Russia declares war on Ukraine. Live updates from inside Ukraine

a reply to: dragonridr

just maybe, he isnt the devil afterall. and just waiting patiently will bring the devil into light. ???

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: ALoveSupreme

Actually for the intent of my post it is appropriate. Combat units made up of forced service are generally less efficient than their volunteer counterparts. People who have no desire to fight in a war generally do not make good soldiers, even more so when the combat duty is based on foreign soil on the other side of the world.

Granted it will be different since its occurring on their home soil. My comparison is based solely on the facts surrounding forced conscription combat effectiveness over volunteer effectiveness. It comes back to the age old doctrine of quality over quantity. While quantity of manpower is extremely important, the numbers can be deceiving when the bulk of those individuals have no desire to fight in a war.

Forced conscription works good for military parades.. just ask N. Korea.

Drafts just throw bodies at a situation however quality of force is a joke. The draft is one of the reasons the US lost Vietnam. Not only does it make the war unpopular but you end up with troops that do nothing but demoralize and bring down combat effectiveness.

@lennutrajektoor: pro-Russian media report #Mariupol city hall is partially in flames. #ATO #Ukraine

There are between 300-500 people in this building.

Too far off topic.

double post sorry.

a reply to: ProfessorT

Note that it's still standing and didn't collapse into it's own footprint...

Sorry. I couldn't resist.

originally posted by: ALoveSupreme
A member of militant feminist, anti-fascist group FEMEN in immediate run up to siege of pro-Russians at Trade Unions building in Odessa yesterday.

from article,,www.abovetopsecret.com...

( which gives me the impression he meant the majority,,,)
quote
"Many attackers chanted "Fascists! Fascists!".
unquote

yaa thought so.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: letscit
a reply to: dragonridr

just maybe, he isnt the devil afterall. and just waiting patiently will bring the devil into light. ???

Well i never bought into evil Putin i believe hes seriously misreading situations based off his own leaning in the KGB. I see some of his motivation but hes making bad calls. He will pay for this later the worst mistake a politician can make is misjudge a situation that later will come back to haunt them.

originally posted by: victor7
a reply to: ausername

I agree that it is the right time for Putin to send in his army. This way he will not have to fight his way in and do destruction on the land.

If he is waiting for full scale civil war to justify sending in his army then he is wrong. West will not give any leeway for Russian invasion, either now or later.

No time for "image dressing" here. Time to gain further confidence of those who have supported him and also to protect his men from Spetsnaz and GRU. Can't leave them on the field to find their own ways and means.

I find myself in agreement with some of the things you stated.......

......looks out the window to see if in fact the world has ended...........
.............................................................................. As for Putin to put up or shut up I agree.

I truly believe he thought East and South Ukraine would go in the same manner Crimea did. I also feel that is the key reasons these separatist groups are pushing for a May 11th referendum instead of waiting for the May 25th Presidential elections.

If they wait, the likelihood of those regions becoming independent drop to nil since territory change referendums in Ukraine require an all nation vote. I also, and I know people disagree with me, think the reason for May 11th is so the separatists / Moscow can control the outcome of the referendum, like they did in Crimea (The UNHCR report specifically mentions the issues involved in the Crimean referendum).

So many contradictory statements made by Putin, Lavrov and Churkin makes me wonder if they even communicate with each other.

I still think Putin's intent / actions are based on how he thinks he is perceived by the world, instead of equating with how Russia is perceived. Making politics at that level personal is a problem as we are seeing. Where a nation would cut its losses and stop while they are ahead, a leader operating at the personal level wont. I think Putin's ego will push this entire endeavor into a mass disaster with no winner on either side.

warm welcome to 'Liberators' in Kramatorsk

originally posted by: letscit
a reply to: dragonridr

just maybe, he isnt the devil afterall. and just waiting patiently will bring the devil into light. ???

Or the Devil accidentally exposed himself by mistake and is desperately trying to force a win out of a loss.

Putin has made so many statements on not invading, that if he does Putin, and by extension Russia, is done in the diplomatic realm. It could also easily escalate from diplomatic responses to military. Not to mention the possible loss of current allies, who may not be dragged into active fighting would surely suffer at the economic level when sanctions would be imposed on Russia.

the other issue I have been thinking about is why Putin stopped where he did and when he did. It makes me wonder if he has been shown the intelligence by the west showing Russia's / Putin's hand involved in this entire mess and makes me wonder if that discussion contained how the information would be made public if Putin does not stop.

a reply to: dragonridr

Misreading situations,Obama and America , you just don't relies the world has begin to wake up.
More and more people can see through the American bulls""t you just got to look to find the truth..

originally posted by: seppirish
a reply to: dragonridr

Misreading situations,Obama and America , you just don't relies the world has begin to wake up.
More and more people can see through the American bulls""t you just got to look to find the truth..

Tell ya what, I will splt the difference.

I think the world is waking up and is starting to see thru the BS of a lot of nations, Russia and the US included.

Figured id show this because his shooting appeared to be a turning point.

Citizen of EU ‏@wavetossed 3m
#Ukraine #euromaidan Israeli doctors say that Gennady Kernes is out of danger, off the ventilator and breathing on his own

"Above, two girls smile for a camera while carrying molotov cocktails in Odessa yesterday before the Trade Unions fire."

yes cover there faces , because in the real world where laws are accepted and followed, this would be evidence, for a CASE OF MURDER.
or do the rules not apply??

Be vary cautious young people,, after all Egyptian people later took stock of the situation,, and are now sentencing people too death. For murder its called,,murder.

a reply to: BobAthome

If ya don't mind me asking, where did the pic come from?

MaidanOnline ‏@MaidanOnline · 8m
The SBU has arrested the GRU subversionist ‘Abwehr’ wp.me... fb.me...

Russian propaganda in overdrive.

RT ‏@RT_com · 21m
#Odessa slaughter: How vicious mob burnt anti-govt activists alive (GRAPHIC IMAGES) on.rt.com...

A lot of angry people in Odessa yesterday, the day after a few dozens of people died in burning building.
And it is going to be worse.
People are chanting 'Russia, Russia' and burning Ukrainian flag.



Another Ukrainian flag burned yesterday, this was in Donetsk.
People chanting 'we will not forgive you for Odessa'

This is supposedly Ukrainian APCs shooting at Russian (terrorist,separatist,pro Russian or defnse force pick one) positions in Konstantinovka.

a reply to: Xcathdra

an arab *futurist female..


www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: BobAthome

opps that futurist female,,arab,,that is.
apparently NOT,, supremest,, as i had first, mis-read,,my mistake,,

futurist , not supremest.