'Horse lasagne' sparks new UK food scare., page 8

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reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:19 PM by burdman30ott6

Originally posted by macman
reply to post by samuel1990

I just have to laugh at this.

And to think, that so many Brits here are quick to add their opinions to issues in the US, when you were/are probably eating horse.

You guys got more problems then us here in the States.

Say hi to Mr. Ed for me.

Wait... consumption of meat which hasn't made anyone ill, wasn't considered to be bad in any way aside from having bits of Secretariat instead of Claribell in it, and was only offputting because of some ridiculous cultural nonsense is on par with the asininity which is modern America? Dude, even as an American I gotta put on the hip waders to wade through that statement. There is no way in hell eating horse (or any other meat aside from the most dangerous game of all, man) counterbalances such gems as approval of using drones to attack your own citizens, illegally selling arms to the same drug lords you're supposedly waging war against, and trying to systematically bring 1984 into reality. No comparison at all.

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:21 PM by blupblup

reply to post by colin42

Also in what list are cookbooks the biggest selling? The best selling book ever a cookbook? Are we talking about of all time? This year? Care to provide a source.... cheers.

Here;s the top ten of all time..

1 Da Vinci Code,The Brown, Dan 5,094,805 Transworld Crime, Thriller & Adventure
2 Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Rowling, J.K. 4,475,152 Bloomsbury Children's Fiction
3 Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone Rowling, J.K. 4,200,654 Bloomsbury Children's Fiction
4 Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix Rowling, J.K. 4,179,479 Bloomsbury Children's Fiction
5 Fifty Shades of Grey James, E. L. 3,758,936 Random House Romance & Sagas
6 Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire Rowling, J.K. 3,583,215 Bloomsbury Children's Fiction
7 Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets Rowling, J.K. 3,484,047 Bloomsbury Children's Fiction
8 Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban Rowling, J.K. 3,377,906 Bloomsbury Children's Fiction
9 Angels and Demons Brown, Dan 3,193,946 Transworld Crime, Thriller & Adventure
10 Harry Potter and the Half-blood Prince:Children's Edition Rowling, J.K. 2,950,264 Bloomsbury Children's Fiction

www.guardian.co.uk...

Not a cookbook in sight...

Another list with no cookbook

en.wikipedia.org...

edit on 8/2/13 by blupblup because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:32 PM by colin42

Originally posted by Ramcheck
At the end of the day, at least these incidents are prompting discussion on whether it should be widely available in the UK after all. As we have seen in this thread and the previous one, and the pattern emerging on social media is that the majority would actually quite like to see Horse meat available on the menu, or to have a choice whether or not they feed their families with it.

These are not incidents. They are crimes of fraud

What depresses me is that I frequent this site because many people show intelligence and offer information that can be learned from. People that question those in power and highlight the abuse of that power.

What I am seeing more and more is this is being lost. This is a clear example of betrayed trust. Abuse of economic muscle. Corporate fraud.

If you asked these supermarket chains to pay you 8 hours pay for two hours work they would sack you on the spot. What they are doing is worse.

We had two butchers that sourced local farms even more green grocers and as the super market chains appeared those shops closed.

my group campaigned for locals to support the butchers and green grocers but when you have rent/mortgages and bills to pay and kids to feed price outweighs choice. You do the best you can.

These supermarket chains worked hard to become the sole source yet are now showing more and more that ever increasing profits is their only concern at the cost to their customers and suppliers.

I am appalled that this is being welcomed as a chance to talk about if we should include horse in our diet when it should be about fraud and broken trust. Misuse of power

Can we do anything about it on this site, in this post? Well we can try to influence public opinion but the minimum we can do is educate each other about corporate greed and its cost to us.

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:34 PM by Silk

reply to post by blupblup

I'm going to wade in here - I'm a lover of all things culinary - believe you me - and yes I do openly love horse and donkey meat - as i do lots of foods including Urchin, Octopus and Snails.

Point 1) Cook books will not lead on a "Fiction" list - Delia has long lead the list of best selling cook books in the charts as has Jamie Oliver. You wont ever see those books alongside Harry Potter (as you wont see the best selling Holy Books of the world)

Point 2) No one has proven so far that the selling of this meat was an "intent" to pollute the food chain - indeed from my sources these were reputable human consumption meat chains that regularly supplied both bovine and equine meat to the channel.

Point 3) and for me the most annoying - this is NOT BSE - it is quite safe to eat Equine meat (on the whole) as it is Porcine or Bovine. As a consequence of this "scare" many tonnes of perfectly edible food is being dumped. I would postulate that repackaged and correctly labelled this might actually sell . I do believe that the horse burgers I have eaten in France and Europe over the years taste considerably better than those with "mystery meat filler".

And therein lies the issue - we were all happy to eat Burgers with mystery filler UNTIL someone said it was equine - we Brits need to grow up sometimes. In the world stage - French Cuisine is held up to the highest standards - and their choices of cuts of meat routinely include Sweetbreads, Offal and Equine sources.

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:36 PM by LFN69

Originally posted by burdman30ott6

Originally posted by macman
reply to post by samuel1990

I just have to laugh at this.

And to think, that so many Brits here are quick to add their opinions to issues in the US, when you were/are probably eating horse.

You guys got more problems then us here in the States.

Say hi to Mr. Ed for me.

Wait... consumption of meat which hasn't made anyone ill, wasn't considered to be bad in any way aside from having bits of Secretariat instead of Claribell in it, and was only offputting because of some ridiculous cultural nonsense is on par with the asininity which is modern America? Dude, even as an American I gotta put on the hip waders to wade through that statement. There is no way in hell eating horse (or any other meat aside from the most dangerous game of all, man) counterbalances such gems as approval of using drones to attack your own citizens, illegally selling arms to the same drug lords you're supposedly waging war against, and trying to systematically bring 1984 into reality. No comparison at all.

Dear Lord, dont lock horns with macman, he will only bleat about his "constitutional rights to........"

He is on a downer with the Brits at the mo because he has been made to look a knob head. Pity the child.
Anyway Horse meat? Horsesh*t.
If you buy duck you expect it to quack not moo.
If you buy a product which has ingredients that DO NOT include horsemeat then that is exactly what you get.
Clearly, people have been buying food products that have been sold on the premis that they contained no hosemeat when they did. Basically, the consumer was lied to and was not given, at the very least, the choice to opt in or opt out. That is the argument, not the moral aspect of eating horse.
It has to be said that, in the main, most of the affected meat products were at the very cheapest end of the market, they sell well but are not huge sellers. British people tend to spend well on meat and spend less on the everyday products.
Finally, this will probably open a huge can of worms where it will emerge that criminal organisations have been making multiple millions selling horsemeat to processing plants for YEARS.
Anybody who thinks that this is a recent occourence is deluding themselves.

edit on 8-2-2013 by LFN69 because: .

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:36 PM by purplemer

reply to post by samuel1990

lol

edit on 8-2-2013 by purplemer because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:43 PM by colin42

reply to post by blupblup

Also in what list are cookbooks the biggest selling? The best selling book ever a cookbook?

Oh please don’t do this. THE TOP 10 SELLING BOOKS.

Top ten selling books

Really you appeared you were better than this. I am sorry if you have taken offence to what I pointed out. You obviously want to talk about diets and how the poor get everything they deserve and it appears you are not alone

Sorry I thought the topic was about fraud, mislabelling and corporate greed that is endemic in the food industry as per the OP. It appears I am wrong.

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:45 PM by Silk

Just to add some context to this - it is interesting to note that the US contributed to Europes demand for Horse meat as well -

The slaughterhouses exported approximately 42 million dollars' worth of horse meat per year, with the majority of that money going to the foreign-owned exporters overseas. Horsemeat is one of the most carbon-intensive meat products, since horses have a very poor feed to pound conversion ratio, so it takes much more time and feed input to get to an acceptable weight for slaughter. Then horses are trucked to auctions all over North America before going to a handful of North American slaughter plants. Following processing, carcasses are then airlifted to Europe and Asia, and Asia also imports live horses as well.

Source: Wikipedia

Although this practice seems to have ceased - it was once prevalent.

What we are seeing is an ongoing trade in equine meat in an area that it is considered acceptable. What seems unacceptable is the mishandling of the routes to market. No conspiracy - Horse Meat is actually far more expensive to produce than bovine - so its hard to press the case that this was an economically advantageous situation to defraud the public.

I recalled a quote - because many people are hooked on the "aww cute horses" aspect of this - from Terry Pratchett -

"If cats looked like frogs we'd realize what nasty, cruel little bastards they are. Style. That's what people remember."

edit on 8-2-2013 by Silk because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:54 PM by Sandalphon

Okay I'm stupefied. This is a UK food scare but it's put under US Political Madness?

Besides that, can't you guys taste the difference between beefy and horsey flavors? Isn't one meat a little redder or chewier than the other? Does it smell different? Or does it not matter what you put in your mouths, that you're eating noodles with meat in it and who cares?

Maybe some vegetarian lasagna would be a good idea. Unless the cheese in there is made with horse milk.

One of these days you're going to DNA test that meat and there's going to be something human in there.

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 05:54 PM by colin42

reply to post by blupblup

Last words

Thanks for the insult. Very adult of you.

You ignored my comments on trans fats so I can only guess you don’t know or don’t care which sort of goes against you healthy eating ethos

Trans fats

There is a load more info on the harm it does. The USA have strict rules on its use now I understand and some EU countries have banned its use.

The UK not only uses it with no restriction it also hides it on the labels. Just another example of profit before people.

Cheerio

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 06:01 PM by mikell

Michigan has a lot of fat farms for horses then they ship them to Canada for packaging shall we say. Lots of people raising lots of money

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 06:02 PM by Bisman

horse meat is tastier and of higher quality then beef.

entire story seems like a good thing lol

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 06:30 PM by blupblup

reply to post by colin42

So on one website's list, there are some cookbooks? And you're trying to say that cookbooks are in the list of biggest selling books?

You do realise that there are lists of best selling books right? And I mean OFFICIAL lists? Like the one I posted, from the Guardian Article... and it has some cookbooks on it, just nowhere the top, like you seem to think.

Amazons "some of our best sellers" list is not one of them....

My god... what a.... seriously, you;re absolutely clueless.

;lol:

My insult clearly stands.

Trans fat...fructose, corn syrup.... there are plenty of things that are dangerous and nasty and shouldn't be in food?

Again, and?

All of these things are in processed crap. Cheap, unhealthy foods.

Don't eat them.

This has been my only point throughout the thread.

edit on 8/2/13 by blupblup because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 06:31 PM by Hijinx

I've got to say, I've had horse, about 3 times I can remember. The first time I tried it, I was cautious, but didn't want to offend my hosts. It was really hard to get over the fact I was eating a horse, but I actually enjoyed it. It was leaner, had a comparable taste to beef not that I would have ever thought to seek it out. I would eat it again if offered, but I'm not out looking for any sources. I knew a few horses growing up, and really this is the part for those of us who have handled/interacted with horses that could be hard. It's always hard to eat something you consider a pet or a friend. How ever, Growing up around farm animals I have eaten cattle like it was no big deal having been around them from calf to steer. Pigs, chickens it's all the same thing really. It's all a matter of how you look at them. Meat is meat, whether you like it or not. Horses aren't typically considered a food stuff because we use them in different ways, but why waste the meat.

It's no more unethical than eating your beef, deer, goose, duck, chicken, lamb, goat, moose, ram, bore, pig, elk etc etc. Meat's meat.

If you get the opportunity to give it a go, I wouldn't tell you not to, but I wouldn't force your hand either.

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 06:37 PM by blupblup

Originally posted by Silk
reply to post by blupblup

Point 1) Cook books will not lead on a "Fiction" list - Delia has long lead the list of best selling cook books in the charts as has Jamie Oliver. You wont ever see those books alongside Harry Potter (as you wont see the best selling Holy Books of the world)

Actually on the very list I posted, from the Guardian list of the best selling books... there are plenty of cookbooks, they're just nearer the bottom, because they don't sell as well.
That wasn't a list of fiction, it was a list of the best selling books.... have a look through the list.

Point 2) No one has proven so far that the selling of this meat was an "intent" to pollute the food chain - indeed from my sources these were reputable human consumption meat chains that regularly supplied both bovine and equine meat to the channel.

Probably, although I haven't said anything regarding whether or not they were fit for consumption?
Most people would eat horse I'm sure, but they should be told what they're eating... I think this is the point.

Point 3) and for me the most annoying - this is NOT BSE - it is quite safe to eat Equine meat (on the whole) as it is Porcine or Bovine. As a consequence of this "scare" many tonnes of perfectly edible food is being dumped. I would postulate that repackaged and correctly labelled this might actually sell . I do believe that the horse burgers I have eaten in France and Europe over the years taste considerably better than those with "mystery meat filler".

And therein lies the issue - we were all happy to eat Burgers with mystery filler UNTIL someone said it was equine - we Brits need to grow up sometimes. In the world stage - French Cuisine is held up to the highest standards - and their choices of cuts of meat routinely include Sweetbreads, Offal and Equine sources.

I agree, I think this food being destroyed is appalling... it should go to feed the poor, homeless or yes, repackaged and shipped to France or somewhere, why destroy perfectly edible food.
And yes, I said exactly the same thing about France and other European countries eating lots of meat we don't.

I'm not sure if your post was actually a reply to me or not, but anyway, cheers.

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 07:21 PM by Detrucci

They should just market it as "I can't believe it's not beef!" Maragrine did it and look how much people buy that crap

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 07:30 PM by Argyll

reply to post by woodwardjnr

Because its advertised as beef. Why are some struggling to grasp this concept? Horse could be the tastiest healthiest meet ever, but when your being told your getting beef, you expect beef not horse. If dog and cat were tasty and healthy, would you not mind them being used instead f beef without your knowledge?

No it's because it's horse, it has little to do with the advertising....If beefburgers sold in the UK were found to contain traces of pork or lamb (which they no doubt do) there would be no public out cry the authorities say it's okay for us to eat those animals....it's because it's horse meat, and we don't eat horse meat in this country because we are hypocrites, a meat eater is a meat eater.

I eat meat, I like meat, I don't give a rats arse what meat I eat if it tastes nice..........I wonder what rats arse tastes like

reply posted on 8-2-2013 @ 08:52 PM by nottelling

Originally posted by SpearMint

Originally posted by SkipIntro
I know that our politics are screwed up but I swear that we had nothing to do with your horsey issues!

I just couldn't imagine eating roos. Do people hunt them or are they raised for consumption like cattle?

They're farmed.

No, they are wild animals which are culled in the wild by professional kangaroo shooters. Their cute, little furry corpses are then taken to an abattoir for processing and for health inspection before being diverted to either the pet food or the human consumption markets. Very sad to see our national symbol rendered down into canned dog food, but if you're an adherent to the paleonutrition concept like I am, fresh 'roo steaks are the sanest choice available commercially here in Australia - naturally lean game meat raised in the wild, far from the profit-obsessed hand of Man. Just like venison.

That British consumers are being fed horsemeat and told it's beef or pork or whatever is a travesty. Not that there's anything wrong with horsemeat as a food - except I like horses so the whole idea of eating Mr Ed makes me sad and hurts me in my heart. Has it been confirmed yet whether the French processing plant was to blame, or whether one of their Eastern European minced meat suppliers lied on the forms?

Yay for the EU! With the barriers to trade gone you can't be sure what you're eating. If I was in the UK, I'd have abandoned the food industry all together. Grow your own I say! The UK nanny state shouldn't be taxing spare rooms in government housing, they should be mandating that the occupants put said spare room to good use as a small goat or rabbit paddock or as a hydroponic garden. That last bit was a joke.. haha?

reply posted on 9-2-2013 @ 01:46 AM by EasyPleaseMe

Originally posted by blupblup
reply to post by colin42

Also in what list are cookbooks the biggest selling? The best selling book ever a cookbook? Are we talking about of all time? This year? Care to provide a source.... cheers.

www.guardian.co.uk...

Not a cookbook in sight...

Another list with no cookbook

en.wikipedia.org...

You shouldn't really argue about it when your sources show different results.

The title 'Best Selling' usually contains a time period. If you look at 2012 sales in the UK for example, you will see cook books in the top ten best sellers...

guardian.co.uk

reply posted on 9-2-2013 @ 02:39 AM by woodwardjnr

reply to post by Argyll

You would have a point if the product was being sold as meat lasagne or horse lasagne. But it's being sold as beef lasagne. It's like me selling you chicken curry made of rats arses, but you would enjoy this it seems.