Canada considering international bases: MacKay

Originally posted by Jocko Flocko
reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

 

Actually theres a few missions where Canadian troops are deployed under humanitarian missions.

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You think Western military forces being sent to Haiti was for humanitarian reasons? It was to suppress the Hatian public from reinstating their democratic leadership. Look at videos from the reality on the ground after the Haiti earthquake and you will see that the red cross HQ was pretty much abandoned while overpopulated tent cities weren't seeing anything from the huge Haiti campaign that was plastered all over the media. Interesting how US military forces go to Haiti to help them (an paradox, by the way) while Cuba, right next door, was set in the American sights for democratic reforms following Castro's resignation.

Libya isn't a humanitarian mission. It doesn't take an idiot to see that Western intervention in a foreign civil conflict has blown it into a civil war. Our forces (as part of the "NATO operation") are supporting the assassination of Libya's government officials and have bombed their infrastructure to destroy their economy and functionality as a state (definition of terrorism). JTF2 was there right alongside the CIA and SAS in training the rebels (same guys we're fighting in Afghanistan) and assisting in attacking the Libyan government.

We aren't in Sudan. Supplying some obsolete military equipment and vehicles to this mission means jack sh*t. In fact, we were planning to send peacekeeping troops to Sudan but that plan was cancelled due to lack of funding and supplies (due to Afghan mission). We may have a few observers there but that doesn't mean we are doing anything productive.

Never been big into armchair conspiracy theories, but have at it fella, to each thier own.

This isn't some "armchair conspiracy". It's the reality of the situation, and it makes a lot more sense than the garbage proclaimed by the Western media and our government.

Well, if it makes you feel any better sweetie I fully support Israel and the IDF and any military force used by Israel to preserve it's existence, including the use of tactical nuclear weapons.

You're one of those types, eh? I believe the term is "sheeple".

PS: Do you even remember why the federal election was called?

It was because the Harper team refused to disclose funding costs for the F-35 program and the new plan to build a lot of prisons for crimes that don't even exist yet (exactly as Stockwell Day explained). You aren't alarmed by this at all?

reply to post by MinorityReporter


You're really hung up on these videogames aren't you?

I spent my time in the Canadian Armed Forces when I was much younger and for a time I was stationed in Cyprus, I am now 37. In 2 months I will be flying logisitical support missions for the Canadian military through a private company using various aircraft carrying mostly medicine, surgical equipment and personnel. So do me a favour, go preach to someone who actually might care, ok?

reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi


Thank you for clarifying my point you pretty much nailed it to the wall there. Concise Clean cut and clarified well put my good sir.!

Its really hard to believe and ingest the stuff the MSM feeds the Sheeple(pigs) in the troughs these days

You're one of those types, eh? I believe the term is "sheeple".

Well this so called "sheeple" has many friends living in Israel, guys in the IDF that I came into contact with during various training and excercise sessions in Cyprus during my service. I went to the mainland on many occasions and I found the people very warm and welcoming and was never treated as an outsider. I found the people to be very vibrant and enjoyed every aspect of thier culture and heritage. They are a very proud people that will not give up thier land no matter what the cost is and I admire that. However I saw first hand the civilian bloodshed caused by fantatical islam upon the Israeli people while I was there and therefore I tend to draw my conclusions based on life experiences. Everyone I met always asked the same question in regards to why the terrorist cowards would go after the civilians instead of military targets. For many of them it was hard to grasp such a lack of honour and dignity by doing so. When I was there we always passed through many checkpoints in Tel Aviv as back in those days the tensions were quite high and getting around was sometimes quite slow and tedious. The coward terrorists had every oportunity to attempt to detonate many military targets around Tel Aviv, yet they went, and still do go after the innocent.

Let's quit calling each oyther names, OK. It's a sure sign that a debate has gone sour and this topic deserves airing.

Jocko... nothing but respect for your service and you're certainly no 'sheeple' but politicians deserve every bit of scrutiny from the public, particularly when it involves military planning and action.

Originally posted by Jocko Flocko

You're one of those types, eh? I believe the term is "sheeple".

Well this so called "sheeple" has many friends living in Israel, guys in the IDF that I came into contact with during various training and excercise sessions in Cyprus during my service. I went to the mainland on many occasions and I found the people very warm and welcoming and was never treated as an outsider. I found the people to be very vibrant and enjoyed every aspect of thier culture and heritage. They are a very proud people that will not give up thier land no matter what the cost is and I admire that. However I saw first hand the civilian bloodshed caused by fantatical islam upon the Israeli people while I was there and therefore I tend to draw my conclusions based on life experiences. Everyone I met always asked the same question in regards to why the terrorist cowards would go after the civilians instead of military targets. For many of them it was hard to grasp such a lack of honour and dignity by doing so. When I was there we always passed through many checkpoints in Tel Aviv as back in those days the tensions were quite high and getting around was sometimes quite slow and tedious. The coward terrorists had every oportunity to attempt to detonate many military targets around Tel Aviv, yet they went, and still do go after the innocent.

Oh please, if Isreal hadn't of taken the land from the Palestianians in the first place there would be no conflict. And don't give me any, it's their land according to the bible, or they are god's chosen people. What if a foreign country came into Canada and claimed a part of it, let's say Ontario as theirs because some book said so. And gradually they keep building settlements into say Quebec and placing an illegal blockade on Quebec and the rest of Canada. Only allowing what they deem as ok to enter the country. And at the same time continually doing airstrikes and sniping children who are trying to collect gravel.

Lmao, you talk about these Isrealis not understanding why civilians are being attacked and that it is hard for them to grasp such a lack of honour and dignity. Why holy cow guy, open your eyes to the big picture. Innocent children, women and men are being killed all the time by the IDF. I think anyone who goes after an innocent civilian is a coward. But can at least see the reason for retaliation. Picture yourself as a hardworking Palestinian who has just come home from a hard days work. You are a peaceful person and try to just live your life honestly. Your wife has just finished dinner and you and your kids are sitting around the table eating. All of a sudden your house is partially blown up from an Isreali airstrike, killing your entire family. Try to understand how that would feel. What do you think that man is going to do now? What would you? Like I said earlier I decry all attacks on innocent civilians.

Oh please, if Isreal hadn't of taken the land from the Palestianians in the first place there would be no conflict. And don't give me any, it's their land according to the bible, or they are god's chosen people. What if a foreign country came into Canada and claimed a part of it, let's say Ontario as theirs because some book said so. And gradually they keep building settlements into say Quebec and placing an illegal blockade on Quebec and the rest of Canada. Only allowing what they deem as ok to enter the country. And at the same time continually doing airstrikes and sniping children who are trying to collect gravel.

Lmao, you talk about these Isrealis not understanding why civilians are being attacked and that it is hard for them to grasp such a lack of honour and dignity. Why holy cow guy, open your eyes to the big picture. Innocent children, women and men are being killed all the time by the IDF. I think anyone who goes after an innocent civilian is a coward. But can at least see the reason for retaliation. Picture yourself as a hardworking Palestinian who has just come home from a hard days work. You are a peaceful person and try to just live your life honestly. Your wife has just finished dinner and you and your kids are sitting around the table eating. All of a sudden your house is partially blown up from an Isreali airstrike, killing your entire family. Try to understand how that would feel. What do you think that man is going to do now? What would you? Like I said earlier I decry all attacks on innocent civilians.

Don't bother with this guy. He's the type that pigeon holes himself into what he sees as identity just by being contrary. Probably quotes Archie Bunker un-ironically just because he saw some ridiculous hippie on tv saying the opposite.

The problem with our country is that we have people that think they have to be either totally pro US or totally anti US(and by extension Israel). We spend far too little time thinking about what will actually help us. Too much time supporting issues that have nothing to do with us merely because we think they link up with some half formed opinion of our politics. Thus you see Canadians singing Bush's praises or alternatively saying all Americans are evil.

It comes down to people with no idea of what culture is or can be making an identity for themselves by blindly supporting whatever their parents weren't.

reply to post by FEDec


Agreed, great post. It's funny that, just as you said, most people are either totally pro US, Isreal or think all Americans and Isrealis are evil. That's a great post because when it comes down to it, we are all people. What's with all the hate and categorizing people into groups. People claiming me to be some, "leftist," because I don't agree with Harper and our government. Most people forget that those in power are put there by us, and they should represent the people.

Just as you said, we should be trying to figure out ways to get together as one and put a government in place that is for the people and not for corporations, banksters or any other nation or organization. There are good and bad people in every country and in every city. We the people as a whole have to recognize what our culture is and start doing things that will benefit our country, our economy, our people and our planet.

Many fail to grasp the big picture. And I will say that in this day and age, you have to research and discover for yourself. Stop depending on the media, the government or anyone for that matter to tell you how it is. Find out for yourself and be yourself. Individuality has been on a huge decrease. We lack true leaders nowadays. Not saying there isn't any, but the majority of people jus follow what they are told is the cool thing or right thing to do, instead of becoming knowledgable on the subject and then making a decision. People are always thinking that they have to get this phone, these clothes or think this way.

reply to post by Canadianpride420


Preachin to the quire when it comes to me man. I hear people talking nonesense, that harper party won, because the left is divided. Don't fall into that trap, please. The more parties the better, if you go the american way, two party system, we will fall with them! Two party system is a sham! Not to mention a lot don't vote, and probably more shouldn't vote. People should be able to pass some kind of test before they vote, showing that they understand the law of the land. I doubt it will happen, but I can at least hope though, right?

reply to post by Canadianpride420


Personally I think our military has quite a bit of shoring up to do in pretty much every area before we can commit to any more foreign action. That's without the said action being questionable or not. I shudder to think of the corruption and deviance we aren't hearing about in the military considering the crimes we are hearing about.

As for Israel, being the one of if not the most secure nations on earth doesn't seem to have stopped a plethora of organized crime from being nurtured there. I find this more than a little questionable and that is not even considering the Palestine issue.

All of this at a time when our own criminal syndicates are flourishing and entrenching themselves no thanks to our massively corrupt police forces. It begs the question what is really important at this point? Will these Base(s) be helpful or even ready in time for the current conflicts?

Or are they simply precautionary and if so are they the best route for funding considering the above? Our money going to something that may or may not prove of any use?

nevermind

Originally posted by dl2one

Originally posted by Jocko Flocko
reply to post by TheUniverse

 

Never been big into armchair conspiracy theories, but have at it fella, to each thier own.

why are you on a conspiracy forum? ahem.

Why what better way to put on airs of superiority?

Canada has left it's front and back doors open for far far too long. We have a veritable who's who of criminal organizations seeping in at a steady rate. The Ndrangheta are even making inroads into Thunder Bay for cripessakes.

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They were busted up sure but it took them going back to Italy for it to happen. We are far too soft on crime and I don't see the conservatives changing that despite the fact it's one of the issues they campaigned on.

With this in mind how can we even think of foreign military action. Unless... This is just a big old look the other way those wascally middle easterners are at it again.

Originally posted by FEDec

Originally posted by dl2one

Originally posted by Jocko Flocko
reply to post by TheUniverse

 

Never been big into armchair conspiracy theories, but have at it fella, to each thier own.

why are you on a conspiracy forum? ahem.

Why what better way to put on airs of superiority?

Canada has left it's front and back doors open for far far too long. We have a veritable who's who of criminal organizations seeping in at a steady rate. The Ndrangheta are even making inroads into Thunder Bay for cripessakes.

LINK

They were busted up sure but it took them going back to Italy for it to happen. We are far too soft on crime and I don't see the conservatives changing that despite the fact it's one of the issues they campaigned on.

With this in mind how can we even think of foreign military action. Unless... This is just a big old look the other way those wascally middle easterners are at it again.

edit on 4-6-2011 by FEDec because: forgot to add my point

I have no knowledge of mafia, especially eastern canada as I live in neo-redneck country. Interesting. I don't disagree with ya there, military action on foreign soil is crap.

And the conservatives aren't getting tough on crime they're just building prisons. They might get tough and make an example of 1 or 2 serious high profile cases, but the real crime, the white collar crime.. meh.

Bottom line is, the way things are heading, we can always keep cutting education, healthcare, arts, AISH, you name it. And there you have the $ to go police the world like the US of Amerika.

So maybe those F35's aren't having block heaters installed due the fact they will be in the mid east and not the arctic? What's 30 billion for a few flying fords when we can spend 70K on glowsticks for the G20? Seems within reason of South Park style nonsense to me

What I am about to type is from Life Experiences while living on the island of Cyprus for 4 years, so sitting on your high horse regurgitating the same old stuff plastered around the internet while attempting to belittle myself and others gets you no points in my book, sorry.

The reason I never brought up the Israeli Palestinian land issue was because it is indeed a complicated one. I believe that both people in the region are entitled to land, how that land is divided up, how much and where is a point of contention that is pointless in me debating as the problem has existed for decades now, not even the great leaders of the past have been able to arrive at a suitable option for both sides. The many people I came into contact with on the mainland, mainly Tel Aviv, were mostly young people as at the time I spent most of my leave at local night clubs attempting to get laid which often ended in myself just getting completely drunk and singing the Canadian National anthem while swimming in the Mediterranean ocean with my fellow countrymen. The beaches in Israel are absolutely fantastic, some of the best I have ever seen and I've been all over; Cuba, Aruba, Egypt, Barbados, Antigua, Mexico Southern Italy and Portugal.

The young people I spoke with were generally in favor of a Palestinian state and just wanted to lead normal lives and live in peace, even though the majority of those same young people are or were at some time serving in the IDF; they knew exactly the forces they were up against. However, the older generation of Israeli are more against "giving up any land", and therein lies the problem, there is a division of ideals in Israel. At the time, back in 1996, there was a heavy "tit for tat" that took place between the terrorists and the IDF. And yes, I classify any group that DELIBERATELY targets innocent civilians as terrorists. "Freedom fighters" or "guerrillas" seek out the military targets of the "occupying country". There is no grey area in my books, sorry, you will not convince me otherwise.

On many occasions we often took part in maneuvers with the IDF that dealt with many aspects of counter-terrorism and counter-insurgency, but mainly the maneuvers consisted of civilian catastrophe support such as field hospital preparation, civilian evacuation, support and logistics, FOB preparation, peace keeping and my all time hated aspect of being over there, dealing with anti-personal mines. I hated dealing with AP mines as they have no conscious or soul, they kill indiscriminately and without hesitation and cause some of the worst wounds and casualties you will ever see done to the human body. The worst type I ever saw were the PONS-2 "booby trap" style trip wire mine who's sole purpose is to injure it's target by blowing off limbs but not completely kill. This would make the enemy dedicate more time to the wounded as opposed to being in battle. AP mines are disgusting and should be completely banned world wide under Geneva conventional warfare statutes.

Not being of very high rank back then meant that you often heard of things passed down through the chain of command rather than firsthand, but as I got to know more and more IDF soldiers during maneuvers I got to hear of how things actually went down instead of hearing about it through the MSM or from my CO. The terrorist groups that operated from within Palestinian territory would often hoard massive amounts of weapons and ordinances within large built up areas where often the Palestinian people were housing 10 times the amount of people the buildings were originally designed for. These terrorists often hid behind the innocent in these same areas basically using them as human shields even though the majority of the people who lived in these buildings wanted nothing to do with these organizations as all they brought was bloodshed and hardship. This created a massive problem because number one, you had a group that would not fight face to face in the street and chose to hide amongst the innocent and created house to house searches that often went on for days. Number two, when a building was designated a terrorist FOB the precision guided munitions that were used were made completely useless by the MASSIVE amounts of ordnance caches that were in these buildings. The destruction and explosion size were often much greater than expected and often led to civilian casualties. You would often see quite a small primary detonation of a precision guided munition followed by huge secondary explosions because an ammo dump was hit.

At NO time did I EVER hear or see any DELIBERATE targeting of innocent civilians by the IDF, it just didn't happen as there was far to many people watching the actions of the IDF. However, I can tell you for a fact that foreign NEWS agencies would often deliberately fake civilian causality reports even though first hand radio reports from the Palestinian emergency services never reported any. At the time the french "NEWS" agencies had a certain "knack" for doing this. However what I did see were DELIBERATE terrorist attacks upon innocent Israeli civilians trying to go about their day to day lives. Terrorist groups would target Israeli civilians and the IDF in response would target known terrorist hideouts and their support structure. Back and fourth, "tit for tat"...

Had these terrorist organizations stuck to ONLY targeting IDF targets like roadblocks, checkpoints, military buildings, soldiers, etc, I think the support in North America and around the world would have shifted in favor of the plight of the Palestinian people and the terrorist groups would have probably been viewed more as "freedom fighters".

reply to post by Jocko Flocko


All I'm hearing is a personal story which besides being massively off-topic to the thread may or may not be made up. Blah blah blah. I met 10,000 Israelis and not one would hurt a fly. Hey it could be true.

Irregardless of whether the Israelis you know were angels or not. The fact remains that the country has harbored some of the worlds worst criminals and is the advance post for Eastern European sex trafficking rings.

No doubt you visited a brothel while there as military men in foreign countries are known to do. We both know whatever girl you were set-up with was not Israeli.

Funny how security for the Palestinians is so tight yet the Bedouin smugglers seem to be able to get through the Negev with no problem. A country with Israel's security budget and small size could easily cut out the inflow of trafficked women yet it does not happen. This would seem to suggest complicity of both government and security forces. The question remains: knowing this how can you support it?

Canada is literally the only western nation that everyone else across the globe views with any sense of sanity. It's just not in Canada's best interests to drop it's image of peace, reason and prosperity to become some sort of mini-globalist nation, piggy-backing on the US' shoulders.

In what possible way, does this benefit Canada, or the average Canadian, to have overseas military bases, to support other warmongering globalist states? Oh, that's right, it doesn't in any way whatsoever.

Canada could easily go the other way, as it should, and just develop Canada as a beacon of peaceful reason in the western world. What business do they have in being a militarized state. What business at all? Seriously.

Talk about progress.

reply to post by FEDec


Don't forget about the international human organ traffic ring, the IDF is right in the center.

As for rising organized crime in Canada, you're right. What I've seen personally is the response, which is the rise of street thugs (Canadian citizens). Gang wars are a big deal in BC, mostly because the RCMP overexaggerates and fabricates real events on the media in order to make their planned intrusion on our freedoms more acceptable.

Considering how well connected the RCMP is with the top gang leaders and grow operations, I can't help but assume that the RCMP is pulling the strings when it comes to more advanced crime in BC, all in order to achieve their own benefits and power. Usually it's the guys on the lower rungs of the ladder that get the worst out of all of this when they are just trying to support themselves via mediocre crime. Other times is innocent citizens that the RCMP "mistakenly" raids and damages their home, only to deny any wrongdoing to avoid repair costs.

It's true. Our own police are highly corrupt. Hell, they even investigate themselves for f*ck's sakes. No wonder they want a lot of new max security penetentraries, so they can round up the dissidents.

Originally posted by deltaboy

A report in Montreal newspaper Le Devoir said the Canadian Forces is negotiating to set up bases under a program known as the Operational Support Hubs Network. They've reportedly already completed negotiations with Germany and Jamaica, and are in talks with Kuwait, Senegal, Kenya or Tanzania, Singapore and South Korea.

Canada did have a base in the United Arab Emirates, known as Camp Mirage, to ease access to Afghanistan, but was kicked out after a dispute over commercial landing rights in Canada.

The Canadian Forces had to scramble to set up an alternative base in Cyprus. They also use a base in Germany for staging.

OMG!! Of all the countries it had to be the Canadians. Are they becoming the superpower? We better watch what goes up in the north. We got thousands of miles of border exposed to an invasion.

www.cbc.ca
(visit the link for the full news article)

Its not really Canada..just the TPTB..under the guise of the Canadian flag. This country is run by the same elite as your country is...This just sounds like more positioning power for the NWO/ illuminati agendas.

Don't want to offend my fellow Canadians....but that's just the way I see it.

reply to post by SyphonX


We really aren't great at importing the good parts of American culture. In fact liberal or conservative people up here will only see the bad parts of of our southern neighbours. However lately that just means blindly following for conservatives and blindly hating for libs. It's madness alright.