Why Do People Believe It Is Their 'Right' To Have Children?

Originally posted by The GUT

Originally posted by GaiusMarius
I honestly think society and the masses are a lost cause and I dont want to live amongst you. Most of you disgust me.

Ahhh...now we get to the root of the problem. Things are tough all over, brother, but there are still a LOT of good folk in this world. Children--no matter their pedigree--are some of the finest.

I dont want anything. I want it to be tougher for the west. I want the NAM nations to get a better deal. I am a socialist. I think the world is a very sad place.

reply to post by GaiusMarius


Who are you, or who are they, to decide who can have children and who cannot? What kind of a world is it that you want to live in? I find your views and mindset to be very disturbing. I want a much, much smaller government. It sounds as if you want a totalitarian, heavy handed machine controlling our every move. You would have them strip our humanity away. We have a right to have children because we are humans, not because we are granted the right to exist by some king or leader.

reply to post by GaiusMarius


There should be an in depth written test to allow pregnancy and an understanding of the consequenses of a quick bit of 'jiggy' and a contract to confirm all financial obligation until adulthood BY BOTH consenting parents 50/50. If either conditions are not met, don't do it or be prepared to make sacrafices.

I'm fed up paying taxes for other peoples kids, single parents and meeting darn horrible ankle biters and adolescents who's best friend is a mobile phone!

Sadly, I think the human race is destined to keep squeezing them out at a rediculous and selfish rate.

This is about a current lack of common sense and responibility for the world by individuals who don't give a damn about anyone but themselves and think they can eliminate their insecurities by making 'mini-me's'.

Eugenics are awesome

Actually, a state rep in Louisiana came up with an idea that might appeal to you. Anyone on welfare would receive a one time payment of a couple thousand dollars in return for being sterilized. If it were adopted and people took the offer, it would save taxpayers millions and lower crime and poverty levels.
Needless to say, people went bonkers, calling him a nazi, racist, you name it.
He did get re-elected though.

reply to post by GaiusMarius


Slave, I guess you can call it what you want.

Let me tell you a story -

I was working at a popular lotion retail store one day. A women came in with her son (probably about 4) who cried the whole time because he was hungry. I politely helped her and gave the boy some stickers to keep him busy. After she picked up about about $50 worth of lotion she came up to the checkout only to have her card declined.

I listened in amazement as she called the 800# on the back of the card to find out why her CHILD SUPPORT payment hadn't processed yet. She handed the phone over to me and they gave me a code to process it through, whatever.

As she carried her bags out her son complained he was hungry again and she smacked him on his cheek and told him to wait until they got home because she didn't have the money to spending on him eating out. Of course she didn't because she had just spent HIS CHILD SUPPORT on lotion for herself.

And yet, I still believe people should get to reproduce? Yep I do. However, it doesn't make me less sick when I see something like that happen. People should be allowed to make their own decisions when it comes to their life. As long as they are capable to make the decisions with a sound mind.

I would guess that most of the people who have been inventors, geniuses, lawmakers, etc. have come from middle class. Where would we be without them?

The governments right to exist is granted by the people, not the other way around.

Why Do People Believe It Is Their 'Right' To Have Children?

Because Darwin says if I can attract the woman and fight off the other males, I get the prize and my DNA gets to outlive me.

Let some stupid politician try to tell me different? I'll knock up HIS wife.

~Heff

reply to post by Hefficide

Let some stupid politician try to tell me different? I'll knock up HIS wife.

Wow. Have you seen some of those women? I guess but you may wanna tie a rope around your waist so you don't fall in.

reply to post by notquiteright

I want a world where every child has the same chances to succeed.

I am not sentimental about human life and I also am not against abortion.

I think society should have more direction and not rely on growth and consumer confidence.

I like that children in Cuba all get the same chances in life as much as possible.

I want everyone to have the same standard of education and access to healthcare.

I want to do away with the class system because I dont like that the poor and middleclass are disadvantaged.

Under capitalism I believe that only the upperclass people should have the right to breed. I dont see why middleclass and the poor want children if their children cant have the very best of everything.

edit- if all cant have the very best then to me the world is a horrible place. If it is not feesable to offer the very best to all then the very best is not yet feesable in my opinion. I dont like seeing starving Africans on tv. I have seen them all my life.

Originally posted by Hefficide

Why Do People Believe It Is Their 'Right' To Have Children?

Because Darwin says if I can attract the woman and fight off the other males, I get the prize and my DNA gets to outlive me.

Let some stupid politician try to tell me different? I'll knock up HIS wife.

~Heff

I have considered the idea of suvival of the fittest under capitalism but I consider it to be devolution. I do believe the rich are the only captalists that should breed, for their childrens sake but I am not capitalist and I dont agree that the rich are the best among us. So its still devolution to me.

I think socialism would be more conducive to producing outstanding individuals. I am for a survival of the fittest of sorts under socialism. I think the best will stand out when all have the same opportunities.

edit- and when society values things that are important.

Originally posted by Doodle19815
reply to post by GaiusMarius

 

Slave, I guess you can call it what you want.

Let me tell you a story -

I was working at a popular lotion retail store one day. A women came in with her son (probably about 4) who cried the whole time because he was hungry. I politely helped her and gave the boy some stickers to keep him busy. After she picked up about about $50 worth of lotion she came up to the checkout only to have her card declined.

I listened in amazement as she called the 800# on the back of the card to find out why her CHILD SUPPORT payment hadn't processed yet. She handed the phone over to me and they gave me a code to process it through, whatever.

As she carried her bags out her son complained he was hungry again and she smacked him on his cheek and told him to wait until they got home because she didn't have the money to spending on him eating out. Of course she didn't because she had just spent HIS CHILD SUPPORT on lotion for herself.

And yet, I still believe people should get to reproduce? Yep I do. However, it doesn't make me less sick when I see something like that happen. People should be allowed to make their own decisions when it comes to their life. As long as they are capable to make the decisions with a sound mind.

I would guess that most of the people who have been inventors, geniuses, lawmakers, etc. have come from middle class. Where would we be without them?

I agree. Many of the best come from the middleclass. I think we would get more if the poor and middleclass had the same level of education. Over just one generation we would see less poor parenting.

I am am working class. My family is. I dontthink socio economic status determines ability, but I do think it determines your level of opportunity.

People do have the right to have children and if they don't parent properly, the government have the right to take their children away.. The world is not overpopulated, don't be deceived by a picture of downtown Mumbai on the news. There is enough room on this planet for billions more people.

Originally posted by DarknStormy
People do have the right to have children and if they don't parent properly, the government have the right to take their children away.. The world is not overpopulated, don't be deceived by a picture of downtown Mumbai on the news. There is enough room on this planet for billions more people.

Lets work out a way to at least feed everyone first.

And under capitalism a nation must manage its economy and compete against the other nations. Many countries cant afford to be increasing their populations because of the strain it puts on their economy and society. Population control is a must for many nations.

edit- I agree that we could increase the global population if we wanted to for some reason but I dont think its sensible under capitalism because money is the problem, not resources. Many people cannot afford enough food while some jerk on thje other side of the planet is making money from the situation. A world that allows speculation on food is demonic.

Originally posted by GaiusMarius
I want a world where every child has the same chances to succeed.

Take away the system and the banksters

I am not sentimental about human life and I also am not against abortion.

If a person gets pregnant and decides they want an abortion, I am happy with that. Not forced abortion.

I think society should have more direction and not rely on growth and consumer confidence.

I agree.

I like that children in Cuba all get the same chances in life as much as possible.

Don't know much about Cuba but it sounds fair from what your saying.

I want everyone to have the same standard of education and access to healthcare.

I cant comment on that.

I want to do away with the class system because I dont like that the poor and middleclass are disadvantaged.

Take away the system and the banksters.

Under capitalism I believe that only the upperclass people should have the right to breed. I dont see why middleclass and the poor want children if their children cant have the very best of everything.

Because as much as middle or poor dont have the best of everything, they can be taught to be successful through their own hard work. they are tougher, they do it tough and I have every ounce of respect for those classes. I would take anyone from those two classes beside me in a war before an upper class shmuck.

Originally posted by GaiusMarius
Lets work out a way to at least feed everyone first.

Put people who give a crap about others in power and that problem would be fixed in a month.

And under capitalism a nation must manage its economy and compete against the other nations. Many countries cant afford to be increasing their populations because of the strain it puts on their economy and society. Population control is a must for many nations.

Life to me comes before money and the economy. If we have stooped to this level, then I pity the very ground we walk on. We deserve a shake up if plastic is more important than flesh and blood.

reply to post by DarknStormy


I agree with what you are saying but I also think there are many tough members of the upper class. Many great Generals come from the upperclass.

I dont think we are so different at the end of the day really. I think access to the same standard of education and healthcare would make us less different. It would also ensure that nobody has an excuse.

And bringing that back to population, I think we should be able to work out how many people is ideal for each nation to have and design budgets around that. I think the right to quality education and healthcare is more important than someones right to breed.

I dont think socialism is the only way to provide all with access to quality education and healthcare. Like you said, if people that cared were in charge then equality would not seem impossible.

Originally posted by GaiusMarius
I agree with what you are saying but I also think there are many tough members of the upper class. Many great Generals come from the upperclass.

This is what I call tough. My gramps was a boxer during his hay day. He runs a farm to this day and he is 82 years old. Every morning he wakes up to a glass of warm water, I guess to flush his kidneys or something, who knows . His eyes are sparkling blue like they were in a 20 year olds body. He raised 6 children who learnt pretty much the exact same thing and he built his first house with his very own hands whilst running a dairy and shearing sheep and on the property next door to his in the middle of nowhere.

Now compare that to the people of today... No contest. You want a general, ask the elders brother. most people are lucky to make it to 70 these days.

reply to post by GaiusMarius


From a purely materialistic point of view, we die and that's the end. If life is viewed from the standpoint of what physics and reality suggest about our nature, we return. The Bible calls it baptism (Immersion of the soul) into reality. Jesus said, "you must be born again." The process of baptism is built around the family we are connected to in this stream of life. No matter which side of this view you are on, the answer to your question will be the same.

If it's a materialistic view, then the life you leave behind is the evidence you were here. That evidence can then speak to future generations as a reflection of who you were in life. Everyone has the right to speak this reflection and those who follow always have the choice to change the image. Nothing in life is easy. Death is only the end of those who produce no fruit.

If your view is spiritual in nature, then you will be born again. Those who you bring into the world will then raise you later. The effort you give now generates the efforts and quality of life for you later. The entire point of baptism is to rise to new life. Knowing this, I raise my family with all my strength.

1 Timothy 2

13 For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. 15 But women will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

Why would the woman's salvation depend on how she raises her children? For the man, our salvation comes from protecting the opening of the tent where the family resides. We are the OX.

Alef Bet and the Nature and the Story Language Tells

The truth is literally woven into the letters of the Hebrew language.

Socialism is the inherent enemy of the middle class or of anyone who believes that one should excel if they put in the effort or have the skills to do so.

It is incredibly naive to believe that socialist systems are not built on hierarchy and elitism. They are the epitome of authoritarian systems which enforce the domination of a elitist central organizing class while everyone else is forced to be equally powerless and equally poor.

Freedom means the freedom to fail. It means some will succeed and some will not. the best way to "organize" a society that maximizes those achieving success is to incentivize it.

In other words, no giveaways. If someone who cannot afford a child on their own knows the government won't pay for it, they have serious incentive not to have one in the first place.

Socialism is the opposite of freedom. It creates the opposite of dignity. It exemplifies the opposite of compassion.
Abstraction is for small minds. The real world is concrete.

Everything you have written in this OP and your responses to it is pathetic.
As another poster indicated "I am the boss of me".
You are overly and very sadly materialistic if you believe that money would be the final factor in having a child or in experiencing the best that the world has to offer. Children largely are the best the world has to offer.

If you wanted to discuss whether the rest of society should foot the bill for poor people who have children...well, that's another issue entirely, but, if they are going to take responsibility for their children then let them have them. Freedom of the most basic sort.