GOD:SATAN:JESUS:WE:CHOICE:LIFE

reply to post by wwwchronos


The crux here is free will, right? Choice. Like in your title. The ability to think and act as we choose.

But you will never, ever know if that's really you doing the thinking or doing. In the Men In Black movies, those people who are neuralized are able to question the possibility that they might have been. But even if they were, they can never prove it without the help of the agents who did that to them. In real life, you are able to question the possibility of an outside force powerful beyond anything you can imagine just reaching in and flipping a switch or rewriting your script and erasing every memory of the original version...even going so far as to replace those absent memories with new ones to keep you from figuring it out. And even if that's exactly what happened, you would be unable to prove it.

So really, you can't say for a fact that you are free and independent. As long as an omnipotent being with its own agenda lurks out there somewhere, you aren't safe. Your thoughts aren't safe. Your life is not safe. Nothing about you is safe. The moment he wants something from you, your say in the matter is nonexistent. You are a sacrifice waiting to happen. He's just kind enough to allow you the illusion of freedom until that moment when he decides that his desires are more important than yours.

It's a terrifying concept. And the worst part is, you can't prove me wrong.

And the worst part is, you can't prove me wrong.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Hey you...

My Thoughts..

The worst part is not having thoughts to prove you wrong. My imagination says you are wrong but scientifically I cannot prove you right.... or wrong.

What I can do is observe what is around me I call reality.

Knowing there are many Universe's in space, I conclude there are many worlds which inhabit life. I cannot prove such, its more of an intuition or some may say, common sense.

This reality is just one of numerous "divine" creations from a force well beyond my imagination and outside of time( since the mind is said to be outside the frame of time).

Each entity in this realm has their own perception of the divine or ~ philosophy of life. Some may expand on such a philosophy while others remain stagnant.

We each have an idea from the imagination (given), so this force can be anything we want it to be. We are free to think what we may.

This creative force we see around us is evident. There are laws that govern the creation, this too is evident. If we abide by the evident laws then we will be kept by them as well. It goes hand in hand.

The arts, sciences, philosophies, religions, and so on can enrich our inward lives to a degree, we realize that through them the laws of existence are variously revealed and manifested for our advancement and enlightenment. Ya know, the ah ha moments. We get it. We understand it. What resides in each of us gives us the ability to understand such an advancement in thought or an enlightenment.

The physical (matter) is the illusion we find our selves in until the moment we release this experience.

For me, I don't accept such as Satan and or Hell. This goes against the laws of nature. Nature thrives for growth, not extinction.

What if our present "state" is the state of all sums from previous experiences? This is what I understand to be true not just for me but for all of us, including the man we call Jesus. We empower our destiny with each life we experience. The sum of these lives allows for the soul to grow and perfect.

I have pondered evil for a while and understand it to have another meaning than most. As I grow I understand evil to be ignorance. Out of ignorance comes that of selfishness, greed, cruelty and so on. Out of ignorance comes a thinking that draws in "error". We feel this error deep in our souls. Some can stop it, others are not so lucky. They continue to live in ignorance.

Do the ones who constantly live in ignorance go to an eternal fire? I don't think so. Not at all, for the purpose of the human experience is to grow. When its all said and done this will be the experience for learning over and over again until we reach our ultimate growth we our truer self are satisfied with.

I can't prove all of the above, but I can understand it. Understanding the philosophy of life from which you attribute your belief to is key, in my opinion of course.

what u written, this is one of most correct lines i ever read:
Nature thrives for growth, not extinction.


black hole act same?

Now im asking,
did that rule applies to hell and heaven, with earth as catalyst, in favor of both sides.
by that, or souls are created, or existing souls are sending down here for more upgrades.

reply to post by MamaJ


According to the exact nature of "God" as described in the Bible, my statement stands uncontested. But I don't believe in the Bible, so it really doesn't matter, does it? I was just making a point to the OP.

Of course, if it were true, then I would devote my life to proving that the mastermind need not be the sole source of guidance in this reality. My greatest act of defiance...

reply to post by AfterInfinity


I appreciate what you write afin. few would admit there is no free will. its to confronting. imagine if you're heterosexual, with free will you could change your interest and voila! you're gay! someones favourite food could suddenly be the worst on the menu-genuinely-if they chose it. a moral person could easily choose to become a bank robber. the stars will reveal much of your expected behaviour, if they are deeply understood.
a great man once said you do have a choice! either you identify with mind and body or you dont. its as simple as that.

reply to post by orangutang


There is free will though. I use that as an argument against the existence of "God". We are clearly not puppets, so "God" either doesn't exist or isn't here right now. Either way, we are free to rule this world as we choose to.

We are the inheritors of this reality. What we choose to do with that will define who we are as a species.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


one of the indicators for destiny in my book is the ability of some card readers to forecast ones future. i have met some excellent ones in my time.
here's an example.
one lady, months ahead of the event, told me i would live in a small house with 1 door on my own. this was against my desire which was to always get a room in a house with several people, living in a capitol city of oz. this automatically gave you contacts and social events. months went by and a chance meeting sent me off to the recruiting office for an oil rig. i got the job and lived in a cabin for 6 months with 1 door. go figure!?!

i must admit though that i vacillate from destiny to freewill to destiny. the evidence for a god or prime energy or undivided intelligence governing all is huge. and if there is somewhere, or someone, or some knowledge where "IT" is absent ,
then "IT" is not so almighty afterall. it would make a good debate show for some panel.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


That's where Man goes wrong..... relying on a history book for all of the answers. Its gives you an idea and basis to work off of.

What does your heart tell you about the nature of the creator?

There is some truth in everything, even the Bible.

Originally posted by wwwchronos
what u written, this is one of most correct lines i ever read:
Nature thrives for growth, not extinction.


black hole act same?

Now im asking,
did that rule applies to hell and heaven, with earth as catalyst, in favor of both sides.
by that, or souls are created, or existing souls are sending down here for more upgrades.

edit on 17-2-2013 by wwwchronos because: (no reason given)

We don't even know what a black hole really is. We will one day, I have hope.

The nature of heaven and hell goes like this (imo).

Heaven is nature thriving and the best mental state.

Hell is nature dying and the worst mental state.

They are both mental states of which do not last as we experience living in both tranquil space time and chaotic space time. The mind is said to be outside of time. What is that like? Is that what its like to be in a black hole?

Is that where Heaven is?

Im a believer in transformation of many lives and experiences. When the Human was created we were there. We are experiencing our own creation. When we perfect in this experience we will move on to another one.

My imagination gets away from me sometimes.

We are the inheritors of this reality. What we choose to do with that will define who we are as a species.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


True enough... may the best win.

My son turned me onto this song... I think its fitting.

reply to post by MamaJ


Some truth in everything. Everything is all inclusive. Meaning there is some truth in atheism and anti-theism. Is that what you meant or would you like to rephrase?

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


That's exactly what I mean. There are different types of atheists I run across.... kind of like the believer. Each label but their view is truly unique.

reply to post by MamaJ

There are definitely different kinds of atheists in the sense they have different beliefs. But all atheists share one in common: god doesn't exist. If they believe otherwise they are not atheists.

You said some truth in the Bible. Which implies not all of it is true. So the whole of the Bible is not the 'Word of God'. Which parts do you believe are?

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


I have had atheists tell me the/a definition and each are different, per their bias and views. I have a neighbor that says they do not believe because "God has not been proven and there are many theories to our existence".

The Word of God can come from anyone. Usually the one who God speaks to is a one who is inspired through a sense.

I believe "God" speaks to me through people, reading, music, and many other ways. Looking at a beautiful flower in bloom inspires me.

reply to post by MamaJ

I have had atheists tell me the/a definition and each are different

No doubt Even more commonplace is people misunderstanding what 'agnosticism' means. Likewise, we hear different definitions of what a 'real Christian' is all the time. I won't offer one for Christianity, but atheism means one thing and one thing only; absent the belief in any god.

I have a neighbour that says they do not believe because "God has not been proven and there are many theories to our existence".

As far as 'labels' go, agnostic atheist. Agnosticism is the method, atheism the creed.

I believe "God" speaks to me through people, reading, music, and many other ways. Looking at a beautiful flower in bloom inspires me.

So you don't view religions outside of Christianity as false in that sense? I can understand what you're saying as a metaphysical belief concerning God's inter-connectedness and omnipresence, but I am a little hesitant because it seems you (almost always?) exclusively reference Christ, The Bible, etc.

reply to post by MamaJ

I believe "God" speaks to me through people, reading, music, and many other ways. Looking at a beautiful flower in bloom inspires me.

That's why I believe godliness to be imagination. Imagination is the seed of dreams, and dreams inspire us to grow. Everything we consider holy is thought to be so because every time we contemplate it, it inspires us to imagine something greater than us, something we yearn to become part of. What can be more divine than that?

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy

So you don't view religions outside of Christianity as false in that sense? I can understand what you're saying as a metaphysical belief concerning God's inter-connectedness and omnipresence, but I am a little hesitant because it seems you (almost always?) exclusively reference Christ, The Bible, etc.

No, I don't view religions outside of Christianity as false. I think they all have merit and serve a purpose. This thread is about Jesus, God, Satan..... so naturally I would address the the Bible and Christ. I believe in Christ, but not the way the typical Christian does.

I enjoy learning about all philosophies of life. I believe in a force that is creative.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


I couldn't have said it better. Your imagination, too, gets the best of me. I love it!

reply to post by MamaJ

This thread is about Jesus, God, Satan..... so naturally I would address the the Bible and Christ.

For sure. I was taking it out of context and drawing from other threads. I make mental notes about members all the time. Just something I thought I had observed.

I enjoy learning about all philosophies of life. I believe in a force that is creative.

As do I

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


I have an opinion in regards to Jesus, Bible, God, Satan, but I consider the opinion to be unique. I'm not a Christian and do not hold onto a religion. I love them all and find a purpose for which they all serve. I am far less judging of the people who hold onto them more so than they are of me.

You said, "as do I". Are you saying you also believe in a creative force? You believe in a force that creates??