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Originally posted by cloudyday
Unions encourage workers to believe that they are enemies of the owners. Communists do exactly the same thing. That is what I find scary about unions - tyranny of the masses.edit on 15-1-2012 by cloudyday because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Cassius666
I dont exactly get what point you are trying to make. That a salary should/is payd according to talent? It reads more like you are trying to avoid a confrontation.
You dont know the first thing about communism.
Originally posted by Cassius666
You dont know the first thing about communism. Unions encourage workers to put themselves in a position where they can negotiate on a level playing field. How is that tyranny of the masses? Sounds like a bashing of democracy. If a great deal of workers are unhappy with their salary and they organise themselves to vouche their demand and put down their work all at the same time, thats tyranny of the masses?edit on 15-1-2012 by Cassius666 because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by antonia
Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by antonia
Don't you get tired of putting words in others mouths?
Spare me all the reasons why you can't succeed.
Oh? Well, SyphonX has is right. We are drones and you are right, we do it to ourselves. As for me, it's way too late. Having the kid sealed my fate. I'm not going anywhere and my life is pretty much working too long for too little. If it wasn't for the kid i'd have done myself in ages ago and I mean that.
So in closing people-If you want to get ahead don't have kids and major in a science or technology field.
Originally posted by UmbraSumus
reply to post by Cassius666
Its an interesting Avatar you have when you consider that this man ...... fired the air traffic controllers on strike in 1981. Believed to be a seminal event for the legal right of private employers.
.........
To your question.
I think that workers need all the leverage they can get in organising the best deal for selling their labour. Corporations have become so behemoth and well resourced...its hardly a level playing field. But trade unions can get a little power hungry and corrupt too given enough time.
Originally posted by Cassius666
I still dont get what point you are trying to make. I dont question there is talen. How does it relate to what I said? From what I read you seem to argue that everyone should be payd according to his talents and skills. I can only guess because you dont say what your point is.
Or do you feel there should be a fixed figure of income determined by talent and skill?
Originally posted by Xtrozero
Originally posted by Cassius666
I still dont get what point you are trying to make. I dont question there is talen. How does it relate to what I said? From what I read you seem to argue that everyone should be payd according to his talents and skills. I can only guess because you dont say what your point is.
A job is worth what skills it takes to do it. If a job is unskilled then it should be low pay, and if a person wants more than they can negotiate, but their best course of action is to get skills and a better job. Holding a company hostage as in the form of a strike is not negotiating though.
You advocate using money as a tool for social engineering. A job is not worth what skill it takes to do it. A job is worth what both sites can negotiate, if only one side does the negotiating, then the price is going to be skewed closely to what the side doing the negotiating wants.
Or do you feel there should be a fixed figure of income determined by talent and skill?
All jobs are somewhat fixed within a range of pay, but your power to negotiate is in what you bring to it i.e. skill. If you have no skills or ones a company does not value there is no negotiating. So I guess my main point is that if a person wants a better wage then they need to get the skills for a different job that pays better. As example a woman who is a phone receptionist most likely does not get paid very well, so what are her choices? Remember I said all jobs fall within a range, well the upper and lower range of a receptionist both suck in pay. She can either motivate all the other receptionists to strike or, just maybe, get a better skill and a better job. Let's say they strike and get a raise, well their pay still sucks.... If she goes to night school and learns to become a dental tech then she can move to a higher range of pay that even at the lower end is 2x what she was making at the higher end before.
Getting ahead in life is much more internal than external. Many though feel it is all external and either the Government or a company needs to take care of them.
Originally posted by UmbraSumus
reply to post by Cassius666
Its an interesting Avatar you have when you consider that this man ...... fired the air traffic controllers on strike in 1981. Believed to be a seminal event for the legal right of private employers.
.........
To your question.
I think that workers need all the leverage they can get in organising the best deal for selling their labour. Corporations have become so behemoth and well resourced...its hardly a level playing field. But trade unions can get a little power hungry and corrupt too given enough time.
Originally posted by antonia
Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by antonia
Don't you get tired of putting words in others mouths?
Spare me all the reasons why you can't succeed.
Oh? Well, SyphonX has is right. We are drones and you are right, we do it to ourselves. As for me, it's way too late. Having the kid sealed my fate. I'm not going anywhere and my life is pretty much working too long for too little. If it wasn't for the kid i'd have done myself in ages ago and I mean that.
So in closing people-If you want to get ahead don't have kids and major in a science or technology field.
Originally posted by ldyserenity
What I don't really get is how the right continues to propegate this BS that only the left wants redistribution, when it is not only the left. The right wants redistribution too, The only problem is, they want it siphoned and redistributed to the top of the pyramid, and, lo and behold, they have been exceedingly successful in doing it within the past few years, the only reason that they hate the left is, the left wants it redistributed to the masses (you know those that the people at the top of the pyramid rode on the backs of for profit) by way of fair wages. So the left is evil for wanting some of the pie basically, because the right thinks they are the only ones "entitled" to any of it, just because they think they're so smart...well I tell them wait until a survival shtf scenario and see just how "Smart" you think you are when you don't even know how to till a field or build a cabin, or even how to do laundry without setting a machine to do it.
Originally posted by apushforenlightment
Originally posted by ldyserenity
What I don't really get is how the right continues to propegate this BS that only the left wants redistribution, when it is not only the left. The right wants redistribution too, The only problem is, they want it siphoned and redistributed to the top of the pyramid, and, lo and behold, they have been exceedingly successful in doing it within the past few years, the only reason that they hate the left is, the left wants it redistributed to the masses (you know those that the people at the top of the pyramid rode on the backs of for profit) by way of fair wages. So the left is evil for wanting some of the pie basically, because the right thinks they are the only ones "entitled" to any of it, just because they think they're so smart...well I tell them wait until a survival shtf scenario and see just how "Smart" you think you are when you don't even know how to till a field or build a cabin, or even how to do laundry without setting a machine to do it.
I hope that there will be a need for technicians also because otherwise I will be doomed . Let the change come already. Namaste
Originally posted by milkyway12
The more Wages you get the more you can afford , the more prices rise. There is no point in raising wages. Things will just rise in price.