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BIG NEWS- Arpaio: Obama birth record 'definitely fraudulent'

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posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by longlostbrother
reply to post by Deetermined
 


I don't suppose you managed to figure out that that has only been a law since 1982?

C'mon birthers, stop your lying and bs...


Are you freaking serious?

What makes you think the laws were more stringent in 1961?

In fact, registering a bunch of Japanese foreigners living in the Pacific Islands was probably much easier back then along with anyone else entering into Hawaii. They didn't even have to be U.S. citizens to register their child.

The only thing this law probably did was set a guideline for how long someone had to live within the U.S. before they could register their child as a U.S. citizen. They probably didn't even have a living requirement before.


Prove that assertion...or don't make it...




posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 09:58 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 



Come on, OutKast, give us some worthy of reading. Give us your explanation to the penciled in numbers on the birth certificate and what they really mean.

Prove to us all of the fields on the birth certificate were filled out from the very beginning.


Let me educate you a bit on the topic of logic and burden of proof....proving the above is not my job.

If YOU are claiming the document is fraudulent, it is up to you to provide 100% indisputable evidence that the document is fraudulent. It's not up to me to prove that it is authentic.

But since you are Arpaio's "posse" CAN'T PROVE IT'S FRAUDULENT...all of you fall back on the illogical argument of "Prove it's real". That's not how it works skippy...sorry.

Back up your own claims...prove that it is fake yourself...take it to court and be the hero of the Birther Nation. Oh right...you can't...because you, and everyone else, is unable to prove any of it is fraudulent...Arpaio even admitted he can't.

Tell me...how many Birther cases have been tossed out of courts around the nation???

And yet...you think I am the one that needs to back up the default position of the document being authentic.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 09:58 AM
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reply to post by Grambler
 


Hey, well, my intention wasn't to hurt anyone's feelings I was simply stating my opinion. I apologise if you took any of what I said personally.

Anyhoo, I think you're right about the banks and the whole LIBOR thing, if you check out my intro to ATS thread (the hello one, I'd link it but I don't know how). I explained to another member my feelings regarding the banking 'conspiracy' and how I think the main issue is in the use of the word 'conspiracy' and it's connotations, especially when used on a conspiracy theory website. It seems like I'm arguing semantics but it's actually central to the issue in my opinion.

In regards to the "most people hate the other guy" well, you might be right, you'll know a lot more than me about that (as you're American I presume, or at least have an interest in the politics beyond just "who won?"). Thing is, that doesn't really change the fact there ARE plenty of people using it as a "don't vote Obama" weapon AND genre are plenty of examples elsewhere on this site where people are using the same kind of double standards/heavy cognitive bias to prop up their belief systems.

I take your point on the mainstream media thing, you're right, it is kind of a standard that people set. My only issue is that it's heavily criticised by the same people who are then holding it up as evidence of their theories. I think you have to be consistent here to really be able to occupy thē high ground. If you think the MSM is truly a sham then you declare it so, and always so... Or you accept that it does report truth on key issues that the typical conspiracy theorist would argue they wouldn't or couldn't (in this case the fact that the presodent isnt really the lresident and never has been) .

I'd like to point out that I wasn't proposing that tptb ARE trying to discredit him in order to manoeuvre the other guy into position, I was simply pointing out that, if you believe that TPTB control the media and the govt and the world etc then you MUST accept that it is AT LEAST AS LIKELY that this birth certificate thing is a load of BS dreamed up by the NWO guys to sway the outcome of the election and therefore, no claims that this proves Obama is a fraud can seriously be made without also claiming that it proves he is being set up.....

I hope you can see my point (although I'm not asking you to agree of course) and seriously, I meant no offense...



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:00 AM
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I was searching immigration fraud in Hawaii and found this,
www.kohalagallery.com...

Immigration Marriage Fraud and VAWA Fraud 101
by John Sampson
CSI Investigations
It is estimated that of the 300,000+ immigrant visas issued on the basis of a marriage to a US citizen each year, nearly 30% of them are fraudulent.

As a result, there are thousands of American citizens who are viciously victimized by foreign nationals who will stop at nothing to gain entry into this country. The sad part is that the United States government oftentimes is not willing to assist a victimized citizen in obtaining some semblance of justice, nor are they prepared to protect its citizens from the abuses heaped upon them by foreign nationals who abuse American citizens and the American immigration "system" to get what they want and what they believe they are entitled to as a matter of "right".

And thousands of American citizens are the victims of sham or fraudulent marriages perpetrated by cold and heartless foreign nationals seeking the American Dream which creates the American Nightmare for the unsuspecting American citizen.

A sham or fraudulent marriage under immigration law is a marriage contracted for the sole purpose of evading the numerical restrictions that otherwise limit immigration into the United States. In Lutwak v. United States the Supreme Court stated that "Congress did not intend to provide aliens with an easy means of circumventing the quota system by fake marriages in which neither of the parties ever intended to enter into the marital relationship..."

Government statistics show that between 1978 and 1984 the number of immigrants acquiring status as spouses of United States citizens increased 43% as compared to a total immigration drop of 9.6%. The Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS) estimated that 30% of these spousal relationships were fraudulent.

Furthermore, Congress was made aware of the problem by the Immigration Service's discovery of numerous marriage fraud rings around the country and national media attention.

There are generally two types of sham marriages. One is the collusive or "contract"' marriage whereby a citizen agrees to marry an alien solely to enable the alien to achieve permanent resident status.

There is usually a fee involved for the citizen and an understanding that the marriage will be dissolved soon after the permanent resident status is obtained by the alien. The more blatant cases of this type of fraud have involved marriage "rings"' whereby citizen "spouses"' are supplied along with bogus documents.


Marriage rings.
and congress is aware,

our whole system is corrupt.

Welcome to Chicago’ mayor says with immigration law to protect, not profile

Read more: www.voxxi.com...

Now you don't think they are doing this out of the kindness of their hearts, do you?



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:00 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 



I'm calling BS on you again, OutKast!

WND clearly stated that investigators had a written manual with the rules and guidelines on the coding as well as U.K. Lee's statement..


Prove it.

If they clearly have all this evidence...why aren't they taking it to court???

Why will the turn it into a book like they did the last time which will invalidate any findings they had to be used in a court of law???

You are being played...and you don't even realize it...it's actually very sad to watch.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:02 AM
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reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


Evidence has been presented.

Either give us some intelligent feedback other than "prove it" or "you're a liar" or everyone on here will know you only as the troll that likes to take up space spouting useless nonsense.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:03 AM
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reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


The only people being played are the ones who don't want to do their research and listen to your garbage all day long instead!



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:04 AM
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Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by Deetermined
 



I'm calling BS on you again, OutKast!

WND clearly stated that investigators had a written manual with the rules and guidelines on the coding as well as U.K. Lee's statement..


Prove it.

If they clearly have all this evidence...why aren't they taking it to court???

Why will the turn it into a book like they did the last time which will invalidate any findings they had to be used in a court of law???

You are being played...and you don't even realize it...it's actually very sad to watch.



I don't know if you knew this, but Congress is a court. This is why they have hearings all the time and gather testimonies from people. They will simply use a few months to wear all this out so that people may judge and decide in their heart if Obahmer is a fake and a fraud.




edit on 18-7-2012 by Fromabove because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:04 AM
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Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


Evidence has been presented.

Either give us some intelligent feedback other than "prove it" or "you're a liar" or everyone on here will know you only as the troll that likes to take up space spouting useless nonsense.


What evidence?

And if it is solid evidence...why didn't they present it in a lawsuit instead of at a press conference???



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:06 AM
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Originally posted by longlostbrother
reply to post by Milkflavour
 


I'm not sure I follow your logic


I was referring to a previous post (in rather a silly and flippant fashion, I'm sorry) that I made about the capability of the most powerful, arguably most technologically advanced government and military in the world and their apparent inability to produce an even half-convincing fake birth certificate. Have a quick look back if you have time, it's the one about the fact they send spies all round the world on faked documents that are scrutinised by their enemies top security measures and the likelihood that a badly photoshopped id pribably wouldn't cut it (the inference being that they clearly have far more sophisticated tech than photoshop when it comes to faking very important and potentially life saving documentation... Which then logically begs the question, why would the do a half-arsed job on Obama Llama-Dingdong's birth certificate)

Edit: Crikey! The post I'm referring to is now waaay back on page 5! This thread is moving quickly!
edit on 18-7-2012 by Milkflavour because: Referrence



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:07 AM
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When will you all finally understand that We the People do not and have not elected any President that We have had through honest choice. The MSM tells us to pick either Dumb or Dumber.... and don't pay any attention to the man behind the curtain.

You all still bicker over Obama or Bush or McCain or Romney, like they are our only hope to "right the ship"..... It's pathetic...

The real power has hypnotized all of you to this left right para-dime that you are too polarized to see what they really have done to us.

Obama was hand picked to be president and the MSM fed you him as the next messiah and only now Romney can bring us back to ....just fill in the left right sound clip quote here.

Just stop, and comprehend the reasons that Obama was chosen for us and how he has been able to pass the most socialistic Healthcare tax that the SC approved and now We the People have to pay for regardless how you might feel about it.

The land of the free has been striped of it glory for the last 50 years and the real power has brought about what it wants and not what we the people want. Look to the bailout for further proof of this.

Think about how it only takes "winning" 3-4 states to win the Presidential election now and the Senate now dictates the terms to the house....

All it takes is paying for 51 Senators and the President and the US is held captive to their wants.....

When the last time you voted for Prez, how many names were on the ballot? 8, 9 maybe even 10 I'm sure. But how many names were mentioned as running by the MSM, only 2. That right there is your masters telling you who to vote for.

So Obama has a fake BC, well guess what, you all are under the control of those that control Obama so it does not matter. If you deny this, then you are still under hypnosis.

Sirric
edit on 18/7/12 by sirric because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:07 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 


Debunked nonsense has been presented.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:07 AM
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reply to post by Fromabove
 




I don't know if you know this, but Congress is a court. This is why they have hearing all the time and gather testimonies from people. They will simply use a few months to wear all this out so that people may judge and decide in their heart if Obahmer is a fake and a fraud.


So why didn't they present it to Congress??? Why did Arpaio say that he has no plans on doing anything else with this evidence, but hopes someone will look into it???

You guys are just proving my point.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:07 AM
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reply to post by Turkenstein
 



Originally posted by Turkenstein
After all that, how do you know they didn't check Bush's?


The same way we don't know if they checked Obama's! If you're willing to assume that "they" checked Bush's, but didn't make an announcement, then it's fair to assume "they" checked Obama's, too.


How do you know "they" didn't check Obama's?



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:08 AM
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reply to post by Milkflavour
 


thanks!



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:08 AM
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reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 




If they clearly have all this evidence...why aren't they taking it to court???


What part didn't you understand about them turning this information over to the federal government because it was beyond their ability to take it to court.

And what part do you not understand about the courts already telling people that this can only be handled by Congress and the courts can't do anything about it anyway??!!



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:09 AM
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Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by OutKast Searcher
 


The only people being played are the ones who don't want to do their research and listen to your garbage all day long instead!


Did you watch the press conference? I did, they presented no evidence.

The best part of the conference was the reporters absolutely nailing them with their questions.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:09 AM
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reply to post by Deetermined
 


The part where you just made that last bit up.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:10 AM
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Originally posted by caladonea
For me there is not enough proof to prove that President Obama was not born in the United States.

I am saying too...this birther movement is all propaganda.
i don't think it is because i don't understand why he would put his already fading reputation on the line like this. but seriously who knows? we get lied to a LOT.

you could easily be right.



posted on Jul, 18 2012 @ 10:12 AM
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proves the cronies before broke our banks and the system, then they allow a fake in as President that has wasted years of our time and screwed over our economical way yet again. Apparently Presidency, Kings and Monarchs are the fall to civilizations. Great another 10-15 trillion in the hole over # #! What fake is next?





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