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Americans Killed By COPS........Outnumber Americans Killed In Iraq War
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reply to post by crazyewok
Ahhh.. a voice of logic from my furry little friend.
The funny thing is, most of what is taught in college these days can be self taught and sometimes, better. It's not a requirement, by any means, to attend a formal school for self improvement. Of course, that depends on the line of work, too. Some require that proof of knowledge on paper and hope it pans out for reality.
What I do get tired of in a hurry are folks who actively tear down others improving themselves by making great fun of the method being pursued to that end. It supports the very motto of our site and community here. Deny Ignorance. There isn't any place, whatsoever, to ridicule of those making good faith efforts in life to do precisely that ..and work their ass off to achieve it, at that. At least in my personal opinion....I'd want to insure I clarify here.
( a lot in the programs have changed by federal law/decree over the past couple years too...something that needs to be taken into account for how different it may be today from years past when others went through the same thing)
I'd imagine we wouldn't disagree to much there.
Ahhh.. a voice of logic from my furry little friend.
The funny thing is, most of what is taught in college these days can be self taught and sometimes, better. It's not a requirement, by any means, to attend a formal school for self improvement. Of course, that depends on the line of work, too. Some require that proof of knowledge on paper and hope it pans out for reality.
What I do get tired of in a hurry are folks who actively tear down others improving themselves by making great fun of the method being pursued to that end. It supports the very motto of our site and community here. Deny Ignorance. There isn't any place, whatsoever, to ridicule of those making good faith efforts in life to do precisely that ..and work their ass off to achieve it, at that. At least in my personal opinion....I'd want to insure I clarify here.
( a lot in the programs have changed by federal law/decree over the past couple years too...something that needs to be taken into account for how different it may be today from years past when others went through the same thing)
I'd imagine we wouldn't disagree to much there.
edit on 13-2-2014 by Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)
reply to post by thisguyrighthere
I'm going to make this my last reply to this, ..because you seem determined to keep this rolling and not just let it go.. Fine with me, but it's with yourself here on. To be realistic tho, this is also OT for why I won't reply on this side topic again. (Not much more to say, anyway)
That statement is insulting. Period. If you don't see it, I'm sorry to hear that. Offense can be in the eye of the beholder....it is..and that was.
I don't see the "other context" it could have been meant in where "just show up and pass" to describe the effort required for a 2 year degree can't be ...especially when you know full well it's personal to who you are replying to, as I'm IN a 2 year program right now.
Agree to disagree......with real meaning. That's the best I can do here. Catch ya on another topic somewhere.
I'm going to make this my last reply to this, ..because you seem determined to keep this rolling and not just let it go.. Fine with me, but it's with yourself here on. To be realistic tho, this is also OT for why I won't reply on this side topic again. (Not much more to say, anyway)
Speaking on education a two-year degree requires no effort. Just show up and you pass. Now, if you're trying to be head of your class or stand out for whatever reason then yeah things get a little harder. Now you actually have to turn in a significant percentage of assignments as well as show up.
That statement is insulting. Period. If you don't see it, I'm sorry to hear that. Offense can be in the eye of the beholder....it is..and that was.
I don't see the "other context" it could have been meant in where "just show up and pass" to describe the effort required for a 2 year degree can't be ...especially when you know full well it's personal to who you are replying to, as I'm IN a 2 year program right now.
Agree to disagree......with real meaning. That's the best I can do here. Catch ya on another topic somewhere.
edit on 13-2-2014 by
Wrabbit2000 because: (no reason given)
reply to post by Wrabbit2000
Yeah exactly. You have a set goal and you want to learn and improve. That should never be discouraged or ridiculed.
I think what gives courses a bad name is the early 20's waster who goes in just to avoid getting a job. We have them over here in the UK. We have a number of foundation degrees (your associate degree) but they are spoiled by work shy teens.
In fact I started higher education on a foundation degree. Was specelised for biology but was still a foundation degree. I went on to get my full degree in biological sciences and have worked in the microbiology and immunology R&D sector as you know. Humble beguinings but went on to take it further.
Yeah exactly. You have a set goal and you want to learn and improve. That should never be discouraged or ridiculed.
I think what gives courses a bad name is the early 20's waster who goes in just to avoid getting a job. We have them over here in the UK. We have a number of foundation degrees (your associate degree) but they are spoiled by work shy teens.
In fact I started higher education on a foundation degree. Was specelised for biology but was still a foundation degree. I went on to get my full degree in biological sciences and have worked in the microbiology and immunology R&D sector as you know. Humble beguinings but went on to take it further.
That's one of the big problems with American...our police officers would rather kill and beat someone then do their jobs. It's pathetic. We need
to learn self-defense and carry guns, not to protect ourselves from criminals, but from cops.
The problem is when you pop numbers out like this to try and make a spalsh you ignore that fact that the number of people killed by police per a year
is no larger than in 60s, 70s, 80s etc. Despite the fact the population has increased by over 100 million people since then. In this case dragging
out numbers and statistics makes it clear that the cops have become less likely to shoot by a large margin over the last 40 years. Kind of blows that
entire miltrary style police force out the window.
reply to post by crazyewok
Indeed... I do have one guy I share classes with ..and I say plural because he's a return feature across more than one semester I've shared class space with. He's got 113 credit hours, I think he'd said? A quirk of different schools is what let him get that far and still within the AA level for aid. A Professional Student is another thing those folks are called sometimes. In fact, the instructor made a joke about it this time, on the first day.
That is among what has changed though and changed in very dramatic ways. For Federal financial aid...like what perspective cops are taking for their AA degrees and hiring req's in many departments today, there is almost no room to play like the student described above has been able to do up to now.
You can retake a class you passed..once. You can retake a class you fail unlimited times ..KINDA.. I say kinda because the changes included a dramatic tightening of terms for academic probation and/or removal and a real lack of any forgiveness to lower grades. One semester .. just one..where I'm falling on a couple classes? My 3.5+ won't help me from being on Academic probation due to the previous semesters poor performance.
Also.. a BIG thing now.. You are permitted 150% of the credit hours you required for the program you are pursuing. For instance, mine is 64 I believe (I'd have to check to be positive of 62 or 64..) credit hours. Once I hit about 95 or so? Graduate or not....doing well or not... 4.0 honors or not...Financial aid is over, too bad, and have a nice life. Sorry it didn't work out.
Nothing easy about how this system works now, especially if someone has a hang up (math in my case) where pulling the degree isn't happening in minimum possible time records, as some imagine it should. (Amazing how many people still look shell shocked when they first learn ..2 year? is anything BUT 2 calendar years. Try 3..into 4 for a lot of people)
Indeed... I do have one guy I share classes with ..and I say plural because he's a return feature across more than one semester I've shared class space with. He's got 113 credit hours, I think he'd said? A quirk of different schools is what let him get that far and still within the AA level for aid. A Professional Student is another thing those folks are called sometimes. In fact, the instructor made a joke about it this time, on the first day.
That is among what has changed though and changed in very dramatic ways. For Federal financial aid...like what perspective cops are taking for their AA degrees and hiring req's in many departments today, there is almost no room to play like the student described above has been able to do up to now.
You can retake a class you passed..once. You can retake a class you fail unlimited times ..KINDA.. I say kinda because the changes included a dramatic tightening of terms for academic probation and/or removal and a real lack of any forgiveness to lower grades. One semester .. just one..where I'm falling on a couple classes? My 3.5+ won't help me from being on Academic probation due to the previous semesters poor performance.
Also.. a BIG thing now.. You are permitted 150% of the credit hours you required for the program you are pursuing. For instance, mine is 64 I believe (I'd have to check to be positive of 62 or 64..) credit hours. Once I hit about 95 or so? Graduate or not....doing well or not... 4.0 honors or not...Financial aid is over, too bad, and have a nice life. Sorry it didn't work out.
Nothing easy about how this system works now, especially if someone has a hang up (math in my case) where pulling the degree isn't happening in minimum possible time records, as some imagine it should. (Amazing how many people still look shell shocked when they first learn ..2 year? is anything BUT 2 calendar years. Try 3..into 4 for a lot of people)
crazyewok
At the very least you guys should disarm your police like the UK and have a small core of highly trained rapid responce armed police recruited from the best. That way your cops will have to use there brain first.edit on 12-2-2014 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)edit on 12-2-2014 by crazyewok because: (no reason given)
What exempts the "highly trained rapid responce armed police", as it's called, from crossing the line and nailing me? Do we call and request heavily armed baton squads to charge potentially armed hoodlums? Or would you like people to call
"highly trained rapid responce armed police" to respond to this?
m.youtube.com...
It's as if some people forget people are people, never expecting shock & awe when shock & awe has always had its place in human beings. What are we expecting police to be other than human beings? The root of this appears to be a "safety issue", and safety isn't complete. You're going to die, regardless of how big you, or anyone "thinks" their status is in the world. Whether it be by that one officer called "trigger", or a natural death. Hey, if we're going to discuss safety, watch that and let me know if disarming our officers increases our safety. Show your love for Palm Beach.
reply to post by TorqueyThePig
never said that all cops are bad....as a matter of fact....I went out of my way to say the opposite.
never said that all cops are bad....as a matter of fact....I went out of my way to say the opposite.
Wrabbit2000
I don't see the "other context" it could have been meant in where "just show up and pass" to describe the effort required for a 2 year degree can't be ...especially when you know full well it's personal to who you are replying to, as I'm IN a 2 year program right now.
In context to a measure of a quality officer. It had been mentioned that an educational requirement such as a two or four year degree would magically weed out candidates who were either violent or of low intelligence.
A degree in and of itself, any degree, is no measure of this and as such requiring minimum educational completion standards for candidates would not affect this problem. Too often ift works contrary to the intended point. See here: Officers explain why millenials make terrible cops
That was my point.
edit on 13-2-2014 by thisguyrighthere because: typo
MrSpad
The problem is when you pop numbers out like this to try and make a spalsh you ignore that fact that the number of people killed by police per a year is no larger than in 60s, 70s, 80s etc. Despite the fact the population has increased by over 100 million people since then. In this case dragging out numbers and statistics makes it clear that the cops have become less likely to shoot by a large margin over the last 40 years. Kind of blows that entire miltrary style police force out the window.
you have any links to that information?
UxoriousMagnus
reply to post by TorqueyThePig
never said that all cops are bad....as a matter of fact....I went out of my way to say the opposite.
Hi
UxoriousMagnusFriends, don’t listen to anybody who tells you it’s “just a few bad apples.” The whole barrel is rotten.
Elaborate on the barrel. Lates!
UxoriousMagnus
Friends, don’t listen to anybody who tells you it’s “just a few bad apples.” The whole barrel is rotten.
If you didn't say all cops were bad what did you mean by this?
reply to post by UxoriousMagnus
I will say all cops are bad, if for no other reason its because the very limited number of "good cops" dont do anything about all of the bad ones in their departments.
Police are the enemy of the people, and things will only continue to get worse.
Ask the 2 asian women who were shot at by the cops who thought they were a large black man named Chris Dorner.
I will say all cops are bad, if for no other reason its because the very limited number of "good cops" dont do anything about all of the bad ones in their departments.
Police are the enemy of the people, and things will only continue to get worse.
Ask the 2 asian women who were shot at by the cops who thought they were a large black man named Chris Dorner.
TorqueyThePig
UxoriousMagnus
Friends, don’t listen to anybody who tells you it’s “just a few bad apples.” The whole barrel is rotten.
If you didn't say all cops were bad what did you mean by this?
If you click on the link....you will see that it is an article.
QuantumDeath
UxoriousMagnus
reply to post by TorqueyThePig
never said that all cops are bad....as a matter of fact....I went out of my way to say the opposite.
Hi
UxoriousMagnusFriends, don’t listen to anybody who tells you it’s “just a few bad apples.” The whole barrel is rotten.
Elaborate on the barrel. Lates!
it is an article.....as stated above....click on the link
reply to post by doubletap
No doubt there are some bad cops out there. No doubt they should be dealt with criminally. No doubt that there are cops that have made some serious mistakes. It is not all cops though.
Do you judge all groups by the actions of some? The military, judges, priests, black,white, Jewish, Christian, atheist?
In my city where I work I have never had to cover up for another officer, because I have never witnessed any kind of abuse or corruption? So you can't say we all cover up for each other. That is a false statement.
What am I, an officer who works in Florida supposed to do about a bad cop in Chicago? I have no jurisdiction there. The only thing I can do is speak out about bad police which I do. I am also a member of Oathkeepers. I do my part.
I could post tons of articles and videos of the police doing positive things. Unfortunately the media doesn't like to run with stories like that. Even if I did post a positive video I would be told that "I didn't take the job for praise", or "that's your job, you're supposed to do that."
It is a lose, lose situation for the police.
No doubt there are some bad cops out there. No doubt they should be dealt with criminally. No doubt that there are cops that have made some serious mistakes. It is not all cops though.
Do you judge all groups by the actions of some? The military, judges, priests, black,white, Jewish, Christian, atheist?
In my city where I work I have never had to cover up for another officer, because I have never witnessed any kind of abuse or corruption? So you can't say we all cover up for each other. That is a false statement.
What am I, an officer who works in Florida supposed to do about a bad cop in Chicago? I have no jurisdiction there. The only thing I can do is speak out about bad police which I do. I am also a member of Oathkeepers. I do my part.
I could post tons of articles and videos of the police doing positive things. Unfortunately the media doesn't like to run with stories like that. Even if I did post a positive video I would be told that "I didn't take the job for praise", or "that's your job, you're supposed to do that."
It is a lose, lose situation for the police.
edit on 13-2-2014 by TorqueyThePig because: (no reason given)
vkey08
I hate to jump in here because I know darn well I'm going to get flamed to death.
But... In the course of my career I have been shot at least 4 times (luckily none were life threatening experiences) stabbed, beaten, I could go on, all just INVESTIGATING things. I don't even want to go into the number of times people have pulled out multiple guns when they actually realize they are going to be arrested (and I deal exclusively in just Civil Rights cases, go figure) and scream that they will not be taken alive etc etc..
(oh and before i get told I have a less than average IQ, it was measured at the hugh hundreds last time I checked, and I do have multiple Masters from college.... requirement of the job...)
Everyone is on edge these days, regular people, police alike... it's a sign of the times.
Do I agree with some of these local officers and how they handle situations? No.. But.. I have fired back, and I have killed another human being in the defense of my own life in the course of my employment, so I understand the split second decisions that need to be made. It's not always easy.
There have also been allegations that cops get off easier, and no matter how many times I reiterate that the Federal portions of these cases takes YEARS to resolve, they don't seem to understand that. Any officer that uses excessive force where it's clear their life was not in immediate harm or danger, faces a very vigorous Civil Rights investigation, amongst other Federal investigations and while this process may take YEARS not weeks not months, YEARS (up to 6 sometimes) it does happen, and they are punished, with very few exceptions.
To lump every officer in Law Enforcement in the United States into a big pot that says "You are all evil jerks" is wrong. To Say that because people do their jobs sometimes (someone mentioned arresting people over plants, well in some places those "plants" are highly illegal and growing them is a Felony crime and can be prosecuted and you can be arrested, they were doing their JOB as defined by the laws.. Personally I would look the other way on something like that, but I don't have to enforce that law as a part of my job.)
The bottom line is, unless you can say without any hesitation that you would be able to make that split second decision any differently given the exact same situation (and not just that you would decide differently, you would have to actually be IN the situation, adrenaline pumping, loud screaming going on, rushing time etc.. ) then and only then can you judge. Until then leave that part up to the juries (which are just people like you and me) and the investigators that do their jobs and ensure that these incidents are investigated and prosecuted..
I'm just so sick of the bash the police threads.. (esp when some members can't see past calling the police "pigs" I find that highly offensive)edit on 1322014 by vkey08 because: just because I'm educated doesn't mean my spelling has gotten any better with time LOL.. I freely admit *that*
vkey08,
I knew it was only a matter of time before you showed up....like mouse to cheese....
I want to just clarify...that I think there are good cops out there....our local sheriffs department is full of good cops.
I also want to state that I know cops have a tough and dangerous job.....
but there are bad cops out there....and the system does nothing to curb these bad cops. This produces a lack of trust and even fear of police in general and of the system as a whole.
as far as your high hundreds IQ...I can't question it as I can't prove one way or another but below are some famous IQ's that you are apparently higher than:
Bobby Fischer (Chess Player)-187
Galileo Galilei (Astronomer/Philosopher/Physicist)-185
Rene Descartes (Philosopher/Mathematician)-180
Immanuel Kant (Philosopher)-175
Charles Darwin (Naturalist)-165
Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart (Composer)-165
Albert Einstein (Physicist)-160
George Eliot (Writer)-160
Nicolaus Copernicus (Astronomer)-160
Rembrandt van Rijn (Painter) -155
TorqueyThePig
Do you judge all groups by the actions of some? The military, judges, priests, black,white, Jewish, Christian, atheist?
Some? I would contend that the number of bad cops is exponentially more than just "some" of them. Undoubtedly, there are good cops. I dont judge groups by the actions of individual members.
Police are nothing more than revenue agents for their various corrupt jurisdictions. They routinely infringe upon the rights of the individual, they flat out lie (documented more times than you and I could ever count). The fact they arent held personally liable for their actions is straight up offensive to every common sense holding individual. Why should the taxpayers have to pay for the criminal actions of idiotic cops?
Some cops have been refused jobs for being too intelligent, while others are given jobs when they are incapable of passing easy tests all in the name of making the police department more "diverse".
No disrespect to you as an individual, but I let out a little cheer every time I hear of a cop dying. It is a check in the win column for freedom.
Have you ever let a fellow cop off from a traffic infraction in the name of professional courtesy? Never looked the other way when one of your peers violated a law or regulation?
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