God Did It! The rest is post modern chatter!

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: edmc^2

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: edmc^2
a reply to: Noinden

Now what do I beleive? I've posted in thexse forums before what I beleive. But here is how it began: At first, there was only emptiness, and a dark sea in it. And there was heat in the dark sea, and from that came desire, the first seed of the mind ...

None of that contradicts the hypothesis of the Big Bang.

We've passed the Beginning (Big-Bang), the question is, the source of the Big Bang. What was there before the Big Bang?

Something or absolute nothing?

The great contraction happened before the Big Bang. Then the Big Bang happened. Then the great contraction. As infinitum.

Hence, like I said - you will come back to infinity because it makes sense. It makes sense that something must had always existed before the Big-Bang.

Question is - what's causing the infinite contraction?

Is it contracting itself? A self contracting something?

Nothing created it. It's just always happened.

So if you accept what you said why then question what I said that God is uncreated?

But which one makes more logical sense?

A wise and powerful always existing uncreated God or an always existing - something that contracts?

The universe exhibits signs of intelligence hence the only logical reason for its existence is an intelligent Creator - God.

This is not based on faith but logic.

a reply to: TerryDon79

Why did he claim it says that?
Show me the natural process that allows for this to be true?

a reply to: TerryDon79

So what is this

the great contraction

that you talked of?

a reply to: edmc^2

This is not based on faith but logic.

This statement depends upon this statement:

The universe exhibits signs of intelligence

Which shows that this statement is true:

This is not based on faith but logic.

Circular logic is not logic.

a reply to: edmc^2

It has already been proposed to you that this could be an infinite cycle. IF we have to accept that "God did it" because you say it is the most logical answer. YOU have to accept that perhaps it just happened.

My answer however is, I don't know, and when the evidence is found (be it in my life time) then I might.

You don't seem to be getting, I am objecting to your "it is the most logical answer" dance, not the idea. PROVE it is the most logical, using logic, not waving it around like a flag.

originally posted by: edmc^2

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: edmc^2

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: edmc^2
a reply to: Noinden

Now what do I beleive? I've posted in thexse forums before what I beleive. But here is how it began: At first, there was only emptiness, and a dark sea in it. And there was heat in the dark sea, and from that came desire, the first seed of the mind ...

None of that contradicts the hypothesis of the Big Bang.

We've passed the Beginning (Big-Bang), the question is, the source of the Big Bang. What was there before the Big Bang?

Something or absolute nothing?

The great contraction happened before the Big Bang. Then the Big Bang happened. Then the great contraction. As infinitum.

Hence, like I said - you will come back to infinity because it makes sense. It makes sense that something must had always existed before the Big-Bang.

Question is - what's causing the infinite contraction?

Is it contracting itself? A self contracting something?

Nothing created it. It's just always happened.

So if you accept what you said why then question what I said that God is uncreated?

for the same reason you don't accept what I said. I think you're wrong and neither of us has proof either way.

But which one makes more logical sense?

both are as plausible as the other.

A wise and powerful always existing uncreated God or an always existing - something that contracts?

contracts and expands. Don't forget the expands.

The universe exhibits signs of intelligence hence the only logical reason for its existence is an intelligent Creator - God.

theres only intelligent life now. There wasn't always. That makes a flaw in your augment for God.

This is not based on faith but logic.

of course it is. If it wasn't then your answer wouldn't be God. Believing in God is a belief. This whole argument if yours is based on belief.

originally posted by: edmc^2
a reply to: TerryDon79

So what is this

the great contraction

that you talked of?

Jesus f Christ riding a dinosaur.

the great contraction is what happens to the universe after billions of years (hypothesis). It then goes into a tiny bit of stuff. Then expands really bloody quick (Big Bang).

How can you argue against something you know nothing about?

a reply to: TerryDon79

How can you?

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: TerryDon79

How can you?

How can I argue against religion and God?

I was a Christian for 20 years. Then I realised it was man made bs.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: edmc^2

This is not based on faith but logic.

This statement depends upon this statement:

The universe exhibits signs of intelligence

Which shows that this statement is true:

This is not based on faith but logic.

Circular logic is not logic.

Actually true faith is based on logic and evidence. It is faith because what you observe is not seen. There is no circular logic. Just a failure to understand what he means when he says faith and logic.

(Hebrews 11:1) Faith is the assured expectation of what is hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities that are not seen.

Faith is assured because there has been evidence given of things that are real and very provable.

You mix true faith based on sound reasoning, logic, proof, and evidence, with blind faith which many people have. Such as the blind faith that God does not exist. While there is plenty of evidence in creation of a thinking mind behind it, there is no such evidence he does not exist.

So actually the blind faith is on the part of people who claim God doesn't exist. That is logical.

a reply to: TerryDon79

That means you don't know God...
God made it all...
Man didn't make God...
That's an oxymoron...
And illogical...
If you would have said religion you might have made sense...
But it's just more proof you don't know what you are talking about really...

originally posted by: 5StarOracle
a reply to: TerryDon79

That means you don't know God...
God made it all...
Man didn't make God...
That's an oxymoron...
And illogical...
If you would have said religion you might have made sense...
But it's just more proof you don't know what you are talking about really...

Prove God did it.

Prove God exists.

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: edmc^2
a reply to: TerryDon79

So what is this

the great contraction

that you talked of?

Jesus f Christ riding a dinosaur.

the great contraction is what happens to the universe after billions of years (hypothesis). It then goes into a tiny bit of stuff. Then expands really bloody quick (Big Bang).

How can you argue against something you know nothing about?

Sure. I know what it is. Just want to see your version since you're a proponent of multiverse.

But to be sure - how many "big bangs" is there that we know of?

a reply to: QuinnP

While there is plenty of evidence in creation of a thinking mind behind it

False. Unless that "evidence" is seen through the eyes of faith. Circular.

there is no such evidence he does not exist.

True.

a reply to: TerryDon79

The Universe was created...
You said so yourself...
You have your idea of the method...
You refer to the process as the big bang...
The definition of God whoever God is remains the creator of the Universe... That would make him the cause of whatever process...
You can assume to know who God is or wonder... but without that supernatural kick-start there really is no other logical answer...
It took something outside our natural laws of everything we know and understand... This is what science says as it fails to provide an answer...
It took something beyond natural means or science would provide the answer...

originally posted by: QuinnP

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: edmc^2

This is not based on faith but logic.

This statement depends upon this statement:

The universe exhibits signs of intelligence

Which shows that this statement is true:

This is not based on faith but logic.

Circular logic is not logic.

Actually true faith is based on logic and evidence. It is faith because what you observe is not seen. There is no circular logic. Just a failure to understand what he means when he says faith and logic.

(Hebrews 11:1) Faith is the assured expectation of what is hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities that are not seen.

Faith is assured because there has been evidence given of things that are real and very provable.

You mix true faith based on sound reasoning, logic, proof, and evidence, with blind faith which many people have. Such as the blind faith that God does not exist. While there is plenty of evidence in creation of a thinking mind behind it, there is no such evidence he does not exist.

So actually the blind faith is on the part of people who claim God doesn't exist. That is logical.

Unfortunately, logic becomes muddy with such person because of a pre-conceived idea that God doesn't exist inspite of the many logical evidence.

Consider again what they are proposing here - INFINITE CONTRACTION!

INFINITE CONTRACTION as the sole power for the existence of this universe and "other universes".

Now where is the logic in that?

the great contraction is what happens to the universe after billions of years (hypothesis). It then goes into a tiny bit of stuff. Then expands really bloody quick (Big Bang).

What does this look like to you? Logic or some kind of Hindu teaching of death and rebirth?

I'm sorry but this looks like a Hindu faith to me.

originally posted by: edmc^2

originally posted by: TerryDon79

originally posted by: edmc^2
a reply to: TerryDon79

So what is this

the great contraction

that you talked of?

Jesus f Christ riding a dinosaur.

the great contraction is what happens to the universe after billions of years (hypothesis). It then goes into a tiny bit of stuff. Then expands really bloody quick (Big Bang).

How can you argue against something you know nothing about?

Sure. I know what it is. Just want to see your version since you're a proponent of multiverse.

wrong, again. Not multiverse. Singular universe.

But to be sure - how many "big bangs" is there that we know of?

That we can say for 100%? None.
How many gods are there that we know of 100%? none.

a reply to: edmc^2

I'm sorry but this looks like a Hindu faith to me.

Your point is what?

a reply to: 5StarOracle

Again, you're wrong in what you have said o said.

There are plenty of logical answers. My favourite is an infinity loop. Go google it. It might open your mind a bit.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: edmc^2

I'm sorry but this looks like a Hindu faith to me.

Your point?

is the INFINITE CONTRACTION based more on faith or logic?