Let’s Agree to Put an End to the Petty 9/11 Argument’s

page: 1
9
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join

posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 07:18 AM
link   
I am sure for many what I am about to say is obvious but I can’t help but feel that to some members are still unaware about this very important and certain fact when it comes to what has turned into the 9/11 argument.

I say the 9/11 argument because that is what it has turned into; to me it is no longer an intellectual debate to seek out the truth it is a petty argument between two opposing sides. On one side we have the people who are adamant that the official story to 9/11 is truth and on the other we have those who are certain that the government or some other tool of the “elite” was directly involved in some kind of false flag that resulted in countless deaths. Now yes I know there are some who might say that they don’t entirely subscribe to one argument or the other pointing out the merits and flaws of both sides of the argument but fundamentally we all fall into one of two groups, people who believe in a cover up of some kind and those who believe the official story.

Both groups have stopped the debate now and started the argument, both groups strongly believe they are right and both groups have their reasons for believing they are right and within each group there is conflict but at the end of the day neither of these two side will ever agree.

Therefore…..

I cannot understand why we are continuing with this stupid argument, we have people who believe the official story banging their heads against an impenetrable wall as they desperately try to show the conspiracy theorists how very wrong they are. And on the opposite side of that wall we have those who believe that there is some kind of conspiracy or cover up behind 9/11 on some kind of odd crusade to force their own brand of “truth” down everyone else throats. Both sides have their “evidence” and openly mock there opposite’s in this argument because they don’t accept their evidence be it the 9/11 commission or evidence of a controlled demolition. This inevitably turns into two groups of people frustrated at each other because neither can understand why the other cannot subscribe to their believes on the basis of their evidence and in the end we get a school yard argument.

The problem is that both sides have their unique bodies of knowledge that rarely cross the same path and each group has a very strong critique of the others body of knowledge. For example a OSer will tell a truth about the bias of their source, it only looks a one side, out to make money and so on. The same goes for the other side with truthers insisting on pointing out that everybody is in on it form the whole Bush administration to the “MSN” all the way to your grandmother.

The point I am making hear is that the two sides are intellectual opposite’s, they have turned into something similar to two groups of sports fans arguing one team is better than the other. Neither of these groups is ever going to agree, submit or negotiate to reach consensus of what happened so why don’t we stop trying in vain to force the other group into our way of thinking because its not going to happen. By continually forcing “9/11 truth” or the “official account” down people’s throats all your going to do is piss people off and end either banned or looking like a fool.

I personally believe the official story, I have my evidence as to why I believe it to be true if I engage in a debate on 9/11 with a “truther” I will present my reasons for by believe but if Mr. Truther does not want to believe what I have to say then I really don’t care. It makes no difference to me if he chooses to bath in pool of what I perceive to be as ignorance. Likewise if one takes a conspiracy view of 9/11 why does it matter to you that I say I hold a different opinion than you despite you showing me your evidence. Why do we need to then get into these petty arguments where we accuse each other of lying, being stupid, flaming posts and resorting to bully tactics such as all ganging up on the truther or OSer.

We are all guilty of this, myself included but really the petty argument about 9/11 has to stop and we need to get back to the intellectual debate




posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 07:30 AM
link   

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
I personally believe the official story,...


Let me quickly think about it .............. no, rejected.


We will get on your nerves until the criminals, who are responsible, are found and prosecuted. Topic is too important, to dismiss it. Sorry.

Why is it almost always believers of the official conspiracy theory who make suggestions like that?

Is that your new method of trying to silence the critics?


edit on 30-11-2012 by ALF88 because: (no reason given)


+6 more 
posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 07:43 AM
link   
reply to post by ALF88
 


You see this is exactly the point I am making,

What I am trying to say hear is that we have two opposing sides both disagree we need to accept that when debate and stop with trying force our perceived truth down the others necks. I believe in the official story with just as much enthusiasm and vigour as you believe that there was something even more sinister behind it.

It has nothing to do with trying to silence you it’s about us debating rather than resorting to pettiness and forgetting that there are two sides two this argument.

Everyone is guilty of this we are all doing it. I deliberately went out of my way to make this thread as balanced as I could I am not saying OSers are wrong or Truthers are wrong what I am saying is that if both sides want to debate first they need to learn to respect the other side of the argument.



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 08:17 AM
link   
reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin
 

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


You are absolutely right: many people have already made up their minds one way or another and in most cases, they are not going to change their opinions.

However, some might. And each day, especially as those who were very young at the time of 9/11 grow to maturity and their own questioning minds lead them to seek answers, there are people who want to discuss these matters and make their own decisions. Therefore I think that it's only right, just and fair to give them the opportunity to do just that.

Let them hear both sides of the argument, let them question, let them offer their own opinions. And let it all be done in an atmosphere of mutual respect.

I feel that even more important than respecting the other side of the argument, is for members to respect other members. We are people, not labels on a package of ideas, so just because some believe the official story (or most of it) and others do not, they all have the same right to be heard.

Members have been reminded time and again... They can question any and all sources or concepts that are presented and criticize the opinions of others, but they need to stay away from making personal attacks against members who make statements that conflict with their own view of things. Calling people "shills" or "idiots" and so on is not intellectual debate, it's a totally negative, disrespectful tactic and it's just plain wrong.

It was this lack of respect for other people that led to the 9/11 forum being shut down for a while then re-opened with the toughest posting rules on this site. The rules have to be tough, because the behavior by some members was simply atrocious and they just would not back off. And like many members, I just didn't visit that forum any more because I was sick of the childish behavior.

Here, members expect to be treated with respect. That's the standard. Their individual opinions are not the problem: it's good for people to discuss this incredibly important subject and reach their own conclusions. What really matters is respect for all members as people.

That's the standard and it's the right one.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

edit on 30/11/12 by JustMike because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 08:21 AM
link   
Unless some bombshell evidence (real proof) comes out that proves a conspiracy, everything will remain the same.

Just my opinion.



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 08:26 AM
link   
I will always Star and Flag threads calling for intelligent discourse over petty poo-flinging.

I, for one, believe that the government at the time, and the government since, and governments before (and the whole freaking system for that matter) has been complicit in the creation of 9/11. To me, it reeks of half-truths and distractions, and the resulting benefits from this tragic event lay squarely with a small set of people who were not the mythological Al Qaeda.

But... this is not an attempt to actually switch this over to a debate on any evidence. In fact, most of what I know is because I've read the opinions of others on the matter, and it's likely the same source that anyone with an opinion has... unless they are the "others" in this case, who have actually examined the evidence and made those public assertions.

I'm a skeptic, but I can always change my mind. (FREEEEEEDOM!!!!!)

I look forward to the intelligent discussion that either does or does not change my mind.



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 08:29 AM
link   
reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin
 


I know how you feel!

There is no need for petty arguing at all really..................just observe the evidence of that fateful day and make your own decision as to what occurred, for me physics as a science died that day if I was to believe the OS

A bit of critical thinking is all it takes to see what happened on 9/11 and it means nothing to argue with OS peddlers.

well I know I'm not going to argue with anyone about this subject as its not worth it!



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 08:31 AM
link   
The facts are the Israeli agencies as well as certain elements around the world and in the west partook in the events of 911. The evidence shows that agents posed as hijackers, used stolen or used forged passports, used the military and airline hijacking exercises that were scheduled for September 2001 as cover to execute the attack. All while being shadowed by Israeli agents as Israeli agencies monitored and phone hacked the u.s agencies as well as had control over certain NORAD computing software linked with Air traffic control.

You say stop the arguments? The whole 911 coverup, the mess of trolls and debunkers and all the misleading disinformation and misinformation was meant to discredit the movement, and derail you from learning who were the true planners and executors of 9/11.

Notice right after the building fells they repeatedly showed happy, cheering Palestinians who had absolutely nothing to do with 911. It was later found that the video was staged and the children and people were given candy and other gifts to celebrate Its obvious who executed 911 were not friends of Palestine and wanted a pretext to take over Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya. Syria, and ultimately Iran.

911 good for Israel - Benjamin Nutinyahoo


Here is Welsey Clark admiting how 911 was used as a pretext for invasion.


edit on 30-11-2012 by Shadow Herder because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 08:34 AM
link   
Here's my 2 cents. If you subscribe to the conspiracy theory version, the public has to continue speaking up loud and adamantly, or the whole issue will eventually get swept under the rug and in 20-30 years noone will care. And so the government gets away with pulling the wool over our eyes yet again. If you subscribe to the official story, you can simply sit back and laugh that people continue to bring the issue up years later.



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 09:25 AM
link   
Thousands of people have died in the US and abroad as a direct result of 9-11. The Patriot Act, NDAA and countless assults on Human Rights and the US Costitution have been justified as a direct result of 9-11. There's no way to "dismiss" this as a difference of opinion.

100's of experts, engineers and rescue worker's have claimed it is impossible for 3 buildings to collapse as a result of being hit by airplanes and fire...building 7 wasn't even hit.....it defies logic. There are mounds of evidence to suggest this was an "inside" job, that is to overwelming ....it just can't be ignored.



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 09:36 AM
link   


I personally believe the official story, I have my evidence as to why I believe it to be true
reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin
 


So why then did U175 and AA11 cross paths at almost the exact same height, to the best of the knowledge of the ATC and data at their disposal, and do so right over the former Stewart Air Force base?
edit on 30/11/12 by Morg234 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 09:38 AM
link   
I don't have to convince anyone of anything.
Just show them the videos of WTC towers 1, 2 and 7 falling at free fall speed and remind them that it was jet fuel fires that caused it.
They can make up their own mind simply from that.

I will not be silent about what happened on 9/11 since G W Bush declared we live in a "post 9/11 world" and our entire foreign and domestic policies have been changed predicated on that event.
Don't change my world and expect me to believe some half-baked farce of an investigation that contradicts itself and the laws on physics in more ways than bankers know how to steal money.
We were attacked because "they hate our freedoms"
I guess we needn't worry since we no longer have any left.


THANK GOD WE"RE SAFE NOW!!



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 09:53 AM
link   
Wow, the last few post are a good example of how to steer and perpetuate the stupid arguments. Dont argue about collapses or planes. Argue about who planned it, why Israelis shadowed and or posed as Hijackers controlled the elements off the FAA etc.

Go after the executors and planners of 911 stop talking about the after effects.



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 09:55 AM
link   
reply to post by Shadow Herder
 
I heard that the Israelis are behind the fluoride in my toothpaste too.




posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 09:58 AM
link   

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by Shadow Herder
 
I heard that the Israelis are behind the fluoride in my toothpaste too.

Stupid comment.

There are 3 more parts



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 10:00 AM
link   

Next Door to Mohammed Atta - Israeli agents were living in Florida and tailing the future death pilots – until their cover was blown.
www.darkpolitricks.com...



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 10:06 AM
link   
reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin
 



Let’s Agree to Put an End to the Petty 9/11 Argument’s



No...


A huge entertainment value would disappear, as the forum and freaks who troll that one are priceless.





posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 10:08 AM
link   
reply to post by Shadow Herder
 




Stupid comment.

Yep.
All the smart ones think that it is a valuable service 'proving' to everyone that the Israeli's made 911 happen. It isn't a waste of time....

Just ask the conspiracy theorists that spent the last 49 years of their lives 'proving' who killed JFK.
edit on 30-11-2012 by butcherguy because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 01:10 PM
link   

Originally posted by ALF88

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
I personally believe the official story,...


Let me quickly think about it .............. no, rejected.


We will get on your nerves until the criminals, who are responsible, are found and prosecuted. Topic is too important, to dismiss it. Sorry.

Why is it almost always believers of the official conspiracy theory who make suggestions like that?

Is that your new method of trying to silence the critics?


edit on 30-11-2012 by ALF88 because: (no reason given)

more like delaying tactics IMO

"the Purpose of Argument, is to alter the Nature of Truth"

the system enables the believers of the OS the double comfort of
living in delusion whether out of ignorance or fear
in the present.

and the ability to say "meh, old news, that was 50 years ago, who cares nowadays" in the future.
while believing the latest version of the OS
edit on 30-11-2012 by DerepentLEstranger because: dont know if mentioning koolaid drinking might get me in trouble sooo....



posted on Nov, 30 2012 @ 01:54 PM
link   

Originally posted by Shadow Herder
Wow, the last few post are a good example of how to steer and perpetuate the stupid arguments. Dont argue about collapses or planes. Argue about who planned it, why Israelis shadowed and or posed as Hijackers controlled the elements off the FAA etc.

Go after the executors and planners of 911 stop talking about the after effects.


I can prove the buildings collapsed.
Can you prove who planned or carried it out?
People respond to different lines of reasoning -
We should cover them all so everyone can at least be exposed to alternative explanations.
On the same side here, why the nitpicking?



new topics
 
9
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join