4 DEAD in O-hi-O

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus

Declassified documents show things differently than they were presented back then, and that the leftist radicals SDS and Weathermen were involved in agitation. They burned the ROTC building. Bill Ayers himself was involved and Bernadine Dohrn had spoken to the students earlier.

www.redstate.com...


I just love the hammer and sickle moment at this OWS march

www.liveleak.com...


more on leftist agitation

dwightmurphey-collectedwritings.info...

6. The SDS had a system of "regional travelers" who moved from place to place, tying together the many strands of militant activism. One of those who visited the Kent SDS was Mark Rudd, who had led the violent shutdown of Columbia University.

By 1968 SDS became a significant force at Kent State. The Chicago and Cleveland offices sent organizers, and speakers were invited to keep the militants apprised of events in the French student strike. When Senator Hubert Humphrey spoke on campus, he was met with an organized walk-out.

8. National SDS conducted a "Spring Offensive" in April 1969. As part of this, SDS leaders at Kent State presented a set of demands to the University Trustees to abolish the Reserve Army Training Corps (ROTC) and to close down all war-related research. This led to a confrontation with the Trustees who were meeting in the Music and Speech Building; 58 arrests were made. SDS's campus charter was revoked.

9. The Weatherman faction of SDS established five communes in Ohio. One militant later described these to James Michener's interviewers as being "to teach severe discipline...The object was to produce revolutionaries programmed to obey orders...You surrendered all personal money, idiosyncracies and will power, assured that you would come out of the experience with total dedication."

In the early morning of May 1, spray-painted slogans appeared all over town. An organization called WHORE ("World Historians Opposed to Racism and Exploitation") sponsored a rally on the Kent State commons at noon, attended by approximately 500, "to bury the Constitution." At that rally, a radical professor who called himself a "libertarian communist" called for "street action downtown tonight."

sound familiar? Sounds just like the demands to abolish Capitalism. I distinctly heard two OWS people say over the microphone to abolish Capitalism. In TEN minutes, one after the other. This I just happened to hear while listening to their own livestream and it was LIVE. That may not have been reported in the news. It is stuff like that, that you just hear it with your own ears.

edit on 21-11-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

Thank you for posting that information. As a graduate of Kent, I can say that that information was not typically shared and certainly not taught to incoming freshmen during their orientation back then. I have learned more about the Kent shootings in the 17 years after graduation than during my whole time at Kent.

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by RSF77

That's what I have been trying to say on here, the only people willing to take to the streets are radical and unfortunate individuals. If people who had some sense joined the movement the potential to accomplish increases exponentially, the movement would become more than just people defecating on sidewalks and not about some radical or harmful ideology.

I may be critical of the movement but I don't see them all that way. Yet by your own words it seems [Now correct me if I'm wrong here] that you feel they are all that way? That none are different?

No, I was trying to get around to the point that the exact people the movement needs are just writing it off because of their own egos, not wanting to be associated with their fellow citizens that somehow they see as trash of our nation.

It doesn't take a genius to figure out I haven't met every OWS protestor.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Look I think we can all agree that Corruption has to be dealt with

You say I'm fear mongering and stuff, but to me, OWS is the beginning of a means to deal with it. I'm not naive enough to just disregard people that are unjustly losing their homes, livelihoods and various educations. You might live comfortably and honestly I do too, but I woke up in world filled with so much ugly # and injustice that I just won't keep quiet about it.

People seem to care more about arguing and one-upping each other than they do the welfare of their kin, not only on this website, but throughout America. People are shooting at the white house, other people... people are barricading themselves and committing mob assaults among a plethora of other things, THIS is supposed to a model of the "greatest nation on earth". The correct path is to just reserve judgement or outright denounce something that calls attention to this growing fact that something wrong is happening here?

OWS is a better representation of democracy than the US is, supposedly the heart of the free world. That is why I say the movement would, if given the chance, basically become a representation of the American People through direct democracy and directly answering the concerns of US citizens, but only if everyone supports it instead of building on their ego scoffing at street #ting protestors.

I hear whispers of OWS fielding independent candidates for the 2012 election. So if it is not OWS that hits home and solves our problem of corruption, what is? Do you think its inevitable that this problem will be dealt with, as it always has been throughout history, violent or not?

I will read your reply if you choose to do so later, I have to go to work for a few hours.

reply to post by jibeho


To be honest, I was hardly aware of the Kent State thing for a long time. I would have been about 12 then. I never knew what that Neil Young song was about. I happened across this info on Kent State in the last couple years, and it caught my attention that Bernadine Dohrn was involved, and something just clicked with me knowing Bill and Bernadine's connection with POTUS.

reply to post by RSF77


Which people are "losing" their educations? Typically, when a student gets a federally funded loan, the student does not even begin paying back the loan till they have finished and gotten their degree. If they stop school for a semester, they have a window of opportunity to go back before having to start paying back the loan. Federally funded Higher education was never mandated by the Constitution any more than welfare and food stamps are.

As I see it, the issue here is that the cost of tuition has risen, and a recession set in during 08 that was a major setback for graduates from then till now. I remember early on listening to talk radio and the host was talking to a student who was having trouble finding a job out after graduation.
Again, OWS is blaming Capitalism and Wall Street for a very complicated issue. Students are now demanding their college loans be forgiven, and supporting socialist solutions. This is all concurrent with an obviously pro socialist President who ran for office on Spreading the Wealth.

Originally posted by RSF77
It doesn't take a genius to figure out I haven't met every OWS protestor.

I'm not going to split hairs with you on this. I was going by what you wrote...

You say I'm fear mongering and stuff, but to me, OWS is the beginning of a means to deal with it. I'm not naive enough to just disregard people that are unjustly losing their homes, livelihoods and various educations

Nobody forced them to take out loans.

Nobody forced them to purchase all manner of foreign made products.

Which exasperates the lack of Jobs issue here in the US.

That requires personal responsibility to acknowledge they are part of the problem. They can't have it both ways. On the one hand, tweet, text, Email and chat away on all their Made in China products and not acknowledge that they are part of the problem and then turn right around and complain there are no jobs available.

Come on

It doesn't work that way..

You might live comfortably and honestly I do too, but I woke up in world filled with so much ugly # and injustice that I just won't keep quiet about it.

And you honestly think that the world just suddenly became that way recently? Yes, there is ugliness in the world. There are murders, wars, hate crimes and rape and all other types of grotesque activities. It has been that way since the beginning of time.

I'm sorry but IBM, Boeing and Hughes Aircraft didn't create Human nature.

People seem to care more about arguing and one-upping each other than they do the welfare of their kin, not only on this website, but throughout America.

I agree but trying to force a minority opinion on the whole is just simply not going to work.
Sorry..

People are shooting at the white house, other people...

Yes, and again this isn't new. Hell, they shot and killed Lincoln and Kennedy. They shot at President Ford not once but twice and missed twice. They shot Reagan.

people are barricading themselves and committing mob assaults among a plethora of other things, THIS is supposed to a model of the "greatest nation on earth".

Yes, What you don't see is outright mass black vs white armed warfare in the streets. You don't see our American Sunni Muslims fighting with our American Shiite Muslims [Like we do in Iraq] or American Jews and Muslims in outright combat in the streets.

Yes, we can dwell on the negative and equally not see the beauty and blessings as well.

It's your choice.

OWS is a better representation of democracy than the US is

I find that statement highly dubious at best.

supposedly the heart of the free world. That is why I say the movement would, if given the chance, basically become a representation of the American People through direct democracy and directly answering the concerns of US citizens, but only if everyone supports it instead of building on their ego scoffing at street #ting protestors.

Well some of us simply refuse to ignore all the very vocal voices in the crowd advocating outright communism. [Whether some OWS supporters care to acknowledge those voices or not] Which quite frankly if they get their way would prevent just about everything you are espousing.

I will read your reply if you choose to do so later, I have to go to work for a few hours.

No problem.

Catch ya on the rebound.

reply to post by SirMike


What a heartless statement..............if one of those had been your brother, your sister or your best friend maybe you might feel different.

Your witty, sarcastic remark did not enrich the thread, only showed how callus of a person you are.



Wanna know what a Police State is take a look, you're living in one and too darn stupid to see it.

Interesting op never knew this Occupy thing has grown so big that it warrant's there own, agents of dissent and chaos....

But ya that one of the vid's with that one Ike character who is into reptilians and there methods, and that documentarist trying to document this little movement back some pages ago says. First they will try to not say anything about it, no news on it whatsoever, because what you do not see or hear about= does not exist. Like a tree falling in the forest when no one is around...it does not make a noise. Even if it makes a noise.

Then if that does not work and they cant control it they will send in agents both in the communication mediums and in the group in question, and they will try to take it over....And if that does not succeed then they will try to turn it out and in by divide and conquer techniques.

And if that does not work then they usually pay dudes to go into the group and do crazy stuff like causing havoc all in different degrees, anything from braking windows to setting stuff on fire, and if that does not work then a few dead people turning up usually does. All depending on how you can spin the story off-course. But if they can spin it the right way, then they send in the Calvary and things get really bloody.

I see they already got a bunch of lets say more "militant group minority's" in there, anything from socialists to communists to capitalists to lefty's and righty's, Or dem's and rep's as they are called, and all manner of other diversions, propagandists, and waste's of time, and other groups off-course. But those seem to be the predominant groups.

Judging by how much opposition this OWS has going on, I take it that it has grown big enough eh. But still as that vid of the four dead people back in the 60 shows, for all people there you best be careful. Because everybody has agendas, and spins, and yes some are there just to cause bloodshed as a form of control ultimately, and it's so convoluted that they wont shed a tear, because as we know there just doing there job.

Really it's all rinse and repeat, cautions among all the different peoples and especially in dealing with the different agent's both the knowing and the unknowing bot like, would be advised.

This thing is just a impasse and prelim so some peoples can wake up a little and smell the tense air growing around them... Them sleepy heads, they need to wake up and so this was not meant to last but to wake people up a little....And it can either be a rude awakening, or something more sensible, at lest in terms of this issue they need to wake up and smell the coffee as apposed of waking up and smelling the napalm.

So don't let it turn into a "deadly" serious deal, even though it is in some ways, and fail as much as those in the 60's did, after all those 4 people seem to have died for a bunch of nonsensical things. And it was all egged on, by every party involved. Especially the parties in the shadows. I know lots of you all think its funny, and in some ways it is....But it's also, Not funny

Just a thought., are they really police who are doing the beating?? Could they be XE operatives or Dyncorp goons dressed as police?? If you think about it, it really isn't that far of a stretch for our dictatorship to hire these kinds of thugs to do their dirty work. If in fact these goon squads are a secret government op of some kind, they have no oath to honor any law and unless the REAL police would stand up and arrest them no one would ever know....

Just throwing that out there......

I don't see anyone getting arrested for protesting. I see some people getting arrested for their actions while they were protesting, which I think everyone can agree that if you're breaking a law(s) during a protest, you can reasonably expect to be arrested. Sometimes this is even the goal, civil disobedience is a great tactic. But its usually wise to get a fair amount of support before hand.

I don't understand what the problem is with OWS protesters getting arrested if the demonstration involves breaking a law, usually this is an accepted risk on the part of the protesters. The goal is, that hopefully, the opposition escalates the situation without provocation so you can expose their response to a non-violent protest or resistance.

The problem I see with this, is that the corporations don't control the police. The corporations influence the (state, in this case) government who controls the police force, but the government is still in 'control.' Wouldn't it be a better strategy to protest the government to expose this whole backroom dealing nonsense. You wouldn't even have to abandon the Wall street stuff at all, but maybe you'd be in a different place physically.

But say you were protesting the government because of all the bribes politicians take, and in turn tailor legislation that helps both them, and their friends on wall street, pilfer the countries, and our pocket book. Its only a slightly tweaked version of the 'main' goals, right? Okay, so the protests go on, the cops show up, and then things go as they have since these protests started. Don't you think it would help better expose the fact that 'wall street' and the government are in bed and screwing us over because the government is sending their 'jack booted thugs' to protect their and their friends' interests?

reply to post by -W1LL


so when are we to expect NATO intervention... I mean that is exactly how it went down in lybia. where is obamas speech about how the people have the right to protest and all that..

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by RSF77
It doesn't take a genius to figure out I haven't met every OWS protestor.

I'm not going to split hairs with you on this. I was going by what you wrote...

You say I'm fear mongering and stuff, but to me, OWS is the beginning of a means to deal with it. I'm not naive enough to just disregard people that are unjustly losing their homes, livelihoods and various educations

Nobody forced them to take out loans.

Nobody forced them to purchase all manner of foreign made products.

Which exasperates the lack of Jobs issue here in the US.

That requires personal responsibility to acknowledge they are part of the problem. They can't have it both ways. On the one hand, tweet, text, Email and chat away on all their Made in China products and not acknowledge that they are part of the problem and then turn right around and complain there are no jobs available.

Come on

It doesn't work that way..

You might live comfortably and honestly I do too, but I woke up in world filled with so much ugly # and injustice that I just won't keep quiet about it.

And you honestly think that the world just suddenly became that way recently? Yes, there is ugliness in the world. There are murders, wars, hate crimes and rape and all other types of grotesque activities. It has been that way since the beginning of time.

I'm sorry but IBM, Boeing and Hughes Aircraft didn't create Human nature.

People seem to care more about arguing and one-upping each other than they do the welfare of their kin, not only on this website, but throughout America.

I agree but trying to force a minority opinion on the whole is just simply not going to work.
Sorry..

People are shooting at the white house, other people...

Yes, and again this isn't new. Hell, they shot and killed Lincoln and Kennedy. They shot at President Ford not once but twice and missed twice. They shot Reagan.

people are barricading themselves and committing mob assaults among a plethora of other things, THIS is supposed to a model of the "greatest nation on earth".

Yes, What you don't see is outright mass black vs white armed warfare in the streets. You don't see our American Sunni Muslims fighting with our American Shiite Muslims [Like we do in Iraq] or American Jews and Muslims in outright combat in the streets.

Yes, we can dwell on the negative and equally not see the beauty and blessings as well.

It's your choice.

OWS is a better representation of democracy than the US is

I find that statement highly dubious at best.

supposedly the heart of the free world. That is why I say the movement would, if given the chance, basically become a representation of the American People through direct democracy and directly answering the concerns of US citizens, but only if everyone supports it instead of building on their ego scoffing at street #ting protestors.

Well some of us simply refuse to ignore all the very vocal voices in the crowd advocating outright communism. [Whether some OWS supporters care to acknowledge those voices or not] Which quite frankly if they get their way would prevent just about everything you are espousing.

I will read your reply if you choose to do so later, I have to go to work for a few hours.

No problem.

Catch ya on the rebound.

edit on 21-11-2011 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

so by your logic, when a company sells you a crappy product and it kills they are not liable because no one forced you to buy that product.. are you listening to yourself?? Do you not realize that it is their fault. They knew those loans were crap and tehy still cranked them out BECAUSE THE KNEW THE FED WOULD BAIL THEM

jeezus are you brain dead.. I would put out crap that could potentially hurt people if I could get away with it. Unlike the people in question i am not too big to fail.. i get the whole take responsibility for yourself but those too big to fail to responsibility for nothing that is the point.. they actually got money and bonuses

Originally posted by MaximosPoena
reply to post by -W1LL

 

Vietnam protesters were out in the millions for a good cause. Ending the war.
OWS protesters are out in the thousands. Ignores the wars and demand Handouts.

Kent State Army National Guards used real Bullets.

OWS get pelted with Rubber bullets from Cops.

I'm sorry, no comparison.

Massive S & F fest for a FAIL

Go figure.

Star for you good sir.

Where were these Occupy idiots when they had the worldwide protests against the Iraq war? I mean, there was a worldwide day of protest sure but nobody invading public and private porperty for weeks in the name of ending it early. Even if I agreed with going to Iraq and Afghanistan, it would have been nice if the energy and sheeple activity in recent months would've happened years ago with parks full of tents for more of a cause than OWS etc.

This whole thread and the pro-OWS, anti-police members of ATS and the outside world beyond this part of the internet are just full of instant fail with stars and flags handed out willy nilly for the latest fad cause that comes along even if the cause is weak and with many excuses/reasons for existing.

The sooner this Occupy stuff is eradicated not only from our streets but from ATS, the better.

Originally posted by GringoViejo
I don't see anyone getting arrested for protesting. I see some people getting arrested for their actions while they were protesting, which I think everyone can agree that if you're breaking a law(s) during a protest, you can reasonably expect to be arrested. Sometimes this is even the goal, civil disobedience is a great tactic. But its usually wise to get a fair amount of support before hand.

I don't understand what the problem is with OWS protesters getting arrested if the demonstration involves breaking a law, usually this is an accepted risk on the part of the protesters.

That's the thing though, most of these protests involve the protesters themselves causing trouble, causing violence against police and breaking laws and requests to do or not do something but the moronic sheeple of ATS choose to ignore all facts and evidence to justify their "lets kill all police and their families to make the world a better place" BS.

Originally posted by curious7

Originally posted by GringoViejo
I don't see anyone getting arrested for protesting. I see some people getting arrested for their actions while they were protesting, which I think everyone can agree that if you're breaking a law(s) during a protest, you can reasonably expect to be arrested. Sometimes this is even the goal, civil disobedience is a great tactic. But its usually wise to get a fair amount of support before hand.

I don't understand what the problem is with OWS protesters getting arrested if the demonstration involves breaking a law, usually this is an accepted risk on the part of the protesters.

That's the thing though, most of these protests involve the protesters themselves causing trouble, causing violence against police and breaking laws and requests to do or not do something but the moronic sheeple of ATS choose to ignore all facts and evidence to justify their "lets kill all police and their families to make the world a better place" BS.

keep repeating the same false statement maybe one day they will come true...

most of these protestors are peaceful. I have not heard one chant about killing cops or their families spread your ignorance somewhere else.

reply to post by -W1LL


There hasn't been one protest yet where someone hasn't gotten arrested. People might think it's a peaceful gathering but trying to destroy businesses, trying to shut businesses down and creating a nightmare for commuters trying to get to their jobs is the reason for the violence that's sure to come.

reply to post by RSF77


I hardly think a visual of the Hammer and Sickle Russian communist flag marching right alongside other OWS is propaganda. They and the Neo Nazis are part of the movement. Adbusters organized it, Tides funded it. Socialists made the demands. the Obama admin and Democrat Party support it.

That is just responsible reporting. It doesn't mean that some within the movement are not sincere souls who understand the manipulations of the Illuminati and the bloodline families and the NWO etc, it just means that some people are misguided.

Originally posted by Athin
reply to post by -W1LL

 

There hasn't been one protest yet where someone hasn't gotten arrested. People might think it's a peaceful gathering but trying to destroy businesses, trying to shut businesses down and creating a nightmare for commuters trying to get to their jobs is the reason for the violence that's sure to come.

again you forgot in your opinion there is no truth to your statement.

Occupiers convene on 15th Street Bridge in Great Falls

I witnessed this protest first hand and there was support from businesses and truckers all of whom showed their support...

no bushiness were shut down no commuters whining about traffic and NO violence from anyone...

have any other generalization all knowingone?

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


The Soros connection has proven to be false. Think for a moment. If Soros was trying to get Obama re-elected by means of creating a liberal version of the Tea Party, why would protesters be being beaten and evicted and pepper sprayed all over the place?

Sure there might be some communists and whatever other boogie man group among the protesters but, none of those are illegal and they have as much right to excercise the 1st amendment as the rest of the protesters and are probably as angry and upset about the corruption. Don't agree with the movement, fine that is your right but there are no boogie men here and while everyone is looking for them people are getting hurt by the police.

Originally posted by yaluk
reply to post by -W1LL

 

so when are we to expect NATO intervention... I mean that is exactly how it went down in lybia. where is obamas speech about how the people have the right to protest and all that..

Here it is

reply to post by Kali74


It has not. You must be going by the website where they put up a news article with a statement about Soros, then they changed it. Oopsie, then they changed it back when people caught them in their little underhanded ways.

No, that is not proof.