Three days Since Sandy and New Yorkers are...dumpster diving for food?

Originally posted by intrptr

Originally posted by elrem48
I have just heard the New York Marathon will be cancelled!

nbcsports.msnbc.com...

Good. About freakin time. Thanks for the update. Now I can relax. That would have been some sight watching them run through neighborhoods jumping over debris as people without food and water line the sidewalks, shaking their fists.

I wouldn't know whether to cry or laugh.

All my life i have heard New Yorkers described as resilient, carry on, tough and never give up types. they are supposed to be the sturdiest of Americans. if this is so i hate to see what the response is when the big quake comes to our west coast area.

“The marathon has been an integral part of New York City’s life for 40 years and is an event tens of thousands of New Yorkers participate in and millions more watch. While holding the race would not require diverting resources from the recovery effort, it is clear that it has become the source of controversy and division The marathon has always brought our city together and inspired us with stories of courage and determination. We would not want a cloud to hang over the race or its participants, and so we have decided to cancel it.

news.blogs.cnn.com...

Originally posted by elrem48

Originally posted by WhoDat09
I have refrained commenting on the people of NYC complaining, only because I didn't want to sound heartless, or uncaring. Having said that, I think most of them need to stop complaining! It's been 4 days since the hurricane! I don't know what they expect, here in NOLA there were people still on their roofs 3 days later!! It was still hurricane season they were told to prepare, they chose not to, maybe they didn't have the extra funds to do so but, they were told to expect catastrophe!

I didn't stay for Katrina I went to Alabama, and was stuck there for 4 months waiting for them to deliver my poisonous FEMA trailer, that didn't happen until about a month after I came home, we came home the day after Christmas, didn't get the trailer until the end of January or early February, in the meantime my husband and two kids slept on a blowup mattress in one room, the only room that was clear enough to put them in!!

I realize people are hungry they have no electricity and are getting annoyed, but to be demanding someone be there right now, is just over the top for me.

Isaac this year I had neighbors without power for over a week, almost two weeks!!! The grocery stores did finally open a few days later but they didn't even have electricity. So you couldn't buy anything that needed refrigeration! No bread, no main staples..... But NO ONE STARVED Gas stations didn't have gas, my hubby ran out of gas driving around looking for gas!!

Anyway I do feel bad for the people who lost everything, I know what they are going through, but help takes time.

Actually there are many people in communities that are devastated by flooding and wind damage which resulted in loss of their homes and also some deaths. Staten Island was very hard hit and was not getting help very quickly which in my "calm, comfortable" mind is totally understandable because of the magnitude of destruction...but in my "frenzied, ravaged, helpless" mind, as if I was one who has lost their home and perhaps loved ones I can also imagine the frustration felt by all who have the sad experience of this scenario. We are all human with many of the same tendencies when backed against a wall!

Well this is good news.

Earlier Friday, Con Edison said it restored electrical service to 84,000 New York City’s Staten Island customers out of the 139,000-plus customers affected.

news.blogs.cnn.com...

Originally posted by intrptr

Originally posted by elrem48
I have just heard the New York Marathon will be cancelled!

nbcsports.msnbc.com...

Good. About freakin time. Thanks for the update. Now I can relax. That would have been some sight watching them run through neighborhoods jumping over debris as people without food and water line the sidewalks, shaking their fists.

I wouldn't know whether to cry or laugh.

Actually it makes for a powerful picture, the continuation of the runners and the strength of New Yorkers, would bring tears seeing them in the struggle that represents the pain of all. It would have brought out that WE CAN spirit and the whole country would have been uplifted.

Originally posted by milominderbinder

Originally posted by Char-Lee

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

Because this is what is happening right now. Look at the picture of the generators being lined up to power the media tent. They even have backups. meanwhile, the power is still out on Staten Island. This can only mean that the MONEY is already committed and nothing stops the MONEY. A storm can decimate a thousand miles of coastline, but not even that can be allowed to interfere with the MONEY.

commonsensewonder.blogspot.com...

Yes you are clearly right and long term always becomes more important then the temporary picture especially in government decision making.

Not really. Those generators are fine and great for small power needs...but people aren't in trouble because they need to juice up their ipods. They are in trouble because THE GRID IS DOWN, and their fridge, heat, and lights don't work. The generators in those pictures cannot possibly solve (or even make a dent) in those problems. In fact, those two aren't powerful enough to even provide juice to a SINGLE highrise...EVEN IF you had the technical skill to sever the building from the grid and patch the generators in instead.

From the link...

The three diesel-powered generators crank out 800 kilowatts — enough to power 400 homes in ravaged areas like Staten Island, the Rockaways and downtown.Manhattan.
---
As of Friday morning, five generators sat outside of the park along with electrical stations and transformers.
In addition to the generators, a food services truck dropped off hundreds of cases of water, sparking angered responses from hurricane victims.

Oh they would find a use for them. There are gas stations that have fuel but no power to pump it. Where were they hiding those anyway? Hidden resources. Now they can distribute them, the marathon is Kaput.

reply to post by Char-Lee

Actually it makes for a powerful picture, the continuation of the runners and the strength of New Yorkers, would bring tears seeing them in the struggle that represents the pain of all. It would have brought out that WE CAN spirit and the whole country would have been uplifted.

Or we would have recoiled at the sight of runners being handed water bottles by attendants and then knocked down by thirsty residents around the next corner and robbed for the precious liquid. I think they made a wise decision. That could have been a fiasco. People don't need "uplifting", they need their services restored, not the wealthy rubbing their noses in a "marathon".

Originally posted by Thunderheart
reply to post by elrem48

 

Maybe New York voters won't be so anti-gun after this fiasco.

Not sure what guns would have helped?

The deaths are 96 but that include a huge area and none from violence I think.

The latest death to be reported comes from New Jersey, where 13 fatalities have now been reported.

The count also includes 48 in New York state; 13 in Pennsylvania; 10 in Maryland; four in Connecticut; five in West Virginia; two in Virginia; one in North Carolina; and one on the HMS Bounty.

Outside deaths

Deaths from Sandy also have been reported in Canada (two) and the Caribbean (67),

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

Actually it makes for a powerful picture, the continuation of the runners and the strength of New Yorkers, would bring tears seeing them in the struggle that represents the pain of all. It would have brought out that WE CAN spirit and the whole country would have been uplifted.

Or we would have recoiled at the sight of runners being handed water bottles by attendants and then knocked down by thirsty residents around the next corner and robbed for the precious liquid. I think they made a wise decision. That could have been a fiasco. People don't need "uplifting", they need their services restored, not the wealthy rubbing their noses in a "marathon".

Earlier Friday, Con Edison said it restored electrical service to 84,000 New York City’s Staten Island customers out of the 139,000-plus customers affected

Maybe most problems would have been dealt with by then. But if you are a New Yorker the response would be better predicted by you then myself.

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

Actually it makes for a powerful picture, the continuation of the runners and the strength of New Yorkers, would bring tears seeing them in the struggle that represents the pain of all. It would have brought out that WE CAN spirit and the whole country would have been uplifted.

Or we would have recoiled at the sight of runners being handed water bottles by attendants and then knocked down by thirsty residents around the next corner and robbed for the precious liquid. I think they made a wise decision. That could have been a fiasco. People don't need "uplifting", they need their services restored, not the wealthy rubbing their noses in a "marathon".

I don't think many marathon runners or goers are wealthy. But I do no most services provided are not by the Hilton and fancy restaurants but small business.

reply to post by Char-Lee


In the case where your family got stressed and lost money, your perception is right on. That official should have lost his job. This is different, there is a major disaster there that effects the whole area. Postponing it even a week would be better. I see both sides of the situation but I would cancel it because safety of the residents is more important than economics. If I was in charge I would also pull out those roadblocks that are stressing everyone over there also. How can delaying traffic save fuel? Waiting in a car with it running for an hour uses fuel. Where do they find these people with crazy ideas? This is the first time I have ever disagreed with you Char.

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

In the case where your family got stressed and lost money, your perception is right on. That official should have lost his job. This is different, there is a major disaster there that effects the whole area. Postponing it even a week would be better. I see both sides of the situation but I would cancel it because safety of the residents is more important than economics. If I was in charge I would also pull out those roadblocks that are stressing everyone over there also. How can delaying traffic save fuel? Waiting in a car with it running for an hour uses fuel. Where do they find these people with crazy ideas? This is the first time I have ever disagreed with you Char.

well we all disagree sometimes. Anyway they canceled. You can't postpone something like this that you have to apply and be accepted for and everyone make reservations it is all very complicated, my daughter is a long distance runner by profession.

The runners determination the feel of spirit all make your heart raise and brings tears as they cross the line.
I feel like they missed out on a world opportunity, to look and feel strong and be the admiration of the world. it would have poured in the aid, these things are very special to people.

I so agree on the gas situation!

Originally posted by WhoDat09
reply to post by elrem48

 

Do you know how many people died in Katrina? I knew people who died in Katrina. 1,833 died in Katrina, my cousin was almost among them, he was trapped in his house for 2 days in the attic, when he finally got out he was swimming for help and cut his leg very badly on something in the water, his leg was infected and he nearly died.

I'm not saying that the people on TV don't need help, I'm saying it's been 4 days!!!

4 DAYS..... they will get the help they need, it will come and they will be OK ... they will rebuild and live to see another day. New Orleans survived, we rebuilt and are STILL rebuilding, it doesn't happen overnight, that's all I'm saying. I also said I understand their frustration, they think no one is listening, people hear them, it just takes time.

Help takes time!!

I think you misunderstood me...I totally agree with you as my area was more fortunate than many surrounding us. Never once did I complain, loss of power is nothing compared to loss of home and life! What I'm trying to convey is that EVERYONE feels that despair when the "worst of the worst" happens to them...that cannot be measured by who, what when and where...it's the same FEELING for everyone.

Originally posted by intrptr

Originally posted by milominderbinder

Originally posted by Char-Lee

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by Char-Lee

 

Because this is what is happening right now. Look at the picture of the generators being lined up to power the media tent. They even have backups. meanwhile, the power is still out on Staten Island. This can only mean that the MONEY is already committed and nothing stops the MONEY. A storm can decimate a thousand miles of coastline, but not even that can be allowed to interfere with the MONEY.

commonsensewonder.blogspot.com...

Yes you are clearly right and long term always becomes more important then the temporary picture especially in government decision making.

Not really. Those generators are fine and great for small power needs...but people aren't in trouble because they need to juice up their ipods. They are in trouble because THE GRID IS DOWN, and their fridge, heat, and lights don't work. The generators in those pictures cannot possibly solve (or even make a dent) in those problems. In fact, those two aren't powerful enough to even provide juice to a SINGLE highrise...EVEN IF you had the technical skill to sever the building from the grid and patch the generators in instead.

From the link...

The three diesel-powered generators crank out 800 kilowatts — enough to power 400 homes in ravaged areas like Staten Island, the Rockaways and downtown.Manhattan.
---
As of Friday morning, five generators sat outside of the park along with electrical stations and transformers.
In addition to the generators, a food services truck dropped off hundreds of cases of water, sparking angered responses from hurricane victims.

Oh they would find a use for them. There are gas stations that have fuel but no power to pump it. Where were they hiding those anyway? Hidden resources. Now they can distribute them, the marathon is Kaput.

Oh...I totally agree that there are FAR better uses than screwing around w/ the Marathon. I'm just saying that tiny little generators like that aren't going to "fix" it. Remember...those things run diesel. LOTS AND LOTS of diesel. So using it to pump gas is a good idea...but sooner or later (probably sooner) you are going to have to fill it with diesel again...which will probably mean hooking it back up to the trailer and dragging to the outskirts somewhere. Not all gas stations have diesel...especially in highly populated metro areas.

Also...I'll admit that those units put out a little more juice that I thought they would (I was thinking about 500kw)...but in general a 100 unit-high rise in NJ is considered to have a power envelope of about 700kw...at least according to the NJ solar projects. I'm really not sure how they figure 800 households. Unless they are taking into account rationing that people would be instructed to have no more than one light bulb lit and their fridge or some such thing. Then I'm sure you could stretch it that far.

In reality...I would say the highest and best use for those things would be to A) power tools, equipment, and pumps to repair the city, drain water, etc. and let people juice up their phones and tablets if they make their way down there. Communication is important too and people gotta have some of their more useful gadgets.

...at least that's the way it looks out here in my cozy armchair in Wisconsin....so take it for what it's worth. I'm certainly not on the ground and don't profess to necessarily know better than those who are living it right now.

Originally posted by Thunderheart

Originally posted by PaperbackWriter
The Red Cross has a DONATE button on my Yahoo. They collect billions of dollars during and after every disaster. So can any poster list the current Red Cross sites that are set up to hand out food, water and blankets? Must not be too well known where they RC is or people wouldn't be Dumpster Diving already.

This is the problem with most of society today, dependent on the RC or big daddy government to come and "save" them.
Maybe after this they will be a little more self sufficient.
This is what happened in New Orleans after Katrina, all the governments babies were left "stranded' waiting on big daddy to come and save them.

edit on 1-11-2012 by Thunderheart because: to add the katrina bit.

I agree with you on many points. Katrina should have been one huge fat lesson to everyone in this country. We have to take care of ourselves. However, I cannot rush to judge people based on what little info I have. And our very old ones who do not get out much and rely on others, may be the ones in most dire need.

I grew up on the rez, where electricity was a luxury in our family. We had it on for 3 months of the winter, and after that dad shut it down so we could pay the bill off the rest of the year. We learned how to live without power, and many people still do. You just learn how to survive, keep warm, or cool. If my power went out right now, I would be okay and wouldn't go stir crazy the way most do.

Originally posted by WhoDat09
reply to post by elrem48

 

Do you know how many people died in Katrina? I knew people who died in Katrina. 1,833 died in Katrina, my cousin was almost among them, he was trapped in his house for 2 days in the attic, when he finally got out he was swimming for help and cut his leg very badly on something in the water, his leg was infected and he nearly died.

I'm not saying that the people on TV don't need help, I'm saying it's been 4 days!!!

4 DAYS..... they will get the help they need, it will come and they will be OK ... they will rebuild and live to see another day. New Orleans survived, we rebuilt and are STILL rebuilding, it doesn't happen overnight, that's all I'm saying. I also said I understand their frustration, they think no one is listening, people hear them, it just takes time.

Help takes time!!

Yes,help takes time.
Especially with such a wide area and with so many power lines ,houses and people.

reply to post by intrptr

Oh they would find a use for them. There are gas stations that have fuel but no power to pump it. Where were they hiding those anyway? Hidden resources. Now they can distribute them, the marathon is Kaput.

That is the question I raise,so the is no power for the gas stations that still have gas,were are the generators for them?????

reply to post by Char-Lee

Maybe most problems would have been dealt with by then. But if you are a New Yorker the response would be better predicted by you then myself.

You got me there, I am not. I'm not even really doing anything about it either except typing on the internet. And thanks for the replies, i'm sorry if it seems like I am directing them at you, I am not. I just get incensed about injustice or corruption or war... steady now... deep breath. .

Wow, just heard on the weather channel, people are throwing eggs at the People trying to repair the power lines, saying they are not doing it fast enough! This is in Connecticut. Seriously, this is a big job, and they are out there working, and getting hit with eggs ? WOW

reply to post by Char-Lee

I don't think many marathon runners or goers are wealthy. But I do no most services provided are not by the Hilton and fancy restaurants but small business.

Well that is part of my problem. See I think that all the people waiting patiently and enduring all the slings and arrows are really going to be looked after then I got to see that big shiny generators and 100s of cases of water stashed by the media moguls and the city bureaucrats for some "fun in the park". They just break them out and line em up right in the middle of the war zone... thats when I started to crisp.

Then I think about NY in general and what other resources they have stashed for a rainy day, and oh by the way, what about all those big banksters in the city? Wheres their contribution, even in the slightest token of gratitude? After all they did get "bailed out" (pun intended) by the same people who's property is floating down Wall Street? Not one shred. Not one red penny. Pffft...

They are next on my list to be basted on the internet. Hey Banksters! You got Hundreds of Billions to float your boat. This is your city. Where the hell are you when the people need you to open your coffers for them?

Originally posted by amatrine
Wow, just heard on the weather channel, people are throwing eggs at the People trying to repair the power lines, saying they are not doing it fast enough! This is in Connecticut. Seriously, this is a big job, and they are out there working, and getting hit with eggs ? WOW

If I was those workers,I would just move on to the next job.