Why my mind is closing towards Capitalism

reply to post by petrus4


Well said my friend and a very thought provoking thread. I agree with your perspective and look forward to a system that includes everyone and not just a particular segment of the population. A system that would incorporate everyone would overall reduce hunger, crime and other social economic problems. Star and flag .

reply to post by aravoth


no i am upset that people live for more then life itself,,, and that the poor are unable to live because of that reason

we are all humans on this world living mortal lives... we all eat food, sleep, work, have a family and home...
its that simple,, everything else is a distraction from that fact

if humans focused their priorities on feeding the population...

there would be no struggled for life... and humans could together share an eternity of progression...

but then people would have to look at each other as equals... and then things would be fair..

Originally posted by Tea4One
I'm going to bed. This discussion has been a pleasure. I shall leave you with something from Marx...

"Capitalism is whack y'all."

Go to bed, but I'll leave you this quote, you socialists/communist continue to try to FORCE your views on others, as is the way of socialism/communism you will find yourselves in a constant war with THE PEOPLE...

Your ideology has cost the people of the world over 110 million deaths, and millions more imprisoned in gulags, concentration camps, work camps, and indoctrination camps. Isn't it time for your ideology to die already?... It has cost humanity more than enough...

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


that has more to do with psychopaths and murderers then an innocent in itself ideology.... it has to do with people who are willing to kill others for their own temporal placement on a pedestal/

Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by aravoth

 

no i am upset that people live for more then life itself,,, and that the poor are unable to live because of that reason

Look, you guys are all talking about this utopian agrarian society where everyone shares everything. Theres another word for that, it's called tribal. I get it, you hate society right now, everyone does, but blasting off back to a time before the dark ages probably is not the best answer.

Like I said, if you guys wanna just go out in the middle of no-where and create your awesome "share it all" society, more power to you, but don't expect everyone, or even a majority to think thats a good idea.

reply to post by ImaFungi


Humm, so why do you have a computer instead of using that money to feed someone in the world?...

Why does anyone in this forum who thinks "socialism/communism" is the answer, and that capitalism is the reason why there are hungry people in the world have computers, have a house, have a car, or own anything instead of living in the woods and giving every cent they earn to "feed other people"?...

You see, really good people can only help others when they have a good life, and they have more than enough money to spend...

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


You still havent said 'Woodrow Wilson'

Im impressed.

Socialists arent going to go and hide in the woods. Our numbers are growing by the day. Real change means global socialism. Socialism for America.

This way it comes.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


in a true socialistic society ... people wouldnt need to cater or help others, because everyone would be taken care of, and everyone would have the means to help themselves...

i dont think any label of systems of past can organize the level of complexity that exists in the world right now...

i am not suggesting moving backwards... but suggesting with our knowledge, technology, and ability,, move forwards... together..

Originally posted by ImaFungi

that has more to do with psychopaths and murderers then an innocent in itself ideology.... it has to do with people who are willing to kill others for their own temporal placement on a pedestal/

Inocent ideology?...

Really? so an ideology which seeks to FORCE upon others the views of a few is innocent?...

An ideology which preaches that "a permanent revolution" must exist in which "peace can only be achieved by the absence of all oposition" is "an innocent ideology"?...

An ideology which seeks to eliminate all forms of spiritual views is "innocent"?...

reply to post by theubermensch


rofl, sounds like a nice comfy New World Order, hope it works out for you. Can't imagine it will though, most of your don't even own firearms because you're all anti-gun, so good luck forcing people to live in communes.

Originally posted by ImaFungi

in a true socialistic society ... people wouldnt need to cater or help others, because everyone would be taken care of, and everyone would have the means to help themselves...

Everyone would be taken care of? really? and who would take care of "everyone"?... BTW, the means to help one self is not a tenet of socialism/communism... According to socialism/communism "the means to help oneself is a selfish capitalist view"...

Originally posted by ImaFungi
...
i am not suggesting moving backwards... but suggesting with our knowledge, technology, and ability,, move forwards... together..

In a "socialistic society"... which history has shown does the contrary to what you claim it would do...

reply to post by petrus4


Beautifully said my friend. I completely agree with you, however, I fear for humanity. I think that because the level of inequality that has amassed in contemporary society due to the corporate regimes of a few, there will need to be some paradigm altering event. We need something like the French Revolution to free humanity from financial serfdom, but much, much bigger. I do not think this event will necessarily be under the direct control of humanity either, whatever that means. Some sort of greater universal consciousness will be at work, and humanity will finally realize its true nature within the cosmos.

S + F

Anakark

Originally posted by aravoth
reply to post by theubermensch

 

rofl, sounds like a nice comfy New World Order, hope it works out for you. Can't imagine it will though, most of your don't even own firearms because you're all anti-gun, so good luck forcing people to live in communes.

Im a socialist not a limp wristed liberal.

A revolutionary socialist beats an 'all talk,do nothing,capitalist neocon' everytime.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


socialism is in my mind and soul a very spiritual system..... i am opposed to brute force of all kinds... the only thing i want is all people realizing how much better the world would be if they worked together...

i am opposed to power and control...

i think people of governments should make the same amount of money as an average worker..

Originally posted by theubermensch

You still havent said 'Woodrow Wilson'

Im impressed.

Socialists arent going to go and hide in the woods. Our numbers are growing by the day. Real change means global socialism. Socialism for America.

This way it comes.

Really?... Well, you will find yourself with an oposition of billions of people, millions of which will be armed to the teeth...

I hope you are more than willing to pay the price...

reply to post by AwakeinNM


If half of these people had even a small clue as to what capitalism and socialism are as defined by economists, you'd have 100 stars on that post alone. That was perfect.

/TOA

reply to post by ImaFungi


and when you speak of spirituality,, there is only one god, one religion.. and it rules us all regardless of what we think or believe..

Originally posted by aravoth

Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi


Socialism is a social institution that can be integrated, politically, by varying degrees. It doesn't even have to have anything to do with politics. It's more of a function designed to keep disparity levels from becoming too excessive. It is also essential to implement within a faltering country to save it from economic collapse (ie, Keynesism).

Yes, you are correct, socialism is social engineering, which never allows anyone to fall to short, or anyone excel to far, it keeps everyone nice, stupid, and mediocre, always catering to the lowest common denominator.

Usually that includes people that think John Maynard Keynes was smart, and that Keynesianism "saves" anything from collapse, when it's actually Keynesianism that caused the collapse in the first place.

Cool story though...

You MUST be joking. Keynes caused the Great Depression? His ideas of government stimulating the public into resucitating the economy saved western countries. His whole point was for government to spend when the people cannot. How is that wrong?

And you think socialists are stupid? Free university in socialist countries. I already owe over 30Gs halfway into my degree.

ElectricUniverse-
Obviously you don't know what a University is... in a university you don't learn to "better society" you learn to THINK FOR YOURSELF and learn something that you can use in real life.

I don't know what a university is? I go there every day.

What I just quoted is a sad piece of text. "in a university you don't learn to "better society"". You seriously lack perception.

It is called PERSONAL DECISION, obviously something you have no idea what it means... Of course people like you would rather FORCE everyone to do your will...

I wish to force people to do things against their will? Did I suddenly evolve from a socialist to a fascist?

I don't know if you've noticed or not, but in socialist societies there is far, far greater opportunity to do what you wish to do in life. Money is not the issue, commitment is. If you're committed, then you'll get all of the training you need plus the actual position. In capitalist countries, for the same opportunity, one needs to be financially well off or good at blowing the boss.

Capitalism, and free markets, when they WERE free, actually helped people, not only did it help people personally better themselves, but when you better yourself and other people better themselves EVERYONE betters themselves...

You talk as if Adam Smith's "invisible hand" is gospel.

ETA, or Euskadi Ta Askatasuna, are the socialists who have been bombing Spain ever since they founded their group... It hasn't been NATO...it has been ETA.

Maybe you should study it up a bit. Try the book "NATO's Secret Armies - Operation Gladio" to start off with.

It is leftwing/socialist/communist ideology which seeks to centralize power, restrict individual liberty and take away the right to choose...

And there you go, grouping socialism and everything "leftwing" as being the same as demonized communism. You do know that there are socialist aspects in democratic, de-centralized, countries... right? There's a lot of socialism in my country and we're the 2nd most de-centralized nation on earth, right behind Spain.

-----

Anyways, here's a short diagram I made comparing the two different ideologies. Key point here: Unlike the posters that I have been responding to, I do not treat socialism as a threatening hostile idealogy; I see it as a separate, alternative, social system.



In my diagram, I try to emphasize that in a socialist society there is no disparity by design because people have a different wealth distribution system. I also try to demonstrate that from a capitalist perspective, why the successful capitalists can not accept socialism.