ATS's Gutter-rats and the 90+ intro thread

Yep,just what I thought.

Descending into childish behavior.

I like the old dude,I think he has alot of insight and great info.


Just do the right thing and move on past your egos,listen to someone who has been there done that.
What a bunch of dumbtards.

Can you really blame people for being skeptical? I mean, this is the same website where the "strange noises" obvious hoax makes the front page. Come on man.

Originally posted by TsukiLunar
Why would a dying old man show up on ATS to reveal his back story?

Why would a young person who could be out having fun show up on ATS at all?
Regardless of age intelligent people enjoy staying informed and having conversations about topics that interest them.

Not everyone over 50 is brain dead.
Yet.

What was I talking about?

Originally posted by NuminousCosmos
reply to post by MacDonagh

 

A typo is when you write "asssume" not when you worked for Macy's and then spelled it "Darcies."

My first job was at McDonnells...I mean McDonalds.

You highlighted it perfectly.

I hung out at helllikedeductions for god only knows how long and I can pick an attention whore a mile away. His expression is near perfect so he is not generation X or Y (yes most of them cannot read or write properly) so he is a baby boomer who is in dire need of an audience. He eloquent expression would be better served writing novels...

reply to post by NuminousCosmos

A typo is when you write "asssume" not when you worked for Macy's and then spelled it "Darcies."

McDonell/McDonnell = fake! Because if you've worked there for a long portion of your life, you would never make a grammatical error like that ever!

Your deduction is flawless.

reply to post by Enlightenme1111


There is a difference between being sceptical and being stupid. Clearly, some members are merely reactionary and lack the means needed for critical, clear thinking; that they've sought to bury some random user because of the fact that he misspelt a place that he claimed to work or that he only became interested in politics when Eisenhower was in office or the fact that he writes very well is astonishing in it's audacity and betrays a certain insensibility in the gutter-rats.

Let's all circle the drain!

reply to post by MacDonagh


I agree with you completely. I posted to that thread on page 18. I offered the gentleman the respect that his age deserves. I will wait and see what he has to say before judging him.

The people who have posted things where they attack him and what he has said in his intro have no right to judge him. They have not offered him any respect or courtesy. They have failed to consider the fact that this man may perhaps be on some serious pain medication for the pain caused by his disease. They do not know him, just as I do not know him. However I have offered him the respect that his age and experience deserves. Others here have not.


The fact that others have not makes me ask what has happened to common sense. Sure other people have posted threads here to garner attention stating that they were this or that. In time they were debunked and sent packing. Sometimes it makes me wonder about the state of humanity when they can no longer take something at face value.

Not everything is a conspiracy, and not everyone who posts a thread saying that they know things is a hoaxer. But some people are so self righteous that they can't see past the end of their noses.

Sorry for the rant , but I'm kinda ticked off about the lack of manners displayed toward this man.

What I find truly disappointing is that people have to argue over a simple introduction thread, giving it over 10 pages when generally such thread only garner about 12 posts if that, then someone gets jealous or persnickety and has to start a thread complaining about the introduction thread, just like OP here.

Next, we're going to have someone start a thread complaining about this one.

Grow up, please. I understand controversy is the name of this game, but there's a point when you just have to accept everything won't go your way.

Namaste

Just like the doomsday predictors, the naysayers want to be the first to holler hoax, bs, fake, etc.. Gives them some sort of rush to try and discredit people. Personally, I read the entire op and most of the thread, and was quiet entertained. Real or not, I was genuinely enjoying this persons writings. Sadly ats has probably left a sour taste in his mouth. I am really disturbed by the viciousness of the attacks on Mr. Typers story. New low, even for ATS.

reply to post by MacDonagh


I have attempted to write a response in this thread many times this morning only to delete them and start over... we'll see if this is the one that does not come off as a half cocked rant born of sheer disgust like the others I have attempted thus far.

I have to say MacDonagh, like you I am severely disappointed in the sheer rudeness and lack of consideration given to the gentleman in his intro thread. What has disappointed me the most is that in that thread, as is in this one too it seems, many of the rudest comments have been made by posters that up until now I have had respect for...well guess what... no longer. People that up until now I held in high regard and respect for what I saw as their fairness in debate and high intellect now only garner my distane and contempt. What you have to say will now fall on deaf ears simply because you chose to take the low road. What happened to denying ignorance? Instead all I saw was some of you not only displaying ignorance but growing it by feeding off of one another like a pack of wild animals....and that just sickened me.

I noticed one of the comments in this thread being something along the lines of "what would bring an old dying man to this site anyway?" Did you ever think that perhaps this is cathartic excersise for him to release some of the heavy burden that he has kept to himself all this time? The fact that he chose us to share it with has me excited for the information he has to share with us and frankly, given the treatment he has received from some of us here, I would not blame him in the least if he simply chooses to turn and walk away. Why do I say this? Because in all honesty, we have not proven to him that we are worthy of the information he could impart.

ETA: I would like to know when "innocent until proven guilty" was revised to "guilty until proven otherwise".

reply to post by Starchild23

What I find truly disappointing is that people have to argue over a simple introduction thread, giving it over 10 pages when generally such thread only garner about 12 posts if that, then someone gets jealous or persnickety and has to start a thread complaining about the introduction thread, just like OP here.

You're implying that I'm jealous? I can assure you that you will find no jealousy in my comments. I took exception to the way that the 90+ man was labelled a fraud before he has even authored a thread.

Next, we're going to have someone start a thread complaining about this one.

Grow up, please. I understand controversy is the name of this game, but there's a point when you just have to accept everything won't go your way.

You've clearly completely missed the point of this thread that was about members who reactively post incendiary comments not just on the intro thread, but in ALL boards. You're a great example of this practice that is prevalent on the board because of instead of challenging my opinion; you've dismissed it completely out of hand and labelled me as "jealous" or "persnickety". If someone doesn't like my thread and decides to start their own; you'll find no objection from me. This is a forum that is meant to share information, inspire debate and enlighten minds which can only be a good thing.

Your suggestion for me to grow up is also mildly amusing considering that I am not the one that is acting like a child. I am merely calling for members to be more civil towards each other instead of descending into pointless non-debate and personal attacks. And there is nothing controversial about that.

Please learn to read my arguments properly and get to the point concisely.

I am just curious as to what ATS was before? You and some others keep saying its not like it used to be. I am a fairly new member, still learning the ropes around here, so does that make me a gutter rat, as you call them? And why so quick to think someone is lying and a fake? I just don't get it. Everything evolves ya know. Nothing can never stay the same. Just wondering why ATS was so much better back then, and what all the fuss is about it?

Isn't this interesting?

reply to post by MacDonagh

You're implying that I'm jealous? I can assure you that you will find no jealousy in my comments. I took exception to the way that the 90+ man was labelled a fraud before he has even authored a thread.

Actually, he started that thread. So technically, that's incorrect. Also, the more detail you give implying you may have important information to share, the more skeptical people are. You trust too much on here, you get hurt...or worse, you get stupid.

Your suggestion for me to grow up is also mildly amusing considering that I am not the one that is acting like a child. I am merely calling for members to be more civil towards each other instead of descending into pointless non-debate and personal attacks. And there is nothing controversial about that.

Interesting you should raise this point, considering your thread provided an opportunity for exactly the sort of behavior you're protesting. If you don't want the cats to get in, don't install a doggy door.

The cause for my response was your initial post (which admittedly, I misunderstood, and I apologize for that) which provoked a very long list of responses tearing at the users questioning Alonzo. In other words, your participants committed the same wrong they are barking about.

This, to me, is less than favorable, in terms of a productive thread. That is my clear and concise point.

Namaste.

I had know idea they did that, I thought it was popular because it was a brilliant intro to the site. So I only read that one post.

That is bloody disgusting.

Originally posted by MyMindIsMyOwn
I would like to know when "innocent until proven guilty" was revised to "guilty until proven otherwise".

I can answer that. When Obama decided it was OK to US citizen kill Anwar Al Alawki without a trial - or when we invaded Iraq on baseless evidence manufactured by the Bush administration. Since 9/11 the US has been on a spree of preemptive destruction while the MSM has been cheerleading and telling the public it w.as the right thing to do.
These are the social values that have arisen during the last decade - can we really expect for them to not rub off on young people in their everyday lives? Rudeness as a cultural value has also found it's way in to the mainstream of American life. Lastly, there has also been a rise in "youth culture" shall we say, where old people are considered used up and without value - indeed burdens on society.

It's good to question but we should all take care to not be rude and impolite when doing so. People make mistakes and I'm sure some of those who posted in an uncivil manner may be having second thoughts about their choice of words.
I was a rude young punk at one time myself, it took me many years to learn to treat people as I would like for them to treat me.
Society is not doing a very good job at helping our young people acquire good manners or understanding of our fellow humans.

I can answer that. When Obama decided it was OK to US citizen kill Anwar Al Alawki without a trial - or when we invaded Iraq on baseless evidence manufactured by the Bush administration. Since 9/11 the US has been on a spree of preemptive destruction while the MSM has been cheerleading and telling the public it w.as the right thing to do.
These are the social values that have arisen during the last decade - can we really expect for them to not rub off on young people in their everyday lives? Rudeness as a cultural value has also found it's way in to the mainstream of American life. Lastly, there has also been a rise in "youth culture" shall we say, where old people are considered used up and without value - indeed burdens on society.

True to form, you are correct. Having thought about it since you wrote this I cannot debate that point. And yet in the back of my mind I cannot help but think that in the course of growing up and maturing at some point there has to be a bit of self discovery and improvement that, in spite of in the fact that rudeness is all around us on a daily basis, it would become evident that rudeness is counter productive and the behavior stopped. I see rudeness as more of a tool used by those who feel powerless to feel like they have power over something or someone.

It's good to question but we should all take care to not be rude and impolite when doing so. People make mistakes and I'm sure some of those who posted in an uncivil manner may be having second thoughts about their choice of words.

You are absolutely correct. A good healthy scepticism is paramout in today's society both with events in the world today and in dealings with people as a whole. However, covering rudness in the cloak of scepticism when dealing with people in general is where I have to take issue. I question much but choose to adapt a wait and see attitude with people because eventually their true colors will come through at which time THEN I will choose to walk away should those colors prove false, but until that happens, if it does at all, I choose to give the benefit of the doubt.

I do hope perhaps some posters are having second thoughts about the manner in which they chose to use their words like weapons. I would hope as well they can be mature enough to apologize for them (not publically, but directly to the new member in question) and make an honest attempt at not doing it in the future. Time will tell and, in calming down a bit from my rant of yesterday and in taking my own advice, I am more than willing to step back and give 2nd chances to those posters in whom my disappointment was the greatest.

I was a rude young punk at one time myself, it took me many years to learn to treat people as I would like for them to treat me.
Society is not doing a very good job at helping our young people acquire good manners or understanding of our fellow humans.

I think we all were rude in our younger years, it seems a right of passage to think that at 15-16 you have the world by the tail and feel your opinions, your views and your 'truths' are the only ones that matter. But like I said before and like you mention above, with life experiences and self discovery that fades away.... for most of us that is.

reply to post by Ops4Ops

I am just curious as to what ATS was before? You and some others keep saying its not like it used to be. I am a fairly new member, still learning the ropes around here, so does that make me a gutter rat, as you call them?

Hmm. Well, it was a smaller community back then, but that's not to say that there wasn't a reasonable share of disagreements, extensive arguments or hoaxes. I can recall the birth of the 9/11 forums with the teething troubles that went with it, due to the divisive nature of the topic at hand and the fact that there was (still is but to a lesser degree!) derailing, aggressive name-calling, and banal chitter chatter. It's safe to say that I don't miss those times, but when the flood of new users joined ATS as an alternative to the various outlets of media that was out there and due to the fact that more new people were awakening to the fact that things were not as they should be; older users became disillusioned to what they saw as a diminishing in quality in threads/posts and a passive aggressive contentiousness that became more and more prevalent over the years.

Up until recently, I would post threads sporadically, due to the content that reached the front page, the frivolous threads, John Lear, that time traveller hoax which was beyond ignorance, the constant nitpicking and the controversial threads which ultimately lacked substance. It was so sad that it made you want to laugh on how far things descended during that time, but that wasn't to say that there weren't quality posts either. They were just harder to come by.

That isn't to say there is no longer any quality posters on this site but as ATS grew; it attracted gutter-rats as well as quality posters. ATS has grown from a small community into a larger mix of varying opinions, some of whom are great thread posters, and others who I'd consider to be irrational buffoons. The rest like you and me are merely caught in the middle. I think of some great posters who have dropped out over the years and ATS are generally a poorer place without them. However, I have hope that the people on this site will continually post great content on this site and push the envelope. While it may be true that hope dies last; you cannot move forward if you keep looking back.

Addressing your question of what a "gutter-rat" is; it's nothing to do with how long that you are registered on this site, but how you conduct yourself in the forums. If you needlessly insult people who have a contrary opinion/viewpoint and cannot contain your ill-founded anger; you're nothing more than an animal or a gutter-rat. Let's also put down the fact that older members aren't somehow above this sort of behaviour, as some tend to forget themselves and have disgraceful conduct that belies their registration date. Having looked through your recent post history, I have failed to find anything disreputable about your conduct. So, no. You're not a gutter-rat and I hope you enjoy your time at ATS.

And why so quick to think someone is lying and a fake?

People have been burnt before on this and want to be in the right for once and there are some sceptics on here as well but the good ones never jump the gun like some folk did. One has to learn to be logical and to not be prey to their baser emotions. It is a good idea to be sceptical but not to the point were you aggressively taunt, ridicule and insult a fellow member. Sarcasm is a very welcoming alternative but should be gingerly peppered in your posts and replies. If one is being truly idiotic in his/her posts; you should gently point it out instead of descending into tit-for-tat remarks.

Apologies for the long reply. Hopefully that clears up some things for you.

reply to post by Starchild23

You trust too much on here, you get hurt...or worse, you get stupid.

Certainly true. A dose of scepticism would certainly be beneficial for members on this site. To outright attack new members who have yet to post a thread on what they claim to know is premature.

Interesting you should raise this point, considering your thread provided an opportunity for exactly the sort of behavior you're protesting. If you don't want the cats to get in, don't install a doggy door.

Hardly. I am just glad that I wasn't the only one who was disappointed at the level of vitriol aimed at the 90+ user. The posts on this thread seem to express that sentiment as well which is surprising; considering that this is the RANT forum where capitalising your statements would be mildly acceptable. The level of vitriol aimed at that user/alleged hoaxer is rather unbecoming for a website like ATS; who's motto is to Deny Ignorance, yet a sizeable minority lost their minds over an INTRO thread. I'm more disappointed by the conduct of the members of this site than anything else and I believe this thread reflects that more than anything else since I'm clearly not the only one who shared the same disappointment when I read through that thread.

reply to post by boncho


It is but it's a very poor advert for ATS. If a potential new member stumbled upon that thread; they'd be taken aback by the viciousness that was on display and will think twice before joining up. It's no longer about who is in the right any more since the conduct of some members in that thread was nothing short of a disgrace. Hoax or not, there is no grace in that thread whatsoever.