Man Shown A Once Atheist Author Now In Hades

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posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 09:51 AM
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Originally posted by Lazarus Short
Ho-Hum, another fictional account of "Hell." It is not verifiable by the Bible or any other means. Yes, the wicked will make an account for their sins and wickedness, but God's own Law forbids an eternal punishment for temporal crimes, or have you not read the Law of Jubilee?

Heaven, yes!

Hell, no!!
edit on 27-12-2012 by Lazarus Short because: lah-de-dah


Christ spoke numerous times of eternal torment. Somehow you're more knowledgeable on these matters than Him?




posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:06 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 



Christ spoke numerous times of eternal torment. Somehow you're more knowledgeable on these matters than Him?


Can you prove it was him who said these things? Can you prove it wasn't simply attributed to him?



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:18 AM
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reply to post by AfterInfinity
 


Can you prove it wasn't? On the other hand, His statements pass the basic standards historians use for authentication.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:32 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Because methods of verifying something written over a thousand years ago must be completely foolproof and easier than a walk in the park, right? The older it is, the more guesswork involved.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:32 AM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by AfterInfinity
 


Can you prove it wasn't? On the other hand, His statements pass the basic standards historians use for authentication.


That is SOOOO not true. Biblical scholars are in agreement that MANY of the words attributed to Jesus were edited into the "books" at much later dates. The last 12 verses of the book of Mark were added much later. The story of the adulteress was added around 1000 years after Jesus supposedly died.

The author of the book of Matthew has an unusually fetish for "the gnashing of teeth" that no other gospels claims.

The biblical words of Jesus, although they may sound pretty, are not trustworthy AT ALL!



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:34 AM
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By the gods, reading things such as this really hurts my eyes, because they can't roll enough to express my feelings on the subject. I'm so tired of all this "You're going to hell!" type stuff that quite a few christians like to spew at people. Even some people in my family.


One thing that always confused me in regards to this belief, and boggles me even more that people are so quick to believe it, is that why would an almighty, supposedly benevolent/caring/loving deity give his creations the gift of "Free Will", then punish them eternally for not doing what he says? That would be like placing all sorts of food made out of bacon all around your dog, then beat him constantly for even sniffing it. It's just a jerk move.

I'm a mere human, and even I see the idiocy behind this logic. I'm not a believer in the christian faith, but even I can see that if their god is as wise as they claim he is, that he would know better than to create a race of very curious beings, all so he could punish them for being curious. That is, unless he's an immature s***head child who just wants to torture his science experiment. If that be the case, why would you even want to give him your praise? It's like the child that has been abused their whole life, beaten and burned for anything they do, worshipping their abusive parent. A huge case of stockholm syndrome.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:39 AM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Because methods of verifying something written over a thousand years ago must be completely foolproof and easier than a walk in the park, right? The older it is, the more guesswork involved.


I tend to believe historians than the prejudicial arbitrary conjectures of someone venturing completely out of their area of professional expertise.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:43 AM
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reply to post by windword
 


I believe you're referring to folks at the Jesus Seminar who carry little to no credibility outside the Seminar itself. They lean towards Gnostic theology and venerate Gnostic texts at the expense of traditional historic texts. And lastly, the liberal "scholars" and textual critics are in the minority of academics, not the majority.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:44 AM
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reply to post by AfterInfinity
 


Can we prove quotes from Plato, Socrates, or Confucius were actually stated by them or just attributed to them?



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:50 AM
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If life feels bad, you are living in Hell. If life feels good, you are living in Heaven.
If you want something different than the world you inhabit then you are in Hell. If you are content with things then you are in Heaven.
Life is eternal so death will not change a thing.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:50 AM
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reply to post by micmerci
 


Heh. Honestly, I don't care which of them said what. If the product is proven to be of quality, then why does the source matter? It seems that many people base their opinion of what was said on their thoughts concerning who said it.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:52 AM
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reply to post by micmerci
 


I love your signature.

"Religion is for people who are afraid to go to hell. Spirituality is for people who have already been there."

Namaste.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:54 AM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by micmerci
 


Heh. Honestly, I don't care which of them said what. If the product is proven to be of quality, then why does the source matter? It seems that many people base their opinion of what was said on their thoughts concerning who said it.


Fair enough. But I was going at it from a different angle. Why does it seem that most people trust the historical accounts of the Greeks or Chinese but are so suspicious of the Jewish and Roman historical accounts of Jesus? Couldn't the Greeks and Chinese have "an agenda" as well?



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 10:55 AM
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I once read that the bible only makes sense after awakening has occured.
edit on 28-12-2012 by Itisnowagain because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 11:12 AM
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reply to post by Itisnowagain
 


Probably because that's when the bullcrap becomes blatantly apparent. At this point in time, almost anything sounds good as long as it provides stability. Or so it would seem.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 11:16 AM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by windword
 


I believe you're referring to folks at the Jesus Seminar who carry little to no credibility outside the Seminar itself. They lean towards Gnostic theology and venerate Gnostic texts at the expense of traditional historic texts. And lastly, the liberal "scholars" and textual critics are in the minority of academics, not the majority.


Nope.


Commentators and other scholars tell us that the earliest manuscripts of John’s gospel do not include the story of the adulterous woman. It does not appear in any Greek manuscript until the fifth century, and no Greek church father comments on the passage prior to the twelfth century. Even then, the comments state that the accurate manuscripts do not contain this story.

When it was inserted in later manuscripts, the story of the adulterous woman appeared in different places: after John 7:52, after Luke 21:38, at the end of John; and when it does appear it is often marked off by asterisks to signal doubt about where it belongs. The story is part of an oral tradition that was circulated in the Western church, eventually finding its way into the Latin Vulgate, and from there into later Greek manuscripts.
www.pastordave.info...



Concerning the Story of the Adulteress in the Eighth Chapter of John, Biblical scholars are nearly all agreed that the Story of the Adulteress (also known as the Pericope Adulterae or the Pericope de Adultera) usually printed in Bibles as John 7:53-8:11 is a later addition to the Gospel.
www.bible-researcher.com...



Part of the problem is that the story of the adulterous woman is not found in any of the most important early Greek manuscripts that have survived, nor is it found in the Egyptian Coptic Church's Biblical texts. www.agapebiblestudy.com...



The Last 12 Verses of Mark Among the disputed passages are the final verses of the Gospel of Mark (16:9-20). (Look in your own Bible: you are likely to find an annotation that these were "added later.")
www.khouse.org...





posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 11:31 AM
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reply to post by EfficientP
 



If you are right, and there is no God, you lose nothing. But if you are wrong, you lose EVERYTHING!


Pascal's wager is cowardly. Why would God want followers to believe in him simply because they don't want to go to hell? That sort of thinking basically proves that Christianity uses fear mongering to promote membership.

It is the same tactics used by despots.

Anyone who uses fear tactics cannot be "benevolent and loving."

I would wager that the majority of Christians chose their faith because of the fear of eternal torture. Any sane person would, who would want to face physical pain for a span of time the mind cannot even comprehend?

The entire construct of the hell idea is why I believe that Christianity is a farce.
edit on 28-12-2012 by LewsTherinThelamon because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 11:58 AM
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Originally posted by Bixxi3
Ok which god do i need to believe to get into heaven? Will any do?
If I'm right you've wasted your whole life basing it on a lie...
edit on 27-12-2012 by Bixxi3 because: (no reason given)


And if you're wrong, he hasn't and you have.

What is your point? You're right and everyone else is wrong?

Here's a what if...

What if you don't believe, yet you follow the ten commandments and the teachings of Jesus. What kind of life do you think you'll have? You'll probably be happy, and stay out of trouble.

If you don't think there is good and evil in this place, you haven't been paying attention to the news.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 12:00 PM
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Having studied to become an Apostolic minister, I can assure you Hell is nowhere mentioned in the Bible as a literal place of eternal torment. In fact, Judaism does not have a Hell, only a Heaven, where you will take an account of what you did in your life, but will be forgiven by an uncondionally loving God.

This, by the way, is the view of the afterlife in a testament that has God laying waste to entire cities. So it's not the New Testament, where God takes on a much more open and forgiving nature. So it's not like God just up and created a fiery pit of damnation by the time Jesus came.

Unless you read the Bible in literal English, which plagues so many modern translations, and/or accept everything that your preacher tells you, you would see this as true. People often forget that the Bible was written in Greek and Hebrew, two complex and multifacted language in which many words have many meanings, or meanings contrary to what we may take them as in our modern language.



posted on Dec, 28 2012 @ 12:17 PM
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Originally posted by Necrobile
By the gods, reading things such as this really hurts my eyes, because they can't roll enough to express my feelings on the subject. I'm so tired of all this "You're going to hell!" type stuff that quite a few christians like to spew at people. Even some people in my family.


One thing that always confused me in regards to this belief, and boggles me even more that people are so quick to believe it, is that why would an almighty, supposedly benevolent/caring/loving deity give his creations the gift of "Free Will", then punish them eternally for not doing what he says? That would be like placing all sorts of food made out of bacon all around your dog, then beat him constantly for even sniffing it. It's just a jerk move.

I'm a mere human, and even I see the idiocy behind this logic. I'm not a believer in the christian faith, but even I can see that if their god is as wise as they claim he is, that he would know better than to create a race of very curious beings, all so he could punish them for being curious. That is, unless he's an immature s***head child who just wants to torture his science experiment. If that be the case, why would you even want to give him your praise? It's like the child that has been abused their whole life, beaten and burned for anything they do, worshipping their abusive parent. A huge case of stockholm syndrome.



"supposedly benevolent/caring/loving deity give his creations the gift of "Free Will", then punish them eternally for not doing what he says"

did it ever occur to u that God may not have 'made' the rules? that God is just as subject to Law as humans are? That the God that we feel is just as much an expression of Divine Law as we are.
"as below, so above"
"made in God's image"

what then?

there is truth to Law and Hell is a unction of how you define it but always involves suffering. Law demands balance: consequence, both positive and negative: either might be "good" depending on view point.

if you eat too much sugar you will become ill
if you value wealth over love your heart will wither.
if you remain blind to the pain you cause in this life, you will experience it when your mind becomes a part of the greater mind at death.

the rules are written in our very beings, if you choose to look you WILL see your own 'right' and 'wrong'. if you *choose* to ignore these personal truths then you will suffer: this is Hell.
and it exists both in the corporeal life and in the greater mind state.

what many humans fail to understand is that the expression of those rules are different for each human snowflake, placing their own personal boxes on others: projecting truth unaware of Plato's cave.

then there are those who misplace human law for divine law. we write dogma and proclaim 'God's' law and point fingers and make accusations. almost always because the seed of that expression lies within the finger pointer.

karma is. divine law is.
consequences will never be the same.

and you and only you can know what those Laws are and will suffer/flourish by the choices you make.
religion attempts to spread the word of Law, but what it should really be doing is spreading the word on how to discover your own Law.

and it's not praise.
its love. the love makes the connection. the connection brings unparalleled experience. Following God means following the deep currents that stir below your busy mind. trusting the vectors that push you where you need to be.

becoming the vessel of a God is VERY different than becoming a slave

true story



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