Dunkin' CEO: $15 minimum wage is 'outrageous'

originally posted by: muse7
I'm sorry but $15 bucks an hour for fast food workers IS outrageous.

The CEO might be overpaid but he probably went to university and busted his ass at school to at least deserve some of the money he's making.

If these people want to make $15 an hour then they should go to college and get a degree in something useful that's in demand or learn a trade that's in demand.

Let's imagine they did. Let's imagine for a moment that everyone worked as hard as Mr Travis, busted their humps, went to business school, got their degrees and so on. That's not going to stop the problem of thousands of people applying for hundreds of jobs, so you''ll still have need of, and have, overqualified people working for fast food companies. And they would also be demanding $15 an hour, and I think they would deserve it. You should be able to live comfortably while working full time.

This would also stop businesses being able to subsidize low wages with food stamps, and that plus a higher disposable income would stimulate the economy. Is it unreasonable to ask the richest country in the world to enforce a living minimum wage? I mean, we allow big businesses and investors to capitilise on an economic collapse they created, we allow them to avoid tax through shady business deals, we allow them to get preferential treatment from the courts, and we allow them to patholigically hoard more wealth than they could possibly ever have need of, and $15 an hour, in a country where 15% of the population struggle to eat every day, is outrageous?

I'm sick of this stupid argument, it's literally impossible within the current capitalist model for everyone to be a high achiever regardless of how hard they work. Sure, the entrepreneur who works 12 hours a day 7 days a week for a decade to build up a multimillion dollar business is to be commended, but for every success there are 10 who couldn't make it, not for lack of hard work and dedication, just pot luck, and some of them end up flipping burgers. Aren't they just as entitled to a living wage as you are? Despite your snooty, holier than thou dismissal of "these people", flipping burgers and other "menial" service jobs are really tough. They takes their toll physically, emotionally and spiritually. Last point, stats point towards the idea that it's not hard work and dedication that determine future job role, but rather your social status in early life. Most born into impoverished families remain impoverished, and those born into middle or upper class families tend to remain middle and upper class. So the problem is clearly structural.

But for you, and people like you, the problem is black and white, "people just need to work harder." Well I'm sorry, but it's clear to me, and others educated about the issue, that it's a little more complicated than that. Your limited understanding and input provide no insights into the issue, or how to fix it, and I would go as far as to say that statement is detrimental to the effort as a whole, because you shift the blame from those responsible for low wages to the people being exploited by them.

originally posted by: pexx421
Shorting me on a regular basis all so the manager can try to get a bonus. So yeah, I think our current sop is exploitative and abusive to the workers.

"Your" SOP, I have hourly and they are full time non-exempt employees and so the get 40 or more no matter what as per FLSA rules. Your position must be under part time and so you work 20 to 40 per week.

And no, I am not speaking for myself, I am in shipping/receiving, but I see first hand who the real movers and shakers are. I've offered this wager to the people who make the decisions where I work. Everyone who works on salary take a month off and see how the company runs, then let the hourly people take a month off and see how it goes. The results will surprise you

Depends on the job I suppose. What are you assuming.. that the salary employee just pushes paper and has no actual skill of merit, whereas the unskilled labor does?

I guarantee if I took a month off, things would go to hell. Why? Because a non-skilled worker can't just step into my job. Which is the point. I on the other hand, -can- step into almost any unskilled job and create production. It may take me half a day to learn how to use the machine to cut a pipe, or how to use that plasma cutter to cut out 1/2 steel. But a non-skilled worker is in no way going to be able to step in and start configuring firewalls and security appliances for VPN access back to our company and other jobsites correctly or securely, or keep up with the dozen or so projects I am usually actively involved in along with a myriad of other duties. It would take them months to learn what they need to know.

And here is the thing.. for the company I work, many hard working plumbers, pipefitters, welders, electricians, etc... worked their way up, put in the effort to learn new systems or processes, and are now in the office making better pay. There is absolutely a degree of effort and learned skills that justify a higher rate of pay. Suggesting that skilled workers and unskilled workers are interchangeable is simply ridiculous.

originally posted by: odd1out
After five or six failed attempts to find someone to "stick"

That is kind of the issue, there are a lot of people who are not very good and they drift from job to job, never sticking and building loyalty skill and pay... wouldn't you just love it that everyone of these you had to pay 15 bucks an hour day one?

. We could not at that time afford to pay him more than minimum wage.

Many here feel you are a failed business and should have closed your doors because of this...

The problem I see with businesses today is the unwillingness to go much beyond minimum wage for loyal employees. A loyal employee is worth their weight in gold, and believe me when I say, my business COULD NOT grow without the employees I have doing their jobs well. They are like family to me and I treat them that way.

I disagree, I think in most businesses capable loyal employees get noticed and work their way to better pay. In those that do not do this don't work in that industry.

If I had to start an employee at $15 an hour (which is what my first employee makes) there wouldn't be much leeway for advances in pay.

Yep failed company, you do not have a right to keep your doors open...

$15 an hour may be a lot in some places, but it isn't a living wage here. Can I afford to pay the wage? If I needed help and I couldn't afford it, then I had better do the work myself.

I was going to say that 15 per hour in Cal is still crap wage...hehe I just spent 5 week in San Diego and if I moved there my income would need to double to keep the same lifestyle I have in Washington state.

Is it unethical for a business owner to take huge profits while not paying his employees a decent wage or never giving raises?

It is hard to say... If you were making 500k per year profit but your 2 employees were making 10 bucks an hour I would agree. The CEO of my company makes about 12 -15 million a year and I don't have a problem with that if he keeps the company growing. BTW if he said he is taking zero pay and putting all his income into everyone's pay instead we would all get a whopping 5 cents an hour raise...

originally posted by: ugmold


71% is not even 3/4 of 100% This is long over due, thus the need for the catch up, haven't you noticed the economy? And if they went out and got some skills, who would serve yo your coffee? Your answer: a machine. You can already go to a vending machine. What, problem with that?

Minimum wage is $7.25/hr. A 100% raise would be $14.50/hr. No wonder people want a $15 minimum wage. They have no basic math skills. Also, Dunkin' Donuts is a franchise company, meaning that how much the CEO makes has zero relevance to how much each store makes.

Maybe expend a joule of energy someday to learn at least something about math, economics, and finance before speaking on a subject?

/TOA

originally posted by: fleabit
Suggesting that skilled workers and unskilled workers are interchangeable is simply ridiculous.

Why do you suggest that a "paper pusher" is unskilled? I'm a senior manger and my "skills" are better than 95% of the people that work for me since I did what they did before I moved up? Also, it is not a "paper pusher"...there is a level ignorance you show using that term.

originally posted by: six67seven

In my post above, Im looking at a $15 minimum wage while discussing these big businesses like a DD or McDonalds, with certain cities in mind. Im not in favor of or expect a small business owner to pay that wage. Financially, its simply not viable.

These problems arent simple, and when government is as nosey as ours, its even more difficult.

The problem is that the model in the past was a bunch of highschoolers in their first job and some retirees looking to make a little extra working under a pimple faced 20 year old as the manager, and it worked well.

Today, people can not find jobs so you have people in the prime of their working age looking for a job that a highschooler should have, and everyone thinks the answer is to raise the wage of that job because of this. That will fix nothing if we can not get quality jobs worth 15, 20, 40, 80 bucks an hour back into our country.

I do not think that the discussion should be about people not having basic skills, it should be about the american taxpayers who are subsidizing businesses to make more profit while paying their employees a salary they cannot live on.

As i understand it the minimum wage has not kept up with inflation, see this as a correction.

I'm only going to say this on one more thread around here, y'all keep screwing around with this $15 minimum wage crap for fast food workers, and the jobs will be GONE. I've already spoken to 3 different franchisees that ALL said if it happens they're going to touch screens like WAWA uses currently with only back of the house staff.

Maybe if Obama added more than just part time and low wage jobs in his 8 years we wouldn't even have a need for this discussion, but that's what we're left with. I do believe there should be a SMALL raise in the minimum wage, but $15 is ridiculous.

originally posted by: earthling42
I do not think that the discussion should be about people not having basic skills, it should be about the american taxpayers who are subsidizing businesses to make more profit while paying their employees a salary they cannot live on.

As i understand it the minimum wage has not kept up with inflation, see this as a correction.

Well lets look... here is the last 20 years...

CPI was 150 in 1995 and 238 today. That means a dollar in 1995 takes 1.57 today to buy the same thing.

Minimum wage in 1995 was $4.25 and today it is Federally $7.25 and a range from $7.25 to $10.50 per hour in States.

If we added 57% to 1995 minimum wage we get $4.25 + 57% = $6.67 so by the last 20 years we are keeping up with inflation.

1968 was the very best in US history for minimum wage at $1.60

CPI is 550% higher today than 1968 so if we added 550% to $1.60 we get $10.40 so an increase to $10.40 would match the very best we every had. Should it be 9 to 10 bucks, most likely. Should it be 15 bucks, no way....

OUCH!!! If $15 an hour is all the starting pay a college degree is worth these days, then, be prepared when a BA degree is the minimum requirement for landing a job in the fast food industry!!! Double that OUCH!!!

a reply to: Sremmos80

People could be paid whatever wage. Business and banking will always figure out a way of extracting any benefit from a higher wage from about anyone you can think of.

The real problem is business and how it is conducted and allowed to be conducted by the supposed regulators and such.

You can give people however much money you would for a wage and they (businesses of all types) are waiting to devise plans and write laws to steal the people's wealth from them.

We have been here before and we will be here again because man is the stupidest animal in the animal kingdom.

a reply to: Xtrozero





I am surprised, i thought the inflation was a lot higher in the US.

Thanks.

a reply to: Nothingbutnet

The top 1 per cent of families had 10 per cent of total income in 1972,now its 20 percent people like this CEO are doing well,people like this CEO also destroyed the middle class and have replaced it with low income/part time jobs.Your average fast food worker gets $9.48 per hour I wouldn't get out of bed for that sorry.The minimum wage in Australia is AUD$17.29 civilization has not collapsed and unemployment is 5-6 per cent.I will admit the rich have done well to brainwash your community people that work at Mc Donalds are not lazy and shiftless most actually get there ass worked off,then theres tipping official welfare for scungy rich people that dont pay good wages to a non-American thats a curious practice the price you pay in Australia includes the capacity to pay properly and guess what its not that much more expensive.

God...

The minimum wage is an idiotic concept -- and raising it is even more pointless.

First of all, if we raise the minimum wage from $7.25 to $15/per hour, after inflation, workers will be making the same relative amount and still won't make a "living wage". If you don't believe me, raise the minimum wage and tell me in three years how well off everyone is.

Second of all, we shouldn't be fighting for a higher minimum wage. We should be fighting for a maximum profit, that is to say that a business can only mark up a product by a certain percent. For instance, currently, a pepperoni pizza costs less than a dollar to manufacture, but pizza restaurants charge you upwards of $6 to purchase it. That is a profit of more than 500%. Where I live, the average apartment complex charges $800 per month for a one bedroom. Assuming there are 100 units and larger, more expensive floorplans, we can figure they'd make an average of $90,000 per month. That's over $1 million per year. After the shoddy repairs and paying the office staff, who make less than one month of the complex's profits, the complex still walks away with just under $.75 million.

All I'm saying is set a cap on the top, not on the bottom.

originally posted by: Nothingbutnet
OUCH!!! If $15 an hour is all the starting pay a college degree is worth these days, then, be prepared when a BA degree is the minimum requirement for landing a job in the fast food industry!!! Double that OUCH!!!

Hey.

The same people telling everybody to get that college degree are the same ones telling everybody to share their wealth with other people who don't get that college degree !!!!

Hmmm.

a reply to: ugmold

Its not your place to tell other people how they have to spend their own money. If you have an objection to Dunkin' Donuts having wages of $10.00, then only go to fair wage restaurants, and get your friends to do the same. Problem solved, without fascist violence against people's property rights. And as far as greed is concerned, its not generous of YOU to give away other people's money. Coveting other people's property is wrong, and two wrongs don't make a right.

Its only moral solve wrongs with rights, and forcing other people to spend their money the way YOU force them to isn't right. A minimum wage is a moral wrong because it violates the property rights of others. Greed is bad, and coveting is just as bad too. So, support fair wage restaurants.

You don't have my respect, because I know where you are going with this. You have my disrespect because a minimum wage is offensive, as it requires violence. Open a fair wage restaurant or stop complaining because you are either relentlessly complaining or attempting to attack us by violating our property rights. So, what will it be?

originally posted by: khnum
Now if everyone was on minimum wages or part time work then no one could afford donuts and Mr CEO would be fired....look for this on a global scale soon the Wizard of Oz hasn't been concentrating on growth and consumer spending the Humpty Dumpty moment approaches when all this greed reaches critical morass.

This is not true. Australia has a high minimum wage for restaurant workers. The price they pay is ultimately that there are very few restaurants that open in that country in comparison to the USA. So, its not worth shutting down restaurants over in most cases, but it prevents new ones from opening. Its basically stupid way of taxing the middle class in a way that works towards a strange charity sort of program that rewards people for dedicating their lives to unskilled labor, so their skills will languish as there is no point in actually learning something useful.

The effects of a minimum wage are highly complex. They are too complex for know-it-all people to actually figure it out whether they are helping or hurting people. Liberals problem here is that the pretend to know something, when they are clueless. I'm not saying I know that much more than they do, because I only know a little bit more than they do about the issue as I mentioned is very complex. But the problem is you have no business running other people's businesses when you really don't know what you are doing. A minimum wage is a communist policy, and it sucks.

a reply to: nonnez

What's the difference between busting your ass on a job and busting your ass in college?

UGHhhh

originally posted by: scolai
God...

The minimum wage is an idiotic concept -- and raising it is even more pointless.

First of all, if we raise the minimum wage from $7.25 to $15/per hour, after inflation, workers will be making the same relative amount and still won't make a "living wage". If you don't believe me, raise the minimum wage and tell me in three years how well off everyone is.

To be fair, this would only be true if all other wages were raised as well. Which, of course, is what should happen because of the value of labor. If someone is making $7.25/hr now, and another is already making $15/hr, that $15/hr worker's labor is valued 107% more. Should the minimum wage rise to $15/hr, a 107% raise, the $15/hr worker should start making $31.05/hr., making the new $15 the old $7.25.

/TOA