Startling evidence about Pyramids of Giza

reply to post by Harte

Originally posted by Harte

I dispute that claim.

If you mean alignment with true north, we can do at least 60 times better.

Harte

60 times better? lol

This is entertaining lol... not ONE modern structure / construction... let alone any OTHER built structure is as accurate as the Great Pyramid, concerning alignment to True North. Claiming "we can' do an accurate alignment when to this day the MOST accurate alignment is the Great Pyramid, is a False Claim.

The Great Pyramid is not only PROOF of the accuracy in alignment to True North, but also PROOF of the accuracy in it's very construction. NO MODERN building can touch that. The PROOF is that the Great Pyramid IS THE MOST ACCURATE aligned construction.

No modern construction beats that. Pyramids: 1... modern false claims: Zip

Originally posted by Serafine
reply to post by Harte

 

Originally posted by Harte

I dispute that claim.

If you mean alignment with true north, we can do at least 60 times better.

Harte

60 times better? lol

This is entertaining lol... not ONE modern structure / construction... let alone any OTHER built structure is as accurate as the Great Pyramid, concerning alignment to True North. Claiming "we can' do an accurate alignment when to this day the MOST accurate alignment is the Great Pyramid, is a False Claim.

The Great Pyramid is not only PROOF of the accuracy in alignment to True North, but also PROOF of the accuracy in it's very construction. NO MODERN building can touch that. The PROOF is that the Great Pyramid IS THE MOST ACCURATE aligned construction.

No modern construction beats that. Pyramids: 1... modern false claims: Zip

I'm not sure what accuracy has to do with it but we know the pyramid has an error of 12 seconds of arc this means that we must be able to determine true north better then the Egyptians.Which means we could build something more accurate if we wanted,So your statement is obviously false. However I'm really not seeing what point it proves you want to align anything to true north you can do it by marking sunset and sunrise or through star observations as well .So what does this prove exactly since you seem to think this was a victory of some sort??

The Egyptians were accurate enough and remarkable too, but the people suggesting they were more accurate than we are today are laughable. We've got theodolites, GPS, laser-levels and steel tape-measures. We've got compressors and hydraulic drills. They had string-lines, chalk-lines and probably water gullies too for levelling. They lined up stakes to ensure sight-lines and used a merchet...a plumb-bob and split-palm leaf.

What they accomplished is outstanding; the architects, surveyors and labour-force worked wonders with simple tools. To extend that quality into BS notions of 'beyond anything we can do today' and 'wow impossible' shows you guys haven't bothered to read more. It also shows you have no idea about modern construction let alone ancient Egypt.

ATS...one day it's 'Egyptians just couldn't have done it! Must be aliens, lost civilisation, red-haired white race, anti-gravity!' The next day, it's 'Wow, nobody can achieve what they did...it's impossible!"

Great Pyramid corner
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/21d4d467897b.jpg[/atsimg]

Wow! Look at all that accuracy! We could never achieve that!
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/105ac814b056.jpg[/atsimg]

Good God! All the blocks are identical in size!
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/afc011dc8685.jpg[/atsimg]

Nope! We couldn't do that...
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f021b24befb3.jpg[/atsimg]

Nothing today comes even close...
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4f95cd438f17.jpg[/atsimg]

"If only we had a plumb-bob and palm leaf!"
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/996f946120ca.jpg[/atsimg]

"Accurate in microns"
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/7f140d0082c0.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by Kandinsky
The Egyptians were accurate enough and remarkable too....

Ok, you made me laugh! LOL +1

Still want to know btw who made these inside the great pyramide. Surely not Ancient Egyptian... but older. or?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b22aac97381f.jpg[/atsimg]

reply to post by Lunica
Hiya Lunica, I think those images were identified as paraiedola (sp?) after further analysis. There was a thread about them over on the Hall of Maat forum in maybe 2009.

If I can find it, I'll edit a link in.

Originally posted by Kandinsky
reply to post by Lunica

 

Hiya Lunica, I think those images were identified as paraiedola (sp?) after further analysis. There was a thread about them over on the Hall of Maat forum in maybe 2009.

If I can find it, I'll edit a link in.

I know the thread. And some people concluded it being pareidola indeed.

Other people ,like me for instance, concluded it wasnt pareidola

reply to post by Lunica
I wish I'd known...the guy who originally uploaded the images has pulled them or let his imageshack account fade away.

The thread in question....

reply to post by dragonridr

Originally posted by Harte

I dispute that claim.

If you mean alignment with true north, we can do at least 60 times better.

Harte

Originally posted by Serafine
reply to post by Harte

 

60 times better? lol

This is entertaining lol... not ONE modern structure / construction... let alone any OTHER built structure is as accurate as the Great Pyramid, concerning alignment to True North. Claiming "we can' do an accurate alignment when to this day the MOST accurate alignment is the Great Pyramid, is a False Claim.

The Great Pyramid is not only PROOF of the accuracy in alignment to True North, but also PROOF of the accuracy in it's very construction. NO MODERN building can touch that. The PROOF is that the Great Pyramid IS THE MOST ACCURATE aligned construction.

No modern construction beats that. Pyramids: 1... modern false claims: Zip

Originally posted by dragonridr
I'm not sure what accuracy has to do with it but we know the pyramid has an error of 12 seconds of arc this means that we must be able to determine true north better then the Egyptians.Which means we could build something more accurate if we wanted,So your statement is obviously false. However I'm really not seeing what point it proves you want to align anything to true north you can do it by marking sunset and sunrise or through star observations as well .So what does this prove exactly since you seem to think this was a victory of some sort??

drgonridr. I don't think you understand my points. Maybe this can help.

The Great Pyramid's north-south axis is aligned to within three-sixtieths of a degree of true north-south. It would be worthwhile to note that this alignment is more accurate than that of the Meridian Building at the Greenwich Observatory in London, which deviates from true north by nine-sixtieths of a degree.

Architects and engineers have been trying to align buildings to True North for thousands of years... The most accurately aligned? The Great Pyramid of Giza. It's not about "knowing" where True North is... The alignment of the Great Pyramid is PROOF that the builders knew EXACTLY where True North was and not only did they KNOW, but they also constructed an accurate alignment. In FACT, the most accurate constructed alignment even to this day. See?

My statements are not false. Building the Great Pyramid with such accuracy is VERY VERY much the state of the art in construction and has never been matched, even to this day... Understand? It is not simple, nor easy to construct such a pyramid or ANY building with that kind of precession. Maybe that's why it remains the most accurately aligned building to True North, even though builders have been trying to align to True North, the Great Pyramid still stands as the most accurate. THAT is not only a Victory for the builders... it is PROOF that remains to this day of VICTORY!!!

reply to post by romka71
Hey romka71, do you ever wonder why you even bother? Thanks for the information, and for anything else I may want to know regarding it, I happen to have a keyboard sitting right in front of me. I bet you didn't know that! heh! heh!

Originally posted by romka71

If you take the perimeter of the pyramid and divide it by two times the height, you get a number that is exactly equivalent to the number pi (3.14159...) up to the fifteenth digit. The chances of this phenomenon happening by sheer chance is remarkably small. Did the ancient Egyptians know what the number pi was? Not likely, seeing as it was a number not calculated accurately to the fourth digit until the 6th century, and the pyramids calculate it to the fifteenth.

What about the fact that even though the sides of the base of the pyramid are some 757 feet long, it still forms an almost perfect square? Every angle in the base is exactly 90 degrees. In fact, the sides have a difference in length of something like two centimeters, which is an incredibly small amount.

Source
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edit on 28-4-2011 by GAOTU789 because: (no reason given)

Well considering that the library's of egypt were repetadly burned by conquerors, I think it's entirely possible that they did calulate the value of pi to a great degree of accuracy. We have to realise that knowledge is not immortal, and is susceptible to death much the same way anything is. Also we have to realise that there's nothing special about "modern" man that would allow him to calculate something like this, and not the ancients.

I mean all it takes is a measuring system, and a tool for drawing perfect circles. measure the diameter and wrap a string around the circumfrance and measure that. The bigger your circle, and the smaller your scale for measurement, the more accurate your number is going to be. The only hard part is coming to realisation that things follow certain rules of porportianality, and that there is a relationship between the diameter and circumfrance. Considering that Egypt had scribes (people who wrote and drew things on paper ), it would only be a matter of time really. Also the circle was a shape of extreme religious signifance to the ancients, so again, not really that surprising.

ps. consider the fact that human history goes back much further than Acadamia currently accepts. I'm not saying accept it as fact, just that it's a valuable line of thought. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, and here in lies the shortcoming of empiricism (or as some like to mistakingly call "science" )

Originally posted by dragonridr

Originally posted by Serafine
reply to post by Harte

 

Originally posted by Harte

I dispute that claim.

If you mean alignment with true north, we can do at least 60 times better.

Harte

60 times better? lol

This is entertaining lol... not ONE modern structure / construction... let alone any OTHER built structure is as accurate as the Great Pyramid, concerning alignment to True North. Claiming "we can' do an accurate alignment when to this day the MOST accurate alignment is the Great Pyramid, is a False Claim.

The Great Pyramid is not only PROOF of the accuracy in alignment to True North, but also PROOF of the accuracy in it's very construction. NO MODERN building can touch that. The PROOF is that the Great Pyramid IS THE MOST ACCURATE aligned construction.

No modern construction beats that. Pyramids: 1... modern false claims: Zip

I'm not sure what accuracy has to do with it but we know the pyramid has an error of 12 seconds of arc this means that we must be able to determine true north better then the Egyptians.Which means we could build something more accurate if we wanted,So your statement is obviously false. However I'm really not seeing what point it proves you want to align anything to true north you can do it by marking sunset and sunrise or through star observations as well .So what does this prove exactly since you seem to think this was a victory of some sort??

It's not that we can't measure it better, but that our construction techinques leave greater room for error. So if an architect says build it facing this way, the finished product won't end up that way.

reply to post by Lunica


Ok im intrigued where did this picture come from? Dont just post a picture without context is this in a pyramid a tomb or the local mall? Where did it come from??

the pyramids were built on a tectonic hotspot, an area where three plates meet, this effect on the structures....along with the lack of casing stones, makes sure the numbers can never be precise, but it is signifcant enough none the less, and one can say, with confidence that it was built at the golden ratio..it is evident.

also it the cubit ...the closest thing we had to the cubit was the british inch.....so the inch is a unit of devine maths,so the metric system is probably blasphemy to the ancients

they worked out true north by mapping the circumpolar stars, the stars that never set,,,,the north star in particular

and to the guy that thinks we could do better today........well its the equivilant of having a skyscraper in medieval england....... when they were building pyramids your people were living in mud huts...probably not even that...a cave lol

Originally posted by Serafine
reply to post by Harte

 

Originally posted by Harte

I dispute that claim.

If you mean alignment with true north, we can do at least 60 times better.

Harte

60 times better? lol

This is entertaining lol... not ONE modern structure / construction... let alone any OTHER built structure is as accurate as the Great Pyramid, concerning alignment to True North. Claiming "we can' do an accurate alignment when to this day the MOST accurate alignment is the Great Pyramid, is a False Claim.

"False Claim?

Odd that you would say that, given your obvious proclivity for swallowing a claim without checking it.

The Mormon Temple in Palmyra New York is perfectly aligned with true north.

Why aren't more buildings so aligned? Because nobody wanted them to be so bad enough to spend the extra monies necessary in construction.

Your "PROOF!!!" is not only "proof" of nothing at all, it's not even remotely associated with what the word "proof" actually means.


Harte

reply to post by Sky watcher


Is it just in books or is there a website i could go see?

reply to post by Harte

Originally posted by Harte

I dispute that claim.

If you mean alignment with true north, we can do at least 60 times better.

Harte

Originally posted by Serafine
reply to post by Harte

 

60 times better? lol

This is entertaining lol... not ONE modern structure / construction... let alone any OTHER built structure is as accurate as the Great Pyramid, concerning alignment to True North. Claiming "we can' do an accurate alignment when to this day the MOST accurate alignment is the Great Pyramid, is a False Claim.

Originally posted by Harte

"False Claim?

Odd that you would say that, given your obvious proclivity for swallowing a claim without checking it.

The Mormon Temple in Palmyra New York is perfectly aligned with true north.

Why aren't more buildings so aligned? Because nobody wanted them to be so bad enough to spend the extra monies necessary in construction.

Your "PROOF!!!" is not only "proof" of nothing at all, it's not even remotely associated with what the word "proof" actually means.


Harte

Hello Harte !!! Are we having fun yet? :|

[color=aqua]Green Light All Systems Go....

In reference to the "Mormon Temple in Palmyra New York" is perfectly aligned...

Moving on to the Temple, GPS reading were taken there on 22 April 2006 with a Magellan SporTrak Map model. A quick initial check with the Suunto showed that the building's long axis ran approximately north-south.

GPS readings at the north end of the building were: 43.03933N, -77.23703W.

GPS readings at the south end of the building were: 43.03869N, -77.23703W.

This results in the building's long axis being exactly 3600, which is an exact north-south celestial axis.

Thus the Palmyra Mormon Temple is exactly aligned to Celestial North.

Daniel Boudillion with all the great work he does, cannot determine the "temple" alignment to True North with any valid accuracy with GPS. Especially with a Magellan SporTrak Map model.

As with most new handheld GPS receivers released since the middle of 2003, the Sportrak Map adds WAAS (Wide Area Augmentation Service) reception for a reading of your location that’s accurate to about 3 meters.

Link ----> Magellan SporTrak Map GPS

In Fact no GPS device will give an accurate reading compared with real Surveys, such as those done on the Great Pyramid and Meridian Building etc... Even Military Standards aren't accurate enough with GPS and all GPS is known for it's "varied" readings and accuracy.

The Magellan SporTrak Map model with it's accuracy ( on a good reading ) to within 3 meters ( 9.84252 feet ) is nowhere near accurate enough to "PROVE" ... what did you call it?

Originally posted by Harte

"False Claim?

Odd that you would say that, given your obvious proclivity for swallowing a claim without checking it.

So.... The Great Pyramid is a "wonder" for a reason. It IS the most accurately aligned building to True North. The structure itself IS THE PROOF. Again... It is NOT easy to build something with such precision, that is one reason why it is a "wonder" and evidence that the builders knew exactly where True North was... see? Knowing where it is and building an accurate alignment is NOT easy... This is why, though many have tried for thousands of years, none have bettered the Great Pyramid.

Harte... even if finally someone actually BUILDS something as accurately aligned, it doesn't mean "modern man" has finally "caught up with the precision of the ancients who built the Great Pyramid" it means that what the ancient builders did then was remarkable. VERY remarkable.The proof is the structure itself.

Engineers have long been amazed with it to this very day. Then again, Engineers and Architects and Masons understand how difficult it is to build things. Especially with precision. The alignment of the Great Pyramid is a great achievement and any builders who ever tried it understand that. That's why it's still the most accurately aligned building to True North. It's not something easy to do, even with all the "modern" bells and whistles.

Maybe some imagine it's like the game of horseshoes... close enough for horseshoes or hand-grenades... Good enough for Government eh? But the precision of the Great Pyramid is a wonder man... an achievement and PROOF set in stones.

Again... GPS is nowhere near accurate enough for Survey of THAT precision, whatever you think of it... Imagine it... Daniel Boudillion using a "Magellan SporTrak Map" GPS device that's only accurate to 3 meters (on a good reading ), claims a building is... what did he write?

"Thus the Palmyra Mormon Temple is exactly aligned to Celestial North."

Precision in validation of verification in WRITING and publication eh? Let alone having a constant be a dead reckoning of True North... yea man... it's
That O Way--------- ->-->--->----->-------->------------->--------------------->

Originally posted by Serafine
60 times better? lol

This is entertaining lol... not ONE modern structure / construction... let alone any OTHER built structure is as accurate as the Great Pyramid, concerning alignment to True North. Claiming "we can' do an accurate alignment when to this day the MOST accurate alignment is the Great Pyramid, is a False Claim.

Do you have any evidence at all for the above (bolded) claim? No, you do not.

So, it's time (apparently) for you to conduct a study of (at least) the majority of buildings on the Earth.

Originally posted by Serafine

The Magellan SporTrak Map model with it's accuracy ( on a good reading ) to within 3 meters ( 9.84252 feet ) is nowhere near accurate enough to "PROVE" ... what did you call it?

However, the GPS does so indicate it. So, where are your surveyor's reports indicating otherwise?

After all, you claim to know facts about every building ever built on the planet.

Originally posted by Serafine

Originally posted by Harte
"False Claim?

Odd that you would say that, given your obvious proclivity for swallowing a claim without checking it.

So.... The Great Pyramid is a "wonder" for a reason. It IS the most accurately aligned building to True North. The structure itself IS THE PROOF. Again... It is NOT easy to build something with such precision, that is one reason why it is a "wonder" and evidence that the builders knew exactly where True North was... see? Knowing where it is and building an accurate alignment is NOT easy... This is why, though many have tried for thousands of years, none have bettered the Great Pyramid.

Finding true north is ridiculously easy with a string and a rock.

Constructing a building aligned with true north is so exceedingly difficult that we don't even think about trying.

If we did, we would do so.

Our society is capitalistic. If there's no profit in it, it's not gonna happen.

Is that so hard to understand?

Originally posted by Serafine
Harte... even if finally someone actually BUILDS something as accurately aligned, it doesn't mean "modern man" has finally "caught up with the precision of the ancients who built the Great Pyramid" it means that what the ancient builders did then was remarkable. VERY remarkable.The proof is the structure itself.

You keep using the word "PROOF!!!" as if it means something in this context. Tell me, what are you saying the pyramid "proves?"
I would agree that the Great Pyramid is a remarkable structure. So are a thousand other structures in Egypt and elsewhere.

Harte

here´s a great docu of a researcher who investigated the building of the great pyramid in giza.
one of the few unspeculative and more scientific documentations.
his theory is about the possibillity of an internal ramp to get the stones towards the pyramid and the great chamber and hallway with a new architectual explanation..

www.3ds.com...

great watch.
no Erich von Däniken needed..

reply to post by Serafine


I hate to burst your bubble but most observatories are aligned to true north. Just because most building dont need to be aligned true north doesn't mean we cant do it. But if acuracy is something you want you can find true north with a piece of rope and a rock. Tie the rock to the end of a rope you have hanging from a support. As the sun travels overhead mark the positions this gives you east west and split that you get north south??? Oh and guess what its accurate I guess unless the earth stops spinning.Im sure if Egyptians could construct boats and charriots and houses they knew this as well.

Why is it everyone thinks are ancestors were stupid they didnt need help to figure this stuff out they were more than capable of using the same brain we have. The only difference between us and them is knowledge is a built upon by each generation. We could no more be where were at technology wise if they didnt lay down the ground work for us to build upon. Did you know the Egyptians invented paper? Hows this one they invented the lock so everytime you go unlock your front door thank them. Shall we continue how about the plow or clocks they had sun dials and water clocks the start of modern time keeping!! I can keep going but you get the idea by now.

reply to post by Harte

reply to post by dragonridr

Originally posted by Harte

Finding true north is ridiculously easy with a string and a rock

Originally posted by dragonridr

I hate to burst your bubble but most observatories are aligned to true north. Just because most building dont need to be aligned true north doesn't mean we cant do it. But if acuracy is something you want you can find true north with a piece of rope and a rock.

*******

Ok... here goes some more investment in some more TIME!

"ridiculously easy" to "...hate to burst your bubble"...

A string and a rock or, as Dragonridr stated, "...a piece of rope and a rock" will never give the precision found in the Great Pyramid alignment to True North... A Plumb Line, even two Plumb Lines will never render the required precision.. or results. Please don't bother with that relating to this issue... if you want to talk sundials and relative alignments sure.. but not the Great Pyramid. I almost wonder that both of you do not comprehend, nor understand, this issue, but I give the benefit that it seems both of you are interested in it.

I've been pondering on a response for both of you, for a few hours... and a light bulb went off! There's a brilliant forum on ATS under conspiracy professionals titled Scott Creighton

Link -------> Scott Creighton

Mister Creighton can illustrate and explain the value of the Great Pyramids alignment to solve any issues you may still have with "alignment", as well as the value of the facts.

There's quite a few things that can be considered... Who "knows" when or how the pyramids were constructed? You may answer academics or an encyclopedia etc... But they have theories yes.. but no conclusions as far as knowing the answers. It's still up for grabs you know? Many people have long been working on this and do work on it... Like most all of ancient history..... it's a land of shadows and not much is known. Which actually makes for great work and entertainment trying to find the answers.

I have some ideas that both of you may want to add to all of this. One is Archaeoastronomy...

Links: A Brief Introduction to Archaeoastronomy ~ Archaeoastronomy: (Prehistoric astronomers)

An example would be something like.... the Lascaux Cave. Location: Dordoigne, Montignac, France.

Lascaux contains some of the best-known Upper Palaeolithic art. These paintings are estimated to be around 17,300 years old. They primarily consist of primitive images of large animals, most of which are now known from fossil evidence to have lived in the area at the time.

*******

Confirmation that the art might have been representative of astronomy comes in the knowledge that the cave opening was orientated towards the sunset on the summer solstice.

Link: -------> Lascaux Cave: (Palaeolithic Cave-art)

*******

Chantal Jègues Wolkiewiez has been doing brilliant work in this area...

My researches tend to prove that as well as the Paleolithic works date from 35000 years ago (the Blanchard shelter bone in Sergeac en Dordogne), the works founded in the Vallée des Merveilles show precise and meticulous observations of the solar, lunar and stellar cycles. They reveal unsuspected astronomical knowledge in periods as ancient as the Aurignacienne era.

Link:-------> Chantal Jègues-Wolkiewiez

She has found many very ancient "sites"... caves.. had interesting alignments... such as the summer solstice ( longest day of the year in the northern hemisphere ). This all points to great understanding by the ancients, around the world really... the alignments are evidence of the knowledge.

So there's all kinds of factors involved in the "ancients" and alignments... especially alignments with precision ( Great Pyramid ) I have another link regarding various theories being worked on "Egypt" wise... Mind you there's much more.. but these seem to be some ideas pertaining to this thread...

Links: -------> Pyramids ~ Remember that it's not known who built the Great Pyramid or when.. There's various theories for sure.. but little "evidence" except the "Great Pyramid" itself... Harte.. That's what I meant by "PROOF"... the structure is it's own evidence and proof....Now there's a process of trying to almost "reverse engineer" the whole thing for understanding.. lol

An example of what I mean by the Great Pyramid is evidence .. itself... When it was "opened"... it was empty... no body... no nuttin....

Well it's been real.... almost as much fun as talking about imaginary burial tombs !