Out of body all in the mind?

Originally posted by Raelsatu
reply to post by Hawkwind.

 

It's not really about gaining or losing anything on a personal level; it's about perpetuating a materialistic, purely scientific approach to the universe that leaves no room for the spiritual, suppressing the true nature of what humans are. If a scientist is paid to lie, spread propaganda, or skew results they very well may do so, as we've seen throughout history and modern times, nearly ANYONE can be bribed and/or blackmailed/threatened. I've only experienced one OBE and that alone was enough to [re]confirm my belief in the spiritual aspect of the human consciousness.

Well, I'm on the fence but if there was one thing in this life that I could just choose to believe it would be life after life. It must be so comforting to believe you carry on, I'd like to believe it's true one day but I can't make myself believe this on faith and my mind is open to the possibility but only the possibility, if I do die not believing in the afterlife at least I'd get a nice surprise if it was real Would you mind describing your experience? What was it that made you believe it wasn't a figment?

reply to post by Hawkwind.


I don't know if the information is hidden or ignored purposely by the scientific community, but the fact the US military and the CIA publicly acknowledged they operated programs for 25 years dealing with this kind of phenomena can't be ignored.

Unlike scientists, we don't care how or why it works, just that it works.

Originally posted by Hawkwind.
Well, I'm on the fence but if there was one thing in this life that I could just choose to believe it would be life after life. It must be so comforting to believe you carry on, I'd like to believe it's true one day but I can't make myself believe this on faith and my mind is open to the possibility but only the possibility, if I do die not believing in the afterlife at least I'd get a nice surprise if it was real

Would you mind describing your experience? What was it that made you believe it wasn't a figment?

Some say "where logic ends, faith begins", there are variations of the quote; but I don't necessarily see it that way. I still think it's possible to have an ideology that's doesn't revolve around empirical evidence or the materialistic eye of pure scientific endeavor. There's something incredible and unique about the human experience that speaks for itself, is vaster than the oceans of knowledge we relatively perceive. I actually had the ability to have spontaneous OBEs every night when I was a child but I didn't know what they were at the time. For my OBE in recent times, it was actually more of a remote viewing experience. I remember lying in my lazyboy, after just drinking a cup of coffee; before I knew it I was floating out of my body, and I knew it wasn't a dream. You can tell the difference when you experience it firsthand, but it's almost as inexplicable as a '___' trip. There were conversations I listened in on that I could't have possibly heard otherwise; and when I mentioned it to some family members they were confused, baffled, and shrugged it off.

Maybe we're right, maybe we're wrong. Maybe we create heaven and hell, or nothingness ourselves. But I don't see any incompatibility with the notion of the physical human experience and an afterlife/spiritual realization. Anyway, the classical method cannot explain human consciousness; the quantum approach however can. There's actually a really interesting theory out there by quantum physicist Stuart Hameroff called the Orch-OR theory which you should check out. =]

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep


The study is bogus because a hallucination, would be delusional and wouldn't make any sense. It also would not only be as if you simply changed your position, your viewing perspective with every thing in reality still making sense. A hallucination would never be so generalized. Hallucinations happen when the mind runs a muck.
The study is wrong.


Science can't even identify what the mind is. By it's own empirical rule and protocols this study is bogus.
( The study of observable phenomena ) If it can not be perceived by the five senses it does not exist.
By this rule, non of these scientists have any brains.

The evidence to experience OBE's are firsthand, to disprove it, they need to have it firsthand and then conclude if it's an hallucination.

reply to post by Hawkwind.


Well, one thing they could lose, control of the people. If even half of what I have read about the governments study and supposed use of OBE's is true, why would they want normal everyday people doing it? You could spy on whatever they are doing right?

To be honest,dont listen to them..
If you've ever stufied savred geometry,in a kinda way,OBE's relate
But i believe they proved it by sending oner to sleep and makng him go to the next room to describe the items in there

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep



Yes just hallucinations. Nothing to see here. Move along.





cough, assuming people cannot manifest actual entities and assuming inter dimension beings dont already exist....

Originally posted by xacto
reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep

 

Yes just hallucinations. Nothing to see here. Move along.





cough, assuming people cannot manifest actual entities and assuming inter dimension beings dont already exist....

I'm gonna go with sarcasm.

reply to post by xacto


Are you being sarcastic? ..

Second


reply to post by randyvs


Wow you beat me to it by a few seconds..

Scientists, the new priests of the Matrix. I find them very funny.- PEACE.

Well as far as I know it has been confirmed by science that they can indeed make matter astral (future and past) travel, Not only our Government but I even read this morning about China being involved in an experiment as well.

As far as it being all in the mind....define Reality first. Depending on the definition then we may come up with a conclusion and or answer to the question.

We live in a Universe on a Planet that is spinning at a rate that should make our head spin. Anything is possible.

The way I see it Creation may just be evolving. (I know....Im out there....probably astral traveling)

I'm keeping my sceptical hat on here; modern Science is far from the bastion of truth most think it to be, and history has shown that, just like religion, it has a hard time accepting new concepts and ideas. They just ridicule people instead of having them murdered, which is almost as effective.

I don't know personally but I tend to give credibility to the stories of people blind from birth that experience sight while out of body and described the surroundings and goings on without reference....

Vicki Umipeg, a forty-five year old blind woman, was just one of the more than thirty persons that Dr. Ken Ring and Sharon Cooper interviewed at length during a two-year study just completed concerning near-death experiences of the blind. The results of their study appear in their newest book Mindsight. Vicki was born blind, her optic nerve having been completely destroyed at birth because of an excess of oxygen she received in the incubator. Yet, she appears to have been able to see during her NDE. Her story is a particularly clear instance of how NDEs of the congenitally blind can unfold in precisely the same way as do those of sighted persons. As you will see, apart from the fact that Vicki was not able to discern color during her experience, the account of her NDE is absolutely indistinguishable from those with intact visual systems. The following is an excerpt from Dr. Ring's latest book reprinted by permission.

I think it is very interesting and hard to debunk from our chairs here at ATS.
www.near-death.com...

They really dint prove anything in that study .In the end it could be just two sides of the same coin. Science could just be describing the brain's process involved during an OBE. But to outright call it a hallucination is disingenuous. Meditation causes changes to brain matter as well. OBE can be practiced and perfected. Sleep paralysis is also part of the process your in between stages body is sleep while your mind is lucid.

Science revolves around confirmation bias, so don't be surprised if these ideas are more widely accepted in a couple of decades/centuries time. Remember what happened during Galileo's time?

reply to post by Hawkwind.


A couple of months effort or less would likely settle this issue for you permanently.

OBEs can be intentionally induced. Sometimes simply reading about it for a while can be enough.

Most prefer to pass judgment without experience, thus not really knowing what they are talking about. This includes some scientists.

Bullpoop. OBEs are real. Seriously, how would you explain that people who had NDE were able to exactly describe what was happening around them while were they physically unconscious?
Old science is dying . New (age) science is unfolding.

I find research into such things fascinating, but I ultimately believe that true investigation, either way, into such a field is impossible at this point. Science has a vested interest in keeping things like this in the realm of spirituality and science fiction because it keeps things in neat little packages that they have already pre-defined.

For any of you guys who don't believe OBE's are real or possible.

You are not only dumb, but jealous.

I hope you never get to have one. It would serve you right for being such an idiot.