Why have morals if God/Nature has no morals?

Some deep but terrible questions:

Why do humans always need to do what's right and moral, when God and Mother Nature have no morality at all? Mother Nature kills countless animals, insects and plant life every second. And God allows wars, famines, poverty, disease, hunger, greed, and evil to kill people everyday. He does nothing to stop it. He lets evil people prosper and good people die young. He allows the strong to take advantage of the weak, and the "might is right" principle to rule the world. So if God himself has no morals, why must humans? How can there be any "universal morality code" if God or Mother Nature doesn't follow it? It's a terrible question, I know. Nothing makes sense in this world or life. But for crying out loud, stop pretending that there is some absolute "divine moral code" that exists for all creation.

Because of balance. Since nature has no morals, she gave us the free will to have/use them.

Since she may depend on us for whatever reason, and we definitely depend on her, morals are there as a balance so that it isn't total chaos.

Or it could be she gave us morals because she foresaw that we would build weapons of globally destructive power.

Hehe... globally destructive power, if a president ever uses that term, I want copyrights.

Every living creature lives by an unwritten covenant, moral code, including mother earth.
Break the covenant and death is sure to follow in short order.

reply to post by WWu777


There is no god. Nature in the wider sense has no morals.

Morals are a concept of social creatures, they are crafted to ensure the success of the society and they evolve as the society evolves.

Its quite possibly that there are creatures in the universe believing themselves moral, following codes we would consider abhorrent. An intelligent insect society (now a familiar sci-fi staple) would be very different.

reply to post by WWu777


Survival of the Species.

We must as a species have boundaries and limits on what we tolerate as a society. Our laws and moral guidelines are as much a part of our survival as teeth designed for ripping and tearing are for a Carnivore.

Out survival needs are unique to our species. Our survival strategy lies in our intelligence and because of that it also relies on boundaries of behavior. Not just us either. Other animals also have codes of conduct ingrained in them.

Canines hunt in packs and if a member goes rogue and starts killing others in the pack they join together to eliminate the member who is a threat. That's one example of a type of morality.

We as Humans are a part of nature. Everything we do is natural for us. We are social for survival. We set boundaries for behavior among ourselves for survival. As a group our chances of survival go up exponentially.

We have become more civilized if you will in how we deal with our rogues. Now we lock them in prisons to protect the community and treat them humanely according to our standards, where other species and we in the past would simply kill them to protect the community. All very natural for us.

Nature is very moral and another good example is animals of all descriptions protect their young.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
Every living creature lives by an unwritten covenant, moral code, including mother earth.
Break the covenant and death is sure to follow in short order.

Yeah right. And what moral code do animals and insects have? Eat, survive and reproduce?

Why do many evil people live longer lives than good people?

Mankind has morals because they are guided by their divine higher selves (rightness and reason) conscience.

The unbreakable number one law of the universe is; Thinking creates human physical destiny. This law cannot and will not be interfered with. So the bad things as well as the good that befalls man and mankind are of his own making. This is to teach man what to think or create and what not to think and therefore not create.

Man, who is emeshed in nature (the body) thinks mainly of things of nature, namely sex, food, a name (fame) possessions and power (control over things and others). This type of thinking creates destiny that must be worked out on the physical plane of the universe and continues to bind man to nature. Thus is the explanation of reincarnation. Man continues his rounds of physical existences to work out the destiny he has created for himself by his own thinking.

Man will continue in this way until he learns that the glam and gloss of nature is an illusion and never brings the satisfaction that somehow never seems to be sated. He will then look for a way out of the nature trap and use his thinking to find out who and what he really is.

I think you've got it all wrong. Humans don't feel the need to do what is good and right. They feel the need to tell OTHERS to do what is good and right.

God/Nature doesn't play favorites, no matter what so called "chosen people" tell you so.

It is a system that keeps everything moving and somewhat balanced and when it gets out of balance the violence and chaos that ensues is what sets it right again.

reply to post by MrUncreated


Exactly, predetermined moral codes set down by priesthoods and prophets are usually nothing more then tools of oppression.

Individual codes are The Way.

While it's true that nothing ultimately matters, and life is an ongoing horror destined to end badly, that's really no excuse to purposely make things worse than they already are. As long as we exist (which isn't long), why not try to make things as bearable as possible for yourself and others by not purposely trying to screw people over? Yeah, it's only good for the short term, but so what?

Isn't morality some kind of "survival strategy" for a species, rather than some "divine moral code" that exists for all creation?

Originally posted by MrUncreated
I think you've got it all wrong. Humans don't feel the need to do what is good and right. They feel the need to tell OTHERS to do what is good and right.

Haha! And how is your penis ?

Originally posted by baalbuster
God/Nature doesn't play favorites, no matter what so called "chosen people" tell you so.

It is a system that keeps everything moving and somewhat balanced and when it gets out of balance the violence and chaos that ensues is what sets it right again.

I'm not sure about that. The universe does seem to play favorites in that some people are a lot luckier than others, and consistently so. Some people avoid all accidents, while others keep having them. Some people seem to have better karma or luck than others. Such patterns are clear.

There is just life and death. I choose life for everything. That's why I am a vegetarian somewhere on her way to be a vegan, because .... I also choose life for me.

Morality is simply the intelligence to know the consequences to the other person if you do them harm. That is, you can foresee that harming someone/thing else would have a negative effect on them, and you would not want that to happen to you, so do not inflict it on another.

Basically: Do to others as you would have them do to you.

God is not needed for this basic sense, and Nature just is - if there is any sentience to Nature, then it is not within the realms of what we would consider 'moral' - that is, either it has no morality, or it is working on a grander scale than we currently perceive. Again, God(s) is not needed for any sense of morality, and historically has been used by most, if not all, cultures to justify immoral acts against fellow humans, animals and the Earth in general.

You can choose not to act morally within this definition, but if we all did that we wouldn't be here to have this discussion - and if you weren't lying in a ditch with your skull bashed in, you would be carrying a rather bloody rock away from someone else lying in that same ditch.

Here is my favorite aware freethinker Darryl Sloan on "defining good and evil without God".

reply to post by WWu777

Yeah right. And what moral code do animals and insects have? Eat, survive and reproduce?

Basically, same as humans, but think about ants for example, who's survival depends on the colonies survival. They have ranks and hierarchy just like humans. Bee's...same thing.

Now for humans it's not so complicated. For example honor thy mother and father. It's a hierarchy but your parents are supposed to raise you and instill morals that exist the day you are born, for your own benefit, then someday you have kids and you do the same for them.

There are also life lessons and while some people never learn, if you pay close attention to the unspoken lessons of life they can insure your success and your survival.

Why do many evil people live longer lives than good people?

Some people have simply found ways to manipulate the morality code, by manipulating others to break covenants while not literally actually breaking any themselves.

Living longer does not necessarily ensure survival. Some people live longer but they're lives may be living hell for all you know.

Originally posted by WWu777
Some deep but terrible questions:

Why do humans always need to do what's right and moral, when God and Mother Nature have no morality at all? Mother Nature kills countless animals, insects and plant life every second. And God allows wars, famines, poverty, disease, hunger, greed, and evil to kill people everyday. He does nothing to stop it. He lets evil people prosper and good people die young. He allows the strong to take advantage of the weak, and the "might is right" principle to rule the world. So if God himself has no morals, why must humans? How can there be any "universal morality code" if God or Mother Nature doesn't follow it? It's a terrible question, I know. Nothing makes sense in this world or life. But for crying out loud, stop pretending that there is some absolute "divine moral code" that exists for all creation.

edit on 26-1-2012 by WWu777 because: (no reason given)

Death is not always a bad thing. For some it's a release from this place to be reborn or exist somewhere better. Why would god stop it. God is using this place exactly like it is meant to. Too see who do the right thing for higher ideals and who do not and continue the lesson in another life. Sorry there is no free pass, you have to pay Karma and learn the lesson. It is mans choice to be ignorant but it will only prolong the suffering. The reason from my point of view that this place does not make sense is because you are in a helllike dimension where the demonpart of our minds (ego) is in control over our empathy. But since god is sending seeds like crazy it seems the plan is to evolve this place quickly before the ego brings armageddon. Why send angellike souls who have even less defence against the ego to this place so that they become corrupted in the dream if not to evolve this place to the next level. System Of A Down - Chop Suey - The lyrics www.youtube.com...

The fact that we haven't destoyed ourself with nuclear war yeet is a miracle in itself.

Sorry that your mind is getting pushed hard right now. Waking up can be painful and he/she/it is really pushing for change now. But if we take the longterm view. Who will care in a billion years. Namaste.

Originally posted by triune
Mankind has morals because they are guided by their divine higher selves (rightness and reason) conscience.

The unbreakable number one law of the universe is; Thinking creates human physical destiny. This law cannot and will not be interfered with. So the bad things as well as the good that befalls man and mankind are of his own making. This is to teach man what to think or create and what not to think and therefore not create.

Man, who is emeshed in nature (the body) thinks mainly of things of nature, namely sex, food, a name (fame) possessions and power (control over things and others). This type of thinking creates destiny that must be worked out on the physical plane of the universe and continues to bind man to nature. Thus is the explanation of reincarnation. Man continues his rounds of physical existences to work out the destiny he has created for himself by his own thinking.

Man will continue in this way until he learns that the glam and gloss of nature is an illusion and never brings the satisfaction that somehow never seems to be sated. He will then look for a way out of the nature trap and use his thinking to find out who and what he really is.

You are wise, as I SEE, but you offer no solutions!