I have an interesting friend

I'm not saying he is right but I will ask this question of everyone within ear shot. Who are we to define what is right about anything in the field of OBE. It is something that not many in the world can truly understand why or even how that it works, all we know is that it seems to be a valid truth about some or all of us that it can be done. The fact is that not many know what reality truly is. In the words of Doc Brown we only see in 3 dimensions, and we don't accept that there are things out there that we can't see. The fact that we don't see them does, not negate the fact that they are there. We see life as all human or all carbon based when there are many other substances and types of life depending on conditions that could thrive. They have found microorganisms in space for crying out loud. In my opinion the ones of us that question our own sanity are not the ones to worry about. Worry about the ones that are in denial.

Originally posted by UFObuilder1
I'm not saying he is right but I will ask this question of everyone within ear shot. Who are we to define what is right about anything in the field of OBE. It is something that not many in the world can truly understand why or even how that it works, all we know is that it seems to be a valid truth about some or all of us that it can be done. The fact is that not many know what reality truly is. In the words of Doc Brown we only see in 3 dimensions, and we don't accept that there are things out there that we can't see. The fact that we don't see them does, not negate the fact that they are there. We see life as all human or all carbon based when there are many other substances and types of life depending on conditions that could thrive. They have found microorganisms in space for crying out loud. In my opinion the ones of us that question our own sanity are not the ones to worry about. Worry about the ones that are in denial.

You must be Dutch.

Come on people. Deny ignorance!!

This mans friend is claiming Jesus lives in a space ship behind a mechanical moon with all the angels.... Why would Jesus be in a spaceship? He is more than likley incarnated on earth now. While im all for the belief that there is a collective wisdom that can be tapped into through meditation or projecting your spirit to other places, astral travel, remote viewing and all that im not sure if thats what this man is really doing.

I think any body who has studied biology would know that plants do produce oxygen and it was not untill enough plant life had evolved and produced enough oxygen that more complex life forms could evolve. Your friend may need to see a phychiatrist. I do agree with some of his theories but those two mainly are what completly discredited this whole thread for me..

Any way that was just my 2 cents,, Peace

Originally posted by PuterMan
reply to post by ProudBird

 

Again, the vivid imagination, but not very in-depth education in science obviously.

Obviously? Just because they do not fit with your idea of the Universe?

Your friend's stories would be in the "Fantasy" genre, and not good solidly based Science Fiction. He may wish (if he can write) to explore that direction......as long as it is clear that it's Fantasy. It is unfortunate, however that there are many, many individuals in the World who cannot distinguish fact and science from Fantasy........

Including many scientists it would seem or we would not be suffering this AGW BS.

As it happens I have a very keen interest in the plasma core theory and in the expanding earth and electric universe. Certainly these theories do not explain everything but there are also many things wrong with the idea that the core is iron and that nothing is expanding, and that comets are balls of ice and with plate tectonics. Perhaps you should do some study and open your mind a little before commenting on an area to which you obviously have not applied any thought, just the mainstream knee-jerk reaction.

Whilst I would not go along with creatures living in the Sun, who actually knows. Can we state that? A few years ago we would have said that nothing could live in the area of a volcanic vent. You cannot deny that some of the things that are seen in the NASA space video of the shuttle cannot be explained by 'ice crystals' or other such BS.

There is a vast amount just on this planet alone that we have not explored an do not know and in my opinion no one can categorically state that we know it all. The science, in all spheres, most definitely is NOT settled.

By the way go tell the Shamans and medicine men of your opinion on mind enhancing drugs. They would laugh at you.

This post deserves more stars.

Honestly, just because someone has something interesting to say based on OBE experiences (that's what we were told and because the OP is unwavering and so is his friend on that explanation then I have no reasons to doubt that because OBEs themselves are strange in nature), it seems all the "smart idiots" come out of the woodwork trying to look intelligent but instantly dismissing something that goes against their current belief system.

It's like the "smart idiots" who continued to claim that the Earth was flat and that anyone who said otherwise was crazy.

reply to post by dilly1


So an OBE denier who thinks those who don't blindly dismiss them as fantasies happens to have one of the biggest fantasies of all time in his signature (that of the theory that two planes didn't cause thousands of deaths on 9/11)?

Interesting....

reply to post by Warpthal

Do you follow any religion?

No, of course not.

Or do you prefer to justify religion with linear logic?

I leave that sort if inane "justification" to the sorts who do try to twist as mightily as they can, for their "religions".

Just as it should have been clear, to those with "open minds", that this person's statements are the result of his own imagination at work. It is, without wishing to go into any specific detail (since it's impossible sometimes to categorize every person, and their possible mental aberrations similar to schizophrenia in some respects....Just, as example, the person who is certain that he sees something (hallucination) or hears it (hallucination again).

It is far more common than many people realize.

As far as OOBEs, they seem to be a function of, as noted in many studies, various naturally-produced chemicals and neurotransmitters that exist in the brain -- but can sometimes become out of proper proportion to each other, and produce amazing (and again, hallucinogenic effects).

Vast research has been and continues to be done in this field of medical inquiry.

As a side note, only half-jokingly -- I sometimes consider certain extreme religions devotees to have a mental aberration as well. One that reduces their grasp and comprehension of logic and rational thought.

There is a difference between "spirituality" and "blind faith in the supernatural"......

if your friend can travel the universe and talk to aliens he should be able to ask them about the bonzai samurai incident... but thats cool... just keep it in mind...

Peace,
-TF

Originally posted by BillyTJames
Come on people. Deny ignorance!!

This mans friend is claiming Jesus lives in a space ship behind a mechanical moon with all the angels.... Why would Jesus be in a spaceship? He is more than likley incarnated on earth now. While im all for the belief that there is a collective wisdom that can be tapped into through meditation or projecting your spirit to other places, astral travel, remote viewing and all that im not sure if thats what this man is really doing.

.................

Any way that was just my 2 cents,, Peace

Yes - OK obviously loony tunes nonsense - but you have to bear in mind that travels in the ether can on occasion lead you to meet some very deceptive tricksy characters who will feed you with all sorts of nonesense.

reply to post by JohhnyBGood


In that case this mans friend has been decieved and what ever characters responsible are laughing their heads off. Provided that any of this is serious and not an attempt to fish for stars and flags, not that i think it is.

Also just thinking about the plasma core his friend claims, if that where true what would account for the magnetic field and pointing of compass needles?? That kind of rules out the plasma core idea in my books.

For those who are here with something to prove

seriously: Get Out, your wasting your time and energy/

I mean come on...if all you are hear to do is argue your point than go somewhere else. You creating unnecessary friction, nobody is saying this is fact.


Do you really think your going to change anyone's mind? NO...if someone wants to change their mind its their choice.

has your friend ever stopped to think that his OBE's were OD's instead

reply to post by musselwhite


In this Forum of "Philosophy" there can still be room for a bit of grounding with facts, in order to properly seek a better "philosophical" outcome, without steering off course ---

Sorry that you simply accepted your "friend's" email assertions without properly examining the claims made. The "facts" that are used to assert the Moon's artificiality are just plain wrong:

1. The moon is a perfect sphere."

Not true. At all. Unless you were Aristotle, and lived in his time.

Aristotle's view, which was the accepted theory at the time, was that the moon was a perfect sphere and that the Earth was the center of the universe. When Galileo looked at the moon with a telescope, he saw a different image -- a rugged terrain of mountains and craters.

www.howstuffworks.com...

[The ^ ^ ^ above also refutes item #3, below)


Also, from Wiki....there is a minor variance of the equatorial and polar radii:

Mean radius: 1,737.10 km (0.273 Earths)[1][2]
Equatorial radius: 1,738.14 km (0.273 Earths)[2]
Polar radius: 1,735.97 km (0.273 Earths)[2]
Flattening: 0.00125

en.wikipedia.org...

So really, merely repeating untruths and passing them along? Well, this doesn't deny ignorance at all.

It IS interesting, but not surprising, to see the slight variance...of course, the Earth's gravity has an influence along the Moon's equator...but, the Moon is not very "flexible", so the difference is minor. Also, it's rotation rate is slow...Earth's equator has a pronounced bulge, due to our rotation mostly.

You can compare MANY other natural satellites in our Solar System.....such as Europa. Just a tad smaller than our Moon, it also appears in photos to be a "perfect" circle, implying a "perfect" sphere. Too far away for anything but a "mean", or average, on its radius though. Until we get there and explore some more.

As with ALL celestial bodies, there is the matter of distance, and scale....and resolution of detail that's observable.

2. There's no corresponding chunk missing from our planet (moon is 1/6th the size so it would be notable)

This is the biggest fallacy, and quite easy to understand....gravity again. Combined with the fact that the gigantic collision that formed the Moon turned the young Earth into a molten mass (again...it accreted, heated and cooled, then when struck was made molten once more). The rest of debris became the Moon, captured in orbit (and, 4 Billion or so years ago, a lot closer than it is now).

ALL that mass, both the Earth and Moon, account for the spherical shapes.....as is the case with all celestial bodies that exceed a certain threshold of mass themselves.

3. The moon is unlike earth in numerous ways, including lack of mountains etc.

No, as noted above, there are "mountains".....the Moon doesn't have active tectonics like Earth, with the crustal plates moving on the molten interior magma....at least not anymore. But, there is virtually no erosion, so any elevation changes that were made early on, persist to today. As well, MANY meteor impacts over the 4 Billion years means that hills and cater rims (that resemble "mountains") were formed.

And, no the Mon does not "ring like a bell"....it reverberates, in a different way than Earth...it's smaller, likely does not have a molten core, and what "rings" is similar to the way a stone will, when struck. Only, as large as the Moon is, the vibrations fro the impact can reverberate over time and distance, until damping out.


Science. It is what makes you able to read this. It's worth noting the importance of knowledge and science, over guesswork and "belief" and fantasy.

reply to post by Pokoia


What an awesome thread...thank you for sharing

Originally posted by JohhnyBGood

Originally posted by BillyTJames
Come on people. Deny ignorance!!

This mans friend is claiming Jesus lives in a space ship behind a mechanical moon with all the angels.... Why would Jesus be in a spaceship? He is more than likley incarnated on earth now. While im all for the belief that there is a collective wisdom that can be tapped into through meditation or projecting your spirit to other places, astral travel, remote viewing and all that im not sure if thats what this man is really doing.

.................

Any way that was just my 2 cents,, Peace

Yes - OK obviously loony tunes nonsense - but you have to bear in mind that travels in the ether can on occasion lead you to meet some very deceptive tricksy characters who will feed you with all sorts of nonesense.

edit on 19-12-2011 by JohhnyBGood because: (no reason given)

I'm skeptical of the OBE phenomenon. It strikes me as similar to hypnosis. Hypnosis can be useful, but it's all too easy to lead yourself or be led along a particular train of thought. The Satanic Ritual Abuse frenzy is the first example that comes to mind. If he discovered some falsifiable data then I would be more supportive of his account. For now it just seems to be another example of the brain acting funny when put in certain situations.

Ultra-marathoners, sleep-paralysis sufferers, and mountaineers have similar experiences which are definitely not supernatural. When I went through The Crucible during Marine Corps boot camp I had some similar hallucinations (mainly involving seeing things move in the woods around me that were definitely not really there.) A friend of mine who attended BUD/S mentioned some similar hallucinations towards the end of Hell Week. I don't see how some very intense meditation would be any different (especially since the OP made it seem like that guy was intentionally trying to have an OBE.)

has your friend been to any planet where E.T live ?
what are the names of these planets and how far ?
which E.|T is currently present here ?

Hi, this is a very interesting thread indeed because it brings up a lot of points that have been said elsewhere, as well as new ideas that I have no heard of yet. It also contradicts what others have channeled to us.

There are so many different groups now that have new theories that it can be difficult to truly find the truth, since they all seem to vary on different points. One thing that comes to mind is your talk about light beings on the sun. You bring new info to me as for their size, but you also mention that they live "in" the sun. Do you mean inside the sun by that or is it a mistranslation for they live "on" the sun like we live on the surface of Mother Earth? You also proceed to say that the Earth is not Hollow, and its core is actually plasma. The group that I learned about the light beings from the sun believe that our planet is in fact hollow with a smaller central sun of cold fusion which I suppose is pure consciousness, as is the sun and all other planets in our solar system with civilizations living in all of them, in what you term as Universe 4 and 5. Both ideas, neither of which are mainstream, really conflict on these notions. Why do you think so many well to do people bring up such conflicting ideas? Is it possible that they are visiting different realities in these other dimensions? Some have speculated that we are living out every possible choices we can make in other realities, that our soul is living this life in many different ways at the same time... as well as past and future lives. Its quite the concept.

But then your friend and this other group agree on ships around our planet and the idea that our planet is a type of boarding school, or an experiment if you will.

You mention that your friend has had many predictions, often which do not happen for quite some time. Does he have any other predictions to offer us, with no dates attached? Particularly where new currency and global economies are concerned, WW3, and ascension for all at the end of 2012?

Namaste

Originally posted by ProudBird

Science. It is what makes you able to read this. It's worth noting the importance of knowledge and science, over guesswork and "belief" and fantasy.

Wrong. A balance between the two is how progress is made. This statement is my proof you cannot see past the end of your nose. I have been patiently biting my tongue at every post you have written since I joined. You are so knee deep in your science/fact/proof/ "pic or it didn't happen" BS that you have forgotten to look up and take a breath of fresh air every now and then.

Science is great! It has allowed for the discovery of many things and is a significant part of what has propelled the Human race as a species to a more advanced age and comfortable age as well as lay the foundation for groundbreaking discoveries..

BUT! there is more; always has and always will be. Everything in this universe (to keep this argument 'small') CANNOT BE PROVEN AS A FACT. Cannot. Will not. Is not. Every year, 'science' unveils new discoveries that in some cases clash with old 'conventional' knowledge and requires a change in thinking or of what you 'know'. Imagine what you will 'know' tomorrow...Why didn't that 'celestial body' burn up or even completely disintegrate when it passed oh so close to the sun, which is 'supposedly' 1.1 million or some absurd # degrees hot? Why do some mornings you wake up more energetic than others? Why do some trees in a field of controlled, planted, cared for pine trees grow better than others or not at all? Variables. Existence as we know it is a variable and CANNOT be defined in any way constant as it always has to change. Otherwise it would stand still. Then there would be no Progression. Then there would be no 'point'.

Ugh, I appreciate your input as it does provide a means for grounding and a base for comparison on wild ideas. And I am NOT AT ALL encouraging people to just blindly accept everything that is thrown at them. BUT, I do ask that A.) you ProudBird loose some pride and try even if just a tad bit to think outside the Berlin wall you have created around your mind. and B.) That everyone questions but understands the necessity for 'new' or 'wild' theories to continue to push the boundaries of what you 'know' and propel you all forward.


Even this post of mine is subjective, so take it as you will. But ProudBird, I could not stand it anymore. Please, Please, PLEASE try to give some ideas a fighting chance...just try to let go of 'reality' even if for just.one.sentence.

And BTW, if I was Just some jackoff w a temper I would have simply just called you a Disinfo agent/Troll/Shrill intead of trying to prvide a viable point...


ThatGuy45

there is no way to prove to us the credability of your source, so I think it a mistake to ask that question, I am however interested in his "imagination" because we traveled to the moon in science fiction stories before we did in real life.
My question for you if it has not been answered in a previous post is what is going on with edgar casey's predictions with the great pyramids hall of records. This subject seems to be on the brink of being revealed and would wish to know of your sources perspective or details on this matter. Also is their a time frame or date of discovery to prove your source credible in the hopefully near future.

Originally posted by ThatGuy45

Originally posted by ProudBird

Science. It is what makes you able to read this. It's worth noting the importance of knowledge and science, over guesswork and "belief" and fantasy.

Wrong. A balance between the two is how progress is made. This statement is my proof you cannot see past the end of your nose. I have been patiently biting my tongue at every post you have written since I joined. You are so knee deep in your science/fact/proof/ "pic or it didn't happen" BS that you have forgotten to look up and take a breath of fresh air every now and then.

Science is great! It has allowed for the discovery of many things and is a significant part of what has propelled the Human race as a species to a more advanced age and comfortable age as well as lay the foundation for groundbreaking discoveries..

BUT! there is more; always has and always will be. Everything in this universe (to keep this argument 'small') CANNOT BE PROVEN AS A FACT. Cannot. Will not. Is not. Every year, 'science' unveils new discoveries that in some cases clash with old 'conventional' knowledge and requires a change in thinking or of what you 'know'. Imagine what you will 'know' tomorrow...Why didn't that 'celestial body' burn up or even completely disintegrate when it passed oh so close to the sun, which is 'supposedly' 1.1 million or some absurd # degrees hot? Why do some mornings you wake up more energetic than others? Why do some trees in a field of controlled, planted, cared for pine trees grow better than others or not at all? Variables. Existence as we know it is a variable and CANNOT be defined in any way constant as it always has to change. Otherwise it would stand still. Then there would be no Progression. Then there would be no 'point'.

Ugh, I appreciate your input as it does provide a means for grounding and a base for comparison on wild ideas. And I am NOT AT ALL encouraging people to just blindly accept everything that is thrown at them. BUT, I do ask that A.) you ProudBird loose some pride and try even if just a tad bit to think outside the Berlin wall you have created around your mind. and B.) That everyone questions but understands the necessity for 'new' or 'wild' theories to continue to push the boundaries of what you 'know' and propel you all forward.


Even this post of mine is subjective, so take it as you will. But ProudBird, I could not stand it anymore. Please, Please, PLEASE try to give some ideas a fighting chance...just try to let go of 'reality' even if for just.one.sentence.

And BTW, if I was Just some jackoff w a temper I would have simply just called you a Disinfo agent/Troll/Shrill intead of trying to prvide a viable point...


ThatGuy45

edit on 19/12/11 by ThatGuy45 because: Edit to add: You want 'proof' or a 'source for this post? Try 26 cycles around the sun full of life experience. Prove that!

Well, he's actually right. Science doesn't claim the answer to everything, but claims forwarded by science have demonstrable evidence, and have been tested. If someone has a horrible illness then I don't think they'd appreciate their Doctor suggesting treatments that veer from reality. Would you buy a vehicle from a company that substituted protection crystals in lieu of airbags?

Scientists can seem like a stick in the mud, but requiring proof and testing is how we have obtained every important breakthrough known to man. Requiring even a smidgen of truth isn't being closed minded, it's simply following logic. Without any evidence there is no reason to give a theory a 'fighting chance.' Suspending disbelief does not make an idea any more right, but could trick you into accepting something that is wrong. You cannot let yourself get bogged down in emotions about a theory.

W@W I LOVE THIS THREAD!!!

Most interesting thing Ive read in a long while.

BIG FUN for me..........way big fun !!!!!

~(waves)~