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Originally posted by Dionisius
but I find myself strongly disagreeing in your belief that this can only be done through Jesus Christ.
reply to post by korathin
The only way to kill a message is to worship the messenger.
Jesus Christ IS BOTH THE MESSAGE AND THE MESSENGER.
Which is greater? The message or the messenger? Why speak only of the messenger and ignore the message?
Unfortunately my friend - your understanding of Christianity is absolutely wrong. Jesus Christ (whom Christianity is about) emphatically states over and over again that He Himself IS GOD and through Him, for Him and by Him (Jesus) all of creation was made. Jesus Christ created everything - including nature (and the laws that govern nature) and He repeatedly states that He (Jesus) IS THE SAVIOUR OF ALL MANKIND.
and to my understanding of Christianity, Jesus Christ did not create Nature, therefore in your religion he is just Gods messenger, not the saviour, or the son of God, but the simple messenger who deserves none of your praise and devotion because he was simply spreading a message of peace and love towards fellow man and more importantly towards nature.
Please allow me to unpack your statement.
He didnt come down from heaven to be put on a pedistool for people to pray to and worship more than they do God, he came down to try and change peoples attitudes towards life, with materialism being the main evil, and to usher in a new age of respect and harmony with nature but he failed in his task and very powerful 'evil' men jumped on the bandwagon and very cleverly changed the direction and essential meaning of Jesus' message to suit their own needs. It was our chance of 'redemption' right then and there but we were too weak minded and stupid to truly understand and accept Gods message, so instead Christianity today is just another Religion obsessed with money, power and influence.
He didnt come down from heaven to be put on a pedistool for people to pray to and worship more than they do God, he came down to try and change peoples attitudes towards life
You admit that He "came down". If He came down (from heaven) then He must have been "up there" in the first place. He must have been in heaven with GOD BEFORE He came down to earth. He entered earth by being born of a woman (Mary) who was a virgin. If Jesus was in heaven (as you have confessed) before He was on the earth - then He must have 'pre-existed' before He became human. The Christian Bible teaches that He (Jesus) was with GOD and He WAS GOD.
he came down to try and change peoples attitudes towards life
Jesus did NOT fail. He took the sins of ALL MANKIND with Him to the cross and died with them - effectively killing mankinds' sin once and for all. He then ROSE FROM DEATH three days later - providing eternal life to all who put their "praise and devotion" (using your own words) into Jesus Christ.
but he failed in his task
"What ever lamp you follow through the night, light it!"
Having given some more thought to your comments it has become even more obvious to me that the debate about Jesus is actually VERY RELEVANT.
i was gonna talk about the video that this thread is about, but it seems to have turned into some irrelevant debate about jesus so i guess i wont bother.
There is not any religion in the world which teaches violence. All religions give some way or path to its follower. This concept about Islam is also wrong that it favours violance. It teaches that to kill a man is like killing a whole mankind.
There is need to respect all religions. The violance in the world is due to us, not due to religions.
Religion is an important part of life. We cant ignore it.
everyone in the world should try for peace and humanity on individual level. We should not wait for some revolution at country level or world level. We need to change ourselves. Look beside you, dont ignore poors which are near by you, speak well to your servents, be honest in your duties, try for the betterment of yourself and the people around you, stick to a path which u think is right..
Be a good man, everything in the world will be alright.
Welcome to the site, Eagle. I'm glad to hear that this is your view of Islam. However, when you read the Koran, you may find something different from the view you support. For example, let's take the verse you refer to:
It teaches that to kill a man is like killing a whole mankind.
Here's the verse from the Koran (5:32):
For that cause We decreed for the Children of Israel that whosoever killeth a human being for other than manslaughter or corruption in the earth, it shall be as if he had killed all mankind, and whoso saveth the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the life of all mankind. Our messengers came unto them of old with clear proofs (of Allah's Sovereignty), but afterwards lo! many of them became prodigals in the earth.
So this verse, is as much a justification for killing your fellow men, as it is a call not to do so. Unfortunately, it says that you can kill your fellow men for "corruption in the earth."
Now, what could that be? The next verse talks about it. Here's the very next verse:
The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom;
So "corruption in the earth"/"corruption in the land" is made by anyone who makes "war upon Allah," and such people are to be "killed or crucified."
Islam declares war on everybody who isn't a Muslim. From About.com:
A crucial distinction made in Islamic theology is that between dar al-harb and dar al-islam. To put it simply, dar al-harb (territory of war or chaos) is the name for the regions where Islam does not dominate, where divine will is not observed, and therefore where continuing strife is the norm. By contrast, dar al-islam (territory of peace) is the name for those territories where Islam does dominate, where submission to God is observed, and where peace and tranquility reign.
So, Islam declares war on anybody who isn't a Muslim. Anyone who is, as a result, at war with Islam, is making "corruption in the Earth," and is to be "killed or crucified."
The result is that the part you quoted, from the verse, only applies to Muslims. It doesn't apply to non-Muslims.
Just in case anyone might think that Islam looks kindly on those of other faiths in any situation, a few verses later (5:36 and 5:37), the Koran says:
As for those who disbelieve, lo! if all that is in the earth were theirs, and as much again therewith, to ransom them from the doom on the Day of Resurrection, it would not be accepted from them. Theirs will be a painful doom.
They will wish to come forth from the Fire, but they will not come forth from it. Theirs will be a lasting doom.
Taken with the preceding verses, it appears that the Koran is saying that Muslims cannot co-exist with others.
This does not look very much like a "religion of peace."
Your misfortune, is that if you tell your kids that the Koran is the word of Allah, some of them are likely to read it and come to the conclusion that, according to the Koran, Allah says to kill non-Muslims. And they're going to be in grave danger of wasting their lives by devoting themselves to racism, violence, and hatred.
Originally posted by John0Doe
All those things u said are only meaning something in "imaginery world",in reality it is like this:
U are property of your government since u are born.
Originally posted by John0Doe
They do own u.
Originally posted by John0Doe
U will never be free as there is no free place on earth anymore,and if u live in any part,u must do things by the rules which they made for u.
Originally posted by John0Doe
Creator/God,Universal high being does not exists,or doesent give a # for us here,we are forgoten by those.
I do not fear them,just doing best i can to make sure my family gets what they need.