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Originally posted by Xcathdra
An excellent post..
Thank you for your service.
As far as what my opinion is, since your the first one to ask me for that and where I stand on this, is the people have failed the government.
Originally posted by Xcathdra
Im not defending the government or its actions. What I AM doing is trying to get people to understand what they state. If a person doesnt take an intrest in all levels of government and participate, they dont know what their rights are. The longer people complain, yet refuse to learn and participate, the bigger this problem is going to get.
The simple fact people are listing issues that arent guaranteed rights prooves my point that there is a massive disconnect between what the people expect and what they actually get. People have been listing of issues, yet none of those issues are guaranteed to anyone in this country.
Originally posted by Xcathdra
How can you condemn a government for actions when you cant even explain how it works in the first place?
Originally posted by Xcathdra
I am all for voting every single person out of office and returning to common sense. The American people became so lazy and apathetic, they quit caring what the government did and just rubberstamped at elections.
In order to effect fundamental change, especially when people want a return to a more strict view of the Constitution, that they should at least understand the document itself first?
Originally posted by Xcathdra
Example - show me where it states any right not granted by the constitution is reserved to you?
Originally posted by CherubBaby
reply to post by Xcathdra
You have to be kidding me. Your an American and your having to ask what rights we have and are loosing? Cmon.. You mean to tell me you don't think the patriot act is a violation of a persons right to privacey i.e. illegal search and seizure? I could and would go on but I won't dignify the question with more examples if your an American and need someone to explain it to you. Hey folks just more of the Dis-info police to get people distracted. I have to laugh at the desperation of it all..edit on 15-10-2011 by CherubBaby because: edit
Originally posted by gwydionblack
We can assume a number of things here.
1. The Declaration of Independence lists human rights as life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. If we go by THOSE individual rights - the death penalty goes against life, the restrictions on freedoms and regulations go against my liberty, and the government doing things against the will of the people goes against the happiness. Therefore, I have lost ALL my rights.
Originally posted by susej
It's not that we are totally losing our freedoms, it's that they are being severely altered. For example: Our right to assemble or protest. We must tell the date, place, and the duration of it.
We arent allowed to "disrupt" the public anymore by and you will get your bull horn confiscated if you use vulgar non threatening words or get to personal. Many people are also fighting against our right to bear arms and so on. But hey, people like you don't notice the little changes and laws passed by congress.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
We can assume a number of things here.
1. The Declaration of Independence lists human rights as life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. If we go by THOSE individual rights - the death penalty goes against life, the restrictions on freedoms and regulations go against my liberty, and the government doing things against the will of the people goes against the happiness. Therefore, I have lost ALL my rights.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
2. If we go by the Bill of Rights our rights are as follows:
Freedom of religion - Though no explicitly done against me, freedom of religion has been lost to many groups in the past. Waco comes to mind as well as the whole Mosque ordeals around the country.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
Freedom of speech - Depending on what I say. I can be thrown in jail for my statements or declared an enemy of the state or "terrorist". While I have the ability to practice my freedom of speech, I am not free from unruly punishments for using it.
Freedom of assembly - My right to assemble has been regulated by a permit process. Though permits do give the right of assembly, the fact that thousands of permits are denied for a number of reasons deprives those people of their freedom of assembly.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
Right to Bear Arms - Though not affecting everyone, in some locales in the United States is is illegal to bear firearms. In nearly all of the states regulations against certain firearms prevent people from owning firearms without paying a fee.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
Right of no Unreasonable Search and Seizure - Since the Patriot Act this right has been thrown out the window. Many, including myself, have been subject to unwarranted search of vehicles and homes, many times without probably cause.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
Right of Due Process - Once again, post-9/11 the right of due process has been denied to political prisoners, not to mention that government has taken to assassinating people without bringing them to trial.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
Right of a Speedy Trial - All about the country the right of a speedy trial has been subdued, with trials sometimes taking years to reach the courts, with innocent and guilty people alike being held captive for that time.
Originally posted by gwydionblack
Right of No Excessive Bail - This is pretty self explanatory. Bail in America tends to reach into the hundreds of thousands of dollars and many times the millions. With the average American income standing at 39,000 per year, this can be seen as QUITE excessive.
Originally posted by cryptographrix
reply to post by Xcathdra
"...strict interpretation of the Constitution..."
Are we really sure we want that? We could probably do a lot better just coming up with something new. There are a lot of things in that document "leaders," in general, have ignored and haven't even used (think fiscal responsibility), as well as a lot of things that got completely blown out of proportion (think 2nd amendment), and a ton of things that people have either misinterpreted or used to benefit individual groups instead of the whole (think Congressional pay/retirement after 1 term).
Not to mention that the language isn't common anymore.
Originally posted by Xcathdra
I have seen this comment used quite a bit by people lately and I am curious.
Exactly what rights have American citizens lost?
When did they lose those rights?
Im not looking for a fight or anything, but am curious as to what people are seeing in regards to this topic.edit on 15-10-2011 by Xcathdra because: spelling
Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
I hate to keep bringing up the drug war but most obviously is the plant. The Constitution does not explicitly grant me that right yet I do not have that right.
Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
Regarding the 2nd, these states signed on to it when they joined. It is the "law of the land" and Mass should not be able to infringe the hell out it and use that infringement to toss me in jail for exercising it.
Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
I know how government works just fine. I've helped plenty of campaigns, gotten plenty of signatures, sat in on local House and Senate hearings. All that "democracy is great" crap.
I'll tell you exactly how government works. Government works as a vehicle for the moron mass to use violence and threats against the minority, whatever minority, to satisfy whatever "flavor of the month" whim the mass is concerned with. As a by product of this the manipulative wealthy paired with dynasty oligarchs get to balance a happy medium that both keeps them rich and in power and pacifies the moron mass into a comatose like state where without fail the minority gets trampled on, property taken away from, thrown in jail, and even killed.