Opinion: Bosnia's lesson for Syrian slaughter

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posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 01:17 AM
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Originally posted by Intrud3r

Originally posted by wingsfan

Originally posted by cprnicus
Yugoslavia has always been the melting pot of Europe where east meets west, Christian meets Muslim and races converge.


Uhhh, you must of missed the part where they and there neighbors spent centuries fighting off invading hordes of arabs/muslims.


Arabs?
GTFO

They fought the Ottoman Empire, not the Arabs ffs. They didnt fight them off, most of the former Yugoslavia was under the Ottoman rule for around 500 years.


Thats correct and also they forced the serbs to convert to Islam it was either Convert or face annihilation extermination.

The Serbs had no choice other then to convert.


This is why in its confusion, the Bosnian Muslims actually believe they are Islamic for which they are not, there grand fathers were not Muslim but Slavic.

As for the Albanians they came out after the fall of the Ottoman Empire.




posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 01:21 AM
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Lads i have long given up on getting through to people...even on sites like ATS almost everybody is so brainwashed by the MSM they dont even realise it. They claim to be denying ignorance yet they will parrot away MSM and govt fabrications all day long without even realising it.

They could all Watch the Judgement! movie that i have linked to before, which shows in video the actual hoax that led to the manufacturing of the "death camps" Time magazine cover. It shows everybody the blueprint used for demonising a nation, and how the MSM is complicit. But i bet not one single person here has watched it.

They could research the conflict itself, and understand that the Milosevic "hate speech" in Kosovo was actually a call for unity in Yugoslavia, simply by reading a transcript of the speech. instead they listen to the MSM claim that it was a call to Serbian nationalism (whatever that is...Yugoslavia was set up by Serbs who wanted to live in unity with their neighbours; instead the Serbs could have taken virtually all of the Balkans if they were bloodthirsty).

They could look at WW2, and see that while the govts and people of Croatia and Bosnian Muslims actively supported the Nazis (and had large-scale death camps to kill jews, serbs, and gypsies) the Serbian people rose up once they heard that the govt had signed a pact with the Nazis, because the Serbian people did not want to support Hitler and his ways. The 22 divisions that Germany sent could not subdue the resistance movement, because the people refused anything aside from freedom.

They could look at the history of Serbia and how the Serbian people lived by the motto "freedom or death", and see that the Serbian people have the same love for freedom and fight against terrorism in the same way as American patriots. The way that Serbs saved US airmen in WW2, despite the Nazis killing civilians in retaliation, because it was felt that the Serbian sacrifice was necessary to help defeat tyranny.

But instead they choose to listen to their politicians and the media, and even a lot of those who support Ron Paul and libertarian ideals dont even see the hypocrisy of their positions when it comes to war.

Serbia was a blueprint for the future. It was the conflict that gave NATO an offensive role, which they have relished ever since. It was a conflict where they used moral positions and blatant propaganda to sell a pointless conflict to the American people. Belgrade was the scene for the first American attack on China through the bombing of the Chinese embassy (which you can bet the Chinese have not forgotten).

But the sheep will never wake up.



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 02:03 AM
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Originally posted by zvezdar
Lads i have long given up on getting through to people...even on sites like ATS almost everybody is so brainwashed by the MSM they dont even realise it. They claim to be denying ignorance yet they will parrot away MSM and govt fabrications all day long without even realising it.

They could all Watch the Judgement! movie that i have linked to before, which shows in video the actual hoax that led to the manufacturing of the "death camps" Time magazine cover. It shows everybody the blueprint used for demonising a nation, and how the MSM is complicit. But i bet not one single person here has watched it.





You're talking about this Time magazine cover, right ?

Hoax ?

Dont think so. There are loads of other videos from the deathcamps, take a look



edit on 9-4-2012 by Intrud3r because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 03:06 AM
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Originally posted by zvezdar
Lads i have long given up on getting through to people...even on sites like ATS almost everybody is so brainwashed by the MSM they dont even realise it. They claim to be denying ignorance yet they will parrot away MSM and govt fabrications all day long without even realising it.

They could all Watch the Judgement! movie that i have linked to before, which shows in video the actual hoax that led to the manufacturing of the "death camps" Time magazine cover. It shows everybody the blueprint used for demonising a nation, and how the MSM is complicit. But i bet not one single person here has watched it.


Another fact you cant argue against are the rulings of the International Court of Justice against the Bosnian Serbs who were involved in the deathcamp atrocities.

The sentences:


The Republika Srpska officials responsible for running the camp have since been indicted and found guilty of crimes against humanity and war crimes.

Commanders of the camp, Miroslav Kvočka, Dragoljub Prcač, Milojica Kos, and Mlađo Radić, and a local taxi driver, Zoran Žigić were all found guilty of crimes against humanity. Kvočka, Prcač, Kos and Radić were sentenced to five, six, seven and 20 years respectively; Žigić was given the longest term of 25 years.[2]

Željko Mejakić was found guilty of crimes against humanity (murder, imprisonment, torture, sexual violence, persecution, and other inhumane acts). He was the de facto commander of Omarska camp and perpetrated one instance of mistreatment. It was found the he was part of a joint criminal enterprise with the intent of promoting mistreatment and persecution of detainees in the camp. He was sentenced to 21 years of imprisonment.[19]

Momčilo Gruban was found guilty of crimes against humanity (murder, imprisonment, torture, sexual violence, persecution, and other inhumane acts). He had command responsibility for crimes committed at the camp and acted as part of a joint criminal enterprise. He was sentenced to 11 years imprisonment.[19]

Duško Knežević was found guilty of crimes against humanity (murder, torture, sexual violence, persecution, and other inhumane acts). He was found to have been directly involved in the crimes carried out in the Omarska and Keraterm camps. He was also found guilty under the theory of joint criminal enterprise for furthering the Omarska and Keraterm camps’ systems of mistreatment and persecution of detainees. He was sentenced to 31 years imprisonment.[19]


Detailed version:

www.icty.org...

Feel free to post your Judgment video all you want.



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 03:08 AM
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Originally posted by ZIVONIC
Keep in mind when you post them that something like 20% of both Bosnian and Croatian Partisans were ethnically Serbian.


Originally posted by Agent_USA_Supporter
There were no Croatians in the Partisan army


Mmkay, some of us don't like the official numbers. There is a word for that - negationism.



In attempting to revise the past, illegitimate historical revisionism appeals to the intellect—via techniques illegitimate to historical discourse—to advance a given interpretive historical view, typically involving war crimes or crimes against humanity.


Anyway, it is offtopic and no one really cares anymore.
Please do continue posting anonymous internet comments and whine how the whole world thinks you're evil.
edit on 9-4-2012 by Exitt because: .



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 03:55 AM
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Originally posted by Intrud3r

Originally posted by wingsfan

Originally posted by cprnicus
Yugoslavia has always been the melting pot of Europe where east meets west, Christian meets Muslim and races converge.


Uhhh, you must of missed the part where they and there neighbors spent centuries fighting off invading hordes of arabs/muslims.


Arabs?
GTFO

They fought the Ottoman Empire, not the Arabs ffs. They didnt fight them off, most of the former Yugoslavia was under the Ottoman rule for around 500 years.


I know they were ottomans(turks), but today they are intrusive arabs/muslims. You probably know that as your name is "Intruder". Serbia is euro land, it is not some magical, multicult BS people are making it out to be. They shall do and think whatever they want in their own land.

Occupied or not, someone shouldn't go on saying it's a melting pot where east meets west. Nobody asked or wanted them there. Muslims want soo much to cling to Europe, I wonder why...............



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 10:22 AM
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reply to post by Intrud3r
 


I was a Refuge Camp as for the skinny guy that was Tuberculosis, Tuberculosis was very well common in Bosnia heres a example



Tuberculosis Rate Jumped in 1992

I have discussed this issue of the so called Serb Camp to death.

Wake up.


Judgment! 1/3 - The Bosnian 'Death Camp' Accusation: An Expose


When you watch the Video you will notice the other Bosnian look completely just fine.


If this was a Nazi why aren't there any guards?
if it was a POW why arent they wearing like what the Jews wear in the Nazi Camps?



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 10:24 AM
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reply to post by Intrud3r
 





Another fact you cant argue against are the rulings of the International Court of Justice against the Bosnian Serbs who were involved in the deathcamp atrocities.


And just tell me do you know who influences, the one sided International Court of Justice? America, Britain



against the Bosnian Serbs who were involved in the deathcamp atrocities.

Claims all made by the Mainstream media and paid stooges.



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 10:26 AM
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reply to post by Intrud3r
 





You're talking about this Time magazine cover, right ? Hoax ? Dont think so. There are loads of other videos from the deathcamps, take a look


Ah yes the Time magazine the biggest propaganda magazine around? and yes it was Hoax and why it was Hoax? because the west wanted to frame the serbs as the biggest villains next to the Nazis and with the mainstream media and there tricks it worked.

And people like you believe it because lets be honest you would be anything the media tells you.


There are loads of other videos from the deathcamps, take a look

And the users are all Radical Bosnian Muslims on YouTube at least in one of those videos that you mentioned that, just look at the related videos see there names of the titles?
edit on 9-4-2012 by Agent_USA_Supporter because: (no reason given)
edit on 9-4-2012 by Agent_USA_Supporter because: (no reason given)
edit on 9-4-2012 by Agent_USA_Supporter because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 10:39 AM
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reply to post by Exitt
 


Oh how typical that and now you accuse me of been historical revisionist i should have expected that from if your going to like that why are you replying here? did i hit a nerve? because it seems that it did.

First you accuse me of been a propaganda artist and then you accuse me of been delusion and now you accuse of me been a historical revisionist.

In attempting to revise the past, illegitimate historical revisionism appeals to the intellect—via techniques illegitimate to historical discourse—to advance a given interpretive historical view, typically involving war crimes or crimes against humanity.



If that's the logical response your going to be replying with by accusing people of lying i am sorry to say this but that wont help your cause.

Not only that you accuse of me of lying that i am lying about me been in Bosnia and on what i saw in Bosnia? i am not surprised you would rather believe the Western Mainstream claims that Serbs are evil or that they are Nazis.

These are the Western Mainstream news outlets that have lied about the first gulf war and the second gulf war whats makes you think they haven't lied about in Yugoslavia? the media works in three phases.


And yet after the three phases never goes back to the issue, why you think CNN is avoiding Libya now? well its simple because it would hurt Obama's image and NATO image of the mission.
edit on 9-4-2012 by Agent_USA_Supporter because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2012 @ 02:38 PM
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Intended as a gentle word of advice:

Speak to the OP not the posters....

Back on topic (sort of)

We all suffer from the same handicap. A) We don't know everything, and B) We generally believe the sources we have vetted ourselves, but not those vetted by others we don't know.

As for the "MSM" it may be time to review our concept of what that means. What we refer to as the MSM now is literally "owned" by less than a dozen individuals. Some say as little as five people. The odds of an unbiased editorial policy therein seems unlikely.

Historical sources are under constant barrage by truth-seekers, and unfortunately, that consigns us to the sad fact that as they chase that truth, they "make" that truth. It is the effect of setting out to "prove" rather than "find" the truth.

Whatever the historical context, there only one certainty ... that the vast (VAST) majority of those killed and damaged by the conflict had NOTHING to do with instigating it. It is our "leaders" who war. Of course they will provide suitable motivation for those who aren't naturally inclined to murder strangers.... Whomever you decide to believe, remember... there was a reason you believe it... and that reason is not necessarily any 'truth' as such.. .but more likely a "choice".

Choose peace... then see what happens. We already know what happens when you choose hate.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 03:21 AM
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Originally posted by wingsfan

Originally posted by Intrud3r

Originally posted by wingsfan

Originally posted by cprnicus
Yugoslavia has always been the melting pot of Europe where east meets west, Christian meets Muslim and races converge.


Uhhh, you must of missed the part where they and there neighbors spent centuries fighting off invading hordes of arabs/muslims.


Arabs?
GTFO

They fought the Ottoman Empire, not the Arabs ffs. They didnt fight them off, most of the former Yugoslavia was under the Ottoman rule for around 500 years.


I know they were ottomans(turks), but today they are intrusive arabs/muslims. You probably know that as your name is "Intruder". Serbia is euro land, it is not some magical, multicult BS people are making it out to be. They shall do and think whatever they want in their own land.

Occupied or not, someone shouldn't go on saying it's a melting pot where east meets west. Nobody asked or wanted them there. Muslims want soo much to cling to Europe, I wonder why...............




Your knowledge about Balkans is around 0. Wars on Balkans were ethnic wars not religious. Serbians fought Croats aswell, Croats are Roman Catholic if you didnt know. Croats and Bosniaks (muslims) were both victims of Serb ethnic cleansing, aswell as Serbs were victims of Croatian ethnic cleansing in the later stage of the war in Croatia. Muslims of Bosnia dont want to cling to Europe. they have always been there FFS, they are not Turks. There are no Turks or Arabs on the Balkans.

Here is a few pics of muslim girls from Sarajevo, just so u get the idea what "kind" of muslims they are.







Yugoslavia was a melting pot. Bosnia was a melting pot, just take a look at this pic:

Sarajevo:



A synagogue, Catholic church, Serbian Orthodox church and a mosque all within a few hundred meters away from each other.

I rest my case. Stop derailing this thread into west vs. muslims because it is not. Educate yourself, deny ignorance.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 03:43 AM
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reply to post by Agent_USA_Supporter
 


Do you really want to argue the rulings of the International Court of Justice ? As far as i know, everyone could watch those court hearings from the ICTY. If this all was a hoax and Judgment movie is some kind of a proof for it, why didnt you send it to ICTY? You are basicly telling me that the Serb truth is the only real truth in the world ? An amateur video is a proof but court rulings supported by video footage and eyewitness testimony is not ?
edit on 10-4-2012 by Intrud3r because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 04:05 AM
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Originally posted by Maxmars
As for the "MSM" it may be time to review our concept of what that means. What we refer to as the MSM now is literally "owned" by less than a dozen individuals. Some say as little as five people. The odds of an unbiased editorial policy therein seems unlikely.


I do agree with you 100%, but comparing Syria and Bosnia is just wrong. The OP has done it in several threads. Difference between Syria and Bosnia is Bosnian war ended 17 years ago. Almost everything the media reported from Bosnia proved to be right.

Mass killings of civilians:

news.bbc.co.uk...

this one is the latest:

www.b92.net...

Rape:

read the Kunarac trial:

www.icty.org...


Bosniak (Bosnian Muslim) women were raped by the Serbs as part of a methodical and concentrated campaign of ethnic cleansing. For instance, the girls and women selected by the later convicted war criminal Dragoljub Kunarac or by his men, were systematically taken to the soldiers' base, a house located in Osmana Đikić street no 16. There, the women and girls (some as young as 14 were repeatedly raped. Serb soldiers regularly took Muslim girls from various detention centres and kept them as sex slaves.


The media didnt have to use propaganda, all the horror was real.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 04:15 AM
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reply to post by Intrud3r
 







If this all was a hoax and Judgment movie is some kind of a proof for it, why didnt you send it to ICTY?


It already was send to the the joke courts. I guess in your mind Bosnian Muslim did no harm they were angels right?
edit on 10-4-2012 by Agent_USA_Supporter because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 04:22 AM
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Originally posted by Intrud3r
Do you really want to argue the rulings of the International Court of Justice ?

You know, that wouldn't even be a bad thing. We all joined ATS i think in seeking of truth, we should (and do) question everything. But when the supposed 'truth seekers' instead of links, numbers, arguments and real proof give you this


Originally posted by Agent_USA_Supporter
i know that because one of my family member and her father was a commander


C'mon, you can't beat that

This whole thread is a joke .. moving on to the UFO section.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 04:23 AM
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reply to post by Intrud3r
 


What your doing is simple your putting all the blame on the Serbs i know who you remind me of you remind of that member that was also from Bosnia and it was Obvious what his agenda was on here, it was to pretend and forth claim that you Bosnian Muslims were the only victims and of course.

You would be saying that 90% of the atrocities were done by the Serbs right? my goodness i have never seen such a blunted propaganda.

Its pretty obvious what your trying to do here.






A synagogue, Catholic church, Serbian Orthodox church and a mosque all within a few hundred meters away from each other.


Oh and expect leave out the facts that those minorities like the jews and Catholics dont have any civil rights or any rights for that matter, unless they convert.



a mosque all within a few hundred meters away
There are more mosques now in Bosnia and i would say plenty rather then churches.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 04:39 AM
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reply to post by Intrud3r
 


Funny how you linked the BBC news article, the BBC has been well know to make propaganda against the serbian people including one of there films.

The Serbian Time Bomb.




The media didnt have to use propaganda, all the horror was real.


Really? so if it was true that serbs are evil and were evil, where are the dead bodies from the iraq war lie, the in famous the Incubator lie?

And also i noted a little problem from you quoted text from the trail.




Bosniak (Bosnian Muslim) women were raped by the Serbs as part of a methodical and concentrated campaign of ethnic cleansing. For instance, the girls and women selected by the later convicted war criminal Dragoljub Kunarac or by his men, were systematically taken to the soldiers' base, a house located in Osmana Đikić street no 16. There, the women and girls (some as young as 14 were repeatedly raped. Serb soldiers regularly took Muslim girls from various detention centres and kept them as sex slaves.




First Problem.



Bosniak (Bosnian Muslim) women were raped by the Serbs as part of a methodical and concentrated campaign of ethnic cleansing


Second.



kept them as sex slaves.



91% or More Of the ethnic cleansing was caused by the Bosniak against the Serbian people and as well croatians only later on the war have the Bosniak and Croatians turned on each other.


The western mainstream News outlets never bothered on reporting the figures from there sides, the only thing they wanted was an excuse in which NATO, and America would send out there forces.


What you Intrud3r are doing is simple your playing the other side propaganda against the Serbian people.
I am not surprised.

The moment you saw the thread with the name and tile in your mind told you that you had to respond right?
and whats wrong on what i said?

Opinion: Bosnia's lesson for Syrian slaughter, CNN Playing The Bosnian Card

CNN is playing the Bosnian card what makes you think they aren't? CNN would try anything just to pump some support for a intervention.

Even though the general public opinion is against it.



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 04:48 AM
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reply to post by Intrud3r
 





Your knowledge about Balkans is around 0


And you have prefect knowledge about the Balkans? Ok time for a little history lesson about The Turks and there invasion of the Balkans.






Muslims of Bosnia dont want to cling to Europe. they have always been there FFS, they are not Turks. There are no Turks or Arabs on the Balkans.


There are no Turks or Arabs on the Balkans.

That is the most ridicules thing i have heard in a well. There are No Turks in the Balkans? really?

Source

Source

Source


And here are Islamic terrorists the mujahedin.



Ah remember that march? i wonder how come CNN,BBC never showed that to the American General Public?

I got plenty more of sources.

As i edit this, the history of the Serbian people,there lands, there traditions are been ethnically wiped out.
The Bosniaks claimed that serbs were ethnically killing them, yet the Bosniaks population is well over 49% to
58% as it was during before the war started.


The Serbian population in Bosnia is far far less then it was during before the wars started.

Now please tell me again who was doing the killings? as i saw the war with my own eyes at the age of 5 years old i was sickened on what i witnessed.

Thanks to the war i had war trauma because of the horrible images, from people killing themselves with a hand grenade and people been gun down.

I am not surprised there are people that dont believe me
and yet you would rather the Western mainstream news outlets who were one sided?


Not once as Either FOX,BBC,CBC have spoken with a Serbian War victim when we came to Italy after a few months stay in Croatia.

We turned on to CNN for the news i was disgusted that CNN didn't never bothered to let a Serbian victim of the war speak he or her mind of the war, and how they plan on fleeing.

That was the most disgusted and sad thing i have seen when i was a child, with my family member. But i shouldn't be surprised.

America needed a new enemy after the cold war and the Serbs played the prefect role And i am sadden here in this thread alone people are buying into the propaganda created by the mainstream news outlets.

And Yet most of there news journalists have connections to either the pentagon or the CFR that usual play along with there agenda in Europe and the Med East.


Intrud3r do you know anything about the CFR? if you are looking for the truth look there, and also look for George soro, it seems Soros had huge money roll outs during the war in Yugoslavia funding either one of the factions.
edit on 10-4-2012 by Agent_USA_Supporter because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2012 @ 05:21 AM
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The Balkan wars were a disaster on many fronts.

The media portrayal was as we all know slanted with a particular propagandist view. And we all know why this was the case. No point getting into that.

Regardless of what side of the war you come from ethnically, you have to admit that atrocities were committed on all sides. This is 100% true.

Number being inflated may have happened and there are also instances of outside intervention in some instances as "triggers" to certain battles.

I have even heard first hand accounts and seen some smuggled video of before and after of how the RED CROSS themselves aided the evacuation of a hospital near Vukovar and the seperation of all males from females which were then taken to a barn and all executed. Nothing officially came out of this....for it was Serbs doing the slaughtering in this instance.

The same sort of situations happened in the croation province of Krajina,when the croats were driving out the serbs.

We know of the reports of Mujahadeen coming to Bosnia to aid the local moslems in their fighting.

Reports of "NATO" snipers taking pot shots at opposing ethnic groups to fire up more killings.

These things we are seeing occuring now in Syria .

Syria, like with the Balkans, we will never know the whole complete story because it doesnt suit the Western Societies "need to know" status.

The only way you might know more than the average person is if you know people that have lived through the tradgedy of their countries falling apart from both sides of the fence and can compare the differing/similar experiences.

Bottom line, who care what happened 500 years ago or 15 years ago, we cannot change it now...its been done.

And we are seeing it happening again, and we will continue to see it happen in the future because it is a powerful tool/method for detroying nations/societies.

Weaken them from within before attacking them from outside....the question remains....for how long will we continue to bear witness to it?



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