San Francisco Police Shoot and Kill Teenager over $2 bus fare GRAPHIC VIDEO

reply to post by BirdOfillOmen


Most see the incident for what it is. Then I came to your post.

Somebody that my "lady friend" has known since childhood just got killed by a cop last week.

So third party information says something happened and you believe it at face value. So something that happened to your mother's dog walker's brother's father's friend's cousin is relevent to this story? I think not.

I guess she called the cops on him and an off-duty officer stalked him.

You guess? How much if this story are you guessing about? An officer who is called to respond to a crime and locates the suspect is not stalking, it is doing good police work.

He was confronted, the kid got into a drunken fight, and the retarded cop pulled a gun on him and shot him. I don't care if a cop gets punched in the face. A gunshot to the head is a little overkill, don't ya' think?

So you blame the cop because this moron wanted to get into a fight with the police after commiting a crime? Yes, that sounds right, blame the police. If the officer confronted him with his weapon out and the kid still wanted to come at him, at that point if you lose the fight the kid will have full access to your firearm. That makes it a fight you can not lose because if you do it might mean your life. Second, if the officer is fighting with this moron and he takes a few punches to the face and is in danger of losing consciousness, same situation.

Originally posted by vlady95
A good question would be why would he be carrying a gun on a bus anyways?

I was thinking the same thing but then I thought, given what the world has come to, maybe it was for 'self-protection' ... he might have been the victim of a bully and he had enough of the bullying and wanted to scare the bully in order to stop him, and to protect himself ... OR he could have been involved with street-drugs and some druggie criminal was after him for $$$$. And if so .... "When we play with fire, we get burnt".

There are many possible reasons, although it does seem a bit odd to be 'carrying' on public transportation in a major U.S. city with a crime rate higher than is actually reported, so as to avoid real-estate property values to decline (sarcasm).

We really can't arrive at any factual conclusion w/o ALL of the facts, which we will NEVER have b/c the media only tells us what they want us to know -- nothing more, nothing less ... which is technically a distortion.

I lived in the SF Bay area for many years. I worked in SF for a few years. Some of the cops there are complete jackarses.

In any case, my heart goes out to the family and friends. Regardless of the facts and whatever the truth may be, it's still a tragedy ... very sad.

reply to post by maryjo44

I here most carry throw a ways for this very reason.

You heard? If I believed everything that I heard I would believe a million things that are not true. Obviously the crowd was hostile towards the police. It is totally believable that someone in the crowd could have picked up the weapon. It happens all the time. It is totally believable that people in the crowd are lying to paint the police in a bad light. It happens all the time.

The police said the man fired at them while he was running away. The video starts after the guy was on the ground so there is no evidence of wrongdoing by the police on the video.

Bottom line, there is no evidence of police wrongdoing on the video so everything else is speculation.

reply to post by lifeform11

why leave him there to die?

Yes, the police are trained in first aid but they are only to use it after the scene is rendered safe. After an event like that, the officers have a lot of stress and adrenaline and are focusing on the threat. Once the stress reaction settles, they can then focus on other things like first aid. After an event like that, it must be ensured that the suspect is not still a danger. That process is not immediate. The officers did the right thing by covering him until they could see that he was not a threat anymore. Once that was accomplished, an officer is clearly seen on the video attempting to render first aid.

They were not intentionally allowing him to die.

reply to post by jam321

I find it sad that the cops just stand around with their guns pointed instead of helping the guy.

Again, you have to make sure the guy, who just shot at the police, is no longer a threat.

They waited 1:39 seconds into the video before somebody got close.

Not an inordinate amount of time when you take into consideration the stress reaction of just having shot someone. And the time it takes to verify that the guy is no longer a threat. And the further stress reaction of a large , hostile, crowd converging on you.

And for those that want to say they feared he had a gun, why did the cop and the cop with the assault weapon in front of the camera have their back to the suspect?

Because now the police had to split their manpower to confront the crowd which was also a growing threat at the time.

reply to post by granpabobby

The officers did nothing but mill around while the guy blead to death!
Compassion for your fellow man ? Think again !

Where was the dirtbag's compassion for the police when he was shooting at them?

Compassion has nothing to do with it. He shot at the police, the police shot back and hit him. The police are doing the right thing by covering him and making sure he is no longer a threat. Once that is established, an officer clearly is seen on the video attempting to render first aid. The dirtbag rolled the dice and lost bigtime.

Originally posted by areyouserious2010
reply to post by lifeform11

 

why leave him there to die?

Yes, the police are trained in first aid but they are only to use it after the scene is rendered safe. After an event like that, the officers have a lot of stress and adrenaline and are focusing on the threat. Once the stress reaction settles, they can then focus on other things like first aid. After an event like that, it must be ensured that the suspect is not still a danger. That process is not immediate. The officers did the right thing by covering him until they could see that he was not a threat anymore. Once that was accomplished, an officer is clearly seen on the video attempting to render first aid.

They were not intentionally allowing him to die.

What a load of wiffle waffle, as I'm sitting here on the Johnny squeezing out what at first appears to be a rather large one, I can clearly see they were not attempting to save his life until he was motionless, which leads me to the conclusion, they defo allowed him to die. Spin it like a politician if you desire, but what you see is totally different from what I see. BTW I do my best thinking whilst sitting on the loo,

reply to post by speculativeoptimist


Yup your exactly right there all a bunch of coward murdering pigs that deserve no less than he got...I dont care if I was the worse cop in the world I would be over there helping that man applying pressure to his wounds so he wouldnt be bleeding to death...its seriously like torture just to let a man lay there and bleed to death

reply to post by areyouserious2010

I'm not guessing on anything. Read the story yourself here.

So this guy was obviously friends with the off-duty cop if he was at a party in his house. The cop accuses him of stealing jewelry (which still hasn't been proven weeks later) and the guy leaves- only to arrive back home (which is out of these cops' jurisdiction) with the two cops standing on his property. The guy supposedly attacks one of the cops. Instead of reaching for pepper spray or even a baton, this guy's "friend" pulls a gun on him and shoots him.

Yeah, real courageous behavior from the cop. I'm not buying his side of the story.

Originally posted by DJLateralus
I've only seen it in the local area news so far, nothing nationwide yet. While I can believe that the police really did find his gun, the witness reports that say the man never shot at police seems to speak otherwise. This wouldn't be the first time police planted/lied about evidence to save their own behinds

edit on 17-7-2011 by DJLateralus because: (no reason given)

Yeah I wouldnt doubt it if he didnt have a weapon and they planted one on him to justify murder like they always do...I dont care what the cops claim in the news or whatever. Just because it comes out of a mouth of a cop or gets put on the news as FACT still could be a LIE

Since there are too many argumentative posts to quote here, i'll address a few of the comments without the use of the quote tool...

"Police shoot teenager"

This man's age may end in the word "teen", but he is hardly a teenager....At 19 you are an adult, and should by now be contributing to bettering our society...
..

"This man was no threat to anyone laying there bleeding"...

If you think an injured man is not a threat, you're very very wrong....An injured animal of ANY KIND could easily be considered even more of a threat....Especially if it/he feels that his life is at stake...There is no way for the police to know if the man is still armed just because he is bleeding..."Playing Dead" is a precurser to an ambush or a surprise attack by the suspect...
..

"I can't believe they just stood there and watched him bleed out"

About him bleeding and being left to 'bleed out'....The man was bleeding, not bleeding out...what would you have them do?....Stroke his hair, and let him know that everything would be alright?...Offer him a cold soda?...He's an apprehended suspect, and should be treated as one....

..

"Why would the police chase and shoot a man over two dollars"

The police weren't chasing him over two dollars. The police were chasing him because he RAN. The better question would be "Why would someone run from (and shoot at) police over two dollars?"...One would be safe to assume that the man has more to hide than two bit fraud....In most cases, a fleeing suspect will have warrants for a much more serious crime, including murder, rape, and armed robbery, OR, be concealing more on his person than would be deemed appropriate, such as illegal drugs or weapons..

..

"But he was running away"

Just because a man is running away dosn't mean that he can't be firing a weapon at the same time....In fact, this is the cowards way of removing himself from a situation while simultaneously flexing his 'muscle'. I've seen it many times living in a low income American 'ghetto'.

..

"Finding the weapon later seems unlikely"

Not only is it likely, but in most instances in this is exactly how it happens. I've seen it first hand. Any good suspect knows that without a weapon, there is no case. Just as any serial killer knows that without a body, there is no case. The weapon or drugs are usually found later, during a perimeter investigation, under a bush, under a car, in a drain culvert, or even in the hands of a witness.

I've also seen evidence 'picked up' by random bystanders. People who do not even know the suspect but share a common hatred for police and distaste for authority. This happens ALOT in lower income neighborhoods. A 'convict code' out on the streets.

...

I don't know if most of you guys just let your emotions get the better of you and you just say things in the heat of the moment and let your emotions overrun your thought process, or if you really don't have the life experience to know any better.

Personally, i WISH i didn't have the life experience. After all, such experience comes from being poor and living in areas where crime is rampant. If you're without this life experience, i envy you, but at the same time i encourage you to branch out and learn the 'rules' just in case you need to know someday.

that is all.

"The deceased, a Washington state parolee wanted for questioning in the slaying of a pregnant woman in Seattle last week"

www.theblaze.com...

should be interesting to see how this unfolds.

This is so emotional, Even if he was carrying a gun at the time the police shot him he was NOT carrying the gun. Therefor they had no reason to shoot him, It makes me feel sick. Something needs to be done cops cant just go shooting people cause the suspect a gun. SnF my friend

Originally posted by Subjective Truth

Originally posted by Observer99
When SHTF we'll see pics of cops bleeding to death in the streets. Then I will be happy.

So let me understand your logic you hate them and want them to bleed in the streets because of the brutality of a few.



Have you ever looked up the definition of the word hypocrite?



You wish for them what you hate them for. Your hate has blinded you.



Cops have a tough job and some of them are bad. But most are good people with families and a dog just like you and me.

Well when you have a gun, and basically a free pass to shoot anyone you desire it becomes kinda hard not to have a itchy trigger finger

Originally posted by SFA437
How does it feel to rush to judgement in defense of a double murderer of an innocent woman and her unborn child by a gun wielding maniac who not only shot her and 3 other people but shot at the cops as well... and then see the weapon being picked up by "witnesses" on video? You know... the ones you all insisted were correct in that he never had a gun in the first place...

I've never hit that level of epic fail and really would like to hear a first-hand account

I didn't rush to judgement. I shared an opinion.

Example: I have a clumsy friend. I find out he has broken his leg AGAIN. Friend tells me someone pushed him and he fell. Opinion: I don't buy it, he's known to be clumsy and my inner voice understands I was not there so my opinion is then formed.

Unless I am missing something feel free to let me know the judgement I made here:

Originally posted by cluckerspud
Wow, that was incredibly difficult to watch..
Finding the gun later seems a little to convenient.
Not buying that.

Notice it is all opinion.

Originally posted by granpabobby
The officers did nothing but mill around while the guy blead to death!
Compassion for your fellow man ? Think again !

Probably they had to let him bleed to death so they had time to plant a gun, and no contradicting testimony of the guy they shot.

reply to post by DJLateralus


Not sure how many more people have to get killed like this before we say enough is enough.
There has to be some new rules for officers across the nations if people have to make some concessions to them to get them...although I don't know what more we can do to help them protect us from criminals and enforce the laws.

reply to post by thinline

Originally posted by OneEleven

"Why would the police chase and shoot a man over two dollars"

The police weren't chasing him over two dollars. The police were chasing him because he RAN. The better question would be "Why would someone run from (and shoot at) police over two dollars?"...One would be safe to assume that the man has more to hide than two bit fraud....In most cases, a fleeing suspect will have warrants for a much more serious crime, including murder, rape, and armed robbery, OR, be concealing more on his person than would be deemed appropriate, such as illegal drugs or weapons..

Originally posted by thinline
"The deceased, a Washington state parolee wanted for questioning in the slaying of a pregnant woman in Seattle last week"

www.theblaze.com...

should be interesting to see how this unfolds.

Thanks for that...Starred you....

As i said, maybe it takes real life experience, but it was obvious here that there was more to this story than the rants from fellow convicts in the immediate audience...

Good riddance.....

Im done this is enough. The police are supposed to protect and serve not kill unarmed teenagers. I hear this all the time. In portland a police officer shot a real shotgun at suspect instrad of non lethal beanbag bullets.,.and in seattle the police left a fully auto rifle on the top of their car. Wtf its everywhere now

I live in a small Canadian city, so I don't hear a lot about corrupt cops or anything, but it seems every time I log onto ATS there is another insane story like this! I believe the world is certainly going through some changes and there is a sense a panic and concern from everyone. Law enforcement included. And maybe that's why all this crazy stuff keeps happening. I didn't even watch the video. It sounds terrible. And I don't want to see the kid dying. It's all really upsetting. And scary to watch it all unfold!