Paul: Rome's version of the Trojan Horse

page: 3
38
<< 1  2    4  5  6 >>

log in

join

posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 12:46 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


So when Peter and Paul had thier famous doctrinal dispute, the guy was just arguing with himself?


There are some weird paralells in the Bible. When Pilate had to choose between the criminal Barabbas and the man who some were claiming was the Son of God, he chose Barrabbas. "Bar Abba" means "son of god." What are the odds? If I wanted to, I could start a theory based on the idea that Pilate misunderstood which "son of god" he was supposed to kill.




posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 01:20 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


Paul was never one of us. You are correct but all our teachings were distorted by the church.

I might regret this but I was apostle Matthew in one of my incarnations. Not sure why I'm saying this on ats. I think because the large changes are coming.

Guys all religions have one origin. All have been distorted because of the cabal.



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 03:05 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 



Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
reply to post by WhoKnows100
 


And your faulty logic of everyone being a bad tree contradicts reason. If god can be good, then so can we. Why would Jesus tell us to be perfect if we could never achieve it?


Jesus would ask you, as He did His disciples, "Why do you reason in your heart?". The Truth states that there is no one good except God. The Holy Spirit declares in 3 John 1.11 that "Anyone who does what is good is from God. Anyone who does what is evil has not seen God." You are being hypocritical by denying that a bad tree cannot be made good for Paul, yet declaring it is possible for all others by your statement above. Our God is not an Author of confusion, so therefore the confusion is in your mind, not scripture.


Paul never changed before Jesus supposedly gave him his vision, he only changed after the vision.


With this reasoning, not one has been able to be saved since Jesus' physical death. Can you not sense what your mind is doing? It's grasping at human arguments to justify your own beliefs, and in the process, you cannot see that you are elevating your truths and not the Truth. 

 

Like I said, why would Jesus choose a tree that was rotten to the core to carry his message? Paul wasn't a changed man until AFTER his vision, which means Jesus deliberately contradicted himself when he chose Paul.


Where does Jesus contradict himself? Our Father granted my belief nearly 2,000 years after Jesus' death. 

You wrote in your thread

"So what changed Paul's mind? Well, apparently he had a vision from Jesus himself telling him to to stop persecuting his followers and to preach his gospel, claiming that Paul was a "chosen vessel" of god to carry his message."


Acts 9:4 He fell to the ground and heard a voice say to him, "Saul, Saul, why do you persecute ME?"

Do you understand what He meant? Saul was persecuting Jesus Christ through His followers. 

"If this work were of MAN, it would come to NOTHING! But if it be of GOD, then NO man is able to stand against it!--Lest they be found to be fighting against GOD!" (Acts 5:38,39).



“Sovereign Lord, as you have promised,
you now dismissd your servant in peace.
For my eyes have seen your salvation,
which you have prepared in the sight of all people,
a light for revelation to the nations
and for glory to your people Israel.”
The child’s father and mother marveled at what was said about him. Then Simeon blessed them and said to Mary, his mother: “This child is destined to cause the falling and rising of many in Israel, and to be a sign that will be spoken against, so that the thoughts of many hearts will be revealed. And a sword will pierce your own soul too.” Luke 2:29-35

"I went in response to a revelation and set before them the gospel that I preach among the nations. But I did this privately to those who seemed to be leaders, for fear that I was running or had run my race in vain." Galatians 2:2



"Make a tree good and its fruit will be good, or make a tree bad and its fruit will be bad, for a tree is recognized by its fruit." Matthew 12:33


You must abandon this particular reasoning, for scripture declares that Jesus came for sinners. Is sin good fruit? Of course not. What is evidence of true conversion? The fruits of the Holy Spirit. Stepping into the Light, we see that all good comes from the One who IS GOOD. Man, without God, does his own good which is defined solely by himself. Love for God is to obey His commands.
 



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 04:25 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 



Isn't it more likely that Paul intended to change Jesus' message from the beginning? And change it he did! Take a look at this site. It lists numerous incidents where Paul completely contradicts Jesus' message. Though I'm sure you'll have an apology for every single one.


Why is it more likely that Paul intended to change Jesus' message? Seriously, what in your reasoning leads you to conclude this? Because you cannot reconcile those supposed differences? Is that truly a reason, or is it indicative that you reject what the Holy Spirit has declared and thus have no desire for understanding? Your last comment solidifies that it is the latter.


Did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only people it has reached? If anybody thinks he is a prophet or spiritually gifted, let him acknowledge that what I am writing to you is the Lord’s command. If he ignores this, he himself will be ignored. 1 Corinthians 14:36-37


Isn't it more likely that Peter's warning regarding those who twist and pervert scripture, including Paul's writings, is truth? That they do what humans do when they can't understand something? Reject it? Does not scripture declare throughout that it is man who rejects God, not the other way round?

The scripture above says it all. It tells each of us that he is writing about the Lord's commands, so therefore if we are not understanding that he is doing exactly that, then it is understanding that we do not yet have. In which case, should you not be seeking that understanding instead of what you are choosing to do - ignoring it? But yet, you go so far beyond just ignoring it, but actively seek to not only pervert the entire gospel but bring in damnable heresies because of it. I'll ask what Paul did, "Did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only people it has reached?"



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 05:00 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 

ARE YOU KIDDING?

You attempt to speak with authority and as an expert on early church history and then you deny/refuse the resurrection of Jesus?

WARNING TO ALL CHRISTIANS: THIS IS A TRAP. THIS IS THE TEACHING OF A LUCIFERIAN IN AN ATTEMPT TO MISLED YOU AND DESTROY YOUR FAITH. STOP HERE AND READ NO FURTHER.

Lucifer is the father of lies and so are you.

In then name of Jesus Christ, the son of the one true God, stop spreading your lies and deceit.May God show you the error of your wicked ways. AMEN



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 05:35 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


OP, I cannot seen a specific reference to Paulinism/Paulism in your thread yet.
I have zero time now to follow through with this, but look it up.

Mary, I mean, many (now why did I type that?) consider that Paulinism/Paulism might be distinctly different from Jesuism. Paul's fervent (some say fanatic) approach might have elaborated beyond what the teaching of Jesus stated.



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 08:45 AM
link   
reply to post by Fraudfinder
 


Wow, you really showed your true colors here. I'm sure you think the bible is infallible even though you've never bothered to read it. Am I right?

Also, I never claimed to be an authority or expert on the bible, I only stated my opinion. Obviously you think that you are an authority otherwise you wouldn't be labeling me a Satanist. Why not refute my claims instead of assuming they're wrong and not attempting to explain why?
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)


Go ahead and show us how much of an expert on the bible you are. I'm waiting.
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 08:55 AM
link   
reply to post by Snsoc
 


You mean the argument that only Paul spoke about? How is it considered an "argument" when only one person gets a say? Paul never mentions Peter saying anything back to him, so I believe that was added in later.



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 09:25 AM
link   
reply to post by WhoKnows100
 


If your god is not the author of confusion then why is there so much confusion at the moment? Christianity having over 40,000 denominations goes to show that your god IS an author of confusion. He even heads two other religions!

Which version of Paul's conversion do you believe?


Version One:

Acts 9:3-17: "…[Saul] was approaching Damascus, suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him. He fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, `Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?'…The men who were traveling with him stood speechless because they heard the voice but saw no one. Saul got up from the ground, and though his eyes were open, he could see nothing; so they led him by the hand and brought him into Damascus. For three days he was without sight, and neither ate nor drank.…there was a…disciple at Damascus named Ananias…laid his hands on Saul and said, `Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on your way here, has sent me so that you may regain your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit."

Version Two:

Acts 22:6-21: "While I was…approaching Damascus…a great light from heaven suddenly shone about me. I fell to the ground and heard a voice saying…Saul,Saul, why are you persecuting me?...those who were with me saw the light but did not hear the voice…I could not see because of the brightness of the light…those with me…led me to Damascus…Ananias, who was a devout man according to the law and well spoken of by all the Jews living there…said…get up, be baptized, and have your sins washed away, calling on his name."

Version Three:

Acts 26:12-18: "…I was traveling to Damascus…I saw a light from heaven, brighter than the sun, shining around me and my companions. When we had all fallen to the ground, I heard a voice saying to me in the Hebrew language, `Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting me? It hurts you to kick against the goads…the Lord answered, `I am Jesus whom you are persecuting…get up and stand on your feet…"


Source

Did they all fall to the ground, or just Paul? Did the others see the light but not hear the voice, or did they not see the light but hear the voice? Which is it? For the bible to be so infallible, it sure does contradict itself a lot.

edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 09:30 AM
link   
reply to post by WhoKnows100
 


Because he DID change Jesus' message! Read the words of Jesus then read the words of Paul. Nothing alike.

Take a look HERE. It explains how Paul contradicted Jesus on SEVERAL occasions. Why does he contradict Jesus SO MUCH if he actually believed in him?

Instead of questioning those differences, you ignore them and assume both contradictions are right. That's no one else's fault but your own. You're digging your own grave by ignoring your GOD GIVEN logic.

Also, why did Jesus wait until AFTER Paul had killed hundreds or even thousands of Christians before giving him his vision? Why would Jesus choose a known murderer to carry his message? IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE AT ALL. Jesus would have never chosen a murderer as one of his apostles while alive, so why would he after he died? Maybe because he didn't choose Paul, Paul chose himself.

So you're telling me that since scripture that PAUL WROTE says he was spreading gods message means he is?

Let's put that a different way why don't we? I am doing the Lord's command. Since I said it it MUST be true right? RIGHT? I'm guessing you'll disagree.
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 09:47 AM
link   
reply to post by EnochWasRight
 


Just because it's in the bible does NOT make it true! I could sit down and rewrite the bible in a completely different way if I wanted, all it would take is time, something they had plenty of 2,000 years ago.

You believe the bible is hermetically sealed correct? Let's take a look at the origins of that term.


The word hermetic comes from the name of the Greek god Hermes, via the vocabulary of alchemy. The alchemists invented a process for making a glass tube airtight, which was used in distillation. The process used a secret seal whose invention was attributed to the legendary patron of alchemy, Hermes Trismegistos.


Wiki

So It derives from the Greek god Hermes. Let's take a look at who Hermes is.


He was protector and patron of travelers, herdsmen, thieves,[2] orators and wit, literature and poets, athletics and sports, invention and trade.[3] In some myths he is a trickster, and outwits other gods for his own satisfaction or the sake of humankind.


Wiki

So your "hermetical seal" is based on Hermes, the god of THIEVES, ORATORS, WIT, AND POETRY. So basically you're basing your entire assumption around a god that protected thieves and poets who is known as a trickster. The bible is a pretty piece of poetry isn't it? And it has tricked you pretty well.

Paul is called Hermes at one point, which points to him being a thief and an orator of wit and trickery.

You're basing your entire argument around the ASSUMPTION that the bible is hermetically sealed. What an ignorant stand-point you have.



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 09:51 AM
link   
reply to post by EnochWasRight
 


Oh, so since the Vatican tried to avoid it last time means they can't be blamed for choosing peter this time. Sorry, but that doesn't make a lick of sense. Their past decisions have no bearing on what they do in the here and now. If they elect Peter as the next Pope, who is known as Peter the Roman in his hometown, then they are INTENTIONALLY fulfilling the "prophecy". There is no other reason for them to elect Peter, AT ALL. What don't you understand about that?

Or is it all "god's will" as you put it? LOL So even if all the cardinals didn't want to vote for Peter, they would still be forced to do it? Come on! Use your head dude!
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 10:02 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


What you are doing ...... there is a name for this and it is called BLASPHEMY and APOSTASY.

I will not debate with you about your falsehoods and deceit. I will not trade bible versus with you that you have clearly mistranslated and do not understand.

Studying or reading the bible without guidance from the Holy Spirit is useless. You DO NOT have the Holy Spirit inside you because you have REJECTED the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. This is clear.

You say this is my God (you like writing it as god) and your words clearly show he is NOT your God.

You speak as a "chosen one". Do you know what a chosen one is? I think you do.

I don't "get it" - if he is NOT your God then why discuss it or the bible? Is it to bring doubts and grand illusions to those of faith?

What is your agenda? Clearly you have one? You are not Christian, that much is very clear. So why don't you talk about baseball or football? Maybe something you watched on TV because clearly you do not know what you are talking about.



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 10:17 AM
link   
reply to post by Fraudfinder
 


You assume I don't know what I'm talking about. Why? Because I don't agree with YOUR version? How close-minded can you possibly be?

The only agenda I have is TRUTH. The difference between you and I is that I don't claim to have all the answer or that I'm absolutely right, you do. That's your biggest mistake, thinking you know it all just because some preacher told you their version of the "truth". Expand your boundaries a little, look outside that tiny little box you're trapped in. USE YOUR BRAIN!

Why run away? Are you scared that if you even consider what I say that it is going to send you to hell? That's the box that's trapping you from knowing the real truth, your fear of a fictional place called hell. A loving god does not prepare a place like hell beforehand, you're ignorant if you believe otherwise.

Prove to me that you are knowledgeable about the bible. Show us why your version is better than everyone else's. I'll be waiting.
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 10:23 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


TRUTH???????

YOU ARE A LIAR



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 10:28 AM
link   
reply to post by Fraudfinder
 


You're confusing me with Paul. Paul is the liar, not me.

Is that the best you've got? Come on, try harder than that! That was pitiful.



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 10:45 AM
link   
HAHA!

Wow... you got some kooks in here eh...

I warned ya...




posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 11:17 AM
link   
reply to post by Akragon
 


Yeah, I have a feeling they didn't even read the OP, they just saw the title and automatically labeled it Satanic. Pretty sad really.



posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 11:31 AM
link   
reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
 


Did you notice we have an apostle among us?

I simply can't wait to see what he has to say!




posted on Feb, 12 2013 @ 11:42 AM
link   
reply to post by WhoKnows100
 



"If this work were of MAN, it would come to NOTHING! But if it be of GOD, then NO man is able to stand against it!--Lest they be found to be fighting against GOD!" (Acts 5:38,39).


The same could be said for Islam. If Islam were the work of MAN, then it would have come to NOTHING. Since Islam is SOMETHING (the second biggest religion in the world) then it MUST have been the work of god! According to your logic at least.

Why do you deny Islam? If it's the work of man (as I assume you believe) then why has it become so popular? Muslims say the Koran is the word of god, and they got people to believe it, LOTS of people. So how could man have tricked others into believing in Allah? The same way christianity tricked you into believing in Yahweh and that Jesus is Yahweh.

BRAINWASHING, CHILD INDOCTRINATION, FEAR, BIGOTRY, DIVISION. This is what religion relies on to stay afloat, that includes all Abrahamic religions, including Christianity.
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)
edit on 12-2-2013 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)





top topics
 
38
<< 1  2    4  5  6 >>

log in

join