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"It's a profoundly damaging argument that tribal peoples are more violent than us," said Survival's Jonathan Mazower. "It simply isn't true. If allowed to go unchallenged … it would do tremendous damage to the movement for tribal people's rights.
Diamond has constructed his argument using a small minority of anthropologists and using statistics in a way that is misleading and manipulative."
The Guardian
He accused Survival of falling into the thinking that views tribal people either as "primitive brutish barbarians" or as "noble savages, peaceful paragons of virtue living in harmony with their environment, and admirable compared to us, who are the real brutes".
He added: "An occupational hazard facing authors like me, who try to steer a middle course between these two extremes, is the likelihood of being criticised from either direction."
The Guardian
He argues its protectiveness toward tribal societies has led it to deny practices including warfare, infanticide, widow-strangling and abandoning the elderly.
"Well-meaning defenders of traditional peoples, including apparently Corry, feel it necessary to deny the existence of those practices," he said. "That's a very bad idea – 'extremely dangerous', to use Corry's words where they really belong.
"Mistreatment of tribal peoples should be condemned not because you claim that they are peaceful when they really are not. It should instead be condemned on moral grounds: the mistreatment of any people is wrong."
The Guardian
Originally posted by ollncasino
On the other hand, some anthropologist are concerned that his findings will negatively impact the moral legitimacy of the movement for tribal people's rights.
Originally posted by winofiend
Tribes are everything that hippies in society call out on every one else.
It's hilarious.
Tribes are utterly xenophobic.
Tribes are barbaric.
Tribes engage in war with their neighbours.
Tribes have specific, separate roles for men and women.
Yet when we look at them we see harmony.
Why? Well, when you realise that humans are a tribal people, you realise we've lost that for ourselves.
All the bad things we're constantly told are the wrong, are simple human nature.
It's no wonder we're lost and have no social compass to guide us.
Originally posted by lampsalot
What I don't get is why the political left is okay with tribalism and nationalism so long as the people are not of European descent. It's definitely a double standard.
Originally posted by ollncasino
Originally posted by lampsalot
What I don't get is why the political left is okay with tribalism and nationalism so long as the people are not of European descent. It's definitely a double standard.
Some of the logic mirrors Marxism. In Communist ideology, the bourgeoisie are assumed to be both very powerful (owning the means of production) and to use that power to exploit all other groups in society. Other groups are consequently assumed to be victims.
On an international level, those of European descent are assumed to be both very powerful (owning much of the world's wealth and dominating international institutions) and to use that power to exploit all other non European decent groups. Any group of non-European descent is assumed to be a victim.
Consequently...
When people of European descent exhibit tribalism and nationalism, they do it to exploit others.
When those of non-European descent exhibit tribalism and nationalism, they do it to resist the actual or potential exploitation of those of European descent.
Consequently, tribalism by tribal people is the fault of those of European descent and not the fault of the tribes.
edit on 3-2-2013 by ollncasino because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Astyanax
A star for your post, but I would beware offering too much aid and comfort to those who would use Diamond's claim to infer the superiority of civilised westerners over dark-skinned primitives.
Originally posted by halfoldman
He actually says there is no difference in intellect, and "European superiority" came from a happenstance of history, mainly by domesticating certain animals and plants.
I think his theories have been quite annoying to certain right-wing streams.
I'm then also quite surprised that he would get critique for not being politically correct enough.
Originally posted by winofiend
Why? Well, when you realise that humans are a tribal people, you realise we've lost that for ourselves.
All the bad things we're constantly told are the wrong, are simple human nature.
It's no wonder we're lost and have no social compass to guide us.
Originally posted by lampsalot
What I don't get is why the political left is okay with tribalism and nationalism so long as the people are not of European descent. It's definitely a double standard.