i live in the bible belt please explain to me about tithes

Originally posted by jaamaan
The god i believe in isnt short of cash.

Belief requires OBEDIENCE...

Giving isn't for HIS benefit...

It's for YOURS.

Jesus viewed money or wealth as a spiritual power (Matthew 6:24 ), identifying wealth as an object of worship, a rival to God. For this reason Jesus often asked people to turn away from it (Matthew 19:21 ; Luke 12:33-34 ). Zacchaeus offered to give half of his possessions to the poor and restore four times to any one that he had cheated (Luke 19:8 ). This was a sign of his desire to follow Christ. The only way to defeat the power of mammon is to give it away (Acts 20:35 ).

God has set a law in place in the universe called ‘sowing and reaping’. This happens rather obviously when a farmer sows seed, but also happens when a Christian ‘sows’ his money. God says that he will organise that this person receives a decent ‘return’ on what they sowed. How wonderful! Not only do we give in order to stay free from the dangers of love for money and reliance on money, but we also get more of it…to give more…

Wealth and Materialism

No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate one and love the other, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money (Lk 16:13). Jesus speaks straight about this: he gives money a capital ‘M’ and says, point blank, that Money and all it represents, contends with him for the throne of your life.

Mammon is not the same thing as money, rather it is the spirit behind money. As with most demonic activities, the assault is one of deception…it tells us that a little more money will make us happier, that we need just a few more possessions to be satisfied, and that having more money or possessions will make us more popular and more powerful.

It tells you that your net worth as an individual is based on your net wealth. And, wait for it, the only way to defeat Mammon is to consistently give money away.

Give to constantly choose God over Mammon

reply to post by proteus33


Your church has enough money. Ask yourself, where does the money go? Certainly it isn't into the hands of your god, so it is lining someone else's pockets.

If you must donate 10% of your income, give it directly to the charities the church sponsers and not the church itself.

But I highly recommend you find a new place of worship. It is none of those people's business how much money you make. I can tell just by the fact they would ask you to see your tax papers that they are nosy and have nothing better to do than gossip and you would be better off without them.

reply to post by proteus33



Tithing is part of the Old Testament Laws, and IMO were man made, apart from the 10 Commandments. According to Chrstianity, when you come to believe in Jesus, you are no longer under the old Laws. Seems like Christians wish to have their cake, and eat it.

The real church is built from within you, and is not about paying for stone buildings. Nothing wrong with people getting together and donating money to their church, to help keep it running etc…but they shouldn’t be calling it tithing, because those Laws no longer apply IMO. If people can and wish to donate, then let them donate freely.

- JC

Tithe means tenth pure and simple, don't let anyone tell you different.

Originally posted by Joecroft
Tithing is part of the Old Testament Laws, and IMO were man made, apart from the 10 Commandments. According to Chrstianity, when you come to believe in Jesus, you are no longer under the old Laws. Seems like Christians wish to have their cake, and eat it.

The laws of probability PROVE that the Word is anything BUT man made.

The prophecies in the bible are irrefutable proof that the Bible was divinely inspired.

The science of probability SHOWS we are dealing with the miraculous…

Any mathematician will agree that odds this high have a ZERO probability of ever happening naturally.

Originally posted by Joecroft
reply to post by proteus33

 

Tithing is part of the Old Testament Laws, and IMO were man made, apart from the 10 Commandments. According to Chrstianity, when you come to believe in Jesus, you are no longer under the old Laws. Seems like Christians wish to have their cake, and eat it.

The real church is built from within you, and is not about paying for stone buildings. Nothing wrong with people getting together and donating money to their church, to help keep it running etc…but they shouldn’t be calling it tithing, because those Laws no longer apply IMO. If people can and wish to donate, then let them donate freely.

- JC

edit on 7-2-2013 by Joecroft because: (no reason given)

Agreed, although I have to say this seems more Americanish than elsewhere, it's certainly old hat here in Ireland, people are asked to give no more than they can afford.

reply to post by proteus33


its a scam.

do Christians sacrifice a sheep on an alter?

of course not! Christians are not under the ceremonial law of the Old Testament. That was the point of Jesus being the sacrifice.. the blood of the Lamb.

Tithing is strictly for the non-Christian jew and many jewish scholars will gladly tell you this.

“Each one must do just as he has purposed in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.” 2Cor 9:7

You are being compelled to give, 20%, which is not you giving freely. even 10% would be wrong.

People forget that Jesus paid the Temple Tax because he was jewish, Paul told people to pay their tithe/tax because they were also jewish & still apart of the community.

the jews are still waiting for their messiah, if you are Christian you believe Jesus was the Messiah. Therefore you are not subject to the Laws of the Old Testament.

you will know them by their fruits, and with every passing week churches get richer & the poor get poorer.

source

I am not a bible scholar so I can't reference the verses, but outside of that, churches have operating costs. They have salaries to pay, utilities for their buildings. If you want to participate in that church and receive the message they put forth, then it goes for those things. Many times they will ask for a special offering to cover things like mission work or special purchases.

Not tithing at church is like eating at a restaurant and not paying for the meal, yet most people don't tithe at all.

Also, in biblical times, 10% of the harvest was set aside to help people in need. Churches used to serve this function in society until the government decided it could do a better job with welfare and food stamps. You can see where that got us.

Originally posted by Murgatroid

Originally posted by Joecroft
Tithing is part of the Old Testament Laws, and IMO were man made, apart from the 10 Commandments. According to Chrstianity, when you come to believe in Jesus, you are no longer under the old Laws. Seems like Christians wish to have their cake, and eat it.

The laws of probability PROVE that the Word is anything BUT man made.

The prophecies in the bible are irrefutable proof that the Bible was divinely inspired.

The science of probability SHOWS we are dealing with the miraculous…

Any mathematician will agree that odds this high have a ZERO probability of ever happening naturally.

This is untrue.

one example.

the ten commandments are from Papyrus of Ani PLATE 31 & 32
CHAPTER 125 'THE NEGATIVE CONFESSION, of the Egyptian Book of the Dead

(1) Ani saith: "Hail, thou whose strides are long, who comest forth from Annu, I have not done iniquity." (2) "Hail, thou who art embraced by flame, who comest forth from Kheraba, I have not robbed with violence." (3) "Hail, Fentiu, who comest forth from Khemennu, I have not stolen." (4) "Hail, Devourer of the Shade, who comest forth from Qernet, I have done no murder; I have done no harm." (5) "Hail, Nehau, who comest forth from Re-stau, I have not defrauded offerings." (6) "Hail, god in the form of two lions, who comest forth from heaven, I have not minished oblations." (7) "Hail, thou whose eyes are of fire, who comest forth from Saut, I have not plundered the god." (8) "Hail, thou Flame, which comest and goest, I have spoken no lies."

these are not written by God, why would He need to write anything down? He's GOD.

these are written by an Egyptian god, the Pharaoh, a man.

Moses, being an adopted son of the Pharaoh would have been educated in such things..

& simply condensed these rules of conduct down to 10 basic principals

for his newly found followers.

you need to expand your understanding.

what a man can do, he will do, and he will lie.

God does not send fred flintstone stone tablet faxes from heaven.

men wrote the bible. men put the books together to serve their own needs

for power, control, & ego.

Originally posted by proteus33
i live in the bible belt please explain to me about tithes

A scam that is older then Christianity, where people give their hard earned money to various religious establishments to try to curry the favor of the divine, when they are only lining the pockets of a privileged few within the religion, with some used to go back into the "business' in order to bamboozle and coerce even more from the desperate public--fancy buildings, a costume and a creed, maybe a pittance to a charity or two for p.r. etc...

That whole 501(c)3 thing... I've been looking at that the past few weeks. The whole thing stinks. And churches don't even have to do it! I've read the IRS regs on that. Not only that, they are prevented from saying certain things. It was started by Lyndon Johnson because he wanted to get churches out of the government.

I wish I could find a church that isn't 501. Have not found one yet.

It deserves it's own thread. I'd really like to see churches and 501(c)3 explored.

"Explain to me about tithes". And you grew up on a farm? OK, I'll try. You know when the sow has little piglets, and each of them need to feed, they each wander over to the sow and.... well, you know, I better U2U on this one, it could get graphic. But trust me, once you find out you'll be a happy man.


I see some people made a mistake on this thread, and are talking about how much money their church wants to shake them down for. For awhile I was giving 10 percent to the Edgar Cayce Association (A.R.E., Association for Research and Enlightenment I believe). There's a guy I could hang my hat on and waltz around the room twice.

The tithe is the acknowledgement that God gave the increase from the seeds that you planted. It serves as a way to keep the devour from eating the seed, and for God to bless that seed with a plentiful harvest. The reason why they pass around the plate is because the church has expenses: lights, phone, advertising, paid staff (including the Pastor's salary), and what ever expenses the church has like: multimedia, office supplies, and hosting events.

8“Will a man rob God? Yet you rob me. “But you ask, ‘How do we rob you?’ “In tithes and offerings. 9You are under a curse—the whole nation of you—because you are robbing me. 10Bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house. TEST ME in this,” says the Lord Almighty, “AND SEE if I will not throw open the floodgates of heaven and pour out so much blessing that you will not have room enough for it. 11I will prevent pests from devouring your crops, and the vines in your fields will not cast their fruit,” says the Lord Almighty. 12“Then all the nations will call you blessed, for yours will be a delightful land, says the Lord Almighty." -(Mal. 3:8-12)

"You are under a curse". God curses no one! Disobedience places you in that position. "Bring the whole tithe (10%)...THAT THERE MAY BE FOOD IN MY HOUSE"(that the pastor can pay the bills). Then, the Lord says: "TEST ME...and SEE': your car will stop breaking down, your kids will stop getting sick, your money will stop running out. ("I will prevent pests from devouring your crops"). Also, "floodgates will open and blessings will pour that you will not have room enough for it." That's what God wants you to TEST and SEE. Give me 10% and I'll do the rest!

BTW....do you go to the movies for free???

When you GIVE TO GOD...you're giving to God in SPIRIT. You're not giving it to the "Pastor". You're giving it to God and you have a RIGHT to EXPECT a HARVEST, FROM GOD!!!

Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your lap. For with the same measure that you measure it shall be measured to you again. -(Luke 6:38)

Every man according as he purposes in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loves a cheerful giver.-(2Cor 9:7)

But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD sees not as man sees; for man looks on the outward appearance, but the LORD looks on the heart. -(1Sam 16:7)

Now read this story, and you'll see why Abel was "favored" by God. It wasn't because Abel was "better than" Cain, it was because Abel gave God his BEST...and Cain just gave to God.

Now Abel kept flocks, and Cain worked the soil. 3In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the Lord. 4But Abel brought fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The Lord looked with favor on Abel and his offering, 5but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast. 6Then the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? 7If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must master it.” -(Gen 4:2-7)

Apply the PRINCIPLES and watch the RESULTS. It works for saint and sinner. Think it doesn't? Let this sink nice and good:

The LORD your God will bless you, as he promised. You will make loans to many nations, but you will not have to borrow from any of them. You will rule many nations, but no nation will ever rule you.-(Deut 15:6)

Seems like bankers and politicians get this PRINCIPLE. LOAN and RULE!

reply to post by Murgatroid

Originally posted by Murgatroid
The laws of probability PROVE that the Word is anything BUT man made.

The prophecies in the bible are irrefutable proof that the Bible was divinely inspired.

The science of probability SHOWS we are dealing with the miraculous…

Any mathematician will agree that odds this high have a ZERO probability of ever happening naturally.

Competely agree with you, in part at least.

The Prophecies of the prophets and many orther parts show divine inspiration, but IMO it’s also made up of mens words, and has to be discerned carefully.

My own view is that men added the extra Commandments, which is why Jesus had to come and fulfill the Law. The only laws that Jesus fufils, from his teachings, IMO are the Ten Commandments.

- JC

Why would god want you to give him money, he has no use for it nor does his followers.In the bible money and wealth is always associated with something bad,evil,selfish.The church made up the tithing thing so they could get rich.

you don`t have the prime the pump ,so to speak, in order for god to give you stuff and take care of you:

And he said unto his disciples, Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat; neither for the body, what ye shall put on.
The life is more than meat, and the body is more than raiment.
Consider the ravens: for they neither sow nor reap; which neither have storehouse nor barn; and God feedeth them: how much more are ye better than the fowls?
And which of you with taking thought can add to his stature one cubit?
If ye then be not able to do that thing which is least, why take ye thought for the rest?
Consider the lilies how they grow: they toil not, they spin not; and yet I say unto you, that Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.
If then God so clothe the grass, which is to day in the field, and to morrow is cast into the oven; how much more will he clothe you, O ye of little faith?

Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

Shew me the tribute money. And they brought unto him a penny.
And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription?
They say unto him, Caesar's. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's.

Jesus sat down opposite the place where the offerings were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the temple treasury. Many rich people threw in large amounts. But a poor widow came and put in two very small copper coins, worth only a few cents.
Calling his disciples to him, Jesus said, “Truly I tell you, this poor widow has put more into the treasury than all the others. They all gave out of their wealth; but she, out of her poverty, put in everything—all she had to live on.”

A lot of people will demonize churches for doing it, but this is my way of looking at it:

Most non-profits and clubs have staff, have to pay for electricity, etc. You have club dues and people always with a hand out for donations in those things, too.

I just think that it becomes a big deal because it's affiliated with religion. Some people take it a little too seriously for my taste, but you have those kinds of people in everything for Home Owner's Associations to the government.

Wow, again I am amazed by the ignorance of people in the world.

To start, Tithe comes from the hebrew word "ma`aser" which means a) tenth part b) tithe, payment of a tenth part

The tithe was established for the priests as a way to feed and support them. When Israel was promised the land of cannan as an inheritance, the priests did not receive any land. They instead received a tithe of the increase of all the land as an inheritance. This was a commandment in the law of the old testament.

When Jesus fulfilled the law with his death, we were made free of the law. (read the writings of Paul in Romans)

Christians today are not commanded to Tithe, but if we do we will reap the benifits.

I know that there is a number of churches that bring in alot of money and tend to spend it a little looser than others. I don't personally agree with a pastor owning a jag or lexus. I have counseled pastors against buying expensive cars simply because of the perception of abuse.

Originally posted by TheLaughingGod
Yeah, God really needs that money..

I don't think the church needs it either.

edit on 7-2-2013 by TheLaughingGod because: (no reason given)

I'm sorry but you are wrong. I prefer small to medium sized churches, 50-150 members, and they typically have a tight budget and in some cases the pastor does not even get a salary. I know a pastor in the town that I live in who does not. The church has to pay electricity, water, gas, phone, and auto expenses. For a small church, that will not leave much more for anything else. Including salaries.

Originally posted by MrBigDave
Christians today are not commanded to Tithe, but if we do we will reap the benifits.

Very few Christians listen to God's voice.

Very few of today's "Christians" are even going to Heaven.

Another post here explains why.

"But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." Matthew 8:12

“Tell My children, they must be obedient to give tithes and offerings," said the Lord Jesus.

6 Messages to the Church

He said "those who don’t tithe, they are disobedient Christians.""

CHOO THOMAS

I asked the Lord, "Lord, how can this be possible, that people are here for this reason??" The Lord responded, "Yes, because these people thought that tithes and offerings were not important, when my Word shows it as a command." In Malachi 3:8-9 it says "Will a man rob God? Yet you are robbing Me. But you say, 'How have we robbed Thee?' In tithes and offerings. You are cursed with curse, for you are robbing Me, the whole nation of you."

Revelations of Heaven and Hell by 7 Youths

Originally posted by Tardacus
Why would god want you to give him money, he has no use for it nor does his followers.

Giving isn't for HIS benefit...

It's for YOURS.

Jesus viewed money or wealth as a spiritual power (Matthew 6:24 ), identifying wealth as an object of worship, a rival to God. For this reason Jesus often asked people to turn away from it (Matthew 19:21 ; Luke 12:33-34 ). Zacchaeus offered to give half of his possessions to the poor and restore four times to any one that he had cheated (Luke 19:8 ). This was a sign of his desire to follow Christ. The only way to defeat the power of mammon is to give it away (Acts 20:35 ).

God has set a law in place in the universe called ‘sowing and reaping’. This happens rather obviously when a farmer sows seed, but also happens when a Christian ‘sows’ his money. God says that he will organise that this person receives a decent ‘return’ on what they sowed. How wonderful! Not only do we give in order to stay free from the dangers of love for money and reliance on money, but we also get more of it…to give more…

Wealth and Materialism

No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate one and love the other, or he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money (Lk 16:13). Jesus speaks straight about this: he gives money a capital ‘M’ and says, point blank, that Money and all it represents, contends with him for the throne of your life.

Mammon is not the same thing as money, rather it is the spirit behind money. As with most demonic activities, the assault is one of deception…it tells us that a little more money will make us happier, that we need just a few more possessions to be satisfied, and that having more money or possessions will make us more popular and more powerful.

It tells you that your net worth as an individual is based on your net wealth. And, wait for it, the only way to defeat Mammon is to consistently give money away.

Give to constantly choose God over Mammon