Is purposeless torture moral?

reply to post by RealSpoke


Hydroman is about to level up to Hydroscientist!

Originally posted by randomname
you didn't exist before you were born, you exist now.

Quick, someone call Captain Obvious!

reply to post by Greatest I am


No torture, just eternal death. Google Sheol and Gehenna. "Hell" is not an accurate description, it is taken from the greek Hades probably because the grecians couldn't understand that you get dumped out with all the unwanted trash of humanity, the only torture is there is no light from Yahweh, just the darkness of death.

The really bad ones end up in a blackhole, if you believe the book of Enoch, the abyss is a supermassive blackhole where 5 of Satan's chief fallen angels are being held imprisoned.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

No torture, just eternal death. Google Sheol and Gehenna. "Hell" is not an accurate description, it is taken from the greek Hades probably because the grecians couldn't understand that you get dumped out with all the unwanted trash of humanity, the only torture is there is no light from Yahweh, just the darkness of death.

The really bad ones end up in a blackhole, if you believe the book of Enoch, the abyss is a supermassive blackhole where 5 of Satan's chief fallen angels are being held imprisoned.

Cool, then I'm not worried about it.

reply to post by Greatest I am


Torture only creates EVIL! Evil is a learned behavior.

reply to post by Greatest I am


Okay, I will look at this two ways. First, I will assume that hell exists. It is not purposeless. Its purpose is to repay those who laid harm on other people, similar to prison. We also have prisons to keep dangerous people out of society the same way that hell keeps dangerous people out of heaven. The people there made the choice to harm others, do you want this to be overlooked?

Harm to self, though, through not knowing any better, is a different matter. I hardly think it would be fair to lock someone up in hell for eternity for being stupid and hurting themselves through bad choices. I would prefer a reincarnation method, where they repeat life until they learn more healthy living on their own through punishments they receive naturally through cause and effect.

So the second way I am going to look at this, is from the other perspective, the personal and metaphorical perspective. We create our own heaven and hells on earth based on the decisions we make - whether they are healthy or unhealthy. This is how things are done in this universe, and it is moral at its core.

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by sageofmonticello

 

No it was just a guess. A lot of people with lots of money are stubborn, arrogant and ignorant, and you display those qualities overtly....

You must be insanely wealthy the, got a few billion I can have? We need to pay off the mortgage on our new church, and I promise to tithe from it too.......

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by Hydroman

 

I've answered this already and I'm not going to do your reading for you.

if you want to seek Him, you will,

I'm done here for a little while.

No, you didn't answer anything, you simply stated that it proves it was divinely inspired, you did not explain how, you did throw around a few links, but we want to hear the wisdom from you. You are running around the question, trying desperately not to answer it.

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by Hydroman

 

No, I do not agree on any of that.

There are TONS of original writings,

and they are all in agreement with eachother.

Look into Biblical authenticity

www.godandscience.org...

There are tons of original writings, maybe, some added, some taken away and put in the apocrypha, especially if they did not jive with other letters. and before all of this, it was passed down by word of mouth from fallible man to fallible man for between 60 and 300 years, then after these original writings, you get your various translations, and mistranslations.

How about you tell us, rather than posting some link and scuttling away like that link is somehow prove anything that you have not already parroted.

And no, contradictions are contradictions, even if they are inspired by god.

Nothing you have said in the last few days, not one thing has so much as maintained my faith, in fact, sitting here reading your writing, and the writings of people like you, only serve to embarrass me as a Christian, and make me wonder if I look as ridiculous as you do when I talk about my faith. All you are succeeding in doing for me is make me question my faith, and question organized religion, that is a pretty amazing to do to a guy who's mother was finishing her Master's of Divinity before she became very ill, and never managed to get back to it before she passed, and who's father trained to be an Anglican Priest.

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by sageofmonticello

 

Of course Jesus is proud of my days work.

All morning and afternoon I was on here, wielding Gods mighty sword and shield against vast amounts of ignorance and deception.

You're right, all in a days work.

I love how you keep calling me names, but base every one of your accusations on the "fact" that the Book my worldview is based on is wrong.

Your like some pissant kid, who sees a bowl of green beans and refuses to try even one, and declares they are unedible because there green.

God help us


PS, nothing I've said makes me seem like an ignorant closed minded person, your own warped views are making you believe that.

If you'd look at some of my other posts, you'd realize I am far, far, FAR from closeminded OR ignorant.

edit on 4/12/2012 by Iason321 because: (no reason given)

See, funny, that won't work for me, as I have studied the Bible, with my eyes open,not relying on the biased spin that others put on it, or try to tell me what it meant, I have studied it long and hard, and see the impossibilities, the inadequacies, the contradictions, that tells me the bible is not perfect, it is a body of trth to live by, but not literal.

Pretty much EVERYTHING you have said makes you sound like a passive aggressive, arrogant, ignorant close minded person, especially the in your face praying for a person's soul who specifically asked you not to do that, that is no different than a smoke blowing smoke int he face of a person who asked nicely for the smoker to please not smoke around him.

reply to post by Greatest I am

my point or opinion is, as a human being, you are not able to decide your fate. as a human, you are other-directed by non-human beings, spirits etc. when you are born, you do not decide, if you become a mayor or murder or police man, you are made, imo.

reply to post by RyanFromCan


I am a pretty hardcore Jesus Head.

I want to rub you in all the ways I am.

I am succeeding,

What makes a sane man have insane faith?

Ask yourself this?

Do I appear incoherent? Do I appear unable to articulate thoughts clearly and meaningfully?

I don't care what you think of me, or what you believe, I am planting a seed in you, for Gods purpose....

Originally posted by Iason321
I don't care what you think of me, or what you believe, I am planting a seed in you, for Gods purpose....

Gross man.

reply to post by Hydroman


LOL

cmon thats low

taking a good mannered post out of context to give it some sick meaning,

you're going to hell for that one!

/sarcasm

Originally posted by Iason321
LOL

cmon thats low

taking a good mannered post out of context to give it some sick meaning,

you're going to hell for that one!

/sarcasm

Giving you a star for having a sense of humor.

Originally posted by Hydroman

Originally posted by Iason321
I don't care what you think of me, or what you believe, I am planting a seed in you, for Gods purpose....

Gross man.

My monitor now has a fine sheen of quickly drying coffee on it, and I am trying to find the turkey baster............

Thanks

P.S. Would this be a Leviticus 18:22 situation?

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

No torture, just eternal death. Google Sheol and Gehenna. "Hell" is not an accurate description, it is taken from the greek Hades probably because the grecians couldn't understand that you get dumped out with all the unwanted trash of humanity, the only torture is there is no light from Yahweh, just the darkness of death.

The really bad ones end up in a blackhole, if you believe the book of Enoch, the abyss is a supermassive blackhole where 5 of Satan's chief fallen angels are being held imprisoned.

You know this as a fact, how?

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Apollo7
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

Torture only creates EVIL! Evil is a learned behavior.

I agree.

I am still working on the morality of torture soeme of the time. It may be that the answer is yes.

I think that we could build a scenario that would say that yes, there may be instances where it could be moral but it would have to include known facts to the torturer and a damned good justification for doing so.

Let us see if this scenario can help us decide.
A criminal has hidden an A bomb in your city that will go off in less time than it takes to evacuate a million people. He admits this to his torturer.

I think it may be morally justified then to try to torture the information out of him.

The good of the many in this case would need to be placed above the good of the one to be tortured and even above the good mental health of the one doing the torturing.

Do you agree or is it more moral not to try to save a million people?

Regards
DL

Originally posted by darkbake
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

Okay, I will look at this two ways. First, I will assume that hell exists. It is not purposeless. Its purpose is to repay those who laid harm on other people, similar to prison. ]

Ok.

The victim in heaven is happy with the one who sinned against him in .00000000000000000000000000000000000000001 of their lives, to now have the perpetrator now spend another 100000000000000000000000000 + years in torture.

Just who is sick here? The sinner or the one sinned against who demands such a hell?

Regards
DL

Originally posted by icepack
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

my point or opinion is, as a human being, you are not able to decide your fate. as a human, you are other-directed by non-human beings, spirits etc. when you are born, you do not decide, if you become a mayor or murder or police man, you are made, imo.

Einstein and I agree.

Regards
DL