I Converted A Catholic To Atheism

reply to post by AfterInfinity

Could you explain that in greater detail? What wish are you talking about? Feeling of desire for what?

Thy question is thy answer.

reply to post by piequal3because14


I was hoping for a better response than that. Clearly, you don't have anything helpful to add, so we'll just let that one go.

Participants and contributors of Abovetopsecret.com, I am told that I am weak for my stance and philosophies. Would any of the participants of this thread be willing to provide insight as to how my approach and perspective may be referred to as "weak"? How is atheism weak? I would appreciate any and all constructive insight in this matter.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

How is atheism weak? I would appreciate any and all constructive insight in this matter.

It aims to dismiss any form of spiritual Accountability to both facing and enduring a Divine Judgement beyond this flesh.

reply to post by PrimeLight

It aims to dismiss any form of spiritual Accountability to both facing and enduring a Divine Judgement beyond this flesh.

That is both an assumption and a generalization. I feel it encourages proactive self-determinism, which essentially takes care of all accountability by default. Go ahead and look it up: "proactive" and "self-determinism".

I would also like to add that I feel divine judgment is very much a bully tactic. It's a psychological technique not uncommon in military strategy.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

The worldly perspective can be quite contrary to the one beyond.

If one has a worldly sight, how can he ever come to understand the Ways of the Heavenly?

We are Called to understand the Ways of Spirit and not the flesh. That is what one should be in a wisdom 'determining' to achieve in a pro-activity to consciously evolve.

reply to post by PrimeLight

If one has a worldly sight, how can he ever come to understand the Ways of the Heavenly?

I don't know for a fact there is even a "heavenly" to have "ways". Since I know for a fact I am here, alive, in this world, I may as well occupy myself with handling that appropriately first and foremost. That seems the most productive course of business. I'd rather not let my life pass me by while I'm preparing for another that may never come.

We are Called to understand the Ways of Spirit and not the flesh. That is what one should be in a wisdom 'determining' to achieve in a pro-activity to consciously evolve.

Why the hell do I want to understand the ways of the spirit instead of the flesh? Your head is in the clouds. Time to focus on what's in front of you instead of what you dream of seeing beyond the many bridges you have yet to cross.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
Your head is in the clouds. Time to focus on what's in front of you instead of what you dream of seeing beyond the many bridges you have yet to cross.

Materialism.

I think one should never focus on either just one of these, but on both. That way you're sure to never get it wrong...

reply to post by AfterInfinity

I'd rather not let my life pass me by while I'm preparing for another that may never come.

I would like your interpretation of the meaning of this life if you care to share?

Let us break it down from the roots.

reply to post by PrimeLight

I would like your interpretation of the meaning of this life if you care to share?

To be happy and leave the world better than you entered it. Live, love, and learn.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

To serve the world in whatever way makes you happy. Live, love, and learn.

And what if another's idea of happiness involved being only self-serving, greedy, dominating others etc? Is that a good thing? Does such even matter if once we die, that's it?

You mentioned love. So where do you think such an inner desire to 'love' comes from?

reply to post by PrimeLight


I revised my original entry while you were formulating a response. Please revise your response accordingly and enter it as a new post.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

The last question still stands relevant--and I appreciated you giving your replies deeper thought.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


It is an interesting choice of words.....converted huh....so this knee jerk terminology is actually akin to a religion. Hell atheists even are vying for membership with their chosen enemy.....religion.

It is a way of thought dependent on religion since it is in essence just an anti.

atheism is an anti...that's all. It is popular now since it is always fun to be rebellious towards the status quo.

I have more respect for agnostics that at least admit they don't know. Atheists are adamant about their certainty which is as big a lie as the certainty they accuse their opponents of.

The hell makes atheists so sure there is no God.......or that they are even capable of understanding the God concept.

some people spend entire life times studying the work of entire life times dedicated to the study of God and don't fully understand what WE think about it. Yet some trendy douche that is completely full of himself comes along and decides to mock others because they believe in "fairy tales"........yet they will play lotto with billion to one odds and REALLY think about it as if their hand of fate will make some sort of difference..

Or they go visit someone in a hospital because the sick persons will to live will multiply by their presence .....

or when they die....they get all emotional because they aren't content with just ending one day completely ....or they cry because others die.......yet they are smug jerks and belittling to people of faith who don't have to feel so sad or scared of death.....

so they resent that. like ruining a 3d movie for everyone because you don't have the glasses ......maybe you don't get it but the rest do.....live and let live...

atheists are like a religion trying to get membership and pushing their ideas on others...just like they say religion does.

also they are the ones to choose to stand against religion ........bunch of anti's is all.

what's your solution? none? ok....no. I may be wrong but your not even trying.....plus you don't know for sure either so.....

no....

op that was not directed at you. That is me speaking aloud to all atheists I have met and know of.

I imagine speaking to Bill Maher actually and I make him curse like an angry child when I am done.....maybe I flip his desk when he acts like a tough guy and clock him in the face for being a smug angry little deputant....

reply to post by tadaman

Originally posted by tadaman
It is an interesting choice of words.....converted huh....so this knee jerk terminology is actually akin to a religion.

convert
to cause to adopt a different religion, political doctrine, opinion, etc.

Originally posted by tadaman
It is a way of thought dependent on religion since it is in essence just an anti.

Atheism is not an "anti" anything. It's just means you don't believe in God. Now if you are against religion and god-believers, that makes you an anti-theist.

Originally posted by tadaman
atheism is an anti...that's all. It is popular now since it is always fun to be rebellious towards the status quo.

Atheism has nothing to do with rebellion. Atheism simply means not believing in a God. It has nothing to do with attitudes or anything like that. All of that is other things not dependent on Atheism itself...

Originally posted by tadaman
I have more respect for agnostics that at least admit they don't know. Atheists are adamant about their certainty which is as big a lie as the certainty they accuse their opponents of.

You are saying "agnostics" and "atheists" as if you can only be one or the other. You can be a gnostic atheist or an agnostic atheist, just like you can be a gnostic theist or an agnostic theist.

if you claim to KNOW that God doesn't exist, then you are a GNOSTIC Atheist.
If you claim to not know for sure but don't BELIEVE God exists, then you are an AGNOSTIC Atheist.

Gnosticism deals with what you think you know
Atheism and Theism deals with what you believe.

Originally posted by tadaman
or when they die....they get all emotional because they aren't content with just ending one day completely ....or they cry because others die.......

I think most people go through that. It's called "having empathy and missing loved ones" and "having a natural fear of death which helped humanity to survive for many, many years".

Originally posted by tadaman
......maybe you don't get it but the rest do.....live and let live...

They are living and letting live. Are they forcing you to be an atheist? All they can do is express their view point, that is not "force" and you have the right to express yours as well.

Originally posted by tadaman
atheists are like a religion trying to get membership and pushing their ideas on others...just like they say religion does.

At least atheists don't use fear saying you'll be eternally tortures if you don't agree with them. Also they are not "forcing" their atheist belief on anyone. Are they threatening you saying "you bettah not believe in God"? No.

Originally posted by tadaman
I imagine speaking to Bill Maher actually and I make him curse like an angry child when I am done.....maybe I flip his desk when he acts like a tough guy and clock him in the face for being a smug angry little deputant....

Doesn't sound like a fun imagination...

reply to post by PrimeLight

And what if another's idea of happiness involved being only self-serving, greedy, dominating others etc? Is that a good thing? Does such even matter if once we die, that's it?

Do you have children? The answer should then be obvious. If you are able to consider the idea from your childrens' perspective, and the children of others, only a sociopath would be comfortable with their children living in a world rife with war and violence.

You mentioned love. So where do you think such an inner desire to 'love' comes from?

Desire? Haha. I have no desire to love. It just happens. Do you desire to breathe? No, because you're already doing it. You cannot desire what you already have.

reply to post by tadaman

It is an interesting choice of words.....converted huh....so this knee jerk terminology is actually akin to a religion. Hell atheists even are vying for membership with their chosen enemy.....religion.

So now the word 'conversion' is a religious term? Wow. It's amazing how religion can claim monopoly over even language.

I have more respect for agnostics that at least admit they don't know. Atheists are adamant about their certainty which is as big a lie as the certainty they accuse their opponents of.

You exercise the same principle more often than you would like to admit. How many times have you been uncertain, yet treated a matter with certainty based on educated guesstimation? You took an informed gamble. We have all done this at least a couple of times in our lives. And then we turned out to be right. Why? Because we pick up on small things that all point to one conclusion, even if the conclusion itself isn't actually manifest. It's called logical deduction.

That's how I came to my conclusion.

op that was not directed at you. That is me speaking aloud to all atheists I have met and know of.

I imagine speaking to Bill Maher actually and I make him curse like an angry child when I am done.....maybe I flip his desk when he acts like a tough guy and clock him in the face for being a smug angry little deputant....

Hmm...yeah. Compared to that sort of attitude, atheists are just awful, aren't they?

reply to post by AfterInfinity

only a sociopath would be comfortable with their children living in a world rife with war and violence.

There are many in this world that could care less of what goes on around them if their life is full of material 'comforts'.

I have no desire to love. It just happens.

How? I would appreciate the atheist perspective on this.

Do you desire to breathe? No, because you're already doing it. You cannot desire what you already have.

Breathing is a basic biological function common across this world's life forms in creatures great and small, less complex that the inner workings of our human based 'emotional states'. The two, even by a scientific based logic should not be compared.

reply to post by PrimeLight

Originally posted by PrimeLight
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

only a sociopath would be comfortable with their children living in a world rife with war and violence.

There are many in this world that could care less of what goes on around them if their life is full of material 'comforts'.

Like I said: sociopaths. In which case, no religion in the world will do anything more than provide a distraction. It won't change their true nature.

I have no desire to love. It just happens.

How? I would appreciate the atheist perspective on this.

The same way it does for you, I would assume. Unless it happens because of your god. In which case, that would suggest you aren't naturally a loving person, eh? I am a naturally loving person. If I am given reason to love, I will love. And no, don't bother asking what those reasons are. They are personal, and they exist, I assure you.

Do you desire to breathe? No, because you're already doing it. You cannot desire what you already have.

Breathing is a basic biological function common across this world's life forms in creatures great and small, less complex that the inner workings of our human based 'emotional states'. The two, even by a scientific based logic should not be compared.

Your lack of imagination is not my problem. Although I daresay it's not your lack of imagination, but your flexibility in applying it. Still, that's your problem, not mine.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

The same way it does for you, I would assume. Unless it happens because of your god. In which case, that would suggest you aren't naturally a loving person, eh? I am a naturally loving person. If I am given reason to love, I will love.

So you cannot explain then 'on point', the origins of innate love by your belief system?

reply to post by PrimeLight

So you cannot explain then 'on point', the origins of innate love by your belief system?

Abstraction of the imagination. It's an emotional construct that is developed through various methods of psychological association and networking. A positive experience creates a positive link, numerous successive positive links regarding one idea or another will obviously create a network of emotional significance, ad nauseum. Take a psychology class, they can explain it better than I do.

I know what you're trying to get at here, what you're trying to build up to. You want to say that the source of love, within all of us, is some sort of deity, a divine figure with its own mind and its own plan. I disagree. I disagree not only with that premise, but with your apparent belief that love has to come from somewhere other than the human mind in order to be really special and significant. I think love should be appreciated, but why does it have to be special? That means it's exclusive. Love should never be exclusive.

I get the feeling that associating with humans tends to decrease the value of certain ideas or properties, in your mind. Like the human condition spoils anything it touches, so all the best things have to come from somewhere else. Why is that? Do you believe humans are worthless worms? Do you believe we are all born evil? Do you think we are the fleshly product of something so inherently abhorrent that we ourselves cannot hope to be any better?

People who think like that really sadden me. They aren't content with being human unless they have something better to look forward to. They basically disdain the human form in all of its aspects. We are fit for nothing except furthering that which is actually worthy of existing. That's a pathetic philosophy to take. I'm sorry, but it really is. It is, of course, your choice to humor such a perspective...but I have no reason at this point in time to even consider sharing it. As such, I will continue to expound upon my humanistic beliefs and encourage those around me to have faith in their ability to provide every miracle they need for themselves - and to understand why some miracles simply aren't necessary.

If any god believes that we are unworthy, right there, that god should be cast out and rejected as the arrogant and shallow hypocrite it is. We are deserving of being treated as the sentient and emotional creatures we are. We are not tools. We are not pawns. And I would hate to see us shrink beneath the iron fist of a tyrant. We are worth more than that. Believe it.