Dolphins 'Deserve Same Rights As Humans'

Dolphins killing Porpoises.

reply to post by Acidtastic


Not entirely, it all has to do with self-awareness, in which humans are top of the list.

reply to post by forklift


Ya killing animals is stupid unless to survive, dolphins are nice so are the whale and sharks, alot animals should be banned from killing/hunting/etc.

great news about time

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by gabbermatt

 

For arguments sake let's say glass doors wrap around you and prevent escape. =) And even then, I'm sure you've only EVER walked into a single glass door. Or how about spider webs? Maybe spider webs would be a better example. You know how hard it is to get a good web off once you've walked in to it.

For arguments sake, let's say that dolphins are able to jump out of water.

Let's also say that they have eyes and echolocation.

Let's also say that spider webs are nearly invisible compared with tuna nets.

Then let's say that dolphins.... the super intelligent creatures that they are, aren't smart enough to jump over the net.

As far as walking into a glass door.... if I am doing what the dolphins are doing, I would have to walk into the same door repeatedly. Maybe you have done that, but I haven't.... something about learning from mistakes.

So the nets never move and are always in the same exact spot? You mean they don't have boats attached to them and move them around to gather stuff up? I kinda thought that's how it worked... but I guess you could be right.

reply to post by milominderbinder


Wow. Just......wow...... I don't expect you to understand this, but there is more to life than humanistic knowledge. There is so much more out there than what we can see or touch. Our biggest fault as a species is to view everything and everyone by humanistic standards, which, in my opinion, is a total farce. I don't care if you can count backwards from 1000 000 whilst standing on your head, you are still not even approaching the level of sophistication that the dolphin's thought processes run at. Just think about it, their brains are 2.8x the size of ours. You are just plain stupid to think that they do not possess a greater level of intelligence. Also, how the hell would you know what a dolphin's linguistic skills amount to. Did you take that remedial course in Dolphin Language last semester? God I hate people. I am suddenly reminded why I would prefer the company of a dolphin over the likes of you any day of the week.

Well...First of all..Most animals alive today were here on this planet far before humans..to think that this is "Our' planet is not only ridiculous, but illogical. I say all animals should have rights, but the same rights as humans??? what"s next, we can"t use yeast for bread and beer because they are an organism that is "alive"? and that is murder?

reply to post by xXxinfidelxXx

I don't care if you can count backwards from 1000 000 whilst standing on your head, you are still not even approaching the level of sophistication that the dolphin's thought processes run at.

I know what you mean. Just the other day I was talking geometry with a dolphin. I asked him what the approximate value of PI was and he said that depends on the bakery that made it. What could I say, he got me.

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

 

Its like how would humans feel if another species seen humanity as a lower species or a species to feed from how would humans think???

Move to Africa, live in the bush with LIONS and LEOPARDS. Swim with Great White sharks when they are feeding.

Then you will have the simple answer to your question. There are plenty of species that view humans as

food.

Animals eat to survive. They don't have the intelligence and technology to maintain a standard of living, and can't responsibly produce food. They only eat for survival, otherwise they die.

You don't eat a cheeseburger for survival, you eat it because it tastes good and you deemed that the animal's suffering was worth it.

Looks like these scientists have really gone off the

-puts on sunglasses-

Deep End.


Other than that, it's kind of fun to think about...in my probably unpopular opinion.

reply to post by Acidtastic


If everything that feels pain should have the same rights as "you or I" then we would have to start charginf all predatory animals with murder and put them in a prison for hunting and eating the animals they naturally eat? Oh but we can't do that because animals shouldn't be in cages. But if animals shouldn't be in cages, and they should have the same rights as us, we should let all the humans out of prison? But if we do that, the violent criminals among them might impede on the rights of other human beings, so how do fix that little problem? Should all carnivorous animals die out because they shouldn't be allowed to eat other animals?


......

You see, life is a lot more complicated and can't be fixed by nice sounding slogans.

reply to post by Seektruthalways1

I know right!

It's so much easier on the brain just thinking a dude in the sky poofed us into existence!

reply to post by SyphonX

You don't eat a cheeseburger for survival, you eat it because it tastes good and you deemed that the animal's suffering was worth it.

News flash.....

Humans are animals. If you do not eat, you will not survive.

Another news flash.......

Most humans eating the cheeseburger have not a single thought about the cow that died to create it. Most people don't think about the dairy animal that brought about the glass of milk or the slice of cheese that they are consuming.

Some of us have actually killed the cow that was ground onto burger that we ate. Some of us made hay,( in the days before the big round bales) that fed the cows that we milked for unhomogenized, unpastuerized milk that we drank. Some of us had to scald and pluck the chickens that made our Sunday meal. Some of us had to plow, harrow, plant, cultivate and harvest the grain that fed the steers, pigs and chickens. None of which , I might add, you will find any darn dolphin doing!

So some of us don't need anyone presuming to tell us about any appreciation we ought to have for the food we eat, especially if the closest they have ever came to creating a meal was when they bought the ingredients at the supermarket.

Wikireply to post by gabbermatt
The nets used for commercial tuna fishing are called purse seines.

They encircle the school of tuna with a wall of net, then the bottom of the net is pulled together like a purse's drawstring. The net moves towards its own center as the net is drawn in. The super-intelligent dolphins just have to take a short leap over the top of the net, which is clearly marked with floats, not that those wily creatures should have to be pointed in the direction of up anyway!

Somehow, those brainiacs of the ocean just can't seem to put it all together. They can jump clear of the water, they do it chasing fish, they do it for fun. They know which way is up. They can locate a tiny minnow with their echolocation skills, but somehow a simple net confounds those geniuses.

Yes, nets might move.... But so do the fish that they catch with their beaks. Apparently they can deal with things that move. Those nets are not gossamer spiderwebs either.

Originally posted by DivineFem
Until we learn to treat humans like humans, dolphins need to get to the back of the line...

I don't think it works that way. Imagine if it was against the law to abuse harass or even kill a dolphin or any animal for that matter...how much more so would each and every one of our human rights come into play?

You can't do that to a dolphin or a dog and so why would you expect to be able to do it to a human? This is how the conversations would begin - eventually people would be less like the animals they condemn now.

Do you really think people are going to stop abusing each other if we allow them to abuse their pets instead?
Your logic is flawed and at this rate we will never gain any ground. Haven't you heard it said you can judge a society by how it treats their children and their animals? It is true.

Here is something to consider while you are thinking...
An elephant painted this:

300 Elephants have been poached ...just recently.
www.dailymail.co.uk...
\

Dolphins asking for equal rights?
Was there a dolphin pride parade somewhere?

Who is this thread being directed at?
Pretty dangerous because the pro abortion activists might agree, then it will be business as usual.

Good to know more people are fighting for this sort of thing. Marine mammals need all the help they can get right now. I dont think its such a preposterous idea as some are impying. Its not like we ll be able to take a dolphin to court for stealing our bait. Pretty simple to me, "do to others as you would have done to yourself". I dont think I would fancy getting eaten alive but if a hungry Preditor attacked me in the wild I dont think I would begrudge it. Hopfully as its about to sink its teeth into my jugular I would look it in the eye and say "enjoy ya dinner mate". But what humans do is a bit different. We have a more efficient and sustainable food supply in fruit/ veg. Dont get me wrong I love to chuck a steak on the barbie but its no longer viable to have meat as a main part of our diet. We are running out of room at an exponential rate, we cant keep using agricaltual land to feed livestock instead of people. I think the more we find out about these magnificant creatures, the more people will be outraged by practices like the annual slaughter at Taiji cove.
Personaly i think earth worms should be given the same rights... My reasoning being that a humble worm likly does more for the global eco-system than all homosapiens combined...

I agree about the earth worm, and the bumble bee, and the shark.

ALL life has equal rights as far as i am concerned.

Brain size has nothing to do with intelligence.

Some crows and ravens use tools.

Some small tree-monkeys use spears to kill bush-babies.

Apes can recognise and put in order up to 20 numbers flashed to them in a sixteenth of a second.

Most of us are arrogant, foolish apes, thinking we are the creme-de-la-creme of life, that we're put here for a purpouse, that we're special somehow.

When, in fact, we are the most disharmonious form of life on this beautiful planet.

We have to change, or we have to go.

reply to post by butcherguy


personally I wouldn't kill anything unless I had too.

but ok then yes, i think there is a difference between killing something that thinks, understands and fears death than say killing a fly, for example.

Mind you they say pigs have the intelligence of a 3 year old... and I eat pork

I thought I'd bring to light the real issue of rights here, with regard to animals.

Here in the USA and I presume in plenty of other countries, Animals are basically treated as property under the law however some countries are more progressive i.e Switzerland's Constitution was amended to acknowledge animals as "beings.”.

Animals here have no standing under the law; individuals and organizations that bring legal actions on behalf of mistreated animals regularly find their suits dismissed due to lack of standing. Courts view the abuse of animals as peripheral to the "real injury" of the person bringing suit. Thus, to have its case heard in court, a plaintiff must show that it has experienced a direct injury; arguing that an animal has been injured is inadequate to establish standing. While judges have slowly become more permissive in granting standing to those trying to protect animals, even the most progressive courts directly hold that the standing they grant is not premised on the mistreatment of the animal itself. For example, in American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals v. Ringling Bros. & Barnum & Bailey Circus, the court was innovative in holding that standing was based largely on a former circus employee's emotional attachment to the elephants that were being abused. The court also expressly held, however, that standing was not based on any continuing injury to the animal.

It cannot be denied that animals are qualitatively different than the average piece of personal property, such as a desk, sweater, or television. Animals are living beings capable of feeling physical pain, experiencing varying degrees of rational thought, and forming seemingly emotional attachments. Outside of the legal context, it would be quite outdated--if indeed it was ever plausible--to presume that an animal is not distinct from a couch or dining room table.

Perhaps it is time for Courts to recognize that animals are not inanimate objects and therefore are entitled to certain legal protections not afforded to typical inanimate property.

www.animallaw.info...

reply to post by ideasarebulletproof


Yeah, and it makes so much more sense that Nothing exploded 20 billion years ago, and we evolved from rocks.....and we lost our tails cause we didnt need them....