BREAKING: Fearing collapse of emergency spillway at Oroville Dam, Oroville evacuated

originally posted by: TheScale

originally posted by: jappee
From the link in the OP;

Governor issues emergency order to assist in dealing with Oroville Dam crisis Gov. Jerry Brown’s office said he has issued an emergency order to help authorities deal with the evacuation and other efforts associated with concerns over the potential for flooding from Oroville Dam spillways. “I’ve been in close contact with emergency personnel managing the situation in Oroville throughout the weekend, and it’s clear the circumstances are complex and rapidly changing,” Brown said. “i want to thank local and state law enforcement for leading evacuation efforts and doing their part to keep residents safe. The state is directing all necessary personnel and resources to deal with this very serious situation.” State emergency services officials are planning an 11 p.m. press conference to discuss their efforts.

if only our politicians in the state would quit appropriating/stealing our money earmarked for infrastructure repairs and upkeep we wouldnt need to be put into a situation like this where we need protecting from their incompetence.

ffs why does the qoute system suck so bad on ATS. the part qouted shows up in my post prior to posting but gets deleted when posted

I have learned that quotes within quotes do not get shown, probably for saving space in the thread.

I can agree with you that our state government is ripe with corruption and stealing our monies for their interests. and these things could be averted if not for these officials need for greed and power. Look at what party is and has been in control for decades.

But that is for another thread.

a reply to: jappee

According to this Mercury News article, it was precisely greed that stopped the emergency spillway from being improved with a concrete cap.

I sure hope the rain stays away and the weather doesn't warm dramatically, melting the snowpack all at once. At least then, the dam operators will have a chance to bring the lake levels down in a controlled manner.

On a side note, I just read that Shasta Dam, a few counties north and west of the Oroville Dam location, was only 5 feet below its maximum? link

Water officials are releasing 70,000 cubic feet per second (cfs) from Shasta Dam as the lake stands just 5 feet from the top of the reservoir, the Shasta County Sheriff's Office said.

This link gives an hourly look at inflows, outflows, level and volume for Lake Shasta, the largest reservoir in California.

a reply to: Olivine

It has been reported that the main spillway is releasing 100,000 CFS at the moment. They are shooting for a goal of 88 ft below crest of the emergency spillway which is way below even reaching it's base. That should be a good buffer for incoming water.

This all started from 2 things.

1; The main spillway showed damage to the slide sometime a week ago, In effort to examine the damage, they shut off water from the main spillway. This and rain/snow melt lead to the lake level rising.

2;The cutoff of the main spillway caused lake water level to rise thus reaching the emergency spillway and revealing inadequacies with the leeward side causing the evacuation. They are currently shoring the erosion with boulders and concrete in case it comes into use again for high rain/snow melt levels. Note that the emergency spillway has NEVER been used in it's 48 year history. This is the first time they have been able to actually see it in action.

Now that the decision had been made yesterday evening to release the main spillway @100,00CFS for sake of more damage to it's slide portion, lake water levels have dropped and it seems they have averted any real danger for the time being.

And YES California's corrupt politicians in general suck (expletive).

a reply to: Miracula2

Sierra Club....just saying.

Yeah? just saying what?

Are you saying that the Sierra Club (and others) suggested that the Oroville spillway needed urgent upgrades way back in 2005 and even before that (because they did, you know)? Or are you saying that Schwarzenegger and Bush told them to go pound sand (because they did, you know)?

Why do you leave us in so much suspense over what you are saying. This is a forum for communication - why are you so reluctant to communicate?

a reply to: jappee

Screw commiefornia! If ol moonbeam had not spent 1/4 billion on sheltering illegals they could fix it anyway. YAY Darwin!

PERSPECTIVE.. From the ERA of the Creation of the Dam...



ANy Engineers of today find fault in this video's representation of the process?

NO clue here, just trying to learn

I've been away but I found this short video to show you guys what the danger was.

it's like 1.5 minutes




notice the erosion near the wall.
THAT is what the issue was. everything else is ok.. (as far as real danger)
the other hole is like 700 feet away from the dam.. Size perspective is probably confusing but that is a LONG ramp.

but that hole in the dirt was the concern.. they noticed it and evacuated.. The only reason they let the water spill over the emergency spillway was to save that hole 700 feet away from the dam in the concrete "water slide" from growing..

once they realized they just opened a much worse danger they just switched the first one on high.
This saved the wall, and they've done a lot to repair the ground erosion closest to the wall that also has much less pressure on it than before.

Next reports will probably be tomorrow morning.


The reason I've been so confident in my assessments is I knew the issue was ground erosion that had not reached any structures, and I knew it was no longer taking place hours after the evacuation order was issued. How did I know that? for one I did not confuse all the different things they were talking about and I've been paying attention to this for hours and hours on end, so I have a lot more to go by than some random person who watches a couple reports from confused journalists. Another thing I knew was the water was only so high because they weren't using any spill ways at different points to assess damage.

They figured the emergency spillway would have it covered. It was quickly apparent that that idea was a grave error. This si why the panic.. The imminent failure warning.. Get out now.. Because they could not have known the issue would come up like that. That's what made the situation change so fast, it wasn't any change in the lake or the first damage growing, it was new groudn erosion in a new spot..

So realizing the danger they turned the main spillway back on, and within about an hour of that the water that was topping the wall at 1.5 feet, was down to 2 inches topping, and about 20 minutes later the water had stopped going down the side of the dirt hill.

That's when I said the pressure on the wall has come down from it's peak, the erosion has stopped, and they will repair that in the daylight.

People look at the amount of water coming out of the main spillway and think it's some kind of mistake it's like a raging river looking thing. Well it's not ideal to be letting that water destroy potentially more of the ramp and cause more erosion towards the bottom of the hill there, but it poses no threat to the dam or the spillway or the town whatever.

It is racking up the damage costs, which is why they originally thought "let's use the emergency spillway"


You have to get your data on your own. Stop trusting dummies.

originally posted by: sycomix
a reply to: jappee

Screw commiefornia! If ol moonbeam had not spent 1/4 billion on sheltering illegals they could fix it anyway. YAY Darwin!

I tend to agree with you but i would prefer you do not call us commiefornia, our politicians are not the citizenship. There are a great number of red blooded Americans here, they only took over the political offices not the whole of our minds. Look deeper into the situation.

Bash our politicians all you want but regard our population with a bit more respect.

And this is not the purpose of this thread, a reminder.

originally posted by: Olivine
a reply to: jappee

According to this Mercury News article, it was precisely greed that stopped the emergency spillway from being improved with a concrete cap.

Hopefully it's safe to say they will put concrete on that DAMN hill now... Jesus...


I mean I know they are filling in gaps, but this better be a crisis averted inspiration to fix these issues BEFORE they come up again in the future.

originally posted by: Olivine
a reply to: jappee

According to this Mercury News article, it was precisely greed that stopped the emergency spillway from being improved with a concrete cap.

I sure hope the rain stays away and the weather doesn't warm dramatically, melting the snowpack all at once. At least then, the dam operators will have a chance to bring the lake levels down in a controlled manner.

On a side note, I just read that Shasta Dam, a few counties north and west of the Oroville Dam location, was only 5 feet below its maximum? link

Water officials are releasing 70,000 cubic feet per second (cfs) from Shasta Dam as the lake stands just 5 feet from the top of the reservoir, the Shasta County Sheriff's Office said.

This link gives an hourly look at inflows, outflows, level and volume for Lake Shasta, the largest reservoir in California.

What so people at the dams are asleep at the switch? Spill ways are emergency goto, why did they let the dams get that high, overburdening the spill way at Oroville? If dams are reaching spillway levels they are not being managed properly on the site.

Given that rains are excessive and could become problematic as reservoirs rise, you'd think they'd be watching them a bit closer, to prevent whats happening at Oroville and may be building to crisis portions at others?

Nah, watchmen and alarms are expensive.

a reply to: JacKatMtn

Hey that was pretty cool, thanks!

On a positive note, this whole thing might have a silver I mean Gold Lining, since the dam was built using earth fill from nearby dredge tailings.

There are tiny piece of gold in there darn dam hills.

On a more serious note, if Trump wanted to make America great again, he could start with our crumbling infrastructure,

What ever happened to our bridges that needed work?

The Gas Pipes?

The Water Pipes?

And the pot holes! They cost you more money than you'd really want to know.

Another thought i wonder how many people will return home to find their homes broken into. Easy to blame criminals but easy for the government to go through all the places they have been wanting to but couldn't get a court order.


HUMMMM

originally posted by: Tranceopticalinclined
There are tiny piece of gold in there darn dam hills.

Oroville isn't that far from Coloma. I'm sure there's dust in pockets if you poke around for it.

We used to dream of finding a lost lode when I was a kid. You could occasionally get a fleck or two of gold but I never found anything promising. Dahlonega isn't that far from Toccoa.

originally posted by: jappee
a reply to: Olivine

It has been reported that the main spillway is releasing 100,000 CFS at the moment. They are shooting for a goal of 88 ft below crest of the emergency spillway which is way below even reaching it's base. That should be a good buffer for incoming water.

I'm fairly certain that the spillway starts at approx 850' and the other mechanisms for draining water are currently broken, which means they can't drop it below 850'.

That's one of the major issues, that the spillway is now the only functional mechanism for releasing water, and they can only use it once the dam is already getting close to capacity - dangerously close when you consider that the spillway itself doesn't appear to be safe to run at maximum capacity and the potential inflow can be very, very high.

They're walking a tightrope between 850' and 901' and hoping that the weather plays nice.

I would welcome any knowledgeable correction as I'm not certain on the spillway height. I can't actually remember where I heard 850'.

originally posted by: rnaa
a reply to: Miracula2

Sierra Club....just saying.

Yeah? just saying what?

Are you saying that the Sierra Club (and others) suggested that the Oroville spillway needed urgent upgrades way back in 2005 and even before that (because they did, you know)? Or are you saying that Schwarzenegger and Bush told them to go pound sand (because they did, you know)?

Why do you leave us in so much suspense over what you are saying. This is a forum for communication - why are you so reluctant to communicate?

The Sierra Club have a history of being anti-dam and lobbying/protesting to prevent them. There is a suggestion that the SC's involvement in the 60's resulted in changes to the way Oroville was built/limited what work could be done/whatever - changes that ultimately led to the current situation.

I've not found anything concrete (if you'll pardon the pun) to support this, but it's a theory that is currently doing the rounds.

a reply to: Bedlam
Ive found some nice nuggets in sutter creek, just outside the city of Volcano, and a bunch of nice big melon shaped flakes in Coyote creek (Natural bridges) right near New Melones dam. There is still a lot of gold up there

a reply to: visitedbythem

Once we found out the second American Gold Rush was less than an hour's drive from the house, we thought we'd learn to pan and check out every creek in the area. I think my next older brother found a nugget the size of a BB once, and you could find places with a bit of show here and there but the pickings were better in the Dahlonega area.

eta: Plus, there was the Legend of the Lost Cherokee Gold Mine, and it was supposed to be Right Around There. Never found it, though.

originally posted by: Reverbs

originally posted by: Olivine
a reply to: jappee

According to this Mercury News article, it was precisely greed that stopped the emergency spillway from being improved with a concrete cap.

Hopefully it's safe to say they will put concrete on that DAMN hill now... Jesus...

I mean I know they are filling in gaps, but this better be a crisis averted inspiration to fix these issues BEFORE they come up again in the future.

the part that blows me away is that they didnt have this taken care of from the outset of building the dam. im not an engineer yet i could have told them exactly what would have happened just by looking at it. i mean whoever thought building a spillway without some sort of concrete/boulders/etc down at the base where the water will be crashing down with immense force, was not thinking his job through.

Anyone noticing the damage to the spillway is going back towards the dam (due to the release of water down it) and not just away from the dam. Continued erosion up the spillway puts the overhead power line structure in jeopardy.

Do they allow the power lines to fail (don't know what it is feeding and consequence of shutting it off) or do they continue to allow 100,000cfs to flow down the spillway to prevent a future overtopping event?

The damage is now only feet away from the powerline structure

originally posted by: corblimeyguvnor

The damage is now only feet away from the powerline structure

I had heard the lines are shut down and some have been removed. But who knows? Seems like a valid approach, FPL dropped all the local power when Katrina hit about two hours before it started beating the crap out of the area so as not to fry up too many Pensacolanians.