Three days Since Sandy and New Yorkers are...dumpster diving for food?

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

I have to agree with you Char-Lee, cancelling the race could put some businesses out of business. A lot of people have supply orders that can't be cancelled, this is nothing for a big business but can be devistating for a small one who planned for it.

I still think the race should be cancelled though. If I took risks in my businesses over and above what I could afford and banked my future on one event, I would understand where I messed up. There are too many risktakers in this country, willing to put everything on line for one time. Businesses go under for that all the time, it could have made them a lot of money also. A conservative business would not put more than they could afford into this event, they will survive. Maybe people will have to learn not to count their chickens before they hatch.

What about all the people who have jobs concerned with the race? All the world runs on one thing now...Money!

I can only imagine the impact that the pre-storm warnings plus the storm had on the economy of New Yorkers.

I have refrained commenting on the people of NYC complaining, only because I didn't want to sound heartless, or uncaring. Having said that, I think most of them need to stop complaining! It's been 4 days since the hurricane! I don't know what they expect, here in NOLA there were people still on their roofs 3 days later!! It was still hurricane season they were told to prepare, they chose not to, maybe they didn't have the extra funds to do so but, they were told to expect catastrophe!

I didn't stay for Katrina I went to Alabama, and was stuck there for 4 months waiting for them to deliver my poisonous FEMA trailer, that didn't happen until about a month after I came home, we came home the day after Christmas, didn't get the trailer until the end of January or early February, in the meantime my husband and two kids slept on a blowup mattress in one room, the only room that was clear enough to put them in!!

I realize people are hungry they have no electricity and are getting annoyed, but to be demanding someone be there right now, is just over the top for me.

Isaac this year I had neighbors without power for over a week, almost two weeks!!! The grocery stores did finally open a few days later but they didn't even have electricity. So you couldn't buy anything that needed refrigeration! No bread, no main staples..... But NO ONE STARVED Gas stations didn't have gas, my hubby ran out of gas driving around looking for gas!!

Anyway I do feel bad for the people who lost everything, I know what they are going through, but help takes time.

Originally posted by WhoDat09
I have refrained commenting on the people of NYC complaining, only because I didn't want to sound heartless, or uncaring. Having said that, I think most of them need to stop complaining! It's been 4 days since the hurricane! I don't know what they expect, here in NOLA there were people still on their roofs 3 days later!! It was still hurricane season they were told to prepare, they chose not to, maybe they didn't have the extra funds to do so but, they were told to expect catastrophe!

I didn't stay for Katrina I went to Alabama, and was stuck there for 4 months waiting for them to deliver my poisonous FEMA trailer, that didn't happen until about a month after I came home, we came home the day after Christmas, didn't get the trailer until the end of January or early February, in the meantime my husband and two kids slept on a blowup mattress in one room, the only room that was clear enough to put them in!!

I realize people are hungry they have no electricity and are getting annoyed, but to be demanding someone be there right now, is just over the top for me.

Isaac this year I had neighbors without power for over a week, almost two weeks!!! The grocery stores did finally open a few days later but they didn't even have electricity. So you couldn't buy anything that needed refrigeration! No bread, no main staples..... But NO ONE STARVED Gas stations didn't have gas, my hubby ran out of gas driving around looking for gas!!

Anyway I do feel bad for the people who lost everything, I know what they are going through, but help takes time.

After our tsunami we could not even reach downtown where the stores are for days.

Every single person who prepares adequately or more, takes the burden for themselves and their family and if they have more then enough for someone else from all of society. leaving the help for those that need it for real and the help will not have to wade through the ones who were not really desperate.

We need to all get responsible and do at least the minimum.
www.ready.gov...

reply to post by Char-Lee

Because this is what is happening right now. Look at the picture of the generators being lined up to power the media tent. They even have backups. meanwhile, the power is still out on Staten Island. This can only mean that the MONEY is already committed and nothing stops the MONEY. A storm can decimate a thousand miles of coastline, but not even that can be allowed to interfere with the MONEY.

commonsensewonder.blogspot.com...

reply to post by Char-Lee


I don't live in NY. I don't know how it is there. I see the police stopping cars from coming in the city if they don't have at least three people in the car. I can't see many thousands of people going to a race when there is stuff going on like that. This is a disaster, it is not just a small inconvenience. If California got devistated by quakes would you want the police tied up somewhere where there was a marathon, or would you want them around checking if crimes were being committed? I do not live there, it is the job of the governor of the state to do what he sees fit. He is the elected official in charge. All the people that are hurting have friends who are also voters, this could be a political nightmare for all the elected officials in that state. If I was in charge, the race would already have been cancelled.

Originally posted by kdog1982
Actually there is no one that I know that is laughing at the situation.
A learning experience,yes,but a tragedy none the less.

You've got that right! I've been without power from Monday until 2 hours ago, and there are some heartwrenching situations going on around my area. However, in my town on one street alone, two liquor stores and two convenience stores got robbed on Tuesday night because there was no power which created the opportunity for certain types of individuals to take full advantage of the situation. I'm sure this is typical anywhere and anytime the "opportunity" might present itself!

reply to post by elrem48

Maybe New York voters won't be so anti-gun after this fiasco.

Originally posted by Stormdancer777

Originally posted by milominderbinder

Originally posted by hanyak69

Originally posted by Wheelindiehl
reply to post by ApolloBloodline

 

There's no F-ing wilderness around there, take a look at a map online, NYC IS HUGE, it takes hours just to DRIVE through it...w/o traffic...there are no unpopulated areas within probably 2-3 days of walking. I'm sure they didn't think the power would be off this long, or that everything would still be flooded, to take a gamble at a 2 day hike to MAYBE find this alleged wilderness you speak of.

Central park has pigeons and squirrels. You could make dumplins.

You can't eat the squirrels though. The rat population is so huge in New York that you risk all kinds of diseases from ticks and fleas that could live on both rats and squirrels. It's not like eating a squirrel elsewhere in America. Pigeon sounds tasty though.

Really you can't eat NY squirrels?

Well...I guess I don't know from first hand experience...LOL. But I don't think I would unless I was a whole lot more desperate than only 3 days without food.

Squirrels and rats are both omnivorous scavenging rodents and both are eating from the same dumpsters and left-overs all over New York. Similarly, ground squirrels and prairie dogs are a subfamily of squiridae and it's a well known fact that prairie dogs (for sure) carry bubonic plague just like rats do...or more accurately, the FLEAS on both prairie dogs and rats carry bubonic plague. Pretty much every year there are a handful of cases in the upland plains states (like Colorado) of somebody contracting bubonic plague from a prairie dog. Not that big of a deal normally...penicillin takes out bubonic plague nicely. However...in this sort of a situation you could be as out of luck as a medieval peasant was. And that doesn't even take into account the more "normal" diseases like rabies. Sure...a squirrel could theoretically contract rabies or some other horrid disease in MN too...but I would think that close contact and similar feeding patters with NYC's rat population would make them a pretty dicey choice of dining options.

I'm not a biologist or a park ranger or anything...but I wouldn't chance it. I'd much rather be real hungry than be real hungry with the Black Death while I waited for the lights to go back on.

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

I don't live in NY. I don't know how it is there. I see the police stopping cars from coming in the city if they don't have at least three people in the car. I can't see many thousands of people going to a race when there is stuff going on like that. This is a disaster, it is not just a small inconvenience. If California got devistated by quakes would you want the police tied up somewhere where there was a marathon, or would you want them around checking if crimes were being committed? I do not live there, it is the job of the governor of the state to do what he sees fit. He is the elected official in charge. All the people that are hurting have friends who are also voters, this could be a political nightmare for all the elected officials in that state. If I was in charge, the race would already have been cancelled.

Well I know I wouldn't want to go it will be hell for the runners and the family and friends.

I know that when our Port canceled the harbor annual art show, because the new commissioner "forgot to arrange it", my family had to lay off one worker and my husband had to skip a payment because we did not get enough to cover all the extra stuff ordered for the show which normally brings a ton of out of town people.

It totally devastated the town who had planned on the normal annual business and so spent in preparation for it. Many temporary jobs associated with the show were lost. the artists who usually came to sell and show were all prepared and it was really sad.


Looks like many will not go. They feel to guilty as they know how people are feeling about it.


47,000 people attend the marathon and it cannot be rearranged or postponed at this point.

It goes without saying that one of the major reasons the city and the NYRR never really considered canceling it (and if they did, they never said so publicly) is because it brings an estimated $340 million in economic impact to the city every year. Even if it's half that this year, it will definitely help keep the local economic engines churning. The major companies, hotel chains and airlines will survive the downturn from the storm, but small businesses, the independently employed and other members of the working class will be hit hard. If you're heading to New York for the marathon, consider doing some holiday shopping while you're there.

espn.go.com...

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

Because this is what is happening right now. Look at the picture of the generators being lined up to power the media tent. They even have backups. meanwhile, the power is still out on Staten Island. This can only mean that the MONEY is already committed and nothing stops the MONEY. A storm can decimate a thousand miles of coastline, but not even that can be allowed to interfere with the MONEY.

commonsensewonder.blogspot.com...

Yes you are clearly right and long term always becomes more important then the temporary picture especially in government decision making.

I am sure glad I don't have to decide.
On the one hand people think you are heartless, in the big picture you must think of the whole of the cities good and future and the economic hardship of a large city is also a burden to the already burdened taxpayer everywhere.

Thinking of leadership and being the ONE who decides...like rationing, if you ration something everyone is angry, if you don't everyone runs out due to greed of some.

i would never want to be a leader.

Originally posted by WhoDat09
I have refrained commenting on the people of NYC complaining, only because I didn't want to sound heartless, or uncaring. Having said that, I think most of them need to stop complaining! It's been 4 days since the hurricane! I don't know what they expect, here in NOLA there were people still on their roofs 3 days later!! It was still hurricane season they were told to prepare, they chose not to, maybe they didn't have the extra funds to do so but, they were told to expect catastrophe!

I didn't stay for Katrina I went to Alabama, and was stuck there for 4 months waiting for them to deliver my poisonous FEMA trailer, that didn't happen until about a month after I came home, we came home the day after Christmas, didn't get the trailer until the end of January or early February, in the meantime my husband and two kids slept on a blowup mattress in one room, the only room that was clear enough to put them in!!

I realize people are hungry they have no electricity and are getting annoyed, but to be demanding someone be there right now, is just over the top for me.

Isaac this year I had neighbors without power for over a week, almost two weeks!!! The grocery stores did finally open a few days later but they didn't even have electricity. So you couldn't buy anything that needed refrigeration! No bread, no main staples..... But NO ONE STARVED Gas stations didn't have gas, my hubby ran out of gas driving around looking for gas!!

Anyway I do feel bad for the people who lost everything, I know what they are going through, but help takes time.

Actually there are many people in communities that are devastated by flooding and wind damage which resulted in loss of their homes and also some deaths. Staten Island was very hard hit and was not getting help very quickly which in my "calm, comfortable" mind is totally understandable because of the magnitude of destruction...but in my "frenzied, ravaged, helpless" mind, as if I was one who has lost their home and perhaps loved ones I can also imagine the frustration felt by all who have the sad experience of this scenario. We are all human with many of the same tendencies when backed against a wall!

Originally posted by Stormdancer777

Originally posted by milominderbinder

Originally posted by hanyak69

Originally posted by Wheelindiehl
reply to post by ApolloBloodline

 

There's no F-ing wilderness around there, take a look at a map online, NYC IS HUGE, it takes hours just to DRIVE through it...w/o traffic...there are no unpopulated areas within probably 2-3 days of walking. I'm sure they didn't think the power would be off this long, or that everything would still be flooded, to take a gamble at a 2 day hike to MAYBE find this alleged wilderness you speak of.

Central park has pigeons and squirrels. You could make dumplins.

You can't eat the squirrels though. The rat population is so huge in New York that you risk all kinds of diseases from ticks and fleas that could live on both rats and squirrels. It's not like eating a squirrel elsewhere in America. Pigeon sounds tasty though.

Really you can't eat NY squirrels?

Oh...one more thing to take into account too is not just the presence of rats...but the sheer magnitude of that presence in NYC. The best ballpark pre-flood estimates is that NYC was home to somewhere between 28 to 32 MILLION rats. I'm guessing the odds that the two rodent species would bump into one another and transmit parasites and diseases across species would be just about a 100%.

Again...not a biologist...I'm just saying I would use reasonable deduction, a little common-sense, and err to the side of caution and pretty much treat a squirrel just as I would a rat in NYC if I was stuck there right now.

I have just heard the New York Marathon will be cancelled!

nbcsports.msnbc.com...

People need to learn humility sometimes. Be happy these people are diving in dumpsters instead of robbing other people. I actually respect these people for their honesty and morals, I know some people who would take a gun and rob someone's food. Some of these people are well to do in society.

reply to post by rickymouse


There is no one to rob. No one has food, it's been three days man!

Honesty and morals go out the window when your kids are starving. Period.

Originally posted by Char-Lee

Originally posted by Wheelindiehl
reply to post by ApolloBloodline

 

There's no F-ing wilderness around there, take a look at a map online, NYC IS HUGE, it takes hours just to DRIVE through it...w/o traffic...there are no unpopulated areas within probably 2-3 days of walking. I'm sure they didn't think the power would be off this long, or that everything would still be flooded, to take a gamble at a 2 day hike to MAYBE find this alleged wilderness you speak of.

there are actually laws also. we don't get to poach on off season just because of a flood. They see you marching around shooting or killing and gutting something in the city I doubt they will pat you on the back. In New orleans they took the guns away.

Agreed. That's a totally ignorant statement from someone who has never lived in a city. I grew up in BFE Wisconsin...but I also lived in LA and Chicago. There's no "just walking out of town" in a situation like this. Not to say it's impossible...obviously if you put one foot in front of the other for a long enough period of time you will EVENTUALLY reach the end of the city...but it's NOT the long walk that's the hard part.

It's what you might encounter along the way. How many people were electrocuted thus far because they stepped in a puddle that had current flowing through it from a downed power line that they couldn't even see? How much raw sewage is floating in that water again? Better not get a little scratch on your leg while wading...blood poisoning can be a real b^tch. Not to mention the who-knows-how-many desperate people you will encounter along the way. Even once you GET out of town...what then? Remember Katrina? The first 15-20 miles around New Orleans looked like the pictures you see of Hutu refugees fleeing the Tutsi's. Tents, tarps, trash, and desperate people EVERYWHERE.

No problem hiking out if absolutely necessary. But my recommendation would be to make sure you have a nice solid group of able bodied individuals who you can ABSOLUTELY TRUST to go with you. If that's not possible...then be sure to rest up and stock up on as much caffeine, 5-hr energy bottles, and advil as you can (loot them if you must) before leaving...because you DO NOT want to have to stop to sleep if you are by yourself once you are out of your "home turf" until you are in an area which is functioning "normally" again.

My guess is whoever posted that "advice" doesn't really understand how massive a real city really is.

Originally posted by elrem48
I have just heard the New York Marathon will be cancelled!

nbcsports.msnbc.com...

Good. About freakin time. Thanks for the update. Now I can relax. That would have been some sight watching them run through neighborhoods jumping over debris as people without food and water line the sidewalks, shaking their fists.

I wouldn't know whether to cry or laugh.

reply to post by elrem48


Do you know how many people died in Katrina? I knew people who died in Katrina. 1,833 died in Katrina, my cousin was almost among them, he was trapped in his house for 2 days in the attic, when he finally got out he was swimming for help and cut his leg very badly on something in the water, his leg was infected and he nearly died.

I'm not saying that the people on TV don't need help, I'm saying it's been 4 days!!!

4 DAYS..... they will get the help they need, it will come and they will be OK ... they will rebuild and live to see another day. New Orleans survived, we rebuilt and are STILL rebuilding, it doesn't happen overnight, that's all I'm saying. I also said I understand their frustration, they think no one is listening, people hear them, it just takes time.

Help takes time!!

Originally posted by Char-Lee

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

Because this is what is happening right now. Look at the picture of the generators being lined up to power the media tent. They even have backups. meanwhile, the power is still out on Staten Island. This can only mean that the MONEY is already committed and nothing stops the MONEY. A storm can decimate a thousand miles of coastline, but not even that can be allowed to interfere with the MONEY.

commonsensewonder.blogspot.com...

Yes you are clearly right and long term always becomes more important then the temporary picture especially in government decision making.

Not really. Those generators are fine and great for small power needs...but people aren't in trouble because they need to juice up their ipods. They are in trouble because THE GRID IS DOWN, and their fridge, heat, and lights don't work. The generators in those pictures cannot possibly solve (or even make a dent) in those problems. In fact, those two aren't powerful enough to even provide juice to a SINGLE highrise...EVEN IF you had the technical skill to sever the building from the grid and patch the generators in instead.

Originally posted by Thunderheart
reply to post by elrem48

 

Maybe New York voters won't be so anti-gun after this fiasco.

Why? How many bullets does it normally take to repair an electrical grid?

Originally posted by elrem48

Originally posted by kdog1982
Actually there is no one that I know that is laughing at the situation.
A learning experience,yes,but a tragedy none the less.

You've got that right! I've been without power from Monday until 2 hours ago, and there are some heartwrenching situations going on around my area. However, in my town on one street alone, two liquor stores and two convenience stores got robbed on Tuesday night because there was no power which created the opportunity for certain types of individuals to take full advantage of the situation. I'm sure this is typical anywhere and anytime the "opportunity" might present itself!

Yeah...but honestly...so what? That's what insurance is for...those business owners aren't out any more or less than what they were before and their insurance company will jerk them around just the same.

Admittedly, it's harder to "excuse" robbing a liquor store, but remember...vodka is not only a beverage...it's a disinfectant and antiseptic too and will even work like lighter fluid to start a charcoal grill in a pinch. As for the convenience store? Screw it. Anybody on planet earth that says they wouldn't take some desperately needed supplies from an unstaffed convenience store to feed or medicate their children or loved ones in a disaster is either lying or they are a terrible, terrible parent. I don't really count that as "stealing" so much as "surviving".