What punishment is sufficient for the ones acting in the riots in the UK?

Take away their moms.
second line

Originally posted by Diyainoue
reply to post by Aeons

 

yeah as if I don't need to pay. To sue them will probably cost more then that they will provide us. The current system is not sufficient. I only take these riots as thesis for as it sparks in society to start the discussion.

But somehow, you think you'll get more money by....selling them? Maybe caning them will pay for the damages.

The system works fine, if it is applied.

That it doesn't fill up your thrist for punishment doesn't mean a god damn thing. If you want blood money to cover your pain, then move to the Middle East. They've got the system you want.

Although there are already laws in place but....

BOOT CAMP kinda comes to mind for those under 18 and prison terms for those 18 and over plus large fines

and a good hiding

they are commiting an act of war against the citizens , burning peoples homes and businesses , looting and destroying public property .
this is nothing less than treason .
and for treason they should hang.

Well, if you can find a group behind these acts who are instigating and organizing them as an act of usurpiung the government, or instituting their own local governance in a area....then sure, you can probably go for treason.

As it is, what you have are thieves, looters and arsonists. Under martial law, if they don't stand down they become volunteer targets. Otherwise, you have civilian criminals whose crimes are covered under the common law.

Originally posted by Diyainoue
reply to post by Aeons

 

yeah as if I don't need to pay. To sue them will probably cost more then that they will provide us. The current system is not sufficient. I only take these riots as thesis for as it sparks in society to start the discussion.

The structure isn't working, the law is part of that structure

edit on 9-8-2011 by Diyainoue because: (no reason given)

if they are young and useless, you could sell them for parts.

kidney, cornea, just get some chinese doctors to work in your jails.

You are just as much a bunch of thugs.

You have a set of laws, but you don't use them. You have a set of laws that effectively deal with this, but you want to ignore them just like the thugs on the street.

Why fight sharia? You guys could have everything you want, if you'd embrace it. You could have a community of leaders in your neighbourhood to hold down the thirteen year olds and hack their hands off in the street.

Good for you.

Originally posted by Aeons

But somehow, you think you'll get more money by....selling them? Maybe caning them will pay for the damages.

The system works fine, if it is applied.

That it doesn't fill up your thirst for punishment doesn't mean a god damn thing. If you want blood money to cover your pain, then move to the Middle East. They've got the system you want.

Maybe start reading again. where did I state I would sell them? I opened this thread with a thesis, I also stated that that solution will bring problems with it. I have no thirst of punishment. I don't need blood money, I stated that although I don't like spending money on unnecessary things I will support my fellow members. I just don't want to spend it on the one causing the problems. Every system works fine, if applied even in the Middle East, China or North Korea. The problem is that the people using the system don't apply it as they should.

Systems care about systems not about changing societies. If you think the abusive system that derived from colonizing the world, projecting the true freedom of democracy and christianity is right, it is your right. But that system allows me to question it and that is what I do.

I never heard about temporary tattoo's in the middle east, sorry.

btw thank you for your kind words and openminded discussion, you must be proud

reply to post by Diyainoue


You have sufficient laws to deal with this. You don't find that enough, because it doesn't sate your thirst for public punishment. Branding. How idiotic.

Ridiculous.

reply to post by Aeons



My laws don't apply in the UK as I am not living there. Laws are nothing more then possible consequences on an action you make. I don't get fined every time I walk through a red light, so they are possible and not inevitable.

I don't know any type of temporary branding. You obviously don't see where I am going with this. The public will brand people. Did you skip all of the comments of blaming legal or illegal immigrants from all other "openminded" people in all the other threads? Did all immigrants do that? Or is it just as any other culture, race what ever, just the rotten apples? They will be branded, you can deny that but it is already happening , I just try to make sure we only brand the ones who caused it.

The ones attacking others. Death.

The rest community service for no less then 6 months on the non-violent
1 year on the ones smashing windows
3 years on theft
5 years on the ones burning anything

I`d say prison but seems that would be a heavy cost to the public
Sentencing would be after school till 8pm every day. Weekends 7am to 8 pm
You don`t show up it`s off to prison.

I do however have to look at the parents. Why on Gods green Earth would you let your kid go out after the 2nd night of this going on? I almost think they need a finger pointed at them for being a little to blame.

And here we have a glimpse of the future. Right the kids are our future? Total destruction.

Thank god I don`t really have to be the one making this decision though. We could just go with existing laws but I think that would rather pack the jail system to much.

Then again it really hasn`t stopped as of yet either so I retract my punishment incase they become the new rulers.

Originally posted by JennaDarling
Easy.


Make every one of them clean up their mess and fix everything that was damaged/broken.

Besides the standand jail time that would be the best option I've seen here. Too many "solutions" people are coming up with would only make things worse.

People have said "shoot them". That's what apparently started it in the first place.

As for branding them with tattoos, that will just cause more division and create an "us and them" mentality. No points for guessing where that will lead.

One comment I saw on the net from a genius was to take away their welfare and make them work for food, that way they won't have time to riot. I'm sure the thought of stealing food won't even enter their minds.

This is a delicate situation. Making the rioters angry will not solve the problem, it will only make it worse.

Without question, any and all agent provocateurs hired by the police and allowed to vandalize private property to bring in martial law should be punished by video taping their actions and showing it for the entire world to see their treason against humanity.

The problem is that it is hard to charge everyone actively involved in these riots, look what happened in Vancouver, the police couldn't even get everyone charged, and the court had to throw out several cases as they were being held up in the court system.

So they are rioting in response to the uber wealthy? Makes sense...:puznot)
like some one else said terrorize downing street or Parliment OR other SEATS OF GOVERNMENT power not working class shops and neighborhoods. Anyone caught looting goods vs. making political statements has crossed a line and loses credibility.
(I.E.should be treated like the bullies and pirates(criminals) they are.

reply to post by Diyainoue


I don't like the ideas of prison because of the cost. BUT if prisons were modelled on Middle Ages prisons, ( Damp, dark, disease ridden, hell holes, with food you would'nt recognise as such, no healthcare, no stimulation, and with no aim other than keeping them locked up, in chains, 24 hours a day.
Hopefully, after a few months in such an Institution NOBODY would want to risk being sent back there, ever. Think along the lines of the film " Papillon " Modern u.k. prisons are just hotels for the feckless and inadequate.
As I type this, I hear on the news that a u.k prison has failed to provide proper conditions for its prisoners. ( !*?!*?! Blame the European Court of Human Rights.. Again.) The vast, silent majority in the u.k. ( People I speak to everyday.) want to see proper good old fashioned punishments, that these people won't forget in a hurry.

reply to post by Diyainoue


placing a mark upon the offender is a parable for learning in the Bible. there is also a famous work of litereature from the early 1800's, The Scarlet Letter, that is a tale of misdeed and repentance.

only in civilizations that are considered less than modern are such undertakings performed. on the big picture, we are supposed to have learned from history that this marking an offender is a thing of the past.

i appreciate your unhappiness with the destructive behavior taking place in the UK at this time.

with these crimes, and IMHO, all crimes, i feel the guilty party should have to pay their fine or do their time as well as pay for the damage they have done, the cost of their arrest and the costs of court.

it has long been an unfair burden on taxpayers that are forced to provide mountains of money for the actions of those who choose not to follow a reasonable structure in society.

just as 'we the people' should have the greater hand in how our land is ruled under government, we too should be able to pick, choose and set the standards of law we feel are reasonable.

sadly, we have neither option. in america the people do not put the president into office. we are lorded over by ineffectual leadership that is incompetent at best and terribly destructive by rote. and the working class had to foot the bill for it all whether we like it or not.

likewise i feel we the people should be instrumental in the creation, application and denial of the laws of the land. here too we are short changed. adults are not free to live as adults in america.

i can understand we need to contribute to the system to have law enforcement available. but the costs of arrest, investigation, court and imprisonment should be the burden of the guilty parties. our tax dollars can go to much more productive applications than being eaten up by criminals. people who choose to engage in illegal and/or destructive behavior should be responsible for their actions and the expense of same.

in the same time, we should have social programs in place that would guide people properly to begin with. people have a right to live, thus they should have a right to a job to make a living at, and affordable housing, food, etcetera. it's obvious in america we have a lot of people that are not being raised by loving parents who give a damn. this situation will not be self-correcting. there are reasons things go wrong and people run around like madmen or drunken chimpanzees. society and government has a responsibility to step in and educate people. the longer we allow ignorance to reign supreme, the longer we all will suffer the consequences.

To many, regrettably most posters here:

You see something you don't like happening, something which causes misery and pain - the riots. You then feel justified in advocating cruel and unusual executions, modern versions of branding, removal of human rights. Somehow you still manage to talk as if you are morally superior to the people who are smashing, burning and looting.

I think the rioters are wrong because they are not aiming their ire at the right targets. I can however empathise with their anger and desperation. I do not support them, but I support people who talk in the ways you do even less.

I've been lucky so far, the rumour in my town last night was that the riots were going to start right outside my home. I was worried but so far it hasn't happened. I'm worried about my family in other parts of the country. In my head this does not translate into wishing to torture and kill people.

I'm not morally superior, I'm human and weak and when I'm in bad situations I might sometimes act wrongly; but if those of you talking about sick types of revenge and punishment think you are somehow better than the people you are railing against I think you need to take a look in the mirror.

A society ruled by rioters, or a society ruled by people who want to tattoo people's foreheads and brick them up in empty mines...tough choice.

Originally posted by JustinSee
I haven't been here in a bit, but are you people here blaming the people for the riots? Nobody should be punished as it is a response to rule.

Really! So that is why people IN THE SAME COMMUNITY are calling them feral kids out of control. This is why people IN THE SAME COMMUNITY are now armed with baseball bats to protect their homes and communities.

These are criminal gangs (yes youths are gang members DUH) who are enjoying the violence and stealing goods they have not earned. There are millions of people in this country suffering as a consequence of the last 3 years of financial constraint and none of them are trashing peoples homes.

well as for the rioters/violent criminals i think it's simple , get a rope and find a tree. and for the ones in power at least in the us anyway 4 yrs is too long it should be treated like any other job 6 mos. reviews , if you suck at your job ,poof YOURE FIRED!!! and then you dont get paid after you are fired or retired.my personal opinion the origional constutional setup was not flawed but it also counted on not letting every corrupt s.o.b. in office to flaw the hell out of it.