China tells US Pacific Command chief military contact with Taiwan must stop

Originally posted by TACHYON
Yes anyone can make an attack. Give a girl scout a pack of SARS and even she can launch a massive worldwide germ war. My question was why would anyone do such a thing, and you still dont even have an answer for an agency.

Do you know that it is US stated policy not allowing any nation to surpass US? Which nation has the potential in the future?

At that time, US is planning to invade Iraq. What if China start Unification War coincide with the time of US invasion? Is it not good for China concentrated in internal turmoil?

To disrupt Chinese economy, is there a better weapon other than SARS? With SARS attack which can be executed by one or few people, there is little chance of being caught. There is only minimal effect on US. With SARS specifically targeted toward Chinese, Japan and the West do not need to worry. SARS is ultimate weapon, way better than even nukes.

With China affected, would it not good for investment fleeing or diverting from China back to US or the West?

I am so glad that Chinese government contained the attack by mobilizing a new People War against SARS, and realized how evil the West esp. US is. So China can anticipate and prepare future attacks on Chinese people, and reserve right and weapons to fight back when needed.

Originally posted by zcheng
The motivation is so obvious, if you have any brain. As I said, even one person can initiate the attack with the virus in a small vial. Do you think China can track all foreigners in China?

Of course, I am on the ignore list because zcheng can't handle the truth, but the government in China DOES make an attempt to track all foreigners in the country. Foreigners are REQUIRED to fill out PSB (Public Security Bureau - China's equivalent to the police) forms when they check into a hotel, and if they change residences, they are required to check in with the PSB. Furthermore, PSB personnel will occasionaly check up on foreigners resident in the country to be sure that they aren't engaging in illegal activities and to make sure that they are living where they say that they are living. Even more, foreigners are only permitted to live and stay in specially PSB approved places!

zcheng is just afraid of the truth, so would someone please tell him the truth of his facist, anti-democratic regime.

Originally posted by zcheng
[Do you know that it is US stated policy not allowing any nation to surpass US? Which nation has the potential in the future?

At that time, US is planning to invade Iraq. What if China start Unification War coincide with the time of US invasion? Is it not good for China concentrated in internal turmoil?

To disrupt Chinese economy, is there a better weapon other than SARS? With SARS attack which can be executed by one or few people, there is little chance of being caught. There is only minimal effect on US. With SARS specifically targeted toward Chinese, Japan and the West do not need to worry. SARS is ultimate weapon, way better than even nukes.

With China affected, would it not good for investment fleeing or diverting from China back to US or the West?

I am so glad that Chinese government contained the attack by mobilizing a new People War against SARS, and realized how evil the West esp. US is. So China can anticipate and prepare future attacks on Chinese people, and reserve right and weapons to fight back when needed.

This post does more than anyone can do to prove his lunacy. I am sure this shows most people that nothing he says can be taken seriously, including his statements on the free nation of Taiwan. Thank you zcheng. You statemebts and behavior are doing a better job of discrediting yourself than anything we could do!

Originally posted by jazzmaster

All i ask is for you to give us links to the articles of what you are talking about because this accusation is really just an accusation after all. There is no evidence to support your accusation. Take the flu virus for example, they mutate constantly every year, and the genome of it is surely alien, no scientists are sure where they come from. That is also the reason why us in the US have to have a shot each year.
I would guess that who ever wrote those articles know very little about biology. I think the pattern of infection extends around the world too, not just on Chinese. There were a dozen cases in the US at the beginning in which those infected were not Chinese nor Asian, but instead Caucasians, I would think that if this virus were ever man-made, the creator would clearly put "make-virus-for-Chinese-only-not-Caucasians" on his list, don't you think so? I am not sure if some Chinese in the rural part of the country ate some wild animals and contracted the virus from them. Chinese will eat everything they find. The AIDS virus was first contracted from a monkey in Africa.

The only sources I have ever seen for this nonsense is from the Chinese propoganda machine on Simplified Chinese websites!

Originally posted by zcheng

Originally posted by TACHYON
Yes anyone can make an attack. Give a girl scout a pack of SARS and even she can launch a massive worldwide germ war. My question was why would anyone do such a thing, and you still dont even have an answer for an agency.

Do you know that it is US stated policy not allowing any nation to surpass US? Which nation has the potential in the future?

At that time, US is planning to invade Iraq. What if China start Unification War coincide with the time of US invasion? Is it not good for China concentrated in internal turmoil?

To disrupt Chinese economy, is there a better weapon other than SARS? With SARS attack which can be executed by one or few people, there is little chance of being caught. There is only minimal effect on US. With SARS specifically targeted toward Chinese, Japan and the West do not need to worry. SARS is ultimate weapon, way better than even nukes.

With China affected, would it not good for investment fleeing or diverting from China back to US or the West?

I am so glad that Chinese government contained the attack by mobilizing a new People War against SARS, and realized how evil the West esp. US is. So China can anticipate and prepare future attacks on Chinese people, and reserve right and weapons to fight back when needed.

I could say the same thing about the anthrax attacks. The Chinese want to shift the attention from their master plans elsewhere. Dude come on. Serioulsy with Chinese stealing US technology, the US policy to stay ahead is one I agree with. You cant just sit there like a duck waiting to be shot. If one does not advance they do not survive. The US will take proper military action if necessarry, but they are not doing so right now. There is no secret SAR WARS going on. So Luke skywalker you are wrong.

Originally posted by ludahai

Originally posted by jazzmaster

All i ask is for you to give us links to the articles of what you are talking about because this accusation is really just an accusation after all. There is no evidence to support your accusation. Take the flu virus for example, they mutate constantly every year, and the genome of it is surely alien, no scientists are sure where they come from. That is also the reason why us in the US have to have a shot each year.
I would guess that who ever wrote those articles know very little about biology. I think the pattern of infection extends around the world too, not just on Chinese. There were a dozen cases in the US at the beginning in which those infected were not Chinese nor Asian, but instead Caucasians, I would think that if this virus were ever man-made, the creator would clearly put "make-virus-for-Chinese-only-not-Caucasians" on his list, don't you think so? I am not sure if some Chinese in the rural part of the country ate some wild animals and contracted the virus from them. Chinese will eat everything they find. The AIDS virus was first contracted from a monkey in Africa.

The only sources I have ever seen for this nonsense is from the Chinese propoganda machine on Simplified Chinese websites!

Of course, Zcheng hasn't provided the link to the article that he quoted from. I am sure that the full article says more than South East Asians are more likely to contract the virus. I have also provided evidence that the SARS virus was first comtaminated and brought out to the open air by Chinese scientists, the Chinese Health Ministry confirmed that in the report for the WHO written by the people themseilves. For some reason, Zcheng does not seem to be moved by this. After that he tried to argue of how this SARS virus would be used by the US to weaken China when he cannot prove that the SARS was a biological attack. The SARS virus was in CHinese's hands before the outbreak, and it was spread by the workers themselves. Therefore i am very certain that dismiss that fact that SARS is a biological attack.

Zcheng, do you not trust your own government agencies when they said that the virus was in Chinese's lab before the attack and your own people contaminated with the virus and spread it? You are unbelievable.

I have a few questions for you.
1. Are you really Chinese? You do not seem to know much about Chinese and China.
2. Are you some sort of Anti-American or Anti-West lunatic ? (don't mean to be rude but i have to know)
3. Do you live in China? Because you seem out of touch with arguements about China.
Are you willing to look at other people's point when debating or you just want to impose your unreasonable views?

I just want answers to these questions before i and the rest of us debate with you any further. Woop, you are going to put me on your ignored list now, are you not? This is so predictable. I've had it with Zcheng. Who's with me?

[edit on 25-8-2004 by jazzmaster]

Yep looks like zcheng is hired bye the PLA to propagate false ideas. Too bad we blew his cover.

MOLLLLLEEE!!

Originally posted by jazzmaster
Of course, Zcheng hasn't provided the link to the article that he quoted from. I am sure that the full article says more than South East Asians are more likely to contract the virus.

You apparently do not have any biological or medical background. The articles can be easily found through PubMed database at NCBI. The link you requested is provided here.
Abstract:
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
Full articles at :
www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov...

Please note this is the result from Taiwan researchers.

I do not have time to read your evidence. I will reply later. You have now got what you have asked for.

I have a few questions for you.
1. Are you really Chinese? You do not seem to know much about Chinese and China.
2. Are you some sort of Anti-American or Anti-West lunatic ? (don't mean to be rude but i have to know)
3. Do you live in China? Because you seem out of touch with arguements about China.
Are you willing to look at other people's point when debating or you just want to impose your unreasonable views?

I just want answers to these questions before i and the rest of us debate with you any further. Woop, you are going to put me on your ignored list now, are you not? This is so predictable. I've had it with Zcheng. Who's with me?

Yes. I am from Yong Kang county in Central Zhejiang Province of China.
I am not anti-American per se, but I am furious of American foreign policy and US support of Taiwan Independence. I now live outside of China since 1998. I returned back to China last winter to visit my family. Yes, I will look at other's view or argument. I will only add those impossible to debate to my ignored list.

Originally posted by jazzmaster
Zcheng, you are just ever so wrong of this topic. Here are a few facts of the outbreak made by the WHO
(source:www.wpro.who.int... )
(And especially this one from your OWN Chinese government: www.wpro.who.int...)

If you read more carefully, you will know that the investigation is about the recent outbreak occured around Feb 2004, not the original outbreak occured in the spring of 2003 around US invasion of Iraq.

These two additional laboratory workers appear to have suffered from SARS-like illnesses in early February 2004. Recent laboratory tests performed at a national reference laboratory were positive for SARS antibodies.

There was similar incident in Taiwan, and Singapore.

Z

I do not understand......the Chinese Government has already admidted they have Mishandled SARS and you are the only word out of China that has Blamed the West for anything..you must just think China has no fault what so ever for anything and that will be chinas Undoing

Originally posted by zcheng

Originally posted by jazzmaster
Zcheng, you are just ever so wrong of this topic. Here are a few facts of the outbreak made by the WHO
(source:www.wpro.who.int... )
(And especially this one from your OWN Chinese government: www.wpro.who.int...)

If you read more carefully, you will know that the investigation is about the recent outbreak occured around Feb 2004, not the original outbreak occured in the spring of 2003 around US invasion of Iraq.

These two additional laboratory workers appear to have suffered from SARS-like illnesses in early February 2004. Recent laboratory tests performed at a national reference laboratory were positive for SARS antibodies.

There was similar incident in Taiwan, and Singapore.

In that case, from the link to the article you have provided tells us that the first cases were also reported in Taiwan. Did China mean to give the virus to Taiwanese too?

In the course of March 19 to May 22, 2003, 93 cases of suspected SARS were reported by Mackay Memorial Hospital in Taipei City and its branch in Tan Sui County of Taipei to the Center for Disease Control in Taiwan. Up until early June, among 680 probable SARS cases reported in Taiwan,

And you said that the attack was on China, if this virus was deadly as scientists claimed, then this "stunt" pulled by the West could have killed the whole population of Taiwan. Therefore it is also unreasonable because that would give China a big advantage in the war, would it not?

Oh i also picked this up too.

Taiwan population is heterogeneous and comprises 91% Taiwanese, 7.5% Chinese who arrived from many different provinces of China after World War II, and 1.5% of indigenous peoples established there since several millenniums. The Taiwanese comprised the Minnan and Hakka people groups, and are the descendants of early settlers from the southeast coast of China (Fujian and Guangdong Provinces) during the last few centuries

How does that contribute to the fact that China is claiming that Taiwan is their land while only 7.5% of the people on the island is Chinese? Interesting

Density of populations possibly favored the growth of the epidemic.

Possibly

The question aroused as to whether affected southern Asian populations were more susceptible to SARS infection than peoples of northern China (Beijing), Japan, or Korea. Many peoples in Beijing generally considered as northern Chinese [16], were also infected, however, infection in Beijing could be attributed to heterogeneity of populations following important recent migration of southern Chinese and population resettlement during the Cultural Revolution.

Interesting, only the south is more likely to contract the virus than the north

I also notice that this article is written by Taiwanese, not the Chinese

[edit on 25-8-2004 by jazzmaster]

Originally posted by jazzmaster
In that case, from the link to the article you have provided tells us that the first cases were also reported in Taiwan. Did China mean to give the virus to Taiwanese too?

And you said that the attack was on China, if this virus was deadly as scientists claimed, then this "stunt" pulled by the West could have killed the whole population of Taiwan. Therefore it is also unreasonable because that would give China a big advantage in the war, would it not?

Not only Taiwan was affected, but also Hong Kong, Vietnam, Singapore, Toronto. It is the infectious nature of SARS, with large travelling between these places. You still do not want to admit that these places are populated by people of Chinese origin?

The West media cried then about the lethality of the virus. I guess they knew beforehand.

The best interest of China and Taiwan lies in the peace of Taiwan strait. Without the Taiwan Independence movement, Mainland China will not threat to attack.

Taiwan population is heterogeneous and comprises 91% Taiwanese, 7.5% Chinese who arrived from many different provinces of China after World War II, and 1.5% of indigenous peoples established there since several millenniums. The Taiwanese comprised the Minnan and Hakka people groups, and are the descendants of early settlers from the southeast coast of China (Fujian and Guangdong Provinces) during the last few centuries

This is one of the statistics. I am wondering where that 91% Taiwanese came from, and how they determine who is Chinese or Taiwanese. Chinese people came from different origin over the thousands of years. SARS targets one section of Chinese people with a particular allele in their genes. Considering the mixed nature of US population, it is not possible to engineer a virus to target all US people.

I also notice that this article is written by Taiwanese, not the Chinese

Yes. It simply shut down some TI's mouth by claiming that it is just some propaganda from China.

Z - you can believe whatever you want (well, at least in America you can, I don't know if that is aplicable to China ), but I have to tell you dude, you are really reaching here. You have nothing to suport your argument - nothing what so ever. There is no smoking gun, no US equipment at "the scene of the crime." Hell, your own government has admitted it was their fault.

Don't you think that China would have said something if they even suspected the US was involved? It would be the biggest news story since WWII. Two of the top three nuclear powers involved, and a biological attack on one, with no real reason. The whole world would probably back China if this occured - and yes, that includes all of NATO (assuming they weren't involved, which by your reasoning they wouldn't be).

Basically dude, you need to seriously take a deep deep look at your beliefs, and why you believe them. Are you looking at all of the information available to you and then making a sound judgement based on those facts, or are you making an assumption and then clinging to that idea, all the while trying to support it? If the latter is the case (and I believe it to be the case), why is that? Could it be that a government has given you so much propaganda that you are willing to overlook facts in order to justify beliefs that support your current comunist government?

Not only Taiwan was affected, but also Hong Kong, Vietnam, Singapore, Toronto. It is the infectious nature of SARS, with large travelling between these places. You still do not want to admit that these places are populated by people of Chinese origin?

Of course i do not deny the fact that Chinese populated areas were hit the most. But you failed to look at the fact that those areas were infected after it infected China and Taiwan. The SARS were not known publicly known until late 2003. During that time, the virus was spread by infected Chinese traveling around the world. There are a lot of Chinese in Vietnam. THere are a whole lot more Chinese in Hong Kong. There are Overseas Chinese living in Singapore traveling back and forth. There are also Taiwanese and Chinese traveling back and forth between Taiwan. Toronto is the largest concentration of Asian in the world besides their ancestor's land, especially Chinese. Chinese also travel back and forth there. The point is, SARS was not made publicly until late 2003, but it started speading a year earlier. I might also add that Caucasians in Canada and the US were infected also.

The West media cried then about the lethality of the virus. I guess they knew beforehand.

I cannot really argue with you there since it's really an opinion. Why would the media know about it beforehand? This could have leaked out and killed Bush's chance of re-electing. Remember, we have both conservative and liberal medias over here.

This is one of the statistics. I am wondering where that 91% Taiwanese came from, and how they determine who is Chinese or Taiwanese. Chinese people came from different origin over the thousands of years. SARS targets one section of Chinese people with a particular allele in their genes. Considering the mixed nature of US population, it is not possible to engineer a virus to target all US people.

SARS did not only target Chinese, it targets others also. It targeted the Hmong, and the Kinh in Vietnam, Taiwanese in Taiwan. It targets the areas where large concentration of population is present. China's population is 1.2 billions, Taiwan's popluation is 23 milliions living in 32,260 sq km of land (www.cia.gov...).

616 persons per square kilometer, making it the second highest in the world after Bangladesh www.roc-taiwan.org...

Vietnam's population is 83 millions living in 325,360 sq km of land. 90% of the people are Vietnamese.
How do they determine that?

My point is, not only SARS targets Asians, it targets one of the most populated region on Earth. Also you failed to mention that SARS also infected London, the Philippines, and Mongolia

[edit on 25-8-2004 by jazzmaster]

Originally posted by American Mad Man
Z - you can believe whatever you want (well, at least in America you can, I don't know if that is aplicable to China

), but I have to tell you dude, you are really reaching here.

You are indeed a Mad Man.

Originally posted by jazzmaster
My point is, not only SARS targets Asians, it targets one of the most populated region on Earth. Also you failed to mention that SARS also infected London, the Philippines, and Mongolia

In acient times, Vietnam was a vasal state of China (called An Nan), esp. in the North. There were intimate interaction between the two population, so is today.

India, Japan may have higher population density.

Can you provide more information about SARS infections in London, the Philippines, and Mongolia? I want to know who were affected and how serious they were. Appreciated.

SARS in Oz.

www.mja.com.au...
www.diaspoir.net...
antisars.qianlong.com...@1825891.htm

Sanc'.

Originally posted by zcheng

Originally posted by American Mad Man
Z - you can believe whatever you want (well, at least in America you can, I don't know if that is aplicable to China

), but I have to tell you dude, you are really reaching here.

You are indeed a Mad Man.

Hey, i'm not the one making outlandish, unfounded accusations that have no backing. Bring some evidance - NOT YOUR OPINION, SOMETHING THAT IS FACT that what you say is true. Something, ANYTHING pointed towards US involvement in SARS.

I'll even let you use RENSE

Originally posted by sanctum
SARS in Oz.
www.mja.com.au...
www.diaspoir.net...
antisars.qianlong.com...@1825891.htm
Sanc'.

Thanks sanctum for the links.
No more was killed in Australia, and I can not find who were affected for futher analysis. The last link is for event in Jan 2004.

Originally posted by zcheng

Originally posted by jazzmaster
My point is, not only SARS targets Asians, it targets one of the most populated region on Earth. Also you failed to mention that SARS also infected London, the Philippines, and Mongolia

In acient times, Vietnam was a vasal state of China (called An Nan), esp. in the North. There were intimate interaction between the two population, so is today.

India, Japan may have higher population density.

Can you provide more information about SARS infections in London, the Philippines, and Mongolia? I want to know who were affected and how serious they were. Appreciated.

Follow any of these links and i will give you the list of the countries that was infected: (Thanks, sanctum)
SARS in UK: www.diaspoir.net...
SARS in the Philippines : www.diaspoir.net...
SARs in Mongolia: www.diaspoir.net... ( I say this is the least hit country near China)
SARS in Thailand: www.diaspoir.net...
SARS in Japan: www.diaspoir.net... (none dead)

In acient times, Vietnam was a vasal state of China (called An Nan), esp. in the North. There were intimate interaction between the two population, so is today.

Exactly, and i am wondering the techniques they use to determine the ethnic of a interracial person (I am not sure if Vietnamese and Chinese are considered different races).

[edit on 25-8-2004 by jazzmaster]