Americans Killed By COPS........Outnumber Americans Killed In Iraq War

reply to post by crazyewok


I actually think a huge part of it is...most part time swat teams only train once a month....if they have someone to cover their shift....I remember being on swat entry and just absolutely cringing at what some of the guys were doing...I moved to sniper as quick as could so i could work alone or with just a partner....then I saw things through my scope which made me cringe ....Id say lack of training is a huge issue...

vkey08
reply to post by UxoriousMagnus

 

I never stated that I was "higher" than anyone, gods.. Insulting me and demeaning me all on one post nice...

I didn't say you did....how could I insult or demean someone with such intellectual pedigree?
You mentioned that your IQ was in the "high" hundreds. To me...that means 160 or higher (about 25 points higher than mine I might add.)
I was simply saying you are in the company of Einstein (IQ 160) and others....

It was congratulatory .....

Wow the cop bashing in this thread has been laid on rather thick.

Of course word has it we pulled out of Iraq.

Word also has it that operations in Afghanistan have been scaled back dramatically.

And then what were those '5000' people doing when they got 'killed'.

I do so love the hyperbole in the thread making it out like that's all cops do is go around shooting people for no reason.

Fine you don't like cops. You don't.

But stooping to the level of demagoguery is beneath ATS.

neo96
Wow the cop bashing in this thread has been laid on rather thick.

Of course word has it we pulled out of Iraq.

Word also has it that operations in Afghanistan have been scaled back dramatically.

And then what were those '5000' people doing when they got 'killed'.

I do so love the hyperbole in the thread making it out like that's all cops do is go around shooting people for no reason.

Fine you don't like cops. You don't.

But stooping to the level of demagoguery is beneath ATS.

Neo...surprised to hear you say these things....I thought everyone here (well...most) were making it clear that we feel the "system" is what is broken....that there are good cops and bad cops but that bad cops seem to get away with their crimes and corruption instead of being punished like we slaves would be.

I don't see how there can be demagoguery when statistics back up the claims that have been presented.

as for pulling out of the middle east....I would like to see some stats on that. And even if we have "drastically" scaled back....that just makes the stats presented that much worse.

reply to post by UxoriousMagnus

Neo...surprised to hear you say these things....I thought everyone here (well...most) were making it clear that we feel the "system" is what is broken....that there are good cops and bad cops but that bad cops seem to get away with their crimes and corruption instead of being punished like we slaves would be.

They can't be compared.

First off neither Iraq or Afghanistan ever had that number of 'boots on the ground'.

The 2012 Bureau of Justice Statistics' Census of State and Local Law Enforcement Agencies (CSLLEA), found there were 17,985 state and local law enforcement agencies employing at least one full-time officer or the equivalent in part-time officers.[1] In 2008, state and local law enforcement agencies employed more than 1.1 million persons on a full-time basis, including about 765,000 sworn personnel (defined as those with general arrest powers). Agencies also employed approximately 100,000 part-time employees, including 44,000 sworn officers

en.wikipedia.org...

That is what close 1 million police in this country ?

To repeat neither Iraq or Afghanistan had that sheer number.

Then there is that tool of choice the drone.

They aren't the same.

So 5000 have been killed so why label the other 995 thousand cops in America 'murders'.

In my book that is bad as trashing talking the military.

Its funny american talk all big with there AR-15 and secound amend meant but your too yellow bellied to do anything.

Britain had one case of a queationable shoting and we had a country wide riot. Hardly worth it IMO espeacial as the suspect was a known gang banger.

America on the other hand seem to have cases every week of not just queationable shooting but out right wrong shootings ! When i was in NY i heard someone got shot for speeding! You have beatings and boarder line toture and not just police but TSA and DEA ect yet what do you americans do? Ignore it.

cosmicexplorer
reply to post by crazyewok

 

I actually think a huge part of it is...most part time swat teams only train once a month....if they have someone to cover their shift....I remember being on swat entry and just absolutely cringing at what some of the guys were doing...I moved to sniper as quick as could so i could work alone or with just a partner....then I saw things through my scope which made me cringe ....Id say lack of training is a huge issue...

Exactly. They need training. Heavy back breaking training, with high revruitment criteria. And for armed police that will habe to not just carry but use there guns in public? Well the standard should be of the very highest. Armed police are unfortnatly needed in some form, and they need to have the publics trust and respect not fear and loathing.

Im sure not all us cops are bad, sure the ones on ats are of good calibre. But therr does seem to me alot of bad apples that are bringing you guys down,

crazyewok
Its funny american talk all big with there AR-15 and secound amend meant but your too yellow bellied to do anything.

Britain had one case of a queationable shoting and we had a country wide riot. Hardly worth it IMO espeacial as the suspect was a known gang banger.

America on the other hand seem to have cases every week of not just queationable shooting but out right wrong shootings ! When i was in NY i heard someone got shot for speeding! You have beatings and boarder line toture and not just police but TSA and DEA ect yet what do you americans do? Ignore it.

What is funny ?

WHAT IS FUNNY ?

Never letting a good chance to trash talk the US pass by.

And mock gun owners in this country which wasn't the topic.

Even more funny that over 350 million other Americans weren't shot by neither the cops or them 'second amendment' pushers.

crazyewok

Exactly. They need training. Heavy back breaking training...

They need feedback. Heavy, backbreaking feedback. The sort they are protected from by the system's structure.

IA is a joke. Who gets to investigate themselves? It's a blatant conflict of interest. IA should be for when an officer gropes the arse of the precinct receptionist. And it's a farce that they're able to investigate themselves and rubber stamp it okey-dokey. What do you expect them to do? I'd LOVE to be able to do that - no officer, I just investigated myself, and conclude that I acted in accordance with my own internal policy.

Secondly, the local DA isn't going to charge a cop with anything if he/she can avoid it, because they depend on the cops for their job success. Another conflict. You want to see some change, you need to provide immediate, punitive feedback that isn't "investigated" by someone with an interest in finding nothing. And that shouldn't come from the taxpayer. There should be state level police investigation teams with a mandate and incentivization to remove cops' certification permanently. Sort of a cop JCAHO. Complete with setups and sting jobs on cops. Take a bribe? Just lost your cert. Bogus ticket? Find another job. Pull over, officer, we're going through YOUR car with the drug dog...whoops! dropsy evidence. Assume the position, sir.

Police payouts should be coming from the personal wallets of the officers involved, too, and when it's the department, it should either come from their retirement fund or the asset forfeiture accounts. Shoot a few dogs, beat a few schizos to death and you won't be getting that neat tank to keep the riffraff in line this year.

reply to post by neo96


Awww hit i nerve did i?

Who cares what your population is, even ONE unjustfiable shooting or beating is too many.

In the war of indepedance im sure you would have made a fiiiiiiinnnnneeee loyalist. A red coat may even have suited you

reply to post by UxoriousMagnus


All it really points out is that our soldiers are highly trained and well equipped. I think 5000 is a very large number and it's unfortunate, but I don't think its a fair comparison.

Here is a fair comparison. Since 911 we have had 5000 citizens killed by police officers. In that same amount of time the citizens executed:

"In the United States, the total number of hand gun deaths (1980-2006) is more than 32,000 per year. Firearms are involved in 68% of homicides"

32,000 * 13 = 416,000

416,000!!!!! WTF!!!

reply to post by ezwip


Another way to look at stats is that we're putting numbers to a no win situation in life.

Within 75-80 years 330 Million Americans are going to die. Some horribly. Some quietly and many violently. By age, statistical fact and historical record, we know this to be 100% and absolutely true. Within 100 years to be generous, almost 7 billion Terrans on this planet will have died as well. 7 Billion people.. All dead. All within the next century. No question. No doubt. No escape.

Everyone dies..and in a nation of hundreds of millions, numbers hide so very much. Like..how many of those are scumbag vs. scumbag shoots? How many are scumbag vs. innocent citizen shootings in robberies, burglaries, crimes of passion and more? Numbers at the overall level become pretty meaningless by themselves, I think.

reply to post by crazyewok


What is unjustifiable in big number thinking? If someone rapes and murders a close family member of yours ..and you have the means..would you not shoot them? How about walking into them, in the act of the killing? Then would you shoot them? In some places...you'd get something like a Key to the City for your service to society. In others, you'd get a prison sentence and in yet others, possibly death by the State. All in the eye of the beholder, prosecutor and laws or attitudes of the location, eh?

It's a real fuzzy line there... Cop or no cop, and especially when people start pulling out statistical figures, IMO.

reply to post by UxoriousMagnus


It's what I like to call Predatory Governance.

Wrabbit2000
reply to post by ezwip

 

Within 100 years to be generous, almost 7 billion Terrans on this planet will have died as well. 7 Billion people.. All dead. All within the next century. No question. No doubt. No escape.

LOL ... have I told you lately how wise you are? I love perspective, but no one retains that when a gun is pointed in their general direction. Even at my age I could stand to carry on a few more years with all my vital organs intact.

Your post really brightened what started out as a very bad day!!

-Cheers

ezwip
reply to post by UxoriousMagnus

 

All it really points out is that our soldiers are highly trained and well equipped. I think 5000 is a very large number and it's unfortunate, but I don't think its a fair comparison.

Here is a fair comparison. Since 911 we have had 5000 citizens killed by police officers. In that same amount of time the citizens executed:

"In the United States, the total number of hand gun deaths (1980-2006) is more than 32,000 per year. Firearms are involved in 68% of homicides"

32,000 * 13 = 416,000

416,000!!!!! WTF!!!

edit on 13-2-2014 by ezwip because: Because 416,000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

okay....okay....hold on a second!

first of all the CDC has total homicides in the USA at 16,000 per year....that is total homicides

link: www.cdc.gov...

but even if you use your number of 32,000....you realize that this is 1% of 1% of the population.

that is 1% of 1%..... so if your proof number was $100 ..... it would be one penny.

It would just be nice to not have to die at the hands of corrupt cops. Is that too much to ask? Can I die some other way then to look at a cop the wrong way and have him beat me to death for no reason and then he get's off scott free?

thesaneone

crazyewok


No as its inocnet until proven guilty.

That is not the officers decision its the judge and jury to determine that.

That right there. But too often the police make it their business to be judge, jury, and executioner. I think that is what a lot of folks are having an issue with.

I remember reading somewhere that cops were on the top ten list of professions that had a high number of psychopathic personalities. Perhaps better psych screening is in order. Psychopaths are attracted to power and dangerous situations. So policework will draw a number of them. Given that psychopaths tend to be rather smart, I dont think low IQs are the issue.

That said, knowing the criminal elements of society and how they behave, I'm sure that more than one of those civilian deaths by cop more than likely involved someone who was an immediate threat to the safety and security of society, and had to be neutralized quickly. I shed no tears for them. I see douchebags everyday who are also psychopaths with no regard for the safety and well being of anyone else, and will threaten the lives innocent people for petty reasons.. If another citizen takes them out, Id certainly shed no tears. Nor would I if a cop did.

I don't really like cops much, and I don't see them as there for my benefit, per se, but neither am I going to jump the gun to the other side and claim that none of those who have been killed by cop didn't provoke or have it coming by being a danger to others. I shed no tears for either. My basic human and civil rights get violated far more by other citizens than they do by cops.