An Iranian's view on the whole situation

Originally posted by Rocky Black
reply to post by seenavv

 

How about arming #e muslims in IRAQ to attack us troops with Iranian weapons.

Though I am not a pro-Iranian person I had to have a chuckle at what you wrote...

How about staying out of that region and staying in your own. Iraq had nothing to do with 9.11 nor did it have any weapons of mass destruction.

How about killing and tortturing your own people. What about that woman Jourrnalist that was held in Evan Prison who was tortured and killed.

Guantanamo Bay. How about the new citizen detainment bill in America? What about the biased journalism that is outrageous in America?

You reap what you so.

By that logic you are waiting for America to collapse? Being all around the world, in other people's backyard, and complaining that their people are attacking you....true hero.

If Iran has all the oil and gas reserves and so much money and pipeline and export money.

Why do they need nuklear power.

The same could be said about America. You have coal and you have oil/gas why do you need nuclear power? Maybe is it because it is a cleaner burning fuel then fossil fuels?

How about some wind technologies.

Wind is good but are you going to put a generator on every square foot to power 1 city?

ZNo they want to be able to threaten their neightbors with nuke weapons.

Tha is why there will be a war and we are all gonna die.

That is the way it is.

You are very one sided in your arguments and show no open mindedness for the world. You listen to what the media tells you and follow it with all your heart.

You want ISREAL wiped off the map well we shall all be wiped off the map someday as we are the poison that is inhabiting and destroying this earth buy our drilling deep into the earth crust and sucking all the oil out.

Well how about all the water that is contaminated and all the poision we spew on the earth.

Doesn't matter as when it happens it happens.

Ironic, America is the #1 pollutant. What makes you special enough to point at any nation on Earth and tell them they are destroying it? From my perspective, these wars are only there to cover up how this system is a sham. Print money out of thin air and lend it to people. When the nation begins to learn of the corrupt ways they go to war and everyone becomes an unquestioning patriot.

Excellent thread.

It's sad that 'some people' seem to think that Iran is some kind of mega force of evil, yet, when we look at other governments around the world, Iran is hardly the worst. I find it annoying that those 'some people' seem to fixate on the fact that Iran is Islamic, as if that means ----> Terrorist. Apparently, this is a good justification for invasion. Afterall, Iran is predominantly Islamic and they have a culture different from ours, therefore, they are primitive terrorists who chop people's heads off...atleast, that's the mantra, and how good it is that we should grace them, save them from themselves, civilize them while we pillage. Those 'some people' also add to their list of justifications by hyperventilating about their nuclear program, funny, when you consider our own personal track record. They say Israel has a right to defend itself...yet Iran dosn't? Why not? And why do we think we can just waltz around and tell other countries what they can and can't do? I doubt it is because we have the higher 'moral ground', har har on that one. I've yet to see any real reasons as to why Iran is a threat to the United States in a real and meaningful way...if anything, our own run-away government is.
And no, i'm not saying the Iranian government is full of rainbows and gum drops with sunshine sprinkles, i've yet to see any government that was...

Originally posted by Sharpenmycleats
reply to post by seenavv

 

If I understand you right you have only spent the equivalent of 1 year of your life in Iran. So how did you become an expert in "all things Iran?"

I never claim to be an expert, I simply explaining my views gathered from my research, my experience, and my consultation with parents, friends, and family who have been directly involved in the conflicts in Iran over the past 3-5 decades

I also noticed you started out your thread trying to sound neutral and pro-western civilization. Then about 2/3's of the way into your thread you lash out, quote from you, "How many times do some of you idiots buy into this form of fear SO easily? Even if it's been proven you've been lied to in the past, and by the same people!". I also laugh when people say "No WMD's", Saddam not only had them he used them on Iran. Now if you want to go down the path that the USA gave them to him, then used that against him, well that's a different thread.

There is no evidence of him having WMD at any point in his rule. However he was provided with chemical weapons by the USA to use against Iran in the Iran-Iraq war in the 80s which resulted in many civilian casualties in Iran. It has however been fully disclosed and documented that Sadam did not Posses WMD during the US invasion Iraq in the past decade. And sorry by "you idiots" I am solely referring to warmongers who are jumping on the identical WMD bandwagon used to start the war in Iraq. It was a lie and they were never found

I also totally disagree with your interpretation on the threat from Ahmadinejad. To vanish someone from the "page of time", to me means that you not only want them vanished physically but you want to rewrite history to remove them from ever existing.

First, you have to acknowledge that he was, and still is to this day, deliberately misrepresented in his statement. Second, his statement clearly implies that the imam wishes to see the regime occupying Jerusalem to vanish from the page of time. There is no reference to any map, citizens, land, or infrastructure residing in Israel it is solely the regime

Now we do agree on one thing. The Iranian citizens, at least all of them I have met are fantastic people.

Thank you , I think there are fantastic people in all countries of this world

There is no way we should want to kill any of them. I also think if you took a poll most American would agree with that statement, I also agree that most Iranians don't believe death to Americans.

I absolutely agree, no one wants to see people killed in any sort of conflict. But unfortunately the same was said before the invasion of Iraq. They supposedly went to "free" the people and told everyone Sadam was the enemy, not the citizens... but there were over 1 million+ civilian casualties in this invasion.

However, it appears neither government wants to listen to the will of their people.

I absolutely agree... it is a widespread problem amongst all people on this planet, including Iran

I will believe you are not a troll when your thread provides fair representation of both sides of the issues you discuss. if the thread is, "Iran is perfect and all this hoopla and war mongering is just Israel and the West then I say, Government Paid Troll.

Iran is far from perfect, many people passionately despise the regime but we also fear another overthrow because of the potential of hijacking by western interests again

I wonder how many threads on Iran we are going to see.
Probably as many as the Nirubu, is my guess.

The Iranians I know are not so enamoured as the OP is with the Iranian Regime. They fear the oppressive nature, the potential for violence on the part of their government.

Sure have seen alot of hearts and flowers lately for little ol' Iran.

As a sceptic, I don't believe even half of what my own government is telling me.

Does anyone here honestly believe the Iranians government?
Or their apologists?

My opinions are probably well known by know on the subject of iran. But I'll repeat them just to avoid any issue.

Get rid of the nuclear ambitions, you're making the rest of the world nervous.
Want to be taken seriously? Start by allowing human rights into your society.
Like equality for women and gays.
Stop with the IED's to other countries. It's annoying and it p!sses the rest of the world off.

I guess that's all for now.
Peace.
beez

Get rid of the nuclear ambitions, you're making the rest of the world nervous.
Want to be taken seriously? Start by allowing human rights into your society.
Like equality for women and gays.
Stop with the IED's to other countries. It's annoying and it p!sses the rest of the world off.

reply to post by beezzer


The US , Israel, Pakistan, having nukes also makes the world nervous. Especially as the US are the only ones to have used nukes in anger.

The US should stop using drone attacks on sovereign nations, it's annoying and pisses the rest of the world off.

So if your biggest concern is the treatment of gays and women, there are many other targets in the world that have a far worse record with regards to human rights.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr

The US , Israel, Pakistan, having nukes also makes the world nervous. Especially as the US are the only ones to have used nukes in anger.

The US using them is a topic for another thread. I'd look forward to debating that issue. As for Israel, Pakistan? While it's too late to put that particular genie back in the bottle, we don't need to add to the growing list of countries that have them.

The US should stop using drone attacks on sovereign nations, it's annoying and pisses the rest of the world off.

I hope it annoys and pisses off our enemies the most.

So if your biggest concern is the treatment of gays and women, there are many other targets in the world that have a far worse record with regards to human rights.

I imagine you are correct in that regard. But we aren't beating the war drums with them.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr

Get rid of the nuclear ambitions, you're making the rest of the world nervous.
Want to be taken seriously? Start by allowing human rights into your society.
Like equality for women and gays.
Stop with the IED's to other countries. It's annoying and it p!sses the rest of the world off.

reply to post by beezzer

 

The US , Israel, Pakistan, having nukes also makes the world nervous. Especially as the US are the only ones to have used nukes in anger.

The funniest thing is, Israel is completely uncooperative with the disclosure of it's nuclear armaments and its one of the only 3 countries in the world that is NOT part of the NPT

Wonderful post OP! Star and Flag for you and for posting a different point of view to this great debacle.

Trawled through the posts, came across a few which I felt deserved a response, but this one struct me as being the best to voice my opinion to:

Originally posted by nightbringr

Originally posted by Tw0Sides

Originally posted by nightbringr
Do you deny Iran hangs gays in the streets with the permission of the government? And do you also deny your president famously and proudly announcing to the world that there are "no gays in Iran"?

Was it not long ago, Black Men were found hanging from trees .
Nice to see you stand up for your beliefs though, you go girl.

Yep, but we have moved past that, havent we?

And when those black men were swinging, it wasnt with the governments explicit permission. Think before you speak.

Did our president ever announce proudly that "There are no more blacks in the USA!"?

edit on 17-1-2012 by nightbringr because: (no reason given)

Moved past that? Really? Rodney King? LA riots? Wasn't authorised by the government? Mmmhhhmm which exact government/side are you speaking about? The North or the South? Slavery in the US was on such a scale I doubt it will ever be "swept under the carpet" however much you might wish it to be. Let alone Vietnam, Iraq, Pakistan.. the list goes on.

Because the United States of America pushes this perception of it being a civilised and democratic country does not necessarily make it true. Hell, your government has actually started hating all of you equally. *thumbs up*

Detroit? Mass unemployment, poverty, 99%, occupy wall street etc..? No?

Right now, in the Western "civilised" world, being an American is about as low as it gets when it comes to freedoms.

Good luck with the FEMA camps dear.

T

Well, I think you just stated the obvious.

You need to get rid of your current regime to have a hope and a prayer. It's all you've got.

And regardless of whether or not you think Ahmadinejad ever used the "map" word, there's too much evidence on the internet of far worse things that he has said about Israel and the U.S. to even dwell on that any more. I hope you're not full of talk and take some action at home.

So, is all of this an error in translation too?

I highly recommend you read the whole link, because it's filled with much much more!

Quotes from Ahmadinejad:

"One hundred years ago the last trench of Islam fell, when the oppressors went towards the creation the Zionist regime. It is using it as a fort to spread its aims in the heart of the Islamic world. ... The skirmishes in the occupied land are part of a war of destiny. The outcome of hundreds of years of war will be defined in Palestinian land ... Some wonder whether there would come a day when one would see a world without the United States and Zionism ... This slogan and goal is one which is attainable and could definitely be realized. There is no doubt that the new wave in Palestine will soon wipe off this disgraceful blot [Israel] from the face of the Islamic world."

Ahmadinejad stressed "Our dear Imam [Khomeini] ordered that the occupying regime in Jerusalem be wiped off the face of the earth."

"This was a very wise statement. The issue of Palestine is not one which we could compromise on... I warn the heads of all nations of the Islamic world to beware of this trap."

"If some, who are under pressure by the dominating powers, follow a misguided policy or are naive, or selfish or have earthly desires, recognize this regime (Israel), they should know that they would be burnt in the fire of the Islamic Ummah (Nation) and will bear an eternal stigma on their foreheads."

He further expressed his firm belief that the new wave of confrontations generated in Palestine and the growing turmoil in the Islamic world would in no time wipe Israel away.

On 26 October 2005 Islamic Revolutionary Guards spokesman Seyyed Massoud Jazayeri said "If this cancer (Israel) is not removed from the Islamic world, Muslims will sustain immense harm... This wound was opened more than half a century ago and has still not been healed, because in the Islamic world, some leaders and regimes, which have not been democratically elected by their own people, continue to rule, with the help of Western imperialism. A world without Zionism, and the obliteration of Israel from the face of the earth, is not only the objective of Iran, but of the whole Muslim world."

www.globalsecurity.org...

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by coolforschool


What the United States gave to Iraq was some samples of some biological agents which Iraq claimed would be used by their universities to get vaccines. That and advanced computers.

But as long as you hate the United States for any reason right?...even if it is LIES...

edit on 17-1-2012 by ElectricUniverse because: (no reason given)

yeh well that's just the stuff quoted in the press or on a bidget sheet, you have to remember there are lots of behind the scenes dodgy dealings , specially with secret service groups ! every country does it
the CIA and the US are no exception !

Originally posted by Rocky Black
reply to post by seenavv

 

How about arming #e muslims in IRAQ to attack us troops with Iranian weapons.

How about killing and tortturing your own people. What about that woman Jourrnalist that was held in Evan Prison who was tortured and killed.

Sorry no love here pal.

You reap what you so.

You so hate well expect hate to come right back at you.

Let me ask this question.

If Iran has all the oil and gas reserves and so much money and pipeline and export money.

Why do they need nuklear power.

How about some wind technologies.

ZNo they want to be able to threaten their neightbors with nuke weapons.

Tha is why there will be a war and we are all gonna die.

That is the way it is.

You want ISREAL wiped off the map well we shall all be wiped off the map someday as we are the poison that is inhabiting and destroying this earth buy our drilling deep into the earth crust and sucking all the oil out.

Well how about all the water that is contaminated and all the poision we spew on the earth.

Doesn't matter as when it happens it happens.

You are so perpetuating that ignorant American stereotype right now.

First of all, thanku 2 tha OP for an insightful post..! I am certainly alarmed by America's history in that part of tha World..

I think a strong lesson to b learned from this thread, iz that there iz a definite under-current of Greed, War-mongering, Liez & Deception at tha very Heart of the problem...

This Planet iz over-populating at such a phenomenal rate, that 'big-consumer' countries are trying their best 2 keep up with an unsustainable way of Life...

...and it all revolves around 'OIL'...

Originally posted by Rocky Black
reply to post by n00bUK

 

We steal nothing.

We liberate.

Make free.

Someday you may be free from oppression..

If you lucky.

Oh, yessss... like you liberated Bosnia, Herzegovina, Panama, Irak and others; like you tried to liberate Vietnam and Korea and Afghanistan (only they didn't like your freedom and kicked you in da nutz, eh?)
Liberation by killing civilians, screwing up their lives, destroying their property, tearing apart their ethnic and cultural identity, only to replace them by McDonalds, Coca-Cola and WalMart.
Who the heck asked YOU to go in their country and "liberate" them? Were they sending you (your government, that is) letters and e-mails crying for help? I seriously doubt it.

Did you ever see a man, a woman or a child torn apart and lying in their own blood, killed by one of your super-duper-brainwashed-soldier? Did you? Well, I DID and you should try that too. At least this will give you a fair idea about the joy of being "liberated" by the Almighty United States Army!

Lucky, you say? Lucky? With the risk of having this post deleted, I must tell you: you, mister, have some nerve to put that up, in the current context.
Do you think war is like you see it from your porch, when, with a six-pack and a shotgun, you defend your properta' from the oh-so-dangerous squirrels or rabbits, huh?
Have you EVER looked upon another human being through the gun-sight? Have you EVER watched someone dying, screaming in pain, with a bullet in the guts?
Luck? Damn, man, you REALLY have some nerve...

You steal nothing, uh-huh. You just take. That's a difference, indeed.

You know something, mister? Why don't you and all the others like you keep sitting on that porch of yours, with your six-pack and your gun and forget about "liberating" and "not-stealing" other countries, hm, how about that?
And when you'll get some mass cries for help, only then make your move? But I guess you'd be waiting 'till the Judgement Day before getting that request for help.

Originally posted by averageGuy505

There seems to be enough ignorance to go around in this thread. America was a strong backer of Saddam and sold him everything he wanted, including weapons and ammunition during his war with Iran. In '79 when we got tossed out of Iran, the Russians were invited in. When a shooting war between Iran and Iraq developed, the Russians cut Saddam off cold. So, Saddam cut his deal with America, which is how he ended up with Anthrax weapons. This info isn't that difficult to find, yet you apparently didn't try to locate it and as a result your post morphs into complete misinformation. We were Iraq's largest weapons supplier, or rather our CIA was.
...

Actually I have written about this a whole deal, and even in this thread i gave a small description of what and who sold what to Iraq.

My friend, EUROPEAN COUNTRIES were the majority of the people/companies who sold military equipment to Iraq, and it was GERMANY who sold the mustard gas, and such to Iraq which Saddam used to gas the Kurds, and many of his own people.

Heck France built the first nuclear weapons facility for Iraq and taught them how to make more and how to make nukes, not to mention that Saddam got his jets from France as well...

The United States unfortunately did sell SAMPLES of biological agents to Iraq to be used by Iraqi Universities to make vaccines, as well as advanced computers which Saddam used for military purposes.

The United states did sell other DUAL used equipment, such as helicopters for spraying pesticides on crops, but Saddam used people as the crops.

The other thing the U.S. sold to Saddam was intelligence to fight against the Iranians.

In the 90s the Russians became Saddam's number one suppliers of military equipment and WMD to the point that Saddam owed more money to the Russians than to anyone else...

Did the U.S. know that the DUAL use equipment and biologicals which they sold as samples were going to be used not as vaccines but to produce more biological agents? Who knows.

You do know that for example the PS3 and XBox360 are advanced computers and are also DUAL USE, which could be used for things they are not intended to be used, including for miltiary purposes?...

Are you going to go after the companies which build these game consoles because they are DUAL USE?...

Man, I've been an American my whole life but I've been smart. As I've gotten older I've just completely tuned out anything that could be considered "mainstream america". The only news I watch is either aljezera or rt, that's it. I don't listen to mainstream american music, opting for european and south american electronic music. I don't watch much tv, if the tv is on it's usally pbs or one of it's related channels. I'm 21 now and I think I have a good grip on world politics now and man I just want to say I'm sorry. No where near are americans as stupid, dumb, and degenerated as most people believe. Problem is the americans that are made an example of are of the lowest common denomanator. Just like how our media only portrays iranians as "death to america" flag burning extremists. Sure, some exist, but it's not the WHOLE of Iran. I'll be honest though, I saw a documentary about iran in the year 2005, I actually don't remember much but even I was like "oh wow" a little bit when I saw that Iran was just as advanced as any western nation. Yes, that's how bad the media portrays that part of the world, not just Iran, but Iraq and afghanstan. First off, they refer to that area as the middle east, when I know for a fact that afghanastan is in south asia. Second, american media would lead you to believe that it's all just dirt hills and goat farmers, nothing of any first world "western city" value. Third off, through various, all real accounts of people who were ex military at my university, and even a professor who was ex cia, they all confirmed such things as iran CONTRA and us soilders running poppies in south asia for decades. I hate my country, bro. You don't know how bad I feel for the bad things done in the name of this country cuz it shouldn't happen. I'm a smart, good willed american, and there has to be like millions of other americans that feel the same way. But yeah, there is a sizeable portion of the population that is just dumb as rocks, I have friends who can't point out countries on a globe. My friends had a globe in his room for decoration, I looked at it and just started to rattle off country names, he's like "how do you know this -_-" That's the state of our young people today. Oh yeah, to finish off this rant, SOPA is gonna killed jobs in the us over the next 5 years or maybe even decade, this is my belief. I'm going for BA in computer science, so I'm aiming for software engineer, even systemadmin or such. Where are the jobs gonna be for me in the next 5 years if this crap passes?? This scares the hell out of me.

reply to post by Rocky Black


What about us killing their people? How is that any different/better than them killing themselves?

reply to post by seenavv


the US has terrorized the world for our gain....N. Korea has many nukes and we aint pissing on them, guess we know where we can afford to pick our battles...Our country is pathetic, the older I get the more ashamed I am. I understand its because of those in power but it is the American people that put them in power and stand for this #... and anyone want to tell me elections are rigged, American people are content with a two party system and will "vote" to continue the process, no real body of people will make waves about it and more elections of the "Bush/Kerry" scull & bones type is the norm. Cheney and Obama related, you got to be f*#@ing kidding me America....The Whitehouse has had some of the same faces since the Vietnam era, until that changes Iran Syria and all surrounding countries will be absorbed into their new age agenda.

MD

Instead of all out war , why dont NATO just give them humanitarian aid , like they did with libya !
oh sorry they are the same thing arent they!

By far the most #ed up thing about this whole scenario is that we the people of earth are against the war, yet its our governments supposedly elected by us that start the wars !

Despite our protest they dont listen , so whats up with that ?
we protested Iraq they killed them
we protested libya , they killed them !
Iran next , lets give them humanitarian aid , lets bomb them !
thats whats going to happen regardless of our constant opposition to the inevitable

reply to post by shansen


Me I did not liberate anyone.

The us arm forces provented the slaughter of the muslims do you not forget.

Shall I go on ....