Is Jesus the only way to God?

Originally posted by Elsha
reply to post by studythem1

 

You clearly have some issues accepting certain facts about history. Council of Nicea was in 325ad About 2oo years before Roman Catholicism. The council basically gave a nod to the scriptures that were ALREADY in acceptance as having apostolic authority.Roman Catholicism persecuted christians for centuries and even today, Vatican II states that the Roman Catholic church is the only true church. True Christianity has always been persecuted. You cannot seem to accept that distinction. You want to see Christianity as a blood shedding movement when its the blood of the martyers that is the seed of the true church. This is all spiritual and you may not even have the capacity to understand what I am saying. Non-believers is Yeshua (Jesus) cannot understand the things of Yeshua. There is no way around this. Those who can accept the truth hear Yeshua's voice. As he told Pilat, its that simple. Therefore it has not been GIVEN to YOU to understand these things. I'm sorry...

who are you to decide what i understand and what i do not? so i guess because i do not tow the line and lock step to the officially accepted doctrines of the church, i have no understanding of anything...i think it makes me a better judge of what is truth, because i am not stuck in such a narrow view of the world...what is the problem here...the truth has been twisted so much that anyone who ascribes to the mix of truth and lies that is found in the doctrines of Christianity, whether the full fledged catholic version or the more tame protestant versions, is doomed to continually perform the same pagan rituals that they so vehemently deny...its insanity...

Jesus was created into a messiah by the powers that be, and even when he was born, the magi (the Illuminati of their day, also known as kingmakers) fully intended him to be killed as a blood sacrifice in their evil rituals...their gifts of frankincense gold and myrrh were funerary gifts, an odd gift to give a child, and they also suggested that Jesus be wrapped in swaddling, which was also a mark of death, because animal sacrifices were wrapped in swaddling before being led to slaughter...they planned to kill him before he could even speak. one way or another they were going to do it...they did not want anyone spoiling their plans...because regardless of what purpose Jesus came for, they did not want him there...and then they turned his crucifixion into a blood ritual to appease their gods...but he beat them at their own game...but instead of people recognizing this, they celebrate his bloodshed much to the glee of these evil powers who have been fooling us for centuries...its sick really...

what people fail to recognize is that their religion has been infiltrated from the beginning by these evil occult groups who demand a blood sacrifice, and then these same people are brainwashed into accepting that as a form of redemption...the Mayans did the same thing by cutting out the hearts of their captors to appease the gods...is it so hard to recognize that? blood sacrifice is an evil practice, its an undeniable part of the occult and so cleverly woven into the fabric of Judaism and Christianity, that people think nothing of it...it is shameful...

ever heard of controlled opposition? balkanization? its where people in control do not want to lose control, so they create imbalance and destabilization, by setting up opposing factions to keep the people they want to control from ever taking focus off each other, and as a result they never realize they are being manipulated...and this is why Catholicism and protestantism superficially were opposed to each other, and yes there was bloodshed, but this was also a part of the occult's blood rituals, so they pushed it, condoned it, and even plotted to get more blood to flow...because their gods demand it...

and the council of Nicaea was not to put into concrete what was already widely accepted, otherwise Constantine would have never had to hold the council members hostage and brutally force them to accept his will or die...there was no debate, and the vote was only for show...there were so many factions prior to his meddling that he made the move to unify them into one religious force...before then who knows exactly what was the truth because it was all but destroyed except for the few mentions we have from the evidence used to support the views of Constantines religion, which was the beginning of the roman church...i guess its easy for you to keep ignoring that fact...

where it first went wrong was by trying to make Jesus into a fully practicing Jew, but he obviously did not because he was always pissing them off by ignoring the rules...some would say his divinity gave him license, but i think that is far fetched, he was never truly a practicing Jew, he came not to uphold the law but to show an alternative to it, and it later obviously got twisted into an extension of the same law he continually defied...why else would the Sanhedrin try to kill him? if he was such a good Jew, then they would have had no problem with him...

also, the Sanhedrin, if we see the fruits they show, are easily recognizable as an extension of the magi, the world powers of the day, and so was Herod, because all the parties involved wanted Jesus dead...and interesting it is that the only times he ever was in danger is when he was not wandering the countryside, but participating in the religious festivals...

bottom line is they hijacked his message, turned it into another blood/death cult, and duped/forced everyone in the known world to follow this sick, ritualistic occult religion disguised as following Jesus...

deny it all you want, but i still see the connection between the occult and Christianity, and i think it is disgusting to celebrate a mans death, but i guess some folks just do not see how they are being played by the Illuminati...and sure the labels changed, but it has always been the same group in control, no matter what name they take...

reply to post by studythem1


I just posted a response to another thread that I wanted to show you. The contents of this post were in reply to a comment about Lucifer, but it could easily be applied to the story of Jesus as well.

One, you are taking it way too literally. There is an underlying meaning to this story, and I suspect that you have not even guessed at all of its symbology and what it's really trying to say. Because literalism only requires what you already have at hand, and metaphoric understanding requires quite a bit of background info (conspicuously absent) you rely on the literal meaning because that's the easiest road. And that's what it's always been about.

You can see it in the world today. We choose what's easiest, most convenient. The human condition, the human nature, is to do what's familiar. So if we happen to find a halfway coherent explanation, we'll rationalize to fill in the remaining gaps and make IT suit OUR feelings and beliefs, rather than adjusting our perspective to suit the truth. And therein lies the conflict. Instead of adjusting ourselves to the truth, we adjust the truth to ourselves so we feel better about it. When we find the truth, before we ever consider the validity of the truth, we consider how we feel about it. Before we have ever decided if we believe it or not, we've already pondered to ourselves, "Do we WANT to accept this truth?"

And if we don't, we rationalize, and we either change it to suit us, or find a reason why we shouldn't accept it. And this works with every kind of inabsolute truth we've ever conceived in the history of mankind. We will think about how WE feel about it before we ever think about whether it's actually true. Because the truth doesn't matter to the majority. What matters is the world inside our head, the only place where anything is real. We don't like a truth we aren't comfortable with. And that's where our "selective comprehension" gift comes into play. We CHOOSE what we believe, we CHOOSE how we want to believe it, and we CHOOSE how we show it or when. If it was really the truth, there'd be no choice. Know it, or lie to yourself. Those are the only options. And yet we find ourself choosing...which implies a wide range of "truth", which implies varying degrees of adjustment for the purpose of comfort and ease of "passage", or ease of acceptance.

And that's how our own nature has crippled us regarding religion. And that's why I don't like religion, because it tempts us to do that, and we give in far too often for it to be truly effective. Spirituality is a more one-on-one thing, and it's much harder for others to influence you when it's a personal journey, because you are forced to come to your own answers. And when peer pressure or peer rationality doesn't encourage you to stick with the simplest definition and "don't think too much about it", you come to more accurate answers on your own.

Because the group mentality is "don't question things too much." That's how it's always been. And so, in my opinion, religion, or group-search, is a lot less effective than spirituality, or personal-search. Unless the group makes a point of managing it the personal-search way. Hence, theosophy instead of Christianity...obviously, the one is a lot less restrictive than the other, and the human condition, in groups, is always restrictive. At least with Christians, it is. And if you aren't restrictive, you're a very RELAXED Christian...which isn't how it used to be, and is more due to modern culture than anything else. But there's still traditionalists...fear of new ideas, you know.

I tried to give a thorough explanation...I hope you understand what I was trying to say here.

reply to post by studythem1


Lets take a look at the first century. It was Paul and the apostles who planted the early church. They also looked after them while they were alive. So the church began at Pentacost and Paul and Peter were killed in the neroian persecution sometime in the 60-70ad period. Thats 30 years of apostolic oversight of the early church. We also know from church historians as well as annals of the Roman Empire that the Roman Empire failed to destroy the early church. Persecution only helped convert more people to the faith. These are all simple facts of history. I do believe that history is written by the winner however my espistemological view incorporates the sense and belief that God overules our historical information and God is able to provide that accurate enough history is passed down from generation to generation. Of course, you may disagree with that which is your right.

Now, after the apostles only the apostle John was alive. But remember that the Apostles trained and ordained and discipled the men that came after them. Example: Polycarp who was burned in the Roman Coliseum, was a disciple of the Apostle John. Many of these men are known as the early church or first century church leaders. They left epistles as well but their epistles are not apostolic and so not part of the canon of scripture.

Also remember that we know the names of some of these early churches because these church's are the church's that the epistles are named after. So corinth, modern day thessalonici, ephesus, galatia, etc etc. Paul also told the church in ephesus to make sure to read the epistle he wrote to the laodiceans. So their was early church organization.

My point, these are the facts of the early christian church according to both church historians and secular roman scholars as well as Jewish historians such as Josephus.

Basically everyone is in agreement on this except you. That means your thinking with an epistemological pre-supposition that everything is relative and it is impossible to discern or come to solid facts about church history.

That would put you at odds with not only modern day theology experts but also secular scholars of history.

By the way, I DO AGREE WITH YOU, as far as not being a fan of state religion. I never said I was. Im a christian theist who is constitutionally minded and a states rights supporter. I think the tax excempt/with strings attached, no tax status is very bad for the church. I'm in favor of modern day house or small government free churchs. I also am KJV only, I reject the new translations. And yes, I believe God can and has preserved His Word. Thats because of my epistemology as a Christian theist. However I do have empirical proof of God but thats another story entirely

reply to post by Elsha


Also, I am convinced that the GOP, national republican party, has COMLETELY infiltrated the protestant christian church in the United States....especially the Southern Baptist Convention.

reply to post by Elsha


You're not Christian then. Accepting only bits and pieces of Christianity, while replacing the parts you don't like with something that suits your flavor better...that's not Christianity. That's being convenient.

This is proof that Christianity is a religion of convenience.

reply to post by studythem1


Constantine was pagan until his dying day. The reason he incorporated his pagan beliefs into the Christian religion is because he knew that if he didn't, someone else would raise Christianity their way. He melded all of the faiths so as to prevent future wars based on religion. It was a very clever political move. And remember, in those days, politics was all that mattered. No one gave a damn about the people, unless the people could be used to further those in power. Constantine knew this, and did the best he could to send his empire off properly.

He underestimated the future.

reply to post by jhill76


jhill76,

(In my opinion - if you don't mind me saying...)

I, honestly, do believe that one CAN follow Jesus to lead oneself to heaven.

I do believe that your interpretation on how to get to heaven (and given with a bible verse quoting Jesus; and Brother may have something to do with it) might be just a-little-off though (again, my personal expression).

*Here's what I think*: I think we can all agree that our world is diverse? And though this statement is off-topic, I'll get to the point: I find many people I speak to (concerning their admission to heaven) think that it has to be that one way for reaching to heaven. Here's my very brief logic and my point: If the world is diverse, could you not be diverse (and ultimately be the person WHOM YOU WANT TO BE) and still make it to heaven?

If the world is diverse and the world stills runs on its feet; why can't you?

jhill76, here's the good thing about you:

Is it possible with having a direct relationship with God, or choosing your own way to God, but being good?

You "hit the nail with the hammer!" (Not to sound like I'm mister know-it-all) but YES, I do think choosing your own way to God, but (emphasizing) being good, can (and will) lead you to God!

Yes, the bible is another way of leading oneself to heaven, but with the verses being hard to understand; some of those verses can be taken out of context!? If my understanding is correct, would it be easier to understand the bible or to understand yourself: leading yourself to heaven? That's for you to decide jhill76!

I wish you the best of luck on your journey!

Originally posted by Elsha
reply to post by studythem1

 

Lets take a look at the first century. It was Paul and the apostles who planted the early church. They also looked after them while they were alive. So the church began at Pentacost and Paul and Peter were killed in the neroian persecution sometime in the 60-70ad period. Thats 30 years of apostolic oversight of the early church. We also know from church historians as well as annals of the Roman Empire that the Roman Empire failed to destroy the early church. Persecution only helped convert more people to the faith. These are all simple facts of history. I do believe that history is written by the winner however my espistemological view incorporates the sense and belief that God overules our historical information and God is able to provide that accurate enough history is passed down from generation to generation. Of course, you may disagree with that which is your right.

Now, after the apostles only the apostle John was alive. But remember that the Apostles trained and ordained and discipled the men that came after them. Example: Polycarp who was burned in the Roman Coliseum, was a disciple of the Apostle John. Many of these men are known as the early church or first century church leaders. They left epistles as well but their epistles are not apostolic and so not part of the canon of scripture.

Also remember that we know the names of some of these early churches because these church's are the church's that the epistles are named after. So corinth, modern day thessalonici, ephesus, galatia, etc etc. Paul also told the church in ephesus to make sure to read the epistle he wrote to the laodiceans. So their was early church organization.

My point, these are the facts of the early christian church according to both church historians and secular roman scholars as well as Jewish historians such as Josephus.

Basically everyone is in agreement on this except you. That means your thinking with an epistemological pre-supposition that everything is relative and it is impossible to discern or come to solid facts about church history.

That would put you at odds with not only modern day theology experts but also secular scholars of history.

By the way, I DO AGREE WITH YOU, as far as not being a fan of state religion. I never said I was. Im a christian theist who is constitutionally minded and a states rights supporter. I think the tax excempt/with strings attached, no tax status is very bad for the church. I'm in favor of modern day house or small government free churchs. I also am KJV only, I reject the new translations. And yes, I believe God can and has preserved His Word. Thats because of my epistemology as a Christian theist. However I do have empirical proof of God but thats another story entirely

all i have ever said is since there is strong evidence of tampering, and there is also strong evidence of Christianity as we know it, and the doctrines that were assembled, being used to create a state religion by Constantine, then we cannot take any of the old assumptions or arguments as fact, and have to re-examine the evidence, not just the one sided evidence in support of it, but everything...and the conclusion i have come to about it is that all religion is a tool of evil, fabricated to enslave the mind...the agendas, lines of thought and everything else fall in line with the doctrines of totalitarianism...i do not therefore think that "god" created this religion or this bible, because it stinks of totalitarianism to the core, it just has the nice costume of Jesus adorning it so people are fooled into believing it is the truth...

it has always been a trick...toss out what you like, but it always was a totalitarian religion...making it gentler today does not erase that fact...it simply puts a new updated friendlier costume on it, which is exactly what "they" wanted to begin with...

we cannot be truly free and live according to the guidance of the creator if we push a totalitarian doctrine...that is not of the creator, never was, never will be...

I want to get in on this discussion again.

One could say I had a revelation yesterday, or better the night before last. The thoughts had a hold of my mind yesterday even more so and I could not stop thinking about what I had come to figure out.

Knowledge is everywhere and within us all. It's like little pieces here and little pieces there and sometimes, it all comes together like a puzzle and you then can see a beautiful picture emerge!

This happened to me.... And I would like to share it with you, if you are open to more knowledge from my point of view.

I'm an almost forty yr old mom of three ( 2 are mine biologically). I've studied and have been a deep thinker all of my life, but more so in the last twenty years. I know a lot, but I also know very little in the entire grand scheme of things, but I cant deny what I'm seeing and feeling. It's a real feeling, with a real picture that is so clear, I could hardly think of anything else yesterday.

Today, I hope to share what I've learned in hopes of expansion on the ideas I hold.

After my " revelation" I began searching on the Internet for confirmation. Surely someone, somewhere has thought the same.

To my surprise I did find a few others who lived many years ago who was under the same impression I am today.

Never have I considered myself a philosopher of sorts, maybe I'm not..... But I seem to think like one. Lol

If you don't mind, I would like to share my thoughts regarding this topic of Jesus being the only way to heaven.

reply to post by MamaJ


Go on ...

reply to post by followtheevidence


Thanks, I shared my thoughts here.... www.abovetopsecret.com... as well, so i will just copy and paste from there as I do not want to take away from this thread as the other has to do with " matter".

Metaphyscis and the philosopy from which it derived many things tells a story.

I hear stories which are an expression that are different, yet tell the same story.

I just can't stop thinking sometimes about the order of the cosmos. The Oder of the human body, and frankly all living things. Even more so today because it seems as of last night, I've had some sort of revelation. I've had pieces of a puzzle scattered about in my mind for the last .... Well..... All of my life of almost forty years but every day devotion for the last twenty.

I've studied at LENGTH many subjects. It began when I was little. I had a love for native Americans so I read all the time the different stories and my father took me and my brother a few times to see the Cherokee reservations not far from my state of Tennessee.

I began to be interested in Einstein as he and I share a birthday. Lol I began reading and studying the ideas of time.

The Bible was always a good read, although the many churches while I was growing up never told the stories as good as I could tell them to myself not to mention the preachers never could answer my questions.

My knowledge seeking began very young as most do ASKING WHY? A child may or may not be a why asker but I was and love the age because I'm the type of parent that gives a full answer each time.

As an adult going through the many life changes including one death after another including but not limited to my sons battle and loss with cancer.

The whys have always remained with me over the years, until last night.

Before last night, the last twenty years have been educating myself all that I wanted to know.

Time, light, darkness, clouds, god/gods, religions, philosphy, quantum mechanics, beginnings of all of creation stories, and big bang, from the atom to the molecule, quirks, human anatomy, anything pertaining to the living whether it's a tree, fruit, forms, shapes, symbols, and so on. I mean I became an addict to reading. I've read about astral physics, psychics, near death experience, out of body experiences and so on. It's been a whirlwind, but it's like one subject leads me to another almost in a fashion of perfect sequence. I was upset one day when a preacher told me where my son was is a mystery. I told God ( whatever that was for me at the time, I didn't know) I will not read the Bible again until you show me your self without it. It's too confusing and I'm hurt. Show me the answers to my questions. I'm going to the library today, so it begins... now. This is what I said!!

Twenty years later I have put all these pieces of the puzzle together and I want to share with you what this picture looks like now that it's all pieced together.

I do not expect agreeance for the knowledge I have is not the same as you, perceptions matter and each is truth in their own unique way. I just want to share mine, and have you share with me thoughts.

I see the Universe filled with matter, energy, light, and so on. I see it as alive just as I see the Earth and the other planets alive. They, we, are all made up of the same things.

We, like the Universe are a reflection of light that is expressing itself in many ways.

The Universe seems to be an expanding expression. Literature of all kinds teach me about expression and how the living matter, not yet expounded on the non living matter, expresses it self.

All objects emit electromagnetic radiation as well.

Matter, then could also be said to be an expression of thought!

We see matter can blink in and out of existence. The nature ( key word nature) of matter is to express... To come in and out of self expressing that which it/we think.

Once the thought comes in, Our voices send off harmonic waves of the highest light forms and each vibration then manifests in the material world.

The laws that govern are governed for the good of nature whether it's seen in us, another living creature, plant, atom, Universe, and so on.

The human can be said to be of mind, body and soul. We are half material and half light, expressing in many ways.

The only " right" way of expression is our perception of how the order of nature should be.

We are matter that's a transferable energy with each expression we give to the seen world, and to the unseen world because the Universal law here is cause and effect.

CONTINUED BELOW

reply to post by followtheevidence


For the religious Christain person it can be viewed from the Bible that creation began, before man. God was said to be void, then a thought aroused within, he spoke,he moved, and this flow continues today. God is then seen to be expressing himself through matter and or creation of the very first expression.

The Bible then becomes stories ( expressions) of mankind and the struggles man has undergone since the beginning of.... Man.

When the term was used, " I am", it was an expression.

" I am" , The First Adam ( atom) (Jesus, joshua, what ever entity you associate him with) ... He was asked to name objects as an expression....

" Name it" you are, I am, we are...... An expression.

I'm sitting outside on my deck, typing this. I see my deck is worn out and needs to be sealed. To me, it's a way of expression through the worn out wood that it needs to be tended to. My tomatoe plants are expressing them self with the blooms, and now comes the fruitation. I see it, in all it's glory and cannot wait to taste it! When I look at the tomatoe plant though, it is expressing something to me. It's an expression all on its own, but with me being the owner/ observer I can take commune with it and know that I too see the expression it's sending.

It's going to be tasty! Right?

With that said though.... There are probabilities. It could rain, I could water it, I could water it too much, I could neglect it, it could become dis eased and so on. Even though I KNOW the nature of the plant, there are possible outcomes and many factors are at play.

What I do with the expression/ expressions indeed matters.

Expressions tend to inspire as well, hence the spiritual, philosophical ideas, science and so on.

Music soothes my soul. The expressions from the artists are like that of a beautiful painting only the sound resonates with my entire being unlike anything else.

Reading is too an inspiration and a way of expression that keeps me learning each and every second.

It's just the nature of all that is and ever will be, in my opinion. If we can see it, it can be an expression, that ultimately inspires the spirit IF it is good with the nature.

The balance is what I'm seeing is off not only with this planet but every living thing.

The balance of the splitting of not only the atom ( man and woman) but of the light and dark. Darkness is said not able to overcome the light and we see this in science. Photons cannot be trapped, as they are free!

The tipping point is where I see us all at the present time, as it appears when the light divided from the darkness in creation it's not only been expressed in tons of literature in different manners, but it's telling a story of humanity and the nature of all things and of the different possibilities.

reply to post by MamaJ


I have a couple of thoughts in reply to your post ... a rather poignant and thought provoking post at that, if I may say.

Unfortunately I am on my phone as my internet is down at the moment and couldn't possibly say all I have to say via my cumbersome touch screen phone ...

Suffice it to say that I'll be back later with what I hope is a worthy and equally thought provoking reply

reply to post by followtheevidence


I totally understand as I have an iPhone that's really hard for my old self to type on...lol but my son and I share an iPad so when he is not on it, I'm able to type freely, like this morning.

I will be checking back in, this afternoon so.... I look forward to hearing a reply as I would love to expand on the idea and see where it goes.

Thanks so much for taking the time to not only read the lengthy posts but be kind enough to share your thoughts as well. :-)

i find that this is really interesting, and in search for the truth, this is probably one of the best explanations of what the purpose of life is...to express...

but we also must learn the meaning of life, and to do that we must experience it, in expressions...

supression is the opposite of expression, and anything that attempts to do this outside of our own personal discipline, is contrary to the universal law...we must have self control, this we learn with wisdom, but we also must not suppress expression...unless that expression actively suppresses anothers expression...in other words if that expression limits or hinders life then it is breaking the universal law of love...

before i even think of taking anything in any line of thought with serious consideration, i turn to one of the truest passages in the bible, which is the one about love...

that is an expression...and in the truest sense it is the expression of the creator...

real love does not limit the object of that love, but follows the description of the definition of love...

so in that sense, does anything any scripture have to say exhibit the expression of love fully? if it does not, then it is not in line with this principle that was not only the central theme of jesus, but is the fullest expression of the creator...

love and light are the same expression in different forms...we could even say on the electromagnetic spectrum there is an equivalent...

when we try to separate things into camps, or factions, or limit things to either one or the other, then we demonize many things that were never intended to be evil...sort of like throwing the baby out with the bathwater...

but if we look at all things, and begin to recognize what they are expressing, then we can properly categorize them as either falling in line with the natural expression of life, or the opposite, the expression of everything contrary to life...

if we bind a tomatoe plant, and cut circulation off on one branch, then we will choke that plant and limit the growth of it...it could even kill the plant...and this is what religion does, it binds the mind and limits its growth, not allowing it to fully express the life and love it was intended to express...

hence we have certain limitations placed on us by society, that in other times and places were not suppressed...not saying that self control is bad, but outside control is certainly not good...what you get with suppression of expression is the urge to express anyway, and in a sense a rebellion against the suppression, which often leads to the wrong kind of expression... one example is telling young people it is wrong to drink alcohol...in the end most of them defy this limitation and some will drink to excess, which is more harmful than moderation...but in some culture, like many of the native american cultures (not all, but many of them are similar to what i describe), the people did not limit themselves when it came to what is natural expression, and instead taught self control, more in harmony with their environment, taking only what they needed, not more, and the people that lived without these limitations were just fine, until they were encroached upon by a society that enforced strict limitations, and then confused them with strange practices, stole from them, pitted them against each other, and finally sequestered them into tiny pockets of isolation where they are controlled by fear and destitution...which breeds depression, greed, and all kinds of things contrary to what they were taught is spiritually important...that sacredness of being good stewards of the earth, and nature...and of their families...they have been broken...and it is not a good thing at all...

sex, is not bad in and of itself, it is a natural expression, that should be explored...the results can be a new life, and yes that is a huge responsibility, but because of societies limitations, we have been conditioned to think that pregnancy, therefore sex is to be avoided, and the side effect of that is so many other things that go against the natural expression of sex and corrupt it...

killing is not a bad thing in the correct context...if we kill an animal for food, then only take what we need for ourselves, or our families, or those around us, then that falls in line with the proper expression of killing, which is hunting...humans are natural hunters...but when we hunt men, out of arrogance, or pride, or hate, or disagreement, or an unwillingness to work for food, or as a substitute for food, or just to kill, or any other reason that does not sustain life, then, we have committed the wrong expression of hunting, or killing...

we have to learn there are other ways of doing things that to support our own lives by limiting or taking away from the lives of others...but since we live in a system that teaches that it is normal to live at the expense of others, it has to fully fail before we can relearn the proper way to live...

reply to post by studythem1


Beautifully spoken and I appreciate your thoughts as they also add to what I was saying in regards to expression.

Moderation is key.... Most definitely.

My daughter is twelve and she has a boyfriend ( I know) and wants to go with his family to his soccer tournament this weekend. Her stepdad just asked me , " what's up with this kind of talk and why will you allow her to go"?

It's in our nature to be loved and give love no matter what age. It's our nature.

What better way for me to teach my children than to practice ( with my guidance) loving and receiving love besides what they see at home. The kids and I talk about this very open and they know that I do not think this puppy kind of love will last but I cannot say it won't either because I do not know. It wasn't that long ago girls her age were dating. Lol lawd!

We prepare our kids for their future and this is one of those means.

We talk openly about everything. If they have the brain capacity to ask me a question then they have the right to know the truth as I see it as an answer.

If what we feel is good and it doesn't hurt anyone including our self, if it can help us grow, then by all means, go with it.

so in that sense, does anything any scripture have to say exhibit the expression of love fully? if it does not, then it is not in line with this principle that was not only the central theme of jesus, but is the fullest expression of the creator...

reply to post by studythem1


As for any expressions I believe this above can also be called discernment. Do you agree?

reply to post by MamaJ


Love cannot be adequately described in any language. It will always be a shadow of the real deal when written or spoken, because all explicit knowledge must be translated to be communicated, and all explicit translation is imperfect.

This much is painfully clear. That is why all the stories are myths and parables, because that is the only other way to impart the truth, other than laboring to make a brick wall understand rocket science. We were far too young for the perfect truth, and we are just now beginning to master algebra, as compared to the quantum physics they tried to give us centuries and centuries ago. We were morons then, and we are fools now. But we are growing...very, very slowly.

Remember how far we have left to go. Right now is the worst time to get drunk on displays of technological power, and the miracles we can perform. We must keep our heads in the game. And we must also remember that we don't know very much about the game, so instead of telling others how they are playing wrong, let's help ourselves learn how to play better.

After all, what we think is winning may not actually be winning.

reply to post by VirginMaryISGod

You "hit the nail with the hammer!" (Not to sound like I'm mister know-it-all) but YES, I do think choosing your own way to God, but (emphasizing) being good, can (and will) lead you to God!

I agree to an extent, as long it is of the true God, not (idols, Satan, etc.), then I do agree.

Originally posted by MamaJ

so in that sense, does anything any scripture have to say exhibit the expression of love fully? if it does not, then it is not in line with this principle that was not only the central theme of jesus, but is the fullest expression of the creator...

reply to post by studythem1

 

As for any expressions I believe this above can also be called discernment. Do you agree?

exactly...that is what people often get wrong, since they are trained to reject anything that doesn't fall in line with the religion(s) of totalitarianism, and in doing so they think they have discernment, but they are fooled... that is not discernment, but successful brainwashing...blindness...interesting how the culprits of all this nonsense always flip things on their head, and call good: bad, bad: good, intelligence: stupidity, truth: blasphemy, and blindness: discernment...

true love is compassion, allowing someone to be themselves, and not trying to control them or make them do anything, rather offering insight instead of forcefully making someone take the actions you want them to...we find that even with our children, we often think that love is in tough discipline, but training them to be self disciplined is much better than trying to herd them all the time, they need to grow up, and how can they if they are always being sheltered and protected? we should trust people to go over the evidence or information we present and be able to make their own decisions, if they fail, then they have to take responsibility, and if they know the consequences, they can make sound decisions...including children, adolescents...

we are the only species that protects our young far past the time they should be learning to be adults, and fail to teach them the skills they will need to survive in the world...instead we let someone else do it, like schools, government, church, and that is why they do not listen to us, and never grow up...they are taught by all these institutions that they should not grow up, hang on to childhood forever, that they always need to ask permission, and cant be trusted to make their own decisions, and then when we get upset at them for acting childish, how can we blame them? this is not love this is exploitation and manipulation by people who should know better, and in many cases do...especially in the case of government, who only want obedient little cogs in the machine...

true love is equipping someone else to be self sufficient, and responsible, and trusting them to make sound decisions once they have the information they need to live...

love is trust...

the antithesis to this is the school of thought in the totalitarian religions, that says no-one can be trusted, that places an authority over people, to control them, restrain them, and not teach them anything real...just enough to parrot propaganda, and keep things going the same way the status quo wants them to be...