'Honour' violence is acceptable, say one in five young British Asians

reply to post by ollncasino


[quote]Honour-related violence can include acid attacks, abduction, mutilations, beatings, and death. But 94 per cent of those questioned said there was 'never a justification' for murder.

Oh thank god! Don't murder me. Just kidnap me, beat me, burn my face off with acid and cut off my ears. That's a LOT better than death. Jeez. Savages.

Originally posted by mkgandhas
reply to post by ollncasino

 

disgusting that you are denying the largest genocide of world.

divide 1.8/200 you get a figure of nine million deaths a year.the extermination of indians was a slow process as british wanted to keep india under control.

after independence ,india's population exploded.

Stars for you,
It is disgusting, yes however they wont acknowledge it, One death is a tragedy and a million is a statistic. A few years from now they will also deny Iraq and Afghanistan, 'casualty' is the new name of genocide carried out by Britain's extension America. Westerners in general like this guy you are responding to have this 'tall poppy syndrome', a bunch of self righteous liberals or zionists pushing their anti Muslim and anti everything not west agenda. You wont change them. However you can get the word out, its pretty easy to disprove their false arguments and inferiority. A Culture that is a few hundred years old is going to push its agenda and try to change ours that have lasted the last five - ten thousand years.


Even up until this day most indian's have contempt for the British in general.

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by ollncasino

 

Honour-related violence can include acid attacks, abduction, mutilations, beatings, and death. But 94 per cent of those questioned said there was 'never a justification' for murder.

Oh thank god! Don't murder me. Just kidnap me, beat me, burn my face off with acid and cut off my ears. That's a LOT better than death. Jeez. Savages.

Savages, Funny. Comes from the people who invade countries, kill, mutilate and blow women and children up, all to steal the resources of a weaker country. Priests, Fathers, and Uncles molesting their young, When you do something its not wrong, when someone else does it its wrong. And yet everyone else are the savages. Funny this always comes from thieves, assassins, and trained murderers.

By the way, most of the acid that get thrown in the face of people are not Honor Killing, its done by x lovers, I have lived in these countries throughout Asia, I speak many of their languages. I know more than you would be able to grasp about their society. Your culture is inferior and biased to even judge or dictate whats done if right or wrong.

Originally posted by mkgandhas
reply to post by ollncasino

 

miss wilson had sex with both the muzzies.Thats funny indeed.

Karma is a bitch you know .Comes to bite you in your rear.

I think you just lost pretty much all credibility in this thread.

One of the differences between Islamic and non-Islamic society, is that in non-Islamic society, adultery is not considered a capital crime.

"Luckily only 6% of those questioned felt that an honour killing was justified."

Luckily?????

We have a Muslim population of @ 2.8 million in the UK.

If 6% consider it to be Ok to commit murder is that lucky?

reply to post by Jameela


[quote]From: en.wikipedia.org...(honor)
Izzat (Hindi-Urdu: इज़्ज़त or عزت) refers to the concept of honor prevalent in the culture of North India and Pakistan.[1] It applies universally across religions (Hindu, Muslim and Sikh), communities and genders.[2][3][4] Maintaining the reputation of oneself and one's family (especially women) is part of the concept of izzat, as is the obligatory taking of revenge when one's izzat has been violated.[5]

Although the concept of izzat has been viewed as curtailing the freedom of women, it is also a strongly egalitarian concept that cuts across social hierarchy and enforces "equality in giving, but also equality in vengeance."[5][6] The idea of reciprocity, in both friendship and enmity, is deeply embedded in izzat.

This is sick. Is it written somewhere on what constitutes being dishonored by someone, or is it wide open to interpretation by every individual?

Could someone be dishonored by a landlord raising the rent too high, making him feel ashamed that he can't afford it? Can a father be dishonored if his kids embarrass him in public, as kids are wont to do?

Originally posted by coirener

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by ollncasino

 

Honour-related violence can include acid attacks, abduction, mutilations, beatings, and death. But 94 per cent of those questioned said there was 'never a justification' for murder.

Oh thank god! Don't murder me. Just kidnap me, beat me, burn my face off with acid and cut off my ears. That's a LOT better than death. Jeez. Savages.

Savages, Funny. Comes from the people who invade countries, kill, mutilate and blow women and children up, all to steal the resources of a weaker country. Priests, Fathers, and Uncles molesting their young, When you do something its not wrong, when someone else does it its wrong. And yet everyone else are the savages. Funny this always comes from thieves, assassins, and trained murderers.

By the way, most of the acid that get thrown in the face of people are not Honor Killing, its done by x lovers, I have lived in these countries throughout Asia, I speak many of their languages. I know more than you would be able to grasp about their society. Your culture is inferior and biased to even judge or dictate whats done if right or wrong.

edit on 26-3-2012 by coirener because: (no reason given)

None of it is right! I am sick to my soul that my nation has wiped out the American Indian, used blacks as slaves, and once considered women and children as having less value than a horse. It was wrong - ALL of it! So, you can't justify honor killings by pointing out the flaws in others.

Originally posted by coirener
I have lived in these countries throughout Asia, I speak many of their languages. I know more than you would be able to grasp about their society. Your culture is inferior and biased to even judge or dictate whats done if right or wrong.

edit on 26-3-2012 by coirener because: (no reason given)

Well, thank allah that somebody knows all about Asian society. Please enlighten us on why it's right to cut off someone's head, why it's right to kill a daughter that has run off with man that the family disapproves of, why it is right to blame a woman for being raped? You tell us why it is right to do these things without using the wrongs of other nations as justification for such barbaric acts.

A cousin of mine just went to Britain for a friends wedding, he went there from Turkey and felt extremely uncomfortable for two reasons:

1. wherever he looked there were bearded men in turbans and traditional Muslim garb

2. the food was small quantities and expensive...


I thought to myself, why have the British been outrun by the most extreme Muslims on the planet?

AND I thought, they really should lower the cost of food over there

Originally posted by coirener
Savages, Funny. Comes from the people who invade countries, kill, mutilate and blow women and children up, all to steal the resources of a weaker country. Priests, Fathers, and Uncles molesting their young, When you do something its not wrong, when someone else does it its wrong. And yet everyone else are the savages. Funny this always comes from thieves, assassins, and trained murderers.

Except for the small problem that you don't really care about this; any of what you're saying. The only reason why you bring it up, is to use it against us, because you know it'll work. You know that not everyone here is military, or racist, or wants to slaughter Muslims. So you know that if you say something like this, you will cause shame in some of us; and you can use that as a weapon.

Originally posted by ollncasino
reply to post by ollncasino

 

Muslims carry out 91% of honour killings world wide

Although Sikhs and Hindus do sometimes commit such murders, honor killings, both worldwide and in the West, are mainly Muslim-on-Muslim crimes.

• In this study, worldwide, 91 percent of perpetrators were Muslims.

• In North America, most killers (84 percent) were Muslims, with only a few Sikhs and even fewer Hindus perpetrating honor killings.

• In Europe, Muslims comprised an even larger majority at 96 percent while Sikhs were a tiny percentage.

• In Muslim countries, obviously almost all the perpetrators were Muslims.

With only two exceptions, the victims were all members of the same religious group as their murderers.

www.meforum.org...

The vast majority of honour killings are carried out by Muslims killing other Muslims.

Yes indeed, to be honest its almost a Muslim exclusive thing, the few others are more or less family disputes gone wrong rather than the code of honour killing. The act of the honour killing also is quite hight in the Turkish community and the honour beating are incredibly high amongst them. I've actually been present at an Honour beating, my landlord at one point was a restaurant owner and normally a very nice man but his sons were vicious beyond words. One day they found out the sister had being seeing a black male on the side, they went berserk. I didn't understand the lingo but one son explained it to me under duress from me and told me the whole story and why they beat her.

A black non Muslim, almost the ultimate no no for them....

People tend to think of honour beatings as mild little spats where a few words are exchanged and maybe the mum slaps the girl, no no no, this is full on assault from all the family and it does not end with the beating, the girl isn't allowed to seek help beyond the family and is vilified pretty much forever onwards.

And of course, its only the females that are the victims...

Some people especially the Radical apologists will claim its no worse than drunken husband and wife altercations, its NOT, this is a mental and physical prison for life until the girl is able to restore the family honour by a forced marriage.

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by mkgandhas
so?

Hasn't west been waging genocide on hundreds of millions and billions for centuries? thing is that the biggest barbarians are the most noisy ones about 'human rights' in zones where massive natural resources exist.

So you are trying to justify Muslims killing other Muslims in honour killings by arguing that the West has waged "genocide on hundreds of millions and billions for centuries".

I don't follow your logic.

Having said that, not all victims are Muslims

Teenager is 'first' white victim of honour killing

The mother of a teenager stabbed to death as she walked by a canal yesterday claimed her daughter was the victim of a brutal honour killing.

Laura Wilson, 17, was repeatedly knifed in the head by her Asian boyfriend Ashtiaq Ashgar on a secluded tow path after their relationship turned sour.

Her mother, who has never spoken publicly before, believes her daughter was murdered because she challenged the code of ethics which some ethnic communities still follow.

It is thought that Miss Wilson could be the first white victim of an honour killing in Britain.

The Telegraph

Did you spot the code word 'Asian' again?

Ashtiaq Ashgar is a Muslim, according to other reports.

The Salfordian

Yes, a Pakistani Muslim to be precise, and of course a fine example of the double standards employed by the radicals, white non Muslim girlfriend on the side, a kuffar to again be exact but ok for him to do the dirty with.

But the second this GIRLFRIEND talks against his religion which he was very much denying while stepping out with her comes to the front and he takes it out on her.

What a hypocrite he and others are, drink, drugs, sexual relations with non believers but its all ok for the males, the second a Muslim radicalised family girl fancies some of the same she's attack and or killed by the very family that brought her into life.

Shocking..

Originally posted by Mclaneinc
What a hypocrite he and others are, drink, drugs, sexual relations with non believers but its all ok for the males, the second a Muslim radicalised family girl fancies some of the same she's attack and or killed by the very family that brought her into life.

I absolutely agree with this. It's as Paul wrote; if you put yourself under the Law, you are bound by the whole Law. If they want to call themselves Muslims, then that means that if alcohol is considered haraam, then they cannot touch it.

I drink, occasionally; but I would never place myself under a religious law where drinking is prohibited, because I know that if I did, I would break it. In magical terms, Allah is as real a Godform as any other; and one thing you learn very early on if you're smart, is that you don't make promises to any spirit that you're not willing to keep.

Originally posted by mkgandhas
reply to post by ollncasino

 

disgusting that you are denying the largest genocide of world.

divide 1.8/200 you get a figure of nine million deaths a year.the extermination of indians was a slow process as british wanted to keep india under control.

after independence ,india's population exploded.

Whoah there...

Are you seriously saying its fine because of what happened in some form back then?

What an illogical stance...

The basic question here is should a woman be allowed to be killed or severely beaten because in the mind of her family she failed the honour of her family.

If you answer yes you are a cruel thug living in times of madness, you seek to not forward your learning as the Koran says to do, you are just returning to a blood lust.

If you think a woman can be beaten for just looking over at a man then again you are a barbarian.

If you feel a woman can be killed for sharing a car with a man then the above still stands.

You have to start learning that WOMEN are equals these days, maybe not in every way but the male female bond now treats the woman partner as an equal. If that isn't agreeable to you then go back to your cave and scream ugh ugh at your woman.

What I find most disgusting about this subject is that the (our UK) government and the supposed enlightened forward thinking Muslims still turn a blind eye to it for the most part, the Police only get involved when its too late.

I can understand with a vile taste in my mouth that it goes on in Shariah controlled countries but to allow it to be transferred here is a severe flaw in our standards. Purists will say that we are interfering in their culture but the actual truth is that they are not recognising OUR laws and should pay the price like any other would be murderer.

Sadly that's the real problem here, we are allowing the UK to be slowly but surely turned away from our own culture, cultures are important to the country they are founded in, we should never change them unless a decay of badness is in them, we can look and share other cultures but they must adhere to the laws of the land.

Anything less is stupidity and good for no one.

These abused women need our protection even if they have been brainwashed over the years, we cannot sit and allow them to be killed simply to keep partnerships with the radical Muslims.

reply to post by petrus4


Thank you for your kind words.

Paul.

Originally posted by coirener

Originally posted by mkgandhas
reply to post by ollncasino

 

disgusting that you are denying the largest genocide of world.

divide 1.8/200 you get a figure of nine million deaths a year.the extermination of indians was a slow process as british wanted to keep india under control.

after independence ,india's population exploded.

Stars for you,
It is disgusting, yes however they wont acknowledge it, One death is a tragedy and a million is a statistic. A few years from now they will also deny Iraq and Afghanistan, 'casualty' is the new name of genocide carried out by Britain's extension America. Westerners in general like this guy you are responding to have this 'tall poppy syndrome', a bunch of self righteous liberals or zionists pushing their anti Muslim and anti everything not west agenda. You wont change them. However you can get the word out, its pretty easy to disprove their false arguments and inferiority. A Culture that is a few hundred years old is going to push its agenda and try to change ours that have lasted the last five - ten thousand years.

Even up until this day most indian's have contempt for the British in general.

What bigoted nonsense

Originally posted by blueorder

What bigoted nonsense

edit on 26-3-2012 by blueorder because: (no reason given)

Did you expect that bigoted nonsense will not be responded to by bigoted nonsense? In the face of the lies and cultural insults by everyone but one or two in this thread.... really you should read the whole thread, its the most disgusting display of hate against any group I have ever seen!

A higher percentage of Christians in the survey quoted agreed with honor killings yet somehow honor killing becomes a "religious Muslim thing" when it has nothing to do with Islam at all, there is no support for it and Islamic clerics have condemned the practice, yet, it is still "Muslims" doing it.

So yeah, bigots deserve bigots don't you suppose?

But that's OK, since all the new terror alerts I can no longer go to the grocery either alone or with someone, my brother wont allow me because of what happened (since the new terror alert) when I was in the grocery last.I thank everyone for making me a prisoner in my own home. The only time I can leave the house is for university and I have to be escorted there and back. Gotta love you people! (I used to enjoy shopping you know)

But that is alright, you all are hateful bigots and I hope more hateful bigots from my side come and behave just as bigoted to you so you all see your mirror.

I do find it amusing and telling that you only commented on his bigoted comments without saying a word to the rest of the people throwing insults like fists. Perhaps bigots can only be westerners? If we do it we are 'wrong' but you can do it all day long that's fine? lol...

What I want to know is why liberals, the left wing and people on ATS carry so much water for Islam, yet very openly hate Christians? What is it about Islam that makes you feel you need to defend them and their religion?

reply to post by Jameela


Going to the stores is somewhat a phenomenon in some Arab countries for women, you should count yourself lucky.
I know that education is not a thing for women to enjoy in the majority of Arab or Muslim countries, however, I have seen that big announcement that the Saudi King has opened the biggest women’s only university. I think it’s good, I think very progressive of them. Perhaps others will follow suit. It’s been a shame that young people, like you, have been prohibited from receiving an education under the rule of some. I know the Taliban was adamant about this, and they claimed to practice the purist form of Sharia. Saying this make me a bigot, doesn’t it? The facts are there for all to see, or talk here is about what Islam does to women. It’s not about what Christians or Jews or Buddhist do. But many an argument is fought by Muslims in a way of trying to do some mudslinging. The thing is, there’s lots of mud to sling, lots, and it’s been slung at Muslims in this instance. Now, denial of what this religion really stands for, is acceptance of hate. Mo didn’t like women very much, he insulted their intelligence and called them inadequate spiritually. Let me point these Haddith quotes to you, and you tell me whether it’s bigotry or fact:

Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:
Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle ?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."
'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house at the age of nine. She further said: We went to Medina and I had an attack of fever for a month, and my hair had come down to the earlobes. Umm Ruman (my mother) came to me and I was at that time on a swing along with my playmates. She called me loudly and I went to her and I did not know what she had wanted of me. She took hold of my hand and took me to the door, and I was saying: Ha, ha (as if I was gasping), until the agitation of my heart was over. She took me to a house, where had gathered the women of the Ansar. They all blessed me and wished me good luck and said: May you have share in good. She (my mother) entrusted me to them. They washed my head and embellished me and nothing frightened me. Allah's Messenger (, may peace be upon him) came there in the morning, and I was entrusted to him.

Sabra Juhanni reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) permitted temporary marriage for us. So I and another person went out and saw a woman of Bana 'Amir, who was like a young long-necked she-camel. We presented ourselves to her (for contracting temporary marriage), whereupon she said: What dower would you give me? I said: My cloak. And my companion also said: My cloak. And the cloak of-my companion was superior to my cloak, but I was younger than he. So when she looked at the cloak of my companion she liked it, and when she cast a glance at me I looked more attractive to her. She then said: Well, you and your cloak are sufficient for me. I remained with her for three nights, and then Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: He who has any such woman with whom he had contracted temporary marriage, he should let her off.