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'Honour' violence is acceptable, say one in five young British Asians

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posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 11:31 AM
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Originally posted by petrus4

This is not true, Jameela. There are other Muslims here who I have been able to have positive communications with. But one characteristic which they had, which you do not, was a willingness to admit that your people are not perfect, and they are not innocent.

You do not know how difficult it is, emotionally, for me to attempt to be fair towards you.

You must simply understand, that while peace may eventually come that it will not necessarily come exclusively on your own terms.


Here is the problem, any issues I have with Muslims are between Muslims, has nothing to do with you, so why would I speak on these issues with you? The problems Muslims face with fundamentalists we take up with them. Any grievances in our countries we have, we take up with the peoples of our countries.

If I were to sit around and complain about problems we have in our countries to you... and I have seen your actions... will be used as more ammunition to go and invade our countries, anything I say has the possibility of getting put onto fox news as the newest reason to hate and kill Muslims, and I will happily face hell fire before I do that to my peoples. Besides, our problems are our own, and it will be we who fixes them, I will die before I ask help from the west.

When it comes to things like fundamentalism, I will and do speak out against it to your community with the hope you will put an end to your governments funding of these groups that are harmful to our societies and peoples. But only in this context, the problems I have with fundamentalism I will face head on with the fundamentalists themselves and not with you. When you all stop funding them, we can more easily tamp out that particular fire in our communities.

If it is apologetics to speak the truth, such as in this thread where I said honor killings have nothing to do with Islam and showed proof of this, and showed proof that it predates both Islam and Christianity, and showed proof it exists in some Christian cultures too, and tried for people to see reason rather than only blame Muslims, then you may call me an apologist. But to me this is only speaking the truth.

Any personal problems I may have with honor killings that may or may not exist in my community, I will take up inside my community and certainly not here in yours. Again, this is something that is our problem to fix where it exists within our communities and not yours. All I will do in your community is to speak the truth about certain misconceptions you may have where it concerns the teachings of Islam.


As I have said on this forum in the past is that all forms of government have their own problems because we are in fact human, and as such we are imperfect beings. It is to each individual society to decide which model they think will work best for them and do their best with it. If they find it fails them, it is up to them and them alone to change it.

It is not for one people to decide what is right for the entire world, as people and cultures are different, with different sets of values and ideals.


If you all want on this forum is people who will speak against Islam and Muslims so people can have more to hate then I am not your person, you can call the CIA I am sure they will be glad to help you.




posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 11:46 AM
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hi jameela

me personally have seen racial abuse many times that go unreported (mine including)
what you have to understand is this
Britain is a small island
we have many different religions here
But at the moment the only religion thats shouting its mouth of is islam
sorry if it sounds harsh but that is the sheer fact
you cant tell me i did not see what i seen..
dave



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 11:50 AM
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reply to post by Mclaneinc
 



Joe, are you on drugs mate (meant in a joke way), you have twice labelled me the bigot based upon your illogical thinking and simply the ignorance to not read what was written or fail to understand it. I'm Northern Irish and part of a mixed race marriage AND have muslim inlaws who love me to bits, where in heavens name do you get bigot from?

Not sure I've actually called you anything Mac...I did suggest that you have a self control problem.Edit: for which I humbly apologise.



As for the highlighted part, don't blame me, blame Harvard scientists and medical experts in general, there is a proven link to close family sexual intercourse and deformity. The fact its relevant in Pakistani people isn't the point, I used them because they do and have done for hundreds of years use close family marriage, I'm sorry but I can't undo the text books to satisfy your annoyance

Cool, and the relevance of your in breeding comment to the OP is....? Be carefull how you answer as Olln has decreed the sample size large enough to be valid.



As for Jameela, I have no clue as to her background and any bigotry she has faced, no one deserves that but her attitude is one of refusing to accept there are bad Muslims, there are, fact, there are bad people in every race creed and religion, fact.

Really? because I've seen her and nusnus etal fully acknowledge the fact there are f-wit muslims and its other posters who seem determined to believe in a 'muslim hivemind'.

Our survey says that 92% of muslims polled do NOT agree it is right to to physically punish a female member of the family if she brings dishonour to her family or community...FACT.



If you can't deal with that then you are in the wrong place to try and discuss it.

says the fella who cried because his post was used to attack bigots and bigotry..tho props and a cold beer to ya Mac for understanding I was taking the piss out of our Anglo - Aussie friend...if he looks like either of the two lads in the pic I posted I'm sure the NF would welcome him with open arms



edit on 26-3-2012 by joewalker because: (no reason given)

edit on 26-3-2012 by joewalker because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by joewalker

Lol, the hypocracy is strong in this thread, especially the 'codeword' BS...



Don't you read the papers?



Grooming of girls by Asian gangs fuelled by unhappy arranged marriages to cousins claims Muslim peer

Daily Mail

Classroom apartheid: Teachers who were afraid to discipline thuggish minority of Asian pupils for fear of being branded racist

Daily Mail

Politically correct social workers and police 'ignoring abuse' in Asian families

Daily Mail

White man bottled and teenager punched in second unprovoked Asian gang race hate attack in just days

Daily Mail

Minister: Asian communities have ignored sex grooming

Daily Mail

Teen girl 'acted as recruiter for Asian sex gang'

The Telegraph

If you want to stop South Asian immigrants bringing in their wives, then say so

The Telegraph

'Honour code' supported by young Asians, poll says

BBC

UK riots: Birmingham murder inquiry after car kills three British Asian men

The Guardian

Asian man cleared of racially abusing Nick Griffin

The Guardian

Firm denies racism as Asian man fakes CV

The Guardian

Police treat Asian man's murder as racist

The Guardian



Originally posted by joewalker


Police are searching for a man who threw acid at a mother as she walked with her six-month-old baby in Salford, Greater Manchester.
Source: uk.news.yahoo.com...


Isn't it usually 'Asians' who throw acid over their women?


Originally posted by joewalker

Enjoy your ranting session.


We were. Thanks. I'm just glad you joined the party.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:47 PM
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reply to post by Jameela
 


Jameela, Arab mythology in the town of Mecca comprised of 360 gods.
One of the main gods was Allah, a happy inventor of life and rain
All the other gods were smashed by Mohamed
Only Allah was left
Worshipping Allah meant walking around a meteorite seven times
Having as much sex as you wanted
And conquering infidels
I'm not a bigot... Research your religion...
Salman Rushdie has a noose around his neck because of this, it's taken many of us the witnessing of Islam unfolding in our worlds over the last 3 decades to understand what he was saying. We've been very slow on the uptake... Catchup!



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:50 PM
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reply to post by ollncasino
 



Don't you read the papers?

My comment might not have been aimed at you Olln and yes, tho I tend ro read the Independent.

From the bottom of your first Daily Fail article:

Further to our article of 30 January (Grooming of girls by Asian gangs fuelled by unhappy arranged marriages to cousins), Lord Ahmed has asked us to make clear that the phenomenon of Asian men preying on vulnerable young girls is not only by men from Pakistan, and nor are the victims always white. We are happy to set the record straight.

Seems the Fail got something wrong again.

Our survey says that 92% of muslims polled do NOT agree it is right to to physically punish a female member of the family if she brings dishonour to her family or community...FACT.
Cba reloading the survey pdf Olln, but the fail headline cannot be referring only to the muslims polled....C'mon Ollin you should know the Daily Fail and accuracy arent words often found together, not in the same sentence anyway.



We were. Thanks. I'm just glad you joined the party.

The suns out and Olln has found a sense of humour(kinda)..We'll have ya foaming like a true leftie liberal next


edit on 26-3-2012 by joewalker because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 12:53 PM
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Originally posted by davesmart
hi jameela

me personally have seen racial abuse many times that go unreported (mine including)
what you have to understand is this
Britain is a small island
we have many different religions here
But at the moment the only religion thats shouting its mouth of is islam
sorry if it sounds harsh but that is the sheer fact
you cant tell me i did not see what i seen..
dave


Why do you think I fight so hard to convince you to stop your governments support of this type of Islam?

Did you know America just gave the go ahead to fund 1.5 billion dollars to a radical Islamic group in our countries, that was once on your list of terrorist organizations (but has conveniently been removed)?

There are Sunni's as well as Shi'a who are against this radicalism within our otherwise beautiful religion. But none of us can fight its propagation when billions of western dollars are being pumped into it, and radical groups are being trained by western governments in military and government take over.

We have our own fight with the House of Saud who funds these people too, but the west is not helping. Years ago these people barely existed on the radar, now, in the last 40 years, they are in every single country in the middle east and beyond and propagating this incorrect teaching of Islam, even the Sunnis are not immune to their hatred and violence. All the west has done is increased the power of these people, it has done nothing to fight radicalism in our countries, done nothing to free us of dictators... the opposite is happening, because your helping to them.

Wallahi I am sorry for what you have faced, but know I have faced the same and worse from these same people you are against. But I can not figure out how you can be against them, if your supporting western governments who fund them!

To me its a catch 22, if you hate fundamentalism so much, then do not kill me, or anyone else who follows what you all call a moderate Islam because fundamentalism exists, kill the money from your governments to the fundamentalists pockets, and allow the Sunni Muslims who are moderate to stop them from further propagating this evil upon the rest of us.

Sunni and Shi'a both are tired of it. We want to stop this. But western powers are not allowing that to happen.
edit on 26-3-2012 by Jameela because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 01:29 PM
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reply to post by Jameela
 


jameela
1st id like to say
i admire you for saying what you think whether any one else does or doesnot
my racial encounters are nothing compared with what ive seen in life
but i dont go shouting it from the hilltops
im glad you put forward your ops just like all other posts
but name calling and general bad manners does not go well here
if i offended you then i am a man and i say "im sorry"
we all have different views as you know
anyway lets keep the peace
dave



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:03 PM
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Aah!!!
The perfect culture called western culture.
Westerners are like sneaky neighbours who don't know what's happening in their own house.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:18 PM
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Originally posted by joewalker
Further to our article of 30 January (Grooming of girls by Asian gangs fuelled by unhappy arranged marriages to cousins), Lord Ahmed has asked us to make clear that the phenomenon of Asian men preying on vulnerable young girls is not only by men from Pakistan, and nor are the victims always white. We are happy to set the record straight.


That's right. 'Asian' men only make up a disproportionately large number of men preying on vulnerable young girls, while only most of the victims are white girls.

It's a bit like honour killings. While 91% of them are carried out by Muslims, sorry 'Asians' the other 9% carried out by non 'Asians' proves that Muslims who carry out honour killings aren't so bad.

What's an honour killing between family, after all?


Originally posted by joewalker
The suns out and Olln has found a sense of humour(kinda)..We'll have ya foaming like a true leftie liberal next


You are somewhat in no man's land at the moment reading the Independent.

Still, I have seen Guardian readers foaming at the mouth about Muslims at times. At times even the true leftie liberals turn.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:21 PM
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reply to post by ollncasino
 


As long as there is no death, why should I care about what a local group does?


And after your previous post on homosexuals, you seem to be missing a great deal of importance that is western society:

Your opinion of what a person's conduct should be does not extend to a right to alter what that conduct is.

Quite plainly, unless someone might die or get seriously injured, mined your own business.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:24 PM
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Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by ollncasino
 


As long as there is no death, why should I care about what a local group does?


And after your previous post on homosexuals, you seem to be missing a great deal of importance that is western society:

Your opinion of what a person's conduct should be does not extend to a right to alter what that conduct is.

Quite plainly, unless someone might die or get seriously injured, mined your own business.


this is not just local groups ffs
you have no idea how the msm work
they feed you what they want you to eat
try checking local area news especially in the midlands
believe me before long you will be eating humble pie



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:36 PM
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reply to post by davesmart
 


I did not ask or have need of any apology. And from your post I take it you believed me to be name calling but it was not my intention to come across as such. So I ask forgiveness for coming across that way.

For the rest, it is simply enough.

Goodbye



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:41 PM
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Originally posted by Jameela
reply to post by davesmart
 


I did not ask or have need of any apology. And from your post I take it you believed me to be name calling but it was not my intention to come across as such. So I ask forgiveness for coming across that way.

For the rest, it is simply enough.

Goodbye


hi jameela i forgive you for nothing
for in my eyes you have done nothing wrong
karma and peace to you



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:44 PM
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Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by ollncasino
 


As long as there is no death, why should I care about what a local group does?

And after your previous post on homosexuals, you seem to be missing a great deal of importance that is western society:

Your opinion of what a person's conduct should be does not extend to a right to alter what that conduct is.

Quite plainly, unless someone might die or get seriously injured, mined your own business.


You are seriously defending violence carried out by Muslims in pursuit of their family honour, as defined by their medieval view of the world while living in the West?

Well, I admire your honesty but I feel you are somewhat an apologist for Islamic violence against their women folk.


##removed inappropriate image##




posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:47 PM
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Yikes, we're going old school.
I thought since we are living in 2012, we would realize by now that yes Honour is good, but can also cost much. One should be smart enough to give up honour and pride in certain situations; not just straight HONOUR!



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 02:58 PM
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reply to post by ollncasino
 




You are seriously defending violence carried out by Muslims in pursuit of their family honour, as defined by their medieval view of the world while living in the West? Well, I admire your honesty but I feel you are somewhat an apologist for Islamic violence against their women folk.



I smack kids when they get out of line.

Suck it up.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 03:11 PM
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i fecked up
many sorrys
edit on 26-3-2012 by davesmart because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 03:13 PM
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reply to post by davesmart
 


I don't think you know what you're talking about considering I never said that. Perhaps you should shut your trap.



posted on Mar, 26 2012 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by davesmart
 


I don't think you know what you're talking about considering I never said that. Perhaps you should shut your trap.


i just said sorry
you know thats what real men do



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