Three days Since Sandy and New Yorkers are...dumpster diving for food?

Originally posted by manykapao
you guys have to understand, most people in the areas affected were already poor. They couldn't afford in many cases to buy a week's worth of food, since they were like the rest of the world, poor and in debt. If you had an extra 50 bucks you would pay the phone bill or a utility or buy other things you and yours need since your kid needs electricity and school supplies. Maybe the elderly in your home need medicine. ect.

People think NY has an abundance of rich people. The ones that work there AND live there aren't. You pay what rent you can for a roach infested apartment you share with too many people.

It is not like you have a really nice car and like expensive vacations. Most people in NYC live pay check to paycheck. Some can't get by without aid, and others just can't get by.

You also have to take into account the size of an average apartment in the city. They are very small. You can't stock up more than what your kitchen can hold, and that is not much.

I see people being way to hard on NYers. You just don't know what it is like to live in a major metropolitan area.

Visit, maybe, live there, no idea. You don't have a month of food on hand because for one, it is really expensive. Try shopping in NY, look at the prices in grocery stores. Not like rural USA, I can tell you that,

and two, you don't have the space for it.

City life is daily shopping, eating out, and trying to save money for an ever increasing cost of life.


NYC poor is not like Alabama poor. You can't just visit your friends house and ask for some food. Your neighbor doesn't have it, and if he does, not allot.


It is easy to say they are deserving of this. But that makes you an apathetic jerk who knows nothing of city life. It is a hard knock life as is. Add the largest storm in US history, and you get this.

No one in a desert is ready for a flood.

edit on 2-11-2012 by manykapao because: (no reason given)

well the areas that LOOK most effected on the news are rich beach houses, i guess itcan be misleading as where we live the closer you are to the water the more $$ you have generally.

Originally posted by Thunderheart

Originally posted by FraternitasSaturni
Really REALLY hope there's no zombie apocalypse.

The "zombies" would be these dumpster divers coming to take your stockpile! headshots would definitely work on these guys.

"stockpiling" is a fool's errand. In a true PROLONGED SHTF scenario the most dangerous thing you could possibly do is have a whole lot of something everybody else wants or needs. I'm not talking about a couple of days or even a week or two, but over the course of months.

Remember. The #1 rule of all those zombie movies is that there are ALWAYS more zombies!! Thus, it is simply not possible to have enough bullets to ward them all off.

Believe it or not...the survival advantage would actually go these "dumpster divers" because they are more willing to adapt to their new conditions, can travel quickly, quietly, and lightly and don't have to try to defend items that everyone else will kill to obtain.

Now...is it a good idea to have a week or two of food laying around? You bet. Would I be dumpster diving after ONLY 3 days? No way...the risk of disease or illness would be greater than the payoff of eating some pretty nasty food.

My only point is that the "stockpiler" is a sitting duck in the long haul. Sure, if you have a mountain of food, water, and ammo in a defensible location you WILL WIN lots, and lots of times. The odds of charging and trying to take your supplies are NOT GOOD. But the odds don't matter unless you have 7 billion bullets and don't ever miss a single shot. And that's impossible.

The only exception being if your "stockpiles" were expertly cached and concealed all around in 10 or 20 mile radius so that you didn't have to defend them NOR carry them with you, but you always knew where you could find your emergency bullets, band-aids, and beans, and the liklihood of somebody else finding them was little to none.

However...short of having all of this prearranged in the middle of nowhere...I really don't see how it's possible either. There are too many people in a city and anything you hide WILL be found by someone else...it's just a question of when.

Just my thoughts on the matter.

Remember...the #1 survival advantage that humans have over other animals is our brain. Keeping a cool head, thinking creatively, and being able to negotiate will be much more valuable than having a storage unit full of food that everybody else wants.

Originally posted by hanyak69

Originally posted by Wheelindiehl
reply to post by ApolloBloodline

 

There's no F-ing wilderness around there, take a look at a map online, NYC IS HUGE, it takes hours just to DRIVE through it...w/o traffic...there are no unpopulated areas within probably 2-3 days of walking. I'm sure they didn't think the power would be off this long, or that everything would still be flooded, to take a gamble at a 2 day hike to MAYBE find this alleged wilderness you speak of.

Central park has pigeons and squirrels. You could make dumplins.

You can't eat the squirrels though. The rat population is so huge in New York that you risk all kinds of diseases from ticks and fleas that could live on both rats and squirrels. It's not like eating a squirrel elsewhere in America. Pigeon sounds tasty though.

Originally posted by Jakes51
Some folks are quite harsh, and my hope is they never have to endure what is going on in New York, Jersey, and other places rocked by the storm. They are doing what is needed to survive. Some have to dumpster dive, and I can see why? The cost of living in NYC is through the roof. Kind of difficult to put money aside to stock your prepper's stash, and then meet day-to-day expenses like rent, food, transportation, childcare, etc. People have got to start helping each other out, and looking after each other instead of judging them. Those people can be any of us, and it can happen at any time. Easy come easy go! I feel bad for them.

I wonder if any of the judgmental types would be willing to put the shoe on the other foot, and walk a mile in their shoes? They would not. As I have said on this site time and time again. Those who live in glass houses should not throw stones. Everybody is Billy Bad@@@ when BSing from behind their keyboards while in their comfortable leather recliners from momma's basement, but put any of them under the pressure that is taking place after one of these disasters? Lets just see how they handle it, and it wont be long until they are in the breadline, lining up to seek shelter and blanket, and foraging for the essentials to survive. Not everyone has thousands of dollars to spend on their panic room, pallets of dry goods and water, or a little patch of land to grow some fruits and vegetables. Everybody thinks it is so easy. Maybe for them, but not everyone else. Lets keep that mind before we judge others, and their actions. This situation is turning out to be like another Katrina, and what makes matters worse is this happened in Northeast and winter is about to begin. In other news, and yet another insult to injury.

East Coast may face new nor'easter while recovering from Superstorm Sandy

Another messy — and wintry — storm may cause post-Election Day problems for an already weather-weary East Coast, forecasters say.

But meteorologists add that it's six days out, so that's rather early to get too worried. The forecast could change before it hits late next week.

So, now maybe a nor'easter on top of what took place after this hurricane? If it hits? It should disrupt clean-up, and rescue efforts that will be taking place at the time of this storm. Also in the article cited above, forecasters are expecting high winds, snow in parts of New York and New England, heavy rainfall, and beach erosion. All I am saying is that we should take off the boxing gloves, and empathize with the plight of these people. It could happen to us, and anyone in our own families? Lets not relive Katrina if we can help it. On another note, economically, people are struggling more today than they were then, and I don't see people getting giddy about whipping out their checkbooks to send money to aide services or sending nonperishable items to the disaster area. Especially when so many are scrimping by to survive themselves. This is not a good situation for anyone!

edit on 2-11-2012 by Jakes51 because: (no reason given)

We always are in awe of the cheep prices when we travel and visit a city. Out wages are so low compared to the cities and we pay way more for gas too.

We are vegetarian so it is a little harder for us but we prepared. You could have a stash of Jerky it is very small and you can put it in a backpack with water purifying tablets and a few bottles of water...that should do and if you wrapped it all in another plastic bag ...generally free...you have prepped.

reply to post by elouina


One thing I have read about Romney and Mormons is they are prepared, he is no stranger to this,

Mitt Romney’s Faith Draws Attention To Mormon Food Storage
hereandnow.wbur.org...

The Mormon Food Plan

You know I may look into this.
www.thesurvivalistblog.net...

My own food storage is based on the Mormon plan. The Mormon plan for stockpiling consists primarily of four basic food items: wheat, sugar and or honey, powdered milk and salt. From these four basic ingredients, a wide variety of foods can be prepared.

The advantages of this plan is that these four food items are relatively inexpensive, readily available, storage is simple and the wheat, sugar and salt will store indefinitely under proper conditions. If you are as poor as I am but still want to prepare for the worst, then the Mormon food storage plan maybe you best option.

After you get the basic foods (wheat, sugar, powdered milk, and salt) in the needed proportions then it is a simple matter to add other foods as you get the extra funds. Pinto beans, mixed beans, rice, and split peas can be added with little expense and will add a little variety your diet.

Remember to date your beans, peas and rice and rotate into your everyday foods, most beans have a shelf life of only about two years, this way you always have fresh supplies on hand.

The poor are being left without help, whilst the rich are trying to set up a marathon. Its an absolute joke.

Originally posted by milominderbinder

Originally posted by hanyak69

Originally posted by Wheelindiehl
reply to post by ApolloBloodline

 

There's no F-ing wilderness around there, take a look at a map online, NYC IS HUGE, it takes hours just to DRIVE through it...w/o traffic...there are no unpopulated areas within probably 2-3 days of walking. I'm sure they didn't think the power would be off this long, or that everything would still be flooded, to take a gamble at a 2 day hike to MAYBE find this alleged wilderness you speak of.

Central park has pigeons and squirrels. You could make dumplins.

You can't eat the squirrels though. The rat population is so huge in New York that you risk all kinds of diseases from ticks and fleas that could live on both rats and squirrels. It's not like eating a squirrel elsewhere in America. Pigeon sounds tasty though.

Really you can't eat NY squirrels?

Originally posted by LeatherNLace
I doubt the people are actually starving after 3 days. However, I can easily see how they could run out of food so quickly. The power went out and their cold food has spoiled. Square footage is expensive in NY, so most have very little space to store dry foods and survival supplies. Those that do have the storage space are mostly due to them having basements; and most of those basements flooded.

No emergency food supplies + no grocery stores = resorting to dumpster diving

My heart goes out to those affected by the storm. I hope emergency workers get there with food very soon or this situation could devolve into mass chaos/violence very quickly.

If you have a basement generally you are not living in a small apartment right? if you have a basement and your food is in 5 gallon cans that cost a couple $$...it will be dry.

reply to post by Char-Lee

I am thinking the majority of the city is fine and that is why they did not cancel the famous and $$ bringing marathon

Considering it is slated to begin on Staten Island, I understand their resentment about it. There is some heating up debate about that. Staten Island is the "forgotten" part of New York when it comes to the coffers. That is proving out in this recovery period. But a "marathon", really?

If people put their food in the 5 gallon buckets that you get at the hardware store with water tight snap lids and especially get survival bars that are for food not fun they will like be ok.

Yah, they all had time (and money?] to prepare, some thought the official downgrade of the storm to "tropical" status and their placement outside the potential flood zone allowed them to relax. They were in Zone "B" after all, the "flood safe zone".

Now if you are going to hoard your emergency rations when those around you are hungry...okay. I'd move after that though. From then on you will carry a stigma and nobody will help you in the least; even for a ride to pick up the kids when your car is in the shop. So yah, share and share alike. You'll be a hero.

reply to post by hanyak69

No, they weren't out of work before the storm, maybe I mis-worded it, they can't get to work now...they can't even get to their houses yet...and IDK, why don't you tell me how many were displaced from IKE and RITA?

I live check to check and have a family. I NEVER have less than 3 weeks worth of food on hand just in case. You don't have to have a lot of money to do this. All you need is a lot of brains. At any moment anything could happen and food is essential for survival. Its a no brainier to rotate a stock of emergency food.

I have stayed in NY for business and I realize most people shop day to day for food never really having more than 2 days worth of food on hand. Your bad!

I would still be eating my "good food" on day 3. I MIGHT tap into canned goods after a week. I'm not bragging here. I'm just shocked most people don't think like this also. BTW I'm not a doomsday prepper, I'm a realist and a survivor.

On the other hand for those who lost everything (entire house) I feel deeply for you and what your going through.

Originally posted by juleol
reply to post by Thunderheart

 

So how exactly can you hoard weeks-months worth of food if you are poor and own no car??
There is no way i could even do it. And with a hour walk to supermarket it would not be easy to carry more than a couple of days worth of food and supplies.
Some of these people are very old and retired who are probably also rather poor.

And it says something about you as a person if you actually laugh about people having to dig through trash just to feed themselves.

edit on 2-11-2012 by juleol because: (no reason given)

When you go to the store, buy one extra item each time to store. Jerky, or dried or canned. Stop when you have a bug out bag ready to go.

Originally posted by SpaDe_

Originally posted by juleol
reply to post by Thunderheart

 

So how exactly can you hoard weeks-months worth of food if you are poor and own no car??
There is no way i could even do it. And with a hour walk to supermarket it would not be easy to carry more than a couple of days worth of food and supplies.
Some of these people are very old and retired who are probably also rather poor.

And it says something about you as a person if you actually laugh about people having to dig through trash just to feed themselves.

edit on 2-11-2012 by juleol because: (no reason given)

Ramen is cheap, light weight, stores easily, and is prepared with ease. You have to want to help yourself before you will figure out how you can do it. Some people will just use excuses instead of finding solutions. It would cost the average person around $5 to keep a week supply of Ramen on hand, and you even have the luxury of selecting different flavors.
I know Ramen isn't the best choice for a food source for a week, but it would be a welcome meal if you were starving.

edit on 11/2/2012 by SpaDe_ because: ...

Almost all who say they can't buy soda or beer or other non essentials all the time on a regular basis.

It is NOT heartless to be pointing this out, the NEED to get ready! this is NOT the end, there are more disaster ahead, the weather is changing, the planet is changing and the ones who wish to coddle everyone is helping them to stay unprepared and feel good about that!

Compassion is not lacking in giving good advice!

Originally posted by Wheelindiehl
reply to post by ApolloBloodline

 

There's no F-ing wilderness around there, take a look at a map online, NYC IS HUGE, it takes hours just to DRIVE through it...w/o traffic...there are no unpopulated areas within probably 2-3 days of walking. I'm sure they didn't think the power would be off this long, or that everything would still be flooded, to take a gamble at a 2 day hike to MAYBE find this alleged wilderness you speak of.

there are actually laws also. we don't get to poach on off season just because of a flood. They see you marching around shooting or killing and gutting something in the city I doubt they will pat you on the back. In New orleans they took the guns away.

reply to post by Char-Lee


yeah I wasn't talking about people who have BEACH HOUSES for recreation. I was referring to people in Brooklyn, queens, Manhattan, ect that live in apartments. I would guess that not everyone on the island was rich though. I would guess some were just regular people who own a home.

Most people that work in the city are not rich enough to live in the suburbs.

When you have several houses to choose from, you don't usually go looting and dumpster diving. Those people went to their homes in Eastchester, new Rochelle, and white plains.

Either way though, it sucks for their hard work to be swept up like that rich or not.
The ones who couldn't leave, because they can't afford it, or thought they would be going to work the next day(need to go to work) are the ones most affected.

on a side note not related to this post at all:

I will say this though. I am seeing peoples true colors after this storm. It is easy to hate New Yorkers, Americans, ect. You all can kiss NY´s ass. We should not donate or care when natural catastrophes occur to your countries and states. You have shown( not all) but most that you think we are just complaining and making a big deal out of nothing. Ok......life is a bitch, and then you get yours.

When Europe gets hit with its mega storm, I will just say they are bitching and making a big deal out of nothing. You wait and see. When it is your people in the cold and suffering from exposure I will ask why you didn't prepare for an act of god.

Oh and when the NYSE stops trading the world economy suffers, so keep saying this is no big deal. When major companies that trade on it tank, I will ask you why you didn't prepare for homeless life, and bread lines. All we need is a straw, and this might be it.

The global economy is in the toilet and you see the financial capital of the world in a state of emergency and ask why it is in the news......yes, because a major metropolitan city in the 21st century is normally out of power and declared a disaster zone, same magnitude as like farms in the Midwest, or plantations in the Caribbean.(not saying it doesnt suck but there is a huge difference)oh but no, Same thing. Nothing different.

We New Yorkers are just trying to feel special because it hit home.....yes. Because the NYSE is nothing and millions of people are not as important. yes, we are drama queens here......

sorry for taking up the head lines. our bad.

Originally posted by FidelityMusic
More than half of Staten Island was without power as of late last night, with many houses damaged, they have more deaths than the other boroughs, a few less than the other 4 combined. You have people without cars, no public transportation is active for them, no one has come to help them. It's easy to talk as a person who knows basics of survival if SHTF, but not everyone is lucky to stumble upon ATS to learn a thing or two. Staten Island is 40 short New York blocks and a bridge away from me, I wish I could be over there helping the people without food, clothing, and proper shelter as I would want someone to help my family no mateer how much we've prepared with food, water, and our necessities.

Have fun laughing and be happy you aren't out here, I'd be glad to take your food and supplies for these people in need.

I am sure we would all be glad too also if that were possible. Sad they did not evacuate the low laying islands to shelters inland that clearly should have happened.
I am surprised supplies are not dropped by helicopter.

reply to post by Digital_Reality

If you have 3 weeks of food stored up then you don't live paycheck to paycheck, I have bought extra food before to try and start preparing for whatever doom or gloom comes along, then what happens, my wife's car or my car has to get fixed...uh-oh, here comes winter, time to try and pay the gas bill for 5 months, what's that? My mortgage is going up next year? Cool, there's a little something extra I don't have money for. "Hey Mr. Boss sir,uh, it's been 4 years, I think it's about time I get a raise or cost of living increase maybe!" ~boss~"NO"...living pay check to pay check is not having anything left over from any check for ANYTHING extra, I'm happy when once every other month I can afford to buy a small can of coffee at the grocery store and my kids can get new socks.

reply to post by Char-Lee

Thank you for getting the humor part.

Funny but watching able bodied people get in boats while "rescue workers" walk the boats out in one to two feet of water looks silly to me. (this was the part of the news i called hype)
The walking your kidding thing? The picture is of water that does not even cover the bottom step?

Debris is everywhere just under the surface. Falling in an open manhole might be hard on the shins. The water is toxic and begins to burn when skin is exposed to it. The rescuers have waders and steel lined boots. They are younger and have secured safe routes to and from the shelter or wherever. I would thank my lucky stars if somebody showed up with a canoe to haul my worthless butt to safety.


Which way to go? Anywhere but here. We're on the 20th floor with no water or power. Its day three, last night was cold and nobody is coming for us.

But... which way?

reply to post by intrptr


no we are just drama queens. The water is fine. warm, crystal blue. What major metropolitan city with sewers and all sorts of crap. Just walk. Who cares if your feet turn blue and you lose toes. Who cares if your skin gets peeled off from chemical burns. No.

We just like to bitch.

in such and such place we just do such and such macho thing and shrug off acts of god....pussies.

EDIT:
I have worn NYC fire fighter and EMT bio hazard boots. They felt like I had armor on. Several layers of water tight acid proof, thick rubber. They have more than jeans on under their uniforms too.

Originally posted by jimmiec
Sandy has flooded thousands of homes in its devastating path, and estimates are that damages will be in the billions of dollars. FEMA, which runs the federal flood insurance program, has to pick up the tab.

But FEMA already owes $18 billion to the Treasury Department, thanks to Hurricane Katrina. Currently, insurance experts say FEMA's flood insurance program has access to funds totaling $3.8 billion, much of it in loans.


Wheres FEMA? They really really need to stop selling flood insurance on coastal areas. A huge chunk of the money will go to extremely wealthy people who built multi million dollar homes on the coast. The one percenters. If you build in a flood plain you should just take your chances. I am not talking about the homes flooded inland but my God, if you build on the coastline you should just be SOL when your home floods. Otherwise, don't build there if you can't afford to rebuild with your own money. All of America has to pay for the rebuilding of rich peoples homes now. This needs to stop. It is totally insane.

On the west coast if we want earthquake insurance added to our home insurance we have to pay and additional 1,500 $. We can't afford it so we have none.