests, and there are certain types of guns that are illegal to own such as assault-style weapons. We can still own many types of guns, shotguns included.

You should stop listening to the LIES of some people who would have you believe we don't have guns at all here. These people ignore FACTS and tell these outright LIES in order to bolster their own failing arguments.

>>>> And you have the surge in homicides and violence to prove your gun restrictions work.

originally posted by: Dutchowl

And you have the surge in homicides and violence to prove your gun restrictions work.

What "surge"?

Provide some proof please.

originally posted by: BatheInTheFountain
Do not mention Islam. Do not mention Islam. Do not mention Islam. Do not mention Islam.

Or guns, or gays.

Wait thats three for three. Wondering what the odds in Vegas were beforehand?

originally posted by: Kryties

originally posted by: Dutchowl

And you have the surge in homicides and violence to prove your gun restrictions work.

What "surge"?

Provide some proof please.

Inside the US or overseas?

The question is pointless. The US gubment is fomenting terror and shipping WMD by the boatload, but you want to focus on just citizen 'gun violence' at home.

Thats a little compartmentalized, isn't it?

There are several problems in the making:

This is starting to become an all too common event in the United States. Every week in various states and cities, mass shootings seem to be happening far more frequently than it should. And the parties turn around and divide up taking position and ignoring what the other has to state. And at times they fail to or want to admit the other side has a good idea.

Then comes the shooting and what happens, oh there is a moment of silence in congress for the victims, and prayer, yet not once have they taken any sort of action, not so much as an open debate or consideration of any legislation on bills that may decrease or even help prevent such actions.

As sad as it is, perhaps now is the time to stop politicizing and for the government to stop praying about the victims and start to do something, to work like they are supposed to. To ignore the lobbyist and positions and to work on a law or laws that would not only decrease such, but also just maybe do things that are good for the country for years to come. Instead of being reactionary in their actions, having a proactive approach to the issues.

This entire debate on guns, and gun control, here is the problem: We cannot and should not deny the right of the people to own firearms, however, there should be some that should be denied and prohibited under the law. There should be a limit on the kinds of firearms that a person can get ahold of.

And who should be allowed to get ahold of such. The president is right, should this man who did this been able to get ahold of a firearm, no, for he was on the terrorist watch list, been interviewed by the FBI, should that not have been a red flag to prevent him from doing such? Funny the bills that would have, and potentially stopped him, failed in congress. And what about the other guy, the one that had a small arsenal of weapons, he too should have not been given or have gotten ahold of firearms, as his past records, indicated he has been in trouble with the law on such, yet due to loop holes he was able to.

Perhaps the this debate needs to be had, and ultimately both sides need to listen and come up with an set of laws that they can agree on, one that not only protects a persons right to own a fire arm, but also limits the type and who can legally purchase one.

originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: Kryties

originally posted by: Dutchowl

And you have the surge in homicides and violence to prove your gun restrictions work.

What "surge"?

Provide some proof please.

Inside the US or overseas?

The question is pointless. The US gubment is fomenting terror and shipping WMD by the boatload, but you want to focus on just citizen 'gun violence' at home.

Thats a little compartmentalized, isn't it?

I'm guessing you're one of those people who couldn't care less how many of your fellow citizens will die as long as you get to keep assault rifles?

originally posted by: Kryties

originally posted by: Dutchowl

And you have the surge in homicides and violence to prove your gun restrictions work.

What "surge"?

Provide some proof please.

"I'm guessing you're one of those people who couldn't care less how many of your fellow citizens will die as long as you get to keep assault rifles?"

I get so sick and tired of hearing these same tired lies from Brits and Aussies over and over again. They think they're so much better then us. I hope the US remembers this. Our allies are always treating us like dirt right up until they need us to save them from their mess again. Do any of you watch any media from your own country or just sit back all day eating popcorn laughing at America's problems?
www.freerepublic.com...

It has now been over 10 years since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own Government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars. The statistics for the years following the ban are now in: Accidental gun deaths are 300% higher than the pre-1997 ban rate The assault rate has increased 800% since 1991, and increased 200% since the 1997 gun ban. Robbery and armed robbery have increase 20% from the pre-97 ban rate. From immediately after the ban was instituted in 1997 through 2002, the robbery and armed robbery rate was up 200% over the pre-ban rates. In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 171 percent

Gun deaths went down but knife deaths have gone way up and so have rapes because a handgun is an equalizer in a way a knife isn't going to be between a 100 pound woman and a 280 pound man. Do you want to ban knives next? I remember when I thought all Aussies were badasses like Crocodile Dundee when I was a kid.


Meanwhile violent crime is also up in the UK:

townhall.com...

The Government's latest crime figures were condemned as "truly terrible" by the Tories today as it emerged that gun crime in England and Wales soared by 35% last year. Criminals used handguns in 46% more offences, Home Office statistics revealed. Firearms were used in 9,974 recorded crimes in the 12 months to last April, up from 7,362. It was the fourth consecutive year to see a rise and there were more than 2,200 more gun crimes last year than the previous peak in 1993. Figures showed the number of crimes involving handguns had more than doubled since the post-Dunblane massacre ban on the weapons, from 2,636 in 1997-1998 to 5,871.

The same article goes on to say that:

Violent crime in the United States fell for the fifth consecutive year in 2011 with murder, rape and robbery all going down, although crime remains a serious problem in many urban areas, the FBI said on Monday. The report of all crimes reported to police nationwide showed slightly more than 1.2 million violent incidents nationwide, while property crimes hit a nine-year low. Compared with 2010, the new figures show violent crime down 3.8 percent overall. Property crime was down 0.5 percent. Among violent incidents reported to police, murders were down about 0.7 percent, robberies dropped 4 percent, aggravated assaults declined 3.9 percent, and forcible rapes were down 2.5 percent.

Violent crime and crime in general are at record lows all across the country. It's never been a safer time to be a woman, a child, a minority, or an LGBT person in America. Why the media is pushing the narrative that it's panic mode and we're all going to die I can't tell you. They've linked you how Chicago with the strictest gun bans has the most gun violence. If you also use your search bar you'll see that the places with the highest gun ownership are the safest. So my question is why don't you love your country's people enough to repeal your gun ban? You've been scared out of your rights and safety for PC bull#. Who is really the delusional one here?

On a side note: Do you support the racist facebook guy going to jail for hating on the lady who was resigning from government? Is assault speech bannable like assault weapons?

Edit Bonus Article: Britain, Australia top U.S.
in violent crime
Read more at www.wnd.com...

The percentage of the population that suffered “contact crime” in England and Wales was 3.6 percent, compared with 1.9 percent in the United States and 0.4 percent in Japan. Burglary rates in England and Wales were also among the highest recorded. Australia (3.9 percent) and Denmark (3.1 per cent) had higher rates of burglary with entry than England and Wales (2.8 percent). In the U.S., the rate was 2.6 percent, according to 1995 figures; “After Australia and England and Wales, the highest prevalence of crime was in Holland (25 percent), Sweden (25 percent) and Canada (24 percent). The United States, despite its high murder rate, was among the middle ranking countries with a 21 percent victimization rate,” the London Telegraph said. England and Wales also led in automobile thefts. More than 2.5 percent of the population had been victimized by car theft, followed by 2.1 percent in Australia and 1.9 percent in France. Again, the U.S. was not listed among the “top 10” nations. The study found that Australia led in burglary rates, with nearly 4 percent of the population having been victimized by a burglary. Denmark was second with 3.1 percent; the U.S. was listed eighth at about 1.8 percent. Read more at www.wnd.com... WND reported that, although lawmakers responsible for passing the ban promised a safer country, the nation’s crime statistics tell a different story:

Countrywide, homicides are up 3.2 percent.
Assaults are up 8.6 percent.
Amazingly, armed robberies have climbed nearly 45 percent.
In the Australian state of Victoria, gun homicides have climbed 300 percent.
In the 25 years before the gun bans, crime in Australia had been dropping steadily.
There has been a reported “dramatic increase” in home burglaries and assaults on the elderly.

Read more at www.wnd.com...

originally posted by: thenightisours


Still can't say Radical Islamic Terrorism, which we know that it is 100% that.

A few questions..

(1) Do you think that speaking the phrase "Radical Islamic Terrorism" invokes some magical property that will stop these events from happening?

(2) The vast majority of Muslims in the Arabic world who oppose the "Radical Islamic Terrorists" refer to them as "Daesch"...and Arabic term that can be interpreted as "“a bigot who imposes his view on others.” Muslims refuse to give them the legitimacy of a "State" or "Islam" or a "Caliphate" in words or title.

Do you think that referring to them as "Islamic" risks giving the them the very credibility they are asking for? Are they not simply terrorists posing as a religious movement?

(3) Lone Wolfs...The Orlando shooters ex-wife does not describe him as fanatical...she says their home was not overly religious in any way...she describes him as bi-polar, violent, bigoted and unstable. The Orlando shooter was desperate to legitimize his evil deeds by associating himself with a larger movement. By choosing to include him in that larger movement do we not give him and "Daesch" at large the credit and credibility they are seeking?

(4) Guns...Crazy people are killing in mass numbers on a regular basis these days. Can we cure crazy? Holmes in Colorado did not claim Islam? Nor the shooter in Newton? etc. Shouldn't we be thinking about general ways to combat these things rather than focus on just "Islam"?

Words matter...

I am sure you can agree that words matter when describing guns accurately?

The Orlando shooter did not use an AR-15 as reported by the press, but rather a Sig Sauer MCX.

An Assault rifle originally designed at the request of Delta Force.

That does not make it any less deadly...

The Shooter was not a member of ISIS or "Daesch", but pledged allegiance via a 9-11 call before he went on his lunatic rampage.

That does not make him any more or less insane.

Whilst searching for solutions, lets start with the accurate facts and go from there.

Banning the AR-15 would not solve the problem, he wasn't using an AR-15.

Combating "Islam" as a religion will not solve the problem either...cuz Islam was only the facepaint he chose before he went crazy...

Crazy + the ability for crazy to purchase weapons that can kill large numbers of people easily is the problem IMO.

The NRA has successfully lobbied the GOP in congress to forbid background checks from referencing terrorist watch lists...why?

Why not begin with instituting more comprehensive and stringent background check requirements for people looking to purchase Assault rifles?...cuz solving the "crazy" part is a heavy lift.

Heard on the news today the perpetrator is gay so the question becomes what is a gay Muslim doing attacking a gay bar then potus declaring war on guns again.
Sounds like a "sleeper " to me, used for psyop against the American people .

This nonsensical regurgitation is getting very old.What thinking, feeling human wouldn't want to try to find a solution or seek answer?



I honestly don't know how to tell the good guys from the bad guys anymore. I don't think too many people do.

a reply to: Indigo5

Assault rifle? Was it one of those usual ar15 that are not weapons used in war ? I'm
Not up on what weapon he used but this whole "assault rifle " deal has been discussed thoroughly on past threads.

If I were a conscienceless criminal who cared about no one but myself and getting all I could from anyone in any way I could, a "capitalist" mindset would pretty much sum it up....

I would be really happy to know that nearly everyone I might want to exploit or take advantage of did not have the means to defend themselves.

It would be great to be an outlaw, the only guy on the block with a gun.

Unencumbered by those pesky self defense retards, yet looked upon by others as their saviour and protector.

I could be like....Governmental like....I guess.

a reply to: LordDraconia

Not to mention that they have already had the gun laws to keep them at bay from
Rising up against their overlords. The elites have to work xtra hard to overturn our Second amendment rights.

a reply to: Kryties

I'm guessing you're one of those people who couldn't care less how many of your fellow citizens will die as long as you get to keep assault rifles?

No, I'm one of those people that doesn't believe in blanket legislation, punishing the many for the acts of a few.

Those that want that are hiding behind a facade of fear to promote 'safety'.

You can't prevent these acts from happening. Knee jerk reactions aren't warranted.

originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus
Heard on the news today the perpetrator is gay so the question becomes what is a gay Muslim doing attacking a gay bar then potus declaring war on guns again.
Sounds like a "sleeper " to me, used for psyop against the American people .

Nudge by nudge. It's called "The Nudge Theory" and it is a real strategy espoused by Obama and others in his administration. Look it up. It sheds a lot of light on their philosophy of manipulating public opinion and behavior.

As Rahm Emmanuel says, "Don't let a good crisis go to waste", perhaps the left is now garnering the LGBT community to help them with their gun control conundrum. I think this time, it is backfiring on them, however. Instead of screaming about getting rid of guns, more people are screaming that we need more people to conceal carry to protect themselves against this sort of thing.